New Super Mario Bros. Wii

2009-12-11 02:07:19 pm

Thanks. I just finished 100% on my file this morning, so I'm working on the actual speed run now.

And UCPro, I improved your 1-1 all star coins route, though in the process made it a lot harder. I could get as high as 444.

UCpro

2009-12-11 02:21:57 pm

Quote from neskamikaze:

And UCPro, I improved your 1-1 all star coins route, though in the process made it a lot harder. I could get as high as 444.

cool ... can't wait to see a video Smiley

neskamikaze

2009-12-11 04:06:12 pm

Quote from UCpro:

Quote from neskamikaze:

And UCPro, I improved your 1-1 all star coins route, though in the process made it a lot harder. I could get as high as 444.

cool ... can't wait to see a video Smiley

Well here you go:

The level cuts off after the pipe room because this one time that I got all of this right I screwed up the end of the level, but still wanted to show the improvements. I leave the pipe at 455 while you left it at 453.

MAS8705

2009-12-11 10:07:32 pm

SDA Apprentice -- (3-1)

I found a more updated version of the red mushroom house... Kudos to gamefaqs.com for the map...

If there was a strategy that had to do with getting just one penguin suit and wrapping it up, this could help speed things up a bit...

I don't know if this actually does help in situations such as SS, but for any multisegmented runs, this could be a simple but effective way of getting the power ups you want/need...

Mr. Piggy

2009-12-12 12:45:03 pm

In the infinite

Quote from neskamikaze:

Well here you go:

The level cuts off after the pipe room because this one time that I got all of this right I screwed up the end of the level, but still wanted to show the improvements. I leave the pipe at 455 while you left it at 453.

Very nice Nes, what time should I add to the route? 444?

Also, that pic will make things quite a bit easier, nice find.

neskamikaze

Edit history:

neskamikaze: 2009-12-12 02:42:53 pm

2009-12-12 12:58:07 pm

I did see that Mushroom Map, and the amount of time you can save in water levels with a penguin suit is worth getting more than one, I just need to test where it is best fit.

And yeah, 444 is what you could probably add. My final time on the segment will be either 443 or 444, but hopefully 444.

Edit: While you're at it, change your 1-3 time to 442 Tongue

Saestrol

2009-12-14 09:38:37 am

Speed Running Joy-bringer

Quote from MAS8705:

If there was a strategy that had to do with getting just one penguin suit and wrapping it up, this could help speed things up a bit...

Basically, memorize the optimal set, then reload until the game hands you that set. Once you get the items you need, get the Bowser heads to end it quickly... something like that? But you would have to do a Mushroom House in World 3 or higher to get a Penguin Suit.

I think it will be necessary to mark down exactly how many items will be collected and then plot where they will be used. For example:

A) 1 Mini-Mushroom could be used for 6-6 if you had ungodly memory of how to get the Coins without being able to see. Since you are running on the water, you wouldn't have to wait for the slow Tilt Raft 1 time (or maybe both times)

B) 1 Penguin Suit has to be reserved for 8-4 because the time saved is huge compared to regular swimming.

neskamikaze

2009-12-14 09:31:14 pm

I've noticed that it might almost be worth it to get a few Penguin Suits. Even for 1-4 it saves a lot of time, considering that because of the increased speed of swimming you don't even need to freeze the urchin to get the 3rd coin. Maybe get the house in World 5?

MAS8705

2009-12-15 05:54:51 pm

SDA Apprentice -- (3-1)

It makes me sad that I can't play NSMBWii well enough to perform a speed run, but all the same, that doesn't mean I can't help come up with some idea of a strategy...

Quote from Saestrol:

Basically, memorize the optimal set, then reload until the game hands you that set. Once you get the items you need, get the Bowser heads to end it quickly... something like that? But you would have to do a Mushroom House in World 3 or higher to get a Penguin Suit.

