Pokemon Colosseum

Edit history:

gia: 2008-05-20 08:20:16 pm

2008-05-20 08:19:39 pm

I love YaBB 1G - SP1!

Hi, I got a gamecube and the game and I want to run this, 100% (all shadows) or any% no idea, I'm currently waiting for a custom electricity adapter (power here is 240V), the ones I have are just 60W so they are not enough for the ngc. Since I haven't played the game any pointers on where I could gain some seconds or not would be appreciated. ie. I already read about an infinite pokeball glitch.

Also I was considering the use of a Gecko card (which i'd have to buy I guess), it allows me to save the game to my computer so I could do an any%. Is this allowed or is it "hardware modification".

Ah, also, I'd run the japanese version (cool looking orange gcn) but wouldn't include the special e-card fights because first I don't have the cards and second looks like too many fights to get those three pokemon (and then have to purify them right?). In any case that could be separated.

Thread title:

Serris

2008-05-20 08:41:20 pm

Not at all to discourage you or anything, but this would probably be the first run for a game I've played I wouldn't watch. It's basically a series of drawn-out, unskippable attack animations of the same few attacks over and over again, interrupted by lots of text, and there isn't any interesting content to remedy that. It's also a fairly linear game with very limited options. Of course, if you want to run it, go ahead, entertainment is secondary, but my main point is that there are much more interesting Pokémon games you could run.

Carcinogen

2008-05-20 08:45:36 pm

You're going to run a game you haven't played? =\

gia

2008-05-21 12:50:08 am

I love YaBB 1G - SP1!

No problem, I don't play games for the viewers, not even the record, I find planning fun, as such I like it more when the game hasn't been tackled and I can develop most if not all of the plan. Anyways being pokemon it will probably get a lot more views than other videos I've done put together ;o I'm more asking for input on running it since I "may" miss something when testing/researching and would feel very bad about that especially if big (don't tend to miss stuff but who knows this is 3d).

OTOH what pokemon game is more varied than lots of battle and text, I can only think of snap right now, mystery dungeon and ranger maybe but don't have those so can't tell, I tried snap recently but my skills with the n64 controller just plain SUCK, I consider myself bad or average at most at any action intensive game anyway. I recall doing great when I was a kid but I couldn't aim at anything now, I suppose I could plan it and leave the execution to someone else, but it would be hard since I should at least be able to aim decently to be sure something can work.

Carcinogen, yes I am, doubt I am the only one that wasn't born having played all games they run. I have run several games, one is here, another might be, but only ZAMN I can say I _have_ played before (since kid). Metal Warriors I played but never got past level 6, X-men I never figured how to do any special before!, when I played again recently I got them all within what, 10 minutes? lol, Ghouls and goblins I think (the one for snes) I had never even heard about it and got a record for level 1 after some hours playing (but then dropped the idea when realized you have to play the game twice, ew), etc.

I would understand if I was saying "mario 64" (and lets add 120 stars for fun) but this isn't a reflexes game, it's more a puzzle exercise(planning) +patience for luck, so previous experience is no problem ;o

No problem, I don't play games for the viewers, not even the record, I find planning fun, as such I like it more when the game hasn't been tackled and I can develop most if not all of the plan. Anyways being pokemon it will probably get a lot more views than other videos I've done put together ;o I'm more asking for input on running it since I "may" miss something when testing/researching and would feel very bad about that especially if big (don't tend to miss stuff but who knows this is 3d).

OTOH what pokemon game is more varied than lots of battle and text, I can only think of snap right now, mystery dungeon and ranger maybe but don't have those so can't tell, I tried snap recently but my skills with the n64 controller just plain SUCK, I consider myself bad or average at most at any action intensive game anyway. I recall doing great when I was a kid but I couldn't aim at anything now, I suppose I could plan it and leave the execution to someone else, but it would be hard since I should at least be able to aim decently to be sure something can work.

Carcinogen, yes I am, doubt I am the only one that wasn't born having played all games they run. I have run several games, one is here, another might be, but only ZAMN I can say I _have_ played before (since kid). Metal Warriors I played but never got past level 6, X-men I never figured how to do any special before!, when I played again recently I got them all within what, 10 minutes? lol, Ghouls and goblins I think (the one for snes) I had never even heard about it and got a record for level 1 after some hours playing (but then dropped the idea when realized you have to play the game twice, ew), etc.

