At the time you can get zangoose (lvl 17) marshtomp is lvl 23.5, but because of the growth rate it might be feasable, however it doesnt get a fighting move until prior to gym 8, he will be faster against e4 with shadow ball, strength, brick break, swords dance. Zangoose is piss weak though and will just fail against norman, overall i think he will be slower than swampert/groudon.
SDA Forum
There's a word for that
I've mentioned this before, but the exp growth for the extra-fast and extra-slow growth rates is inconsistent. The extra-fast growth starts out really slow and only catches up at high levels, while the extra-slow one starts out quickly but ramps up dramatically later on. In the case of a speedrun, extra-slow is actually the better choice.
There's a word for that
DON'T RUSH ME I CAN'T WORK UNDER PRESSURE
Seriously: My reasons for the delay this time are at least somewhat more genuine; mostly it boils down to uni eating up all my time and wrecking my sleep pattern. However, semester is over now, so I can work on it again. Was going to start tomorrow, actually. The Elite Four shall fall by the end of November!
Seriously: My reasons for the delay this time are at least somewhat more genuine; mostly it boils down to uni eating up all my time and wrecking my sleep pattern. However, semester is over now, so I can work on it again. Was going to start tomorrow, actually. The Elite Four shall fall by the end of November!
Long ass bloody story, turns out that after my 2nd hsc exam i got chicken pox, possibly the worst case in history, ill include a photo. So i was unable to do my other 3 hsc exams meaning that my chances of getting into uni are now fucked. I recovered about 3 weeks later and spent some time with friends and now i got a bloody cold and im kind of incapasitated. So basically i started on a black/white speedrun and a ruby/sapphire improvement run but because of the circumstances i have been unable to pursue them. Ill post in the thread when i am able to get back to it.
http://www.facebook.com/photo.php?fbid=455088074294&set=a.36288649294.42903.818529294#!/photo.php?fbid=455088074294&set=a.36288649294.42903.818529294&pid=5194342&id=818529294
http://www.facebook.com/photo.php?fbid=455088074294&set=a.36288649294.42903.818529294#!/photo.php?fbid=455088074294&set=a.36288649294.42903.818529294&pid=5194342&id=818529294
THIS RUN CONTAINS SECRET WORLDS
First and foremost, a question like this should probably have gone in the casual speedrunning section, since the purpose of this thread is for breaking SDA records rather than personal ones. Nevertheless I will answer your question, but in the future you should generally avoid bumping threads like these unless you have something to contribute!
I would start by not grinding up to level 60 with your starter, especially since you've caught Kyogre. At the beginning of your run, reset as much as you can stomach to get nearly optimal DVs and a helpful nature (in speedrunning, attack and speed tend to be more important than defense). Skip all battles that aren't absolutely necessary. To beat Liza and Tate, pair Swampert with the Castform you get as a freebie and have it use Rain Dance to power up Swampert. Once you get Kyogre, ditch Swampert and teach Kyogre useful TMs like Thunderbolt/Thunder and Calm Mind (be sure to take advantage of TMs for the starter as well; Rock Tomb is especially useful). In order to compensate for being underleveled, stock up on X items and take advantage of the starter's Torrent ability (it powers up water attacks when it's under 1/4 of max HP or something to that effect). If you take full advantage of these strategies (among others) in a segmented run you should easily finish under 3 hours.
A lot of the above tips and information can be found elsewhere in this very thread, but I just put them here for your convenience. I advise you to skim threads like these before asking questions.
I would start by not grinding up to level 60 with your starter, especially since you've caught Kyogre. At the beginning of your run, reset as much as you can stomach to get nearly optimal DVs and a helpful nature (in speedrunning, attack and speed tend to be more important than defense). Skip all battles that aren't absolutely necessary. To beat Liza and Tate, pair Swampert with the Castform you get as a freebie and have it use Rain Dance to power up Swampert. Once you get Kyogre, ditch Swampert and teach Kyogre useful TMs like Thunderbolt/Thunder and Calm Mind (be sure to take advantage of TMs for the starter as well; Rock Tomb is especially useful). In order to compensate for being underleveled, stock up on X items and take advantage of the starter's Torrent ability (it powers up water attacks when it's under 1/4 of max HP or something to that effect). If you take full advantage of these strategies (among others) in a segmented run you should easily finish under 3 hours.
A lot of the above tips and information can be found elsewhere in this very thread, but I just put them here for your convenience. I advise you to skim threads like these before asking questions.
Make it so.
Hi all, necrobump in the extreme here but I think it's preferred to starting new threads.