You forget, if you use the cannon before 1-4, that takes you to world 5... Then once you collect a penguin suit, (and even a mini mushroom and a spare propeller suit if the runner decides to get it) then you can go back and continue from there (or however the running chooses to approach the run form there)...

Besides, in some idea, the penguin suit is just like a "nerfed" blue shell... it doesn't allow you to exactly bounce off the walls, but it still plow through alot of enemies all the same... If I'm not mistaken, there are a few stages where you don't really need to utilize the propeller suit, but as for using the penguin suit for an extended use, that could be a problem...

Still though, that red mushroom map on gamefaqs.com can help make run by much easier if you have the power ups you need before starting the stage...

It makes me sad that I can't play NSMBWii well enough to perform a speed run, but all the same, that doesn't mean I can't help come up with some idea of a strategy...

[quote="Saestrol"]
Basically, memorize the optimal set, then reload until the game hands you that set. Once you get the items you need, get the Bowser heads to end it quickly... something like that? But you would have to do a Mushroom House in World 3 or higher to get a Penguin Suit.[/quote]

You forget, if you use the cannon before 1-4, that takes you to world 5... Then once you collect a penguin suit, (and even a mini mushroom and a spare propeller suit if the runner decides to get it) then you can go back and continue from there (or however the running chooses to approach the run form there)...

Besides, in some idea, the penguin suit is just like a "nerfed" blue shell... it doesn't allow you to exactly bounce off the walls, but it still plow through alot of enemies all the same...  If I'm not mistaken, there are a few stages where you don't really need to utilize the propeller suit, but as for using the penguin suit for an extended use, that could be a problem...

Still though, that red mushroom map on gamefaqs.com can help make run by much easier if you have the power ups you need before starting the stage...

neskamikaze

Edit history:

neskamikaze: 2009-12-17 01:14:21 pm

2009-12-15 08:15:52 pm

The penguin suit moves a little slower when sliding than a normal run, so sliding through all of the enemies isn't the most optimal method. However you are right, there are levels that don't need the propeller suit to efficiently run through it and ice can be helpful (see my 1-6 video) so it has non-water level applications. Most of the time though the propeller suit is most useful.

Edit: I don't know if I'm going to be able to do this run. I've put in an estimated 1000 attempts into the first segment, and still haven't produced favorable results. If this is just the first segment then the rest are going to be worse. I have the skill to develop the fastest possible routes, but I don't have the consistency to pull off 3 or 4 in a row.

UCpro

2009-12-17 07:38:02 pm

Quote from neskamikaze:

Edit: I don't know if I'm going to be able to do this run. I've put in an estimated 1000 attempts into the first segment, and still haven't produced favorable results. If this is just the first segment then the rest are going to be worse. I have the skill to develop the fastest possible routes, but I don't have the consistency to pull off 3 or 4 in a row.

wow, that many attempts already? maybe don't shoot for absolute perfection ... that seems to be the reason why so many people don't finish runs (or even start them). What times did you get for your best attempt?

Mr. Piggy

2009-12-17 07:46:34 pm

In the infinite

Please don't be so hasty to quit the run (like me ;)), like UCPro said, maybe try not to shoot for absolute perfection. If you already put in around 1,000 tries just in this one segment in this amount of time, then you might end up burning yourself out. Maybe try to spread the playing time out a little more?

neskamikaze

2009-12-17 08:48:43 pm

Quote from UCpro:

Quote from neskamikaze:

Edit: I don't know if I'm going to be able to do this run. I've put in an estimated 1000 attempts into the first segment, and still haven't produced favorable results. If this is just the first segment then the rest are going to be worse. I have the skill to develop the fastest possible routes, but I don't have the consistency to pull off 3 or 4 in a row.

wow, that many attempts already? maybe don't shoot for absolute perfection ... that seems to be the reason why so many people don't finish runs (or even start them). What times did you get for your best attempt?