I would understand if I was saying "mario 64" (and lets add 120 stars for fun) but this isn't a reflexes game, it's more a puzzle exercise(planning) +patience for luck, so previous experience is no problem ;o

Serris

2008-05-21 01:16:01 am

Well, there aren't any runs on the 3rd and 4th geneneration main games (Ruby/Sapphire/Emerald, Diamond/Pearl), as well as the 1st gen remakes Firered/Leafgreen. They seem to have various threads and WIPs, though, so you could help out with the planning and maybe run them yourself. You can turn off animations, battles aren't as long, they're not nearly as linear, and you have far more options regarding which Pokémon to catch/use, and the 100% runs are a planner's paradise.

ShadowLaguna

2008-05-21 03:24:48 am

THE GAME!!

Ah, I was wondering when somebody would bring this up. I found this game to be very mediocre, but I don't see many problems with running this. You'd really only be using Umbreon and Espeon for the entire run and avoid catching any Pokemon, as they have that Dark Aura shit which takes years to get down. One problem is versing the Team Snagem members, as none of them can be avoided. But all I really need to say is good luck. Oh, and because I have the PAL version of Pokemon Colosseum, I have no idea what the JP difference are.

Kryal

2008-05-21 09:47:58 am

from red to blue

I'd love to see a Colosseum run up.

petrie911

2008-05-21 10:34:29 am

Everybody loves Hypnotoad!

I made a request for this in the thread. Glad to see someone's taking it up.

As for planning, I'd say espeon and Croconaw should be your main attackers. once it gets it, STAB Psychics from espeon do a lot of damage, and Feraligatr has a fairly good movepool and can use EQ to great effect (Espy will want protect for this). Umbreon just doesn't have enough attack power.

Meditite and Quagsire are really your only good options before you start getting legendary dogs. Speaking of which, they're also quite usable if Espy/Croconaw aren't up to snuff.

Once you get the Master Ball, the Master Ball duplication glitch gives you a free KO on all shadow pokemon. It's almost certainly worth the time it takes to get.

Kryal

2008-05-21 11:15:17 am

from red to blue

Quote:

I made a request for this in the thread. Glad to see someone's taking it up.

As for planning, I'd say espeon and Croconaw should be your main attackers. once it gets it, STAB Psychics from espeon do a lot of damage, and Feraligatr has a fairly good movepool and can use EQ to great effect (Espy will want protect for this). Umbreon just doesn't have enough attack power.

Meditite and Quagsire are really your only good options before you start getting legendary dogs. Speaking of which, they're also quite usable if Espy/Croconaw aren't up to snuff.

Once you get the Master Ball, the Master Ball duplication glitch gives you a free KO on all shadow pokemon. It's almost certainly worth the time it takes to get.

And it's FABULOUS (PW/Abridged Quotes FTW^^) for 100% files.

Greenalink

Edit history:

Greenalink: 2008-05-21 11:38:46 am

2008-05-21 11:32:15 am

DS Dictator

There is a 5 battle finale but after you've completed the 4th Battle (Aquiring Shadow Metagross battle) you lose on the 5th Battle and you can continue on the 5th Battle instead of repeating the first 4.

There are 3 special flutes in the game that can instantly purify a pokémon.
Raikou has good speed and STAB electric attacks
Suicune has bulky defences and if it knows Calm mind it can be almost unstoppable.
Entei, meh only useful against a few but it gets let down by small physical move pool and slow speed I would just Shadow rush spam and prevent (unfortunate) hyper mode (if you wanted to use a different attack + turn lost when first activated).

You can also "Call" to awaken sleeping pokemon.

This walkthrough video can give out a good reminder about the final battle:

Kryal

2008-05-21 12:49:30 pm

from red to blue

Mantine completely devastates Steelix in Admin3 fight IIRC. The Suicune user.

gia

2008-05-22 12:46:23 am

I love YaBB 1G - SP1!

Quote:

Well, there aren't any runs on the 3rd and 4th geneneration main games (Ruby/Sapphire/Emerald, Diamond/Pearl), as well as the 1st gen remakes Firered/Leafgreen. They seem to have various threads and WIPs, though, so you could help out with the planning and maybe run them yourself. You can turn off animations, battles aren't as long, they're not nearly as linear, and you have far more options regarding which Pokémon to catch/use, and the 100% runs are a planner's paradise.

I would have swear RS and FL were done already, and I don't have a ds much less a digital videocamera. Anyway they got a path they just need the "perfect" recording dont they?

Thanks for pointers so far, I'll have to see if raikou+suicune can do better than espeon+x. I am still waiting for the adapter so I loaded snap again and played and the controller gave me a lot less problems A tas would get perfect scores, but right now I'm thinking 3k per species is a good goal, so 6 species and 18k points would be good (would that mean 20k would be an ok goal for a segmented speedrun? I guess :P). Problem is pester ball is required before river and you'd need 25 species before that level and I counted only like 24, and one is kangaskhan which only gives like 600 points on the first trip. Maybe a quick revisit to level 1 for surfing pikachu can do enough but no idea right now.