I've been working for a while now on some SS strategies for Sapphire and I'm reaching the end of the testing stages and have begun practice runs.
There are several things which I'm sure could be improved upon with my strats so any help or just general support would be extremely welcome.
I use Mudkip as my starter and swap it for Kyogre for the elite 4, much like the segmented run, in fact, after getting Kyogre my run hardly differs from the seg'd run at all, except for the fact that I don't use Hydro Pump as it is unreliable and use Calm Mind instead of x-specials as they are slightly quicker and it means less shopping.
Currently the hardest fights in the game are easily the second fight against May (below mauville), which I have a good strat for but there are a few things that can go wrong, and Norman. Oh god Norman.
So yeah, I will bump this thread with updates as often as I make them, for now let's just say that my target time is probably around 2:20, my best so far being a hilariously bad 2:51.
I've been working for a while now on some SS strategies for Sapphire and I'm reaching the end of the testing stages and have begun practice runs.
There are several things which I'm sure could be improved upon with my strats so any help or just general support would be extremely welcome.
I use Mudkip as my starter and swap it for Kyogre for the elite 4, much like the segmented run, in fact, after getting Kyogre my run hardly differs from the seg'd run at all, except for the fact that I don't use Hydro Pump as it is unreliable and use Calm Mind instead of x-specials as they are slightly quicker and it means less shopping.
Currently the hardest fights in the game are easily the second fight against May (below mauville), which I have a good strat for but there are a few things that can go wrong, and Norman. Oh god Norman.
So yeah, I will bump this thread with updates as often as I make them, for now let's just say that my target time is probably around 2:20, my best so far being a hilariously bad 2:51.
Make it so.
Cheers for the support 
Updating and testing my shopping routes, that's somthing that I definitely need to work on.
Just completed a "marathon" style playthrough using some slightly safer strats and a couple of saves with the result of a 2:34:02, although probably more like 3 hours or more RTA due to having to reload saves etc.
Updating and testing my shopping routes, that's somthing that I definitely need to work on.
Just completed a "marathon" style playthrough using some slightly safer strats and a couple of saves with the result of a 2:34:02, although probably more like 3 hours or more RTA due to having to reload saves etc.
Make it so.
Really? Fantastic, at least I know for sure now
Any help would be greatly appreciated, obviously there are very few people who are going to know more about it than you!
My first question would be a really simple one actually; with regards to the randomly rotating trainers (I hate them so much) I've found that for a SS, the Mach bike just seems to uncontrolable as you cant stop quickly with it so you end up getting in far too many unneeded battles.
So basically, is there any rhyme or reason to the trainers facing direction that I could take advantage of? If not I think I may have to bite the bullet and just use the acro bike for the run.
Any help would be greatly appreciated, obviously there are very few people who are going to know more about it than you!
My first question would be a really simple one actually; with regards to the randomly rotating trainers (I hate them so much) I've found that for a SS, the Mach bike just seems to uncontrolable as you cant stop quickly with it so you end up getting in far too many unneeded battles.
So basically, is there any rhyme or reason to the trainers facing direction that I could take advantage of? If not I think I may have to bite the bullet and just use the acro bike for the run.
From memory rotating trainers will only change direction to look at you if you 'run' past them (biking and walking they are left to their own demise). Mach bike vs Acro bike depends on your ability to control the mach bike, for a SS if you just keep running into crap (trainers/walls) then i would recommend the Acro bike. Actually now that i think about it id say use the Acro bike for a SS unless you are near flawless with your Mach bike controls. Keep in mind the most important thing about a 'Pokemon' speedrun (IMHO) is making the battles go as fast as possible. 1 less turn of a battle could very well be the time saved by not using the Mach bike if you catch my drift XD
EDIT: Also im not sure of your strats (if you have a written copy id love to see it) but UltimateDarius and I came up with pretty decent strats for May V2 and Norman which i can remember most of haha.
EDIT: Also im not sure of your strats (if you have a written copy id love to see it) but UltimateDarius and I came up with pretty decent strats for May V2 and Norman which i can remember most of haha.
Make it so.
I'll write out a comprehansive version of my strats and send it across then for your judgement
It's not the ones that rotate, I shuold have been clearer, it's the ones that change the direction that they face completely randomly (or so it seems) that are giving me issues. I'm currently thinking that I'll just include a quota for them in the run, for example, if I run into three of them that's fine but a fourth is too many so I would bin the run.