Well, most ended in less than a minute screwing up getting the propeller mushroom. I am a bit of a perfectionist, I was going for only accepting runs if they got all 3 levels on the best possible time (443, 437, and 442). My new 1-1 strategy is driving me nuts, ground pounding the propeller box and doing the perfect jump to grab the mushroom without hitting the Goomba is so much harder than it looks. I'd say I only could get a level past that part once in 30 tries or so, and even then I would mess up the end half the time.
In all of those runs I only made 2 of them that were acceptable to me to 1-3, and one Mario wouldn't jump when I pushed 2 (and the Wii-mote almost went through the wall I was so mad) and the other I was 1 second short. I made a 441 instead of a 442 and I didn't take it and deleted the footage.

Quote from Mr. Piggy:

Please don't be so hasty to quit the run (like me ;)), like UCPro said, maybe try not to shoot for absolute perfection. If you already put in around 1,000 tries just in this one segment in this amount of time, then you might end up burning yourself out. Maybe try to spread the playing time out a little more?

I said I don't know, I haven't given up yet. I play it 1 hour blocks (since that's about all my computer can hold) and have done a few of those a day. It pains me to not go for perfection, but I might have to if I want to do this.
That being said, if I took UCPro's 1-1 strategy, which is a second slower, than I could probably have the segment done in less than 50 tries. That's how much 1-1 has frustrated me.

[quote="UCpro"]
[quote="neskamikaze"]
Edit: I don't know if I'm going to be able to do this run. I've put in an estimated 1000 attempts into the first segment, and still haven't produced favorable results. If this is just the first segment then the rest are going to be worse. I have the skill to develop the fastest possible routes, but I don't have the consistency to pull off 3 or 4 in a row.
[/quote]

wow, that many attempts already?  maybe don't shoot for absolute perfection ... that seems to be the reason why so many people don't finish runs (or even start them).  What times did you get for your best attempt?
[/quote]

Well, most ended in less than a minute screwing up getting the propeller mushroom. I am a bit of a perfectionist, I was going for only accepting runs if they got all 3 levels on the best possible time (443, 437, and 442). My new 1-1 strategy is driving me nuts, ground pounding the propeller box and doing the perfect jump to grab the mushroom without hitting the Goomba is so much harder than it looks. I'd say I only could get a level past that part once in 30 tries or so, and even then I would mess up the end half the time.
In all of those runs I only made 2 of them that were acceptable to me to 1-3, and one Mario wouldn't jump when I pushed 2 (and the Wii-mote almost went through the wall I was so mad) and the other I was 1 second short. I made a 441 instead of a 442 and I didn't take it and deleted the footage.

[quote="Mr. Piggy"]
Please don't be so hasty to quit the run (like me ;)), like UCPro said, maybe try not to shoot for absolute perfection. If you already put in around 1,000 tries just in this one segment in this amount of time, then you might end up burning yourself out. Maybe try to spread the playing time out a little more? 
[/quote]

I said I don't know, I haven't given up yet. I play it 1 hour blocks (since that's about all my computer can hold) and have done a few of those a day. It pains me to not go for perfection, but I might have to if I want to do this. 
That being said, if I took UCPro's 1-1 strategy, which is a second slower, than I could probably have the segment done in less than 50 tries. That's how much 1-1 has frustrated me.

UCpro

2009-12-18 12:23:42 am

Quote from neskamikaze:

That being said, if I took UCPro's 1-1 strategy, which is a second slower, than I could probably have the segment done in less than 50 tries. That's how much 1-1 has frustrated me.

well, it's your decision which way you want to go. I don't see any problem using my strat for 1-1 and then perfecting everything else.

I found some time to work on the any% run again, here's World 8-7 in 340 ... 341 looks out of reach

neskamikaze

2009-12-18 08:55:49 am

You missed a red coin! Lol, looks good.

I might try to get it recorded today.