[quote]Well, there aren't any runs on the 3rd and 4th geneneration main games (Ruby/Sapphire/Emerald, Diamond/Pearl), as well as the 1st gen remakes Firered/Leafgreen. They seem to have various threads and WIPs, though, so you could help out with the planning and maybe run them yourself. You can turn off animations, battles aren't as long, they're not nearly as linear, and you have far more options regarding which Pokémon to catch/use, and the 100% runs are a planner's paradise.[/quote]
I would have swear RS and FL were done already, and I don't have a ds much less a digital videocamera. Anyway they got a path they just need the "perfect" recording dont they?

Thanks for pointers so far, I'll have to see if raikou+suicune can do better than espeon+x. I am still waiting for the adapter so I loaded snap again and played and the controller gave me a lot less problems http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HtuEG8bXrpc&fmt=18. A tas would get perfect scores, but right now I'm thinking 3k per species is a good goal, so 6 species and 18k points would be good (would that mean 20k would be an ok goal for a segmented speedrun? I guess :P). Problem is pester ball is required before river and you'd need 25 species before that level and I counted only like 24, and one is kangaskhan which only gives like 600 points on the first trip. Maybe a quick revisit to level 1 for surfing pikachu can do enough but no idea right now.

LordLocke

Edit history:

LordLocke: 2008-05-23 04:46:29 am

2008-05-23 04:43:29 am

Yes, it's a ninja riding an invisible jet

Colosseum would be a tricky run to do, yeah. You start with one Pokemon who can do good as a speed run center. (Espy) and one great Pokemon that is just too slow for a speed run (Umby) and you don't get a lot of good replacements early. Furthermore, you can't really get a replacement until about a third of the way through the game, since you can't level or change the moveset on Shadow Pokemon- albut Shadow Rush is a pretty brutal attack a few Pokemon can get a lot of use out of. I'd say the main options are:

Makuhita: For reasons seen in previous speed runs: Guts + Huge Attack + applied status = lots of one-turn kills. Main problem is possibly losing the extra time due to the status (Don't know if Poison or Paralysis would be the better choice for a Colosseum run- enemy animation time on extra turns due to speed reduction/FP or Poison animation and extra time spent in menus healing to maintain poison) That said, Makuhita later becomes a risky-but-speedy setup machine with Belly Drum, which can be used to turn a lot of fights absolutely trivial, Guts-abusing or not. Basically, high-risk, potentally high-payoff.

Croconaw: Possibly the only worthwhile catch in the first segment of the game for use as a Shadow Pokemon. Good attack stat, decent movepool, little slow and is probably going to be outclassed before reaching the point it can be restored but Shadow Rush for mauling stubborn foes is always handy.

Qwilfish: The only other pre-purification Pokemon I'd even consider snagging, Qwilfish is probably only worth noting for one and only one reason: That rain-dishing, slow-killing pain in the arse Miror B. This is probably the only Pokemon you can grab before this boss fight that can be expected to actually contribute to it (Qwilfish has both great speed and attack, making it a great Shadow Rusher, and both of it's possible abilities can really help out- either turning Miror B's advantage into your own, or by crippling his regen tactics with 30% poison chance) which is a plus when this is the only real boss match in the game before you can start purifying your help. Miror B's strategy will still require some luck manipulation to beat with any kind of speed still- being the regen-loving, stall-oriented jerk that he is-but unless you can somehow get Espy to one-shotting levels in a speed run, the help might be very appreciated. (I think Qwilfish can also get Pin Missile uncovered through the heart meter, one of the few super-effective attacks you can have against his Ludicolo posse at this point, but I could be wrong since it's been a while since I've played it)

Entei: Basically the best '2nd Man' once he becomes available, but probably not worth wasting a flute on unless you're really having trouble on the segment between him and one of the other Legendary Dogs. Especially since Entei's strong attack makes him a really good designated Shadow Rusher for pretty much the rest of the game.

Suicune: Comes around where you're pretty much hurting for a real 2nd Pokemon if you haven't decided to stick with Croconaw or Makuhita/Hariyama. If you can continue to hold out, I'd wait for Raikou, but Suicune will probably serve you well if you can't take riding Espy alone for kills anymore. Suicune would work great as a sweeper once TMed up... but you can't find Calm Mind (TM 04) in Colosseum to the best of my knowledge, so it's basically just a good tank with slightly better killing speed then most of it's breed. Also, snagging Suicune leaves Venus with a higher-level Milotic later, which is very, very frustrating to kill unless you can one-shot it through it's great HP and defenses, so there's merit in actually NOT snagging Suicune.