Can you remember the strats for norman that you had? I think my May V2 strats are quite good (I hope) but if there is a better way to do Norman that would be fab. I know you used Bide very imaginitively in your segmented run but that relies too heavily on the opponents AI and seems out for me. Currently I'm using X-Specials because Slakings Sp.Def is half it's defence so Water Gun is actually the strongest move against them. I'm usually level 29 at Norman by the way, if that helps.
It's not the ones that rotate, I shuold have been clearer, it's the ones that change the direction that they face completely randomly (or so it seems) that are giving me issues. I'm currently thinking that I'll just include a quota for them in the run, for example, if I run into three of them that's fine but a fourth is too many so I would bin the run.
Can you remember the strats for norman that you had? I think my May V2 strats are quite good (I hope) but if there is a better way to do Norman that would be fab. I know you used Bide very imaginitively in your segmented run but that relies too heavily on the opponents AI and seems out for me. Currently I'm using X-Specials because Slakings Sp.Def is half it's defence so Water Gun is actually the strongest move against them. I'm usually level 29 at Norman by the way, if that helps.
The site really has been without a Hoenn region SS run for far too long. Not sure how much I actually can, but I'd love to help ya get this run, Tiberius. (even if you just need a test monkey to verify some strats)
Question though, Are May V2 and Norman really the biggest speed bumps in R/S run? Or are they just the 2 more noticeable bumps that pop up in the early parts of the run?
Question though, Are May V2 and Norman really the biggest speed bumps in R/S run? Or are they just the 2 more noticeable bumps that pop up in the early parts of the run?
Make it so.
Thanks a lot MBM, any help would be vastly appreciated!
One of the problems is that whichever starter you choose, there will be one or two reasonable sized bumps as you put it. Torchic has a lot going for it SS but you have to grind a bit before the first Gym and also, Tate and Liza are absolute hell, the most reliable way of beating them seems to actually be going out of your way to fish up two Shapedos...
With Mudkip, the biggest three obstacles certainly seem to be May V2, Archie 1, and Norman. And I'm only counting Archie because his damn Mightyena can sand attack spam while you're setting up on him.
For May V2 my strat is as follows:
Against wailmer, use 2 x-atts and 1 x-speed, if he growls use another x-attack to compensate. Heal up then mud shot, with optimal IVs this *should* OHKO but sometimes it will take two, that's not a huge issue as long as it doesn't growl/crit in between, if it does you must compensate. She sends out Groyvle next, use mud shot, it will go first, that is absolutely vital as it uses absorb which does massive damage and heals it, (if it has truly terrible IVs this can mess up) Mud Shot will take away just over half of it's HP and slow it down, next turn you go first, killing it. Numel is easy obviously. Oh by the way I think I'm usually level 18 going into that fight.
The ways this strat can mess up are as follows:
1. You miss a Mud Shot against Groyvle - unlikely.
2. Groyvle goes second in it's first turn - very unlikely.
3. Groyvle crits - always a chance but hasn't been happening too much.
4. Second turn, Groyvle uses Quick Attack and your defence is low enough so that it kills you - has only happened once in about 100 tries.
5. Your speed is so low that even after the mud shot, Groyvle still goes first - very unlikely as long as you check stats at level 5 to roughly determine IVs.
So add that all up and yeah, it's a pretty awkward fight unfortunately! But this strat seems to work best as far as I can tell.
Any tips/help would be appreciated, also I'll find my notes and give you a comprehensive idea of what I'm doing with Norman currently.
One of the problems is that whichever starter you choose, there will be one or two reasonable sized bumps as you put it. Torchic has a lot going for it SS but you have to grind a bit before the first Gym and also, Tate and Liza are absolute hell, the most reliable way of beating them seems to actually be going out of your way to fish up two Shapedos...
With Mudkip, the biggest three obstacles certainly seem to be May V2, Archie 1, and Norman. And I'm only counting Archie because his damn Mightyena can sand attack spam while you're setting up on him.
For May V2 my strat is as follows:
Against wailmer, use 2 x-atts and 1 x-speed, if he growls use another x-attack to compensate. Heal up then mud shot, with optimal IVs this *should* OHKO but sometimes it will take two, that's not a huge issue as long as it doesn't growl/crit in between, if it does you must compensate. She sends out Groyvle next, use mud shot, it will go first, that is absolutely vital as it uses absorb which does massive damage and heals it, (if it has truly terrible IVs this can mess up) Mud Shot will take away just over half of it's HP and slow it down, next turn you go first, killing it. Numel is easy obviously. Oh by the way I think I'm usually level 18 going into that fight.