UCpro

2009-12-18 06:51:12 pm

Quote from neskamikaze:

I might try to get it recorded today.

your doing 1-1 - 1-3 for your 2nd segment right? ... leaving the intro movie as it's own separate segment 1. just wanted to check and make sure that was what you're doing.

i re-did World 1-2 ... it's now at 455 which is the target time for the any% speedrun

neskamikaze

2009-12-18 06:59:11 pm

Quote from UCpro:

Quote from neskamikaze:

I might try to get it recorded today.

your doing 1-1 - 1-3 for your 2nd segment right? ... leaving the intro movie as it's own separate segment 1. just wanted to check and make sure that was what you're doing.

i re-did World 1-2 ... it's now at 455 which is the target time for the any% speedrun

That's correct. I'd go crazy if I had to watch that movie every time. I tried for about 45 minutes today and didn't get it, but I can't expect great results first thing in the morning. I've been playing much more DKC3 today.

And 1-2 looks nice, only a couple more levels to plan out and this is going to be a really good looking run. After you do the segmented run, do you think you would attempt a SS?

UCpro

2009-12-18 07:04:33 pm

Quote from neskamikaze:

Quote from UCpro:

Quote from neskamikaze:

I might try to get it recorded today.

your doing 1-1 - 1-3 for your 2nd segment right? ... leaving the intro movie as it's own separate segment 1. just wanted to check and make sure that was what you're doing.

i re-did World 1-2 ... it's now at 455 which is the target time for the any% speedrun

That's correct. I'd go crazy if I had to watch that movie every time. I tried for about 45 minutes today and didn't get it, but I can't expect great results first thing in the morning. I've been playing much more DKC3 today.

And 1-2 looks nice, only a couple more levels to plan out and this is going to be a really good looking run. After you do the segmented run, do you think you would attempt a SS?

yeah, it's always nice to do segmented runs first, as practice, and then do SS runs. But yeah, I'm gonna do a SS any% run. It should be a nice game to SS speedrun because there will always be improvements ... based on the difficulty of the run. It'll be nice to see what time i get for the segmented run and see how SS attempts will stack up next to it. I'll probably start the run next month.

[quote="neskamikaze"]
[quote="UCpro"]
[quote="neskamikaze"]
I might try to get it recorded today.
[/quote]

your doing 1-1 - 1-3 for your 2nd segment right? ... leaving the intro movie as it's own separate segment 1.  just wanted to check and make sure that was what you're doing.

i re-did [url=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=r_BVJBjpK5s]World 1-2[/url] ... it's now at 455 which is the target time for the any% speedrun
[/quote]

That's correct. I'd go crazy if I had to watch that movie every time. I tried for about 45 minutes today and didn't get it, but I can't expect great results first thing in the morning. I've been playing much more DKC3 today.

And 1-2 looks nice, only a couple more levels to plan out and this is going to be a really good looking run. After you do the segmented run, do you think you would attempt a SS?
[/quote]

yeah, it's always nice to do segmented runs first, as practice, and then do SS runs.  But yeah, I'm gonna do a SS any% run.  It should be a nice game to SS speedrun because there will always be improvements ... based on the difficulty of the run.  It'll be nice to see what time i get for the segmented run and see how SS attempts will stack up next to it.  I'll probably start the run next month.

neskamikaze

2009-12-18 07:55:39 pm

Cool, I'll be looking forward to it. I need to find a way to balance all of these projects I want to do, as I want to go back to my N64 runs I already started, but I'd like this one to be done more. Then I want to DKC3 and a couple others... oh well. I'll give this another go once the Rockets are done beating the Mavericks Tongue

DK28

2009-12-18 08:38:08 pm

General Kong - Bullets and Bananas

Quote from UCpro:

yeah, it's always nice to do segmented runs first, as practice, and then do SS runs. But yeah, I'm gonna do a SS any% run. It should be a nice game to SS speedrun because there will always be improvements ... based on the difficulty of the run. It'll be nice to see what time i get for the segmented run and see how SS attempts will stack up next to it. I'll probably start the run next month.