Raikou: Probably the best sweeper you can ask for before the end-game. It's main problem is that it doesn't learn it's best off-type attack (Crunch) until levels which you might not see in a speed run- or at best, at the very end of it. Still, better then most of it's alternatives. Whatever Raikou and Espy can't handle, you can tag in Shadow Rush Entei to deal with.

Granbull- Huge attack makes Granbull potentially desirable as a designated Shadow Rusher if you decide to purify Entei. Otherwise, Entei is pretty much the best Shadow Rusher you get until the after-game. (Granbull has a slightly-higher attack, but Entei is still way, way faster.)

Absol- Snagging him with an empty spot on your team would, theoretically, give you an absolutely sexy Shadow Rusher for the last four fights of the run. Unfortunately, you can't do much else with him, but if you got the space it might be worth considering using your Master Ball on, especially if you decided to take Makuhita (since otherwise the best use of it from a time perspective is probably to take out T-tar from Evice's team before he can become too much of a nuisance, which Hariyama would just murder anyways.)

Most other Pokemon I can't see worth the time snagging, except maybe, maybe Flaffy/Noctowl for cheap paralysis/sleep to help with snagging in later fights. Flaffy also evolves into Ampharos, who's amazing Special Attack stat might make it worth using while waiting for the Dog of your choice after purifying it. Vibrava might be a decent choice, two levels away from evolving into it's powerhouse final form and coming ready-packed with great moves, but it doesn't come until later in the run. (and very, very close to likely-better-option Raikou)

I'd personally grab Makuhita (purify later into Hariyama). Croconaw, Qwilfish (Miror B is probably going to be the hardest fight in a speed run, so having help is... helpful, heh), and Entei (Designated Shadow Rusher). If you want something more reliable, I'd take Raikou over Makuhita- using both would probably split XP too much, and Raikou will need a LOT of XP to get full use out of. Absol looks like a sweet last-second snag to basically pound some annoyances into gravel, but since I've never played the final fights from a speed run perspective, I haven't tried it myself to see how feasible it is.

Good luck out there!

Colosseum would be a tricky run to do, yeah.  You start with one Pokemon who can do good as a speed run center. (Espy) and one great Pokemon that is just too slow for a speed run (Umby) and you don't get a lot of good replacements early.  Furthermore, you can't really get a replacement until about a third of the way through the game, since you can't level or change the moveset on Shadow Pokemon- albut Shadow Rush is a pretty brutal attack a few Pokemon can get a lot of use out of.  I'd say the main options are:

Makuhita: For reasons seen in previous speed runs: Guts + Huge Attack + applied status = lots of one-turn kills.  Main problem is possibly losing the extra time due to the status (Don't know if Poison or Paralysis would be the better choice for a Colosseum run- enemy animation time on extra turns due to speed reduction/FP or Poison animation and extra time spent in menus healing to maintain poison)  That said, Makuhita later becomes a risky-but-speedy setup machine with Belly Drum, which can be used to turn a lot of fights absolutely trivial, Guts-abusing or not.  Basically, high-risk, potentally high-payoff.

Croconaw: Possibly the only worthwhile catch in the first segment of the game for use as a Shadow Pokemon.  Good attack stat, decent movepool, little slow and is probably going to be outclassed before reaching the point it can be restored but Shadow Rush for mauling stubborn foes is always handy.

Qwilfish: The only other pre-purification Pokemon I'd even consider snagging, Qwilfish is probably only worth noting for one and only one reason: That rain-dishing, slow-killing pain in the arse Miror B.  This is probably the only Pokemon you can grab before this boss fight that can be expected to actually contribute to it (Qwilfish has both great speed and attack, making it a great Shadow Rusher, and both of it's possible abilities can really help out- either turning Miror B's advantage into your own, or by crippling his regen tactics with 30% poison chance) which is a plus when this is the only real boss match in the game before you can start purifying your help.  Miror B's strategy will still require some luck manipulation to beat with any kind of speed still- being the regen-loving, stall-oriented jerk that he is-but unless you can somehow get Espy to one-shotting levels in a speed run, the help might be very appreciated.   (I think Qwilfish can also get Pin Missile uncovered through the heart meter, one of the few super-effective attacks you can have against his Ludicolo posse at this point, but I could be wrong since it's been a while since I've played it)

Entei: Basically the best '2nd Man' once he becomes available, but probably not worth wasting a flute on unless you're really having trouble on the segment between him and one of the other Legendary Dogs.  Especially since Entei's strong attack makes him a really good designated Shadow Rusher for pretty much the rest of the game.