The ways this strat can mess up are as follows:
1. You miss a Mud Shot against Groyvle - unlikely.
2. Groyvle goes second in it's first turn - very unlikely.
3. Groyvle crits - always a chance but hasn't been happening too much.
4. Second turn, Groyvle uses Quick Attack and your defence is low enough so that it kills you - has only happened once in about 100 tries.
5. Your speed is so low that even after the mud shot, Groyvle still goes first - very unlikely as long as you check stats at level 5 to roughly determine IVs.
So add that all up and yeah, it's a pretty awkward fight unfortunately! But this strat seems to work best as far as I can tell.
Any tips/help would be appreciated, also I'll find my notes and give you a comprehensive idea of what I'm doing with Norman currently.
Yeah i used the same strat for May V2 for SS except used rocktomb over mudshot (there is a dire hit or something similar right near may which can be grabbed, (it's a fairly easy fight)). As for Archie you use a guard spec to stop his mightyena sand attack working (he still uses sand attack however which is funny) while you set up with x attacks and x speeds. Norman you can use the same strat as i used in the segmented run, however you will be a level or 2 higher and just use more potions and an extra x attack. Ive lost all my notes for the SS but perhaps Ultimate Darius has them if he is still on here?
I found my SS notes on my old laptop today and figured id try to run the SS. I saved maybe 5 times (infront of some battles that my notes didnt cover properly to figure them out) so its not a total SS but it kinda is haha dunno how to say it really, but even though i saved i played the battles as if it were a SS (if that makes sense?). Anyway i just finished and i got a final time of 2.26.26 with mudkip which i think is pretty good, im not sure of the current best time or if there even is one but i think a time of 2.20-2.30 (including a fair few errors) is a good time. If you did a REALLY good SS you could probs get <2.20 but you would have to have a pretty sweet run through haha. Norman was easy using the bide strat (slightly altered) only problem would be Vigaroth scoring a crit slash, but crits tend to fuck up SS's anyway. I need a more reliable way to beat Brawly (if anyone wants to test its a level 16 marshtomp vs brawly). May v2 is easy (same method as Tiberious mentioned but using rocktomb with x accuracy over mudshot because mudshot doesnt always 2HKO). i think the hardest battle is Liza + Tate (my current method is use an x speed then spam muddy water, it works quite well but is pretty much up to luck 
which is annoying). So yeah 2.26.26. Considering this is the 1st time ive really touched Sapphire since my segmented run im pretty stoked. Any questions?
Make it so.
Good shout, Rock Tomb would have 7.5 higher base power by then so works with marginally lower IVs.
That's a great time bro, looks like I've got a fight on my hands! I'm sure you would be better at getting this done anyway but that doesn't mean I'm going to give it up easily
Oddly enough, even though he *could* easily cause problems, Brawly never has for me, his AI has always been nice enough that 2 x-attacks are enough to get rid of Machop (the problem would be if he bulks up twice then karate chops twice I think) then one-shot Makuhita. And it's nice and early too.
Against Tate and Liza I think I just pretty much spam surf and it seems to work fine, need to find/remake my notes on that though.
Good news about Norman though, I understand if you wanna keep the modified strat to yourself
Also, my skype is james_tiberius_hartley if you fancy a race sometime?
That's a great time bro, looks like I've got a fight on my hands! I'm sure you would be better at getting this done anyway but that doesn't mean I'm going to give it up easily
Oddly enough, even though he *could* easily cause problems, Brawly never has for me, his AI has always been nice enough that 2 x-attacks are enough to get rid of Machop (the problem would be if he bulks up twice then karate chops twice I think) then one-shot Makuhita. And it's nice and early too.
Against Tate and Liza I think I just pretty much spam surf and it seems to work fine, need to find/remake my notes on that though.
Good news about Norman though, I understand if you wanna keep the modified strat to yourself
Also, my skype is james_tiberius_hartley if you fancy a race sometime?
ill see if i can modify my shopping to score an extra 2 x attacks before Brawly. My Norman strat is pretty much the same as the segmented run but just heal when your health gets low so i think i use like 5 energy roots. And i dont skype (cant be bothered) but this should get quite interesting now. Its fun when you have someone to race against XD
EDIT: Just wondering, what time are you expecting? Also ill be happy to trade notes with you (mine are a bit dodgy) but I can see us getting a really great SS time for this.
EDIT: Just wondering, what time are you expecting? Also ill be happy to trade notes with you (mine are a bit dodgy) but I can see us getting a really great SS time for this.