How funny, I've been watching this thread with much anticipation. Since you were doing the segmented any% and it looked like neskamikaze was doing the segmented 100%, I was thinking about maybe tackling the SS any%. I needed to do some practicing before committing to anything though.

UCpro

2009-12-18 08:59:52 pm

Quote from DK28:

Quote from UCpro:

yeah, it's always nice to do segmented runs first, as practice, and then do SS runs. But yeah, I'm gonna do a SS any% run. It should be a nice game to SS speedrun because there will always be improvements ... based on the difficulty of the run. It'll be nice to see what time i get for the segmented run and see how SS attempts will stack up next to it. I'll probably start the run next month.

How funny, I've been watching this thread with much anticipation. Since you were doing the segmented any% and it looked like neskamikaze was doing the segmented 100%, I was thinking about maybe tackling the SS any%. I needed to do some practicing before committing to anything though.

cool, it'd be nice to see someone work on the SS any% run ... i won't get to it until i'm done with the segmented run, which will probably take quite some time. The any% route is almost done. I've got to figure out the last 2 levels, and then go back and refine some of the others.

good luck if you decide to try out the SS ... i have a feeling it's going to be a rough ride with 5-1, 5-4 and basically all of World 8, not to mention the luck needed to make sure you get the 5-2 route

[quote="DK28"]
[quote="UCpro"]
yeah, it's always nice to do segmented runs first, as practice, and then do SS runs.  But yeah, I'm gonna do a SS any% run.  It should be a nice game to SS speedrun because there will always be improvements ... based on the difficulty of the run.  It'll be nice to see what time i get for the segmented run and see how SS attempts will stack up next to it.  I'll probably start the run next month.
[/quote]

How funny, I've been watching this thread with much anticipation.  Since you were doing the segmented any% and it looked like neskamikaze was doing the segmented 100%, I was thinking about maybe tackling the SS any%.  I needed to do some practicing before committing to anything though.
[/quote]

cool, it'd be nice to see someone work on the SS any% run ... i won't get to it until i'm done with the segmented run, which will probably take quite some time.  The any% route is almost done.  I've got to figure out the last 2 levels, and then go back and refine some of the others.

good luck if you decide to try out the SS ... i have a feeling it's going to be a rough ride with 5-1, 5-4 and basically all of World 8, not to mention the luck needed to make sure you get the 5-2 route

DK28

2009-12-18 09:08:53 pm

General Kong - Bullets and Bananas

Quote from UCpro:

cool, it'd be nice to see someone work on the SS any% run ... i won't get to it until i'm done with the segmented run, which will probably take quite some time. The any% route is almost done. I've got to figure out the last 2 levels, and then go back and refine some of the others.

good luck if you decide to try out the SS ... i have a feeling it's going to be a rough ride with 5-1, 5-4 and basically all of World 8, not to mention the luck needed to make sure you get the 5-2 route

the 5-2 route is definitely a sticking point. Also the helicopter hat. Are we essentially looking at a no-hit run to keep it? Makes the biggest difference in 5-4 and 8-1.

neskamikaze

2009-12-18 09:20:13 pm

It also allows for some very nice skips in 8-Airship, so it would probably be best to go for a no-hit run.

UCpro

2009-12-18 09:26:40 pm

well, you can get another propeller cap quickly at the Airship ... so it could be possible to lose it, say, in 8-1 ... but the best case scenario would be a little more cautious to make sure you get a no-hit run. Boy, just thinking about the SS is making me nervous ... it's going to be tough

DK28

2009-12-18 09:48:26 pm

General Kong - Bullets and Bananas

From what I've done. The difference, just using regular Mario, is about 7-8 seconds between 5-2 and 5-3. So there is something more to be explored there. And in regards to the copter, I would just hope some conservative play, to keep it, would still look good.