Suicune: Comes around where you're pretty much hurting for a real 2nd Pokemon if you haven't decided to stick with Croconaw or Makuhita/Hariyama.  If you can continue to hold out, I'd wait for Raikou, but Suicune will probably serve you well if you can't take riding Espy alone for kills anymore.  Suicune would work great as a sweeper once TMed up... but you can't find Calm Mind (TM 04) in Colosseum to the best of my knowledge, so it's basically just a good tank with slightly better killing speed then most of it's breed.  Also, snagging Suicune leaves Venus with a higher-level Milotic later, which is very, very frustrating to kill unless you can one-shot it through it's great HP and defenses, so there's merit in actually NOT snagging Suicune.

Raikou: Probably the best sweeper you can ask for before the end-game.  It's main problem is that it doesn't learn it's best off-type attack (Crunch) until levels which you might not see in a speed run- or at best, at the very end of it.  Still, better then most of it's alternatives.  Whatever Raikou and Espy can't handle, you can tag in Shadow Rush Entei to deal with.

Granbull- Huge attack makes Granbull potentially desirable as a designated Shadow Rusher if you decide to purify Entei.  Otherwise, Entei is pretty much the best Shadow Rusher you get until the after-game.  (Granbull has a slightly-higher attack, but Entei is still way, way faster.)

Absol- Snagging him with an empty spot on your team would, theoretically, give you an absolutely sexy Shadow Rusher for the last four fights of the run.  Unfortunately, you can't do much else with him, but if you got the space it might be worth considering using your Master Ball on, especially if you decided to take Makuhita (since otherwise the best use of it from a time perspective is probably to take out T-tar from Evice's team before he can become too much of a nuisance, which Hariyama would just murder anyways.)

Most other Pokemon I can't see worth the time snagging, except maybe, maybe Flaffy/Noctowl for cheap paralysis/sleep to help with snagging in later fights.  Flaffy also evolves into Ampharos, who's amazing Special Attack stat might make it worth using while waiting for the Dog of your choice after purifying it.  Vibrava might be a decent choice, two levels away from evolving into it's powerhouse final form and coming ready-packed with great moves, but it doesn't come until later in the run.  (and very, very close to likely-better-option Raikou)

I'd personally grab Makuhita (purify later into Hariyama). Croconaw, Qwilfish (Miror B is probably going to be the hardest fight in a speed run, so having help is... helpful, heh), and Entei (Designated Shadow Rusher).  If you want something more reliable, I'd take Raikou over Makuhita- using both would probably split XP too much, and Raikou will need a LOT of XP to get full use out of.  Absol looks like a sweet last-second snag to basically pound some annoyances into gravel, but since I've never played the final fights from a speed run perspective, I haven't tried it myself to see how feasible it is.

Good luck out there!

petrie911

2008-05-23 07:50:30 pm

Everybody loves Hypnotoad!

I think the EXP splitting means that you're going to have to choose one of Makuhita, Croconaw, or Entei to use. You're also going to have to purify them at some point, as they simply won't be high enough leveled at the end if you don't.

Here's base stats for the pokemon in question.

Makuhita
HP:72
At:60
Df:30
sA:20
sD:30
Sp:25

Hariyama
HP:144
At:120
Df:60
sA:40
sD:60
Sp:50

Croconaw
HP:65
At:80
Df:80
sA:59
sD:63
Sp:58

Feraligatr
HP:85
At:105
Df:100
sA:79
sD:83
Sp:78

Entei
HP:115
At:115
Df:85
sA:90
sD:75
Sp:100

Entei can't get EQ, and generally has no other physical attacks than stomp once purified. However, Fire blast right off the bat is quite nice, although Solarbeam is not available in a run. Could still help in Dakim's sunnybeaming battle, and Sunny Day can mess with Miror B. Could be caught if the team needs some support in the bigger battles (Venus, Ein).

Hariyama has that juicy attack stat, but has very disappointing speed. However, Brick Break is not available, so you'll need either a good HP fighting or rely on Vital Throw. Cross Chop may have a lot of power, but low PP and accuracy make it ill-fitted for random battles. Vital Throw makes Hariyama go last, which is really not advisable. Additionally, it gets no other viable attacks naturally, and only EQ through the available TMs. May be one to catch anyway to help out if things prove too much for the main two.

Feraligatr has Surf and Bite right off the bat, and quickly learns slash. Leer actually works rather well in doubles, and EQ is still there. It's also a better shadow rusher than Makuhita, as its attack is higher. Surf helps greatly in the battle with Dakim, and if you keep Rain Dance on Feraligatr, you can turn the tide in the sunnybeam battle.

Qwilfish can help with Miror B., and Meditite has a good enough attack that it's probably worth grabbing. But they're more one-time things.

At the end, Heracross and Absol can make good ringers, as you'll be masterballing everything in sight at that point, and those are in the first 4 you get. Skarmory and Miltank, the other two, aren't bad either.

So I'm thinking the best course is Feraligatr and Espeon, with Makuhita, Qwilfish, Meditite, and Entei as backups if necessary. Later, drop them in the PC, and Heracross, Skarmory, Absol and Miltank can be backups in the final fights.

Oh, and as for Suicune and Raikou, the ease with which they can be killed compared to their replacements, as well as their somwhat lacking combat prowess off the bat probably warrants not snagging them.

I think the EXP splitting means that you're going to have to choose one of Makuhita, Croconaw, or Entei to use.  You're also going to have to purify them at some point, as they simply won't be high enough leveled at the end if you don't.

Here's base stats for the pokemon in question.

Makuhita
HP:72
At:60
Df:30
sA:20
sD:30
Sp:25

Hariyama
HP:144
At:120
Df:60
sA:40
sD:60
Sp:50

Croconaw
HP:65
At:80
Df:80
sA:59
sD:63
Sp:58

Feraligatr
HP:85
At:105
Df:100
sA:79
sD:83
Sp:78

Entei
HP:115
At:115
Df:85
sA:90
sD:75
Sp:100

Entei can't get EQ, and generally has no other physical attacks than stomp once purified.  However, Fire blast right off the bat is quite nice, although Solarbeam is not available in a run.  Could still help in Dakim's sunnybeaming battle, and Sunny Day can mess with Miror B.  Could be caught if the team needs some support in the bigger battles (Venus, Ein).

Hariyama has that juicy attack stat, but has very disappointing speed.  However, Brick Break is not available, so you'll need either a good HP fighting or rely on Vital Throw.  Cross Chop may have a lot of power, but low PP and accuracy make it ill-fitted for random battles.  Vital Throw makes Hariyama go last, which is really not advisable.  Additionally, it gets no other viable attacks naturally, and only EQ through the available TMs.  May be one to catch anyway to help out if things prove too much for the main two.

Feraligatr has Surf and Bite right off the bat, and quickly learns slash.  Leer actually works rather well in doubles, and EQ is still there.  It's also a better shadow rusher than Makuhita, as its attack is higher.  Surf helps greatly in the battle with Dakim, and if you keep Rain Dance on Feraligatr, you can turn the tide in the sunnybeam battle.

Qwilfish can help with Miror B., and Meditite has a good enough attack that it's probably worth grabbing.  But they're more one-time things.

At the end, Heracross and Absol can make good ringers, as you'll be masterballing everything in sight at that point, and those are in the first 4 you get.  Skarmory and Miltank, the other two, aren't bad either.

So I'm thinking the best course is Feraligatr and Espeon, with Makuhita, Qwilfish, Meditite, and Entei as backups if necessary.  Later, drop them in the PC, and Heracross, Skarmory, Absol and Miltank can be backups in the final fights.

Oh, and as for Suicune and Raikou, the ease with which they can be killed compared to their replacements, as well as their somwhat lacking combat prowess off the bat probably warrants not snagging them.

kablay

2008-05-30 06:43:44 pm

I love SDA!

I don't care what anyone else says, but that game is magical to me :3 I'd totally love to see a speed run of that game, and I would totally watch it. Play on!

gia

Edit history:

gia: 2008-05-31 10:37:10 am

2008-05-30 10:25:30 pm

I love YaBB 1G - SP1!

I played using Espeon and Croconaw skipping everything but a great ball to catch tough/quick opponents and everything went more or less smooth until Mantine's battle. There were many battles where none could get ohkos though, so Umbreon would have been just as good seeing how it can also flinch opponents. I caught Makuhita, Furret and Meditite, the others were fainted.

Mantine has "huge" defenses, is good offensively and has very low catch rate so it's going to be annoying. I don't see Flaafy helping being just a flaafy and having spark at best, or would it be just tshock?. Miror B took long but wasn't hard (well they didn't use grass on croconaw until the end).

Then when I got to battle 8 on Mt Battle, everything became extremely harder and finally lost vs. the boss since I wasn't expecting him to switch strategy and go for kills by combining attacks (and I dont mean protect + EQ).

Well I still haven't seen if Feraligatr makes up for the trouble. Also would have to check "stronger" pokes at this stage, like those I caught, plus Mantine, and if all also take 2 turns for most things then Umbreon since it also does but would get levels along the way.

I played using Espeon and Croconaw skipping everything but a great ball to catch tough/quick opponents and everything went more or less smooth until Mantine's battle. There were many battles where none could get ohkos though, so Umbreon would have been just as good seeing how it can also flinch opponents. I caught Makuhita, Furret and Meditite, the others were fainted.

Mantine has "huge" defenses, is good offensively and has very low catch rate so it's going to be annoying. I don't see Flaafy helping being just a flaafy and having spark at best, or would it be just tshock?. Miror B took long but wasn't hard (well they didn't use grass on croconaw until the end).

Then when I got to battle 8 on Mt Battle, everything became extremely harder and finally lost vs. the boss since I wasn't expecting him to switch strategy and go for kills by combining attacks (and I dont mean protect + EQ).

Well I still haven't seen if Feraligatr makes up for the trouble. Also would have to check "stronger" pokes at this stage, like those I caught, plus Mantine, and if all also take 2 turns for most things then Umbreon since it also does but would get levels along the way.

SmashKing/SK!Z$L3TZ

2008-06-06 09:16:30 pm

I am not a NERD or a GEEK I am a N33K

for 100 percent to catch all the shadow pokemon just use the infinite master ball glitch

Greenalink

2008-06-07 05:39:25 am

DS Dictator

Quote:

for 100 percent to catch all the shadow pokemon just use the infinite master ball glitch

You can only get the master ball at the last part of the game, also some shadow PKMN have a limited appearance from NPCs (Entei only appears twice and if you fail to capture it, it won't come back).

SmashKing/SK!Z$L3TZ

2008-06-07 07:34:55 am

I am not a NERD or a GEEK I am a N33K

but the glitch lets you turn other items into masterballs before you get one i think

gia

2008-06-07 08:57:24 am

I love YaBB 1G - SP1!

lol no, but it lets you use unlimited pokeballs/great balls/ultras (whatever you got) yeah

SmashKing/SK!Z$L3TZ

2008-06-07 03:19:41 pm

I am not a NERD or a GEEK I am a N33K

oh nvm then

finalgamer23

2008-06-16 10:15:19 pm

slice of pie

I am going to highly try to do this speed run as soon as i can get some free time..
I won't be able to record..

(I have a gamebridge that i got in mail months ago but when i put the system hooked up to it then pc it just wont work)

Yes but here is how i consider doing the speed run...

Segment 1:
Very easy as cake...just use Espeon and Umbreon on all enemies you are forced to fight.
Save the girl and go catch your shadow Makuhita.
Store it in PC ....you wont be needing that piece of crap any time soon...

Segemnt 2:
Hopefully your Umbreon and Espeon are now at level 36-37 thanks to those other fights.
I recommend catching a shadow Noctowl,Misdreavus for now.
Keep them and then keep playing..the heart gauge will begin to open soon.
Go to the tournament and compete.
Then once inside go back and save..its going to be a long annoying path to Miror B. now..

Segment 3:
Not a whole lot to say but fight..considering you cant really dodge these morons..(unless theres a glitch i dont know about)
Keep in mind.Just because you see a shadow pokemon doesnt mean it needs to be caught.
Also..save at the Pc in sewers and heal up.

Segment 4:
Its nice to see you powered through them right?
Keep going and get to Mirior B.
make sure you have this..
Umbreon lvl 39
Espeon lvl 40-41
shadow noctowl
Shadow misdreavus
both shadows should be nearly ready to open..
Just pummel Miror B.'s 4 Ludicolos to nothing and defeat the sudowoodo.
Sudowoodo wont be really that great to have anyway...
YOu should now have a Plusle in your party.
id recommened storing it away for now.
Its just way to low level wise to be of use right now.

Segment 5:
Time to go to Agate village.
this is were the fun beguns.
talk to the girls grandparents then go to the Celebi shrine thing.
after some rather tedious running and crap you have to come back again.
A shadow hitmontop?
just destroy it..its really not useful to you anyway.
after you do that..dont pick up the report yet.
Purify Misdreavus and noctowl
Misdreavus should now be level 37-42
same for noctowl and know some new moves.
go to the poke center and get 5 great balls or poke balls.Id get the poke balls.
now save your game

Segemnt 6:
Talk to her parents again and listen to crap about Mt. Battle
Go to mt. battle
Nothing special really.
Just going through area 1
most of the people will be weak.
Just be careful of of the shadow Entei user.
its at level 40.
by now..the 4 pokemon will have no prob.
pummel the guy and get your time flute.

i'll continue with how i do segemnts 7-12 tommorow.

your total time as of now should be if you were quick enough as i was.
1 hour and 08 minutes total.

I am going to highly try to do this speed run as soon as i can get some free time..
I won't be able to record..

(I have a gamebridge that i got in mail months ago but when i put the system hooked up to it then pc it just wont work)

Yes but here is how i consider doing the speed run...

Segment 1:
Very easy as cake...just use Espeon and Umbreon on all enemies you are forced to fight.
Save the girl and go catch your shadow Makuhita.
Store it in PC ....you wont be needing that piece of crap any time soon...

Segemnt 2:
Hopefully your Umbreon and Espeon are now at level 36-37 thanks to those other fights.
I recommend catching a shadow Noctowl,Misdreavus for now.
Keep them and then keep playing..the heart gauge will begin to open soon.
Go to the tournament and compete.
Then once inside go back and save..its going to be a long annoying path to Miror B. now..

Segment 3:
Not a whole lot to say but fight..considering you cant really dodge these morons..(unless theres a glitch i dont know about)
Keep in mind.Just because you see a shadow pokemon doesnt mean it needs to be caught.
Also..save at the Pc in sewers and heal up.

Segment 4:
Its nice to see you powered through them right?
Keep going and get to Mirior B.
make sure you have this..
Umbreon lvl 39
Espeon lvl 40-41
shadow noctowl
Shadow misdreavus
both shadows should be nearly ready to open..
Just pummel Miror B.'s 4 Ludicolos to nothing and defeat the sudowoodo.
Sudowoodo wont be really that great to have anyway...
YOu should now have a Plusle in your party.
id recommened storing it away for now.
Its just way to low level wise to be of use right now.

Segment 5:
Time to go to Agate village.
this is were the fun beguns.
talk to the girls grandparents then go to the Celebi shrine thing.
after some rather tedious running and crap you have to come back again.
A shadow hitmontop?
just destroy it..its really not useful to you anyway.
after you do that..dont pick up the report yet.
Purify Misdreavus and noctowl
Misdreavus should now be level 37-42
same for noctowl and know some new moves.
go to the poke center and get 5 great balls or poke balls.Id get the poke balls.
now save your game

Segemnt 6:
Talk to her parents again and listen to crap about Mt. Battle
Go to mt. battle
Nothing special really.
Just going through area 1
most of the people will be weak.
Just be careful of of the shadow Entei user.
its at level 40.
by now..the 4 pokemon will have no prob.
pummel the guy and get your time flute.

i'll continue with how i do segemnts 7-12 tommorow.

your total time as of now should be if you were quick enough as i was.
1 hour and 08 minutes total.

gia

2008-06-17 12:40:26 am

I love YaBB 1G - SP1!

uh, but if you are going to try you should record lol, go to tech support forum ;o, you can get a cheap capture card too, it will work fine.

Nitpicks dont visit the pkmn box so often, if you are going to deposit both makuhita and plusle you can do so in one visit, what starter are you going to get, are you gonna deposit it too?

Get a great ball at the Outskirt and use that with the duplication glitch.

At agate there are ultra balls, I'd get those and use the glitch so you dont run out of them.

Your route doesn't seem to use Croconaw, so it will be good for comparison Smiley

finalgamer23

2008-06-17 12:00:22 pm

slice of pie

Quote from gia:

uh, but if you are going to try you should record lol, go to tech support forum ;o, you can get a cheap capture card too, it will work fine.

Nitpicks dont visit the pkmn box so often, if you are going to deposit both makuhita and plusle you can do so in one visit, what starter are you going to get, are you gonna deposit it too?

Get a great ball at the Outskirt and use that with the duplication glitch.

At agate there are ultra balls, I'd get those and use the glitch so you dont run out of them.

Your route doesn't seem to use Croconaw, so it will be good for comparison Smiley

I dont use the starters.
to save time i go catch bayleef.
Its closest to the exit and use it for a but then deposit.
you still have to use Umbreon,Espeo,noctowl,misdreavus a lot
I use them simply because they can learn the widest variety of attacks
Misdreavus can learn a water attack later

gia

2008-06-24 03:08:22 pm

I love YaBB 1G - SP1!

Been replaying and this time evolved croconaw before mt battle, and feraligatr did it with no trouble. Then I kept playing without issues until Venus, Espeon + Fera can take on any of their pokes the problem is that not all of them at once. Once both banette and vileplume are out it becomes easier, thing is keeping espeon alive that long.

After that battle no issues until the research lab, since I am not using X items and also didn't catch quagsire its hell. I'll have to catch entei to get that fire blast for the magneton, or get quagsire maybe since the boss uses water/electric. For segmented 70 HP ground would rock ;o