New Metroidvania - Operation Smash

Heidrage

Edit history:

Heidrage: 2013-07-26 04:54:16 pm

2013-07-26 04:53:10 pm

Willing to teach you the impossible

request for future vids, a quick show of the map at the start

Why do you have dots on your map?

LLCoolDave

2013-07-26 04:54:50 pm

Those are the ghosts of your friends, the time machine room has an upgrade that displays them.

Heidrage

2013-07-26 04:55:26 pm

Willing to teach you the impossible

I guess that is what you get for trying to break the game...

Onin

2013-07-26 05:39:02 pm

After exploring the area Dave broke into, I found an inactive golem. I have no idea how to interact with it. The map gives the room a little icon so I guess it's important.
The jungle area has a pretty big upgrade, that costs 9999 gold to unlock.

Heidrage

Edit history:

Heidrage: 2013-07-26 05:56:25 pm

Heidrage: 2013-07-26 05:48:36 pm

2013-07-26 05:46:45 pm

Willing to teach you the impossible

Here is my current stats: 210 health, about 65 bombs and the map. And i have 47555 gold

Edit: I would sell my soul for some fire protect and a change in one game mechanic.

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Heidrage

2013-07-26 06:11:54 pm

Willing to teach you the impossible

I just found an upgrade that costs 99,999 gold. I want it.

LLCoolDave

Edit history:

LLCoolDave: 2013-07-27 04:00:39 am

LLCoolDave: 2013-07-27 03:52:50 am

LLCoolDave: 2013-07-27 01:55:45 am

2013-07-26 11:12:35 pm

The Giant Golems take the power cells from the Time Machine room.

We can certainly get the 9999 item right after bombs if we can find the money. There's a 2500 gold orb in the room right before it that we should be able to reach without double jump but I have no idea where to get 6.5k more from.

Just got the Super Grenades, but it involved a double bomb jump double jump into Bouncy Hammer bounce, not sure if this actually breaks anything or if you should be able to get them yet.

Just finished the game, completion% includes items and map, and the map seems to have the largest influence. That probably means low% is a nightmare to run, considering you can't enter any save rooms etc.
I also kind of dislike the item check at the end of the game, where one of the hammer upgrades seems solely exist to lock out one of the statues. Guess we need to clip through gates then.

As for items we can probably skip: Second Hammer Charge (Don't see how we can skip the spike wheel charge power unfortunately), the starting hammer maybe (if we can get through the first screen we should be fine without it), anything besides one set of bombs (maybe we can reach an expansion early). Maybe 60 Health is enough for one of the lava sections you need to go through, but that's, ugh. Money pick ups count as items, so low% will need to grind out 9999 on enemies, great fun... (unless we break in from the back)

[hidden]The Giant Golems take the power cells from the Time Machine room.[/hidden]

We can certainly get the 9999 item right after bombs if we can find the money. There's a 2500 gold orb in the room right before it that we should be able to reach without double jump but I have no idea where to get 6.5k more from.

[hidden]Just got the Super Grenades, but it involved a double bomb jump double jump into Bouncy Hammer bounce, not sure if this actually breaks anything or if you should be able to get them yet.[/hidden]

Just finished the game, completion% includes items and map, and the map seems to have the largest influence. That probably means low% is a nightmare to run, considering you can't enter any save rooms etc.
I also kind of dislike the item check at the end of the game, where one of the hammer upgrades seems solely exist to lock out one of the statues. Guess we need to clip through gates then.

As for items we can probably skip: Second Hammer Charge (Don't see how we can skip the spike wheel charge power unfortunately), the starting hammer maybe (if we can get through the first screen we should be fine without it), anything besides one set of bombs (maybe we can reach an expansion early). Maybe 60 Health is enough for one of the lava sections you need to go through, but that's, ugh. Money pick ups count as items, so low% will need to grind out 9999 on enemies, great fun... (unless we break in from the back)

LLCoolDave

2013-07-27 05:02:11 am

Just a few routing ideas: Currently the most reasonable thing to do seems to be Bombs -> Super Bombs (yes) -> Bouncy Hammer, picking up 4 2500 Gold caches along the way. No clue where to go to next, or what would be useful to accomplish next.

Attachment:

bouncyhammerearly.png

Onin

Edit history:

Onin: 2013-07-27 12:01:22 pm

2013-07-27 10:46:49 am

So here's as far as we got the route:

Pick up the hammer, get a launcher boost to pick up +20 health in Snow early, get bombs, get fire hammer, get a launcher boost up to super bombs, get the bouncy hammer and discover Jungle teleporter, go through Snow into Water, unlock Water teleporter, proceed to Fire to get Double Jump and that teleporter, then go into Acid, get the spike hammer and Charge and head into the time machine.

From there on, it's a matter of completing the golems in the most efficient way possible. Fire, Water, Jungle and Snow golems don't need anything specific to do from here on. Ice golem can't be reached before the dark matter hammer. Dark matter hammer doesn't need upgrades but is very dangerous. Acid Golem needs a stupid shitton of health, so he'll probably be the last one.

We skip the super charge, wall analyzer, mining pick and golden hammer. We can also skip every single battery, and we only need a little bit of gold here and there (2000 in Acid for free health+bombs upgrades, I think that's all).

So here's as far as we got the route:

Pick up the hammer, get a launcher boost to pick up +20 health in Snow early, get bombs, get fire hammer, get a launcher boost up to super bombs, get the bouncy hammer and discover Jungle teleporter, go through Snow into Water, unlock Water teleporter, proceed to Fire to get Double Jump and that teleporter, then go into Acid, get the spike hammer and Charge and head into the time machine.

From there on, it's a matter of completing the golems in the most efficient way possible. Fire, Water, Jungle and Snow golems don't need anything specific to do from here on. Ice golem can't be reached before the dark matter hammer. Dark matter hammer doesn't need upgrades but is very dangerous. Acid Golem needs a stupid shitton of health, so he'll probably be the last one.

We skip the super charge, wall analyzer, mining pick and golden hammer. We can also skip every single battery, and we only need a little bit of gold here and there (2000 in Acid for free health+bombs upgrades, I think that's all).

LLCoolDave

2013-07-27 12:18:28 pm

98.47% completion, missing 3 soul stones, got 135 grenades, 370 health and miss 1 room on the map.

One Soul Stone was hidden in a single breakable block in a random pool of lava. This game is really evil.

Attachment:

os_map.png

Onin

2013-07-28 09:24:42 am

You can actually skip the first hammer by getting a frame-perfect running jump off the box onto the switch. Of course this makes it exceptionally difficult to reach the bombs, since you gotta just damage boost through a lot of mobs instead of killing everything.

LLCoolDave

2013-07-28 11:46:33 am

Some low% progress, ignoring map completion. Grabbed super bombs -> bouncy hammer as I hope that could somehow make getting through acid on 70 health plausible. I'll stick on 60 health for now and see how far I can get. I really hope the super bombs will pay off or they are a wasted pickup instead of grinding out 9999 gold.

Attachment:

lowpercentprogress.png

Heidrage

2013-07-28 12:01:25 pm

Willing to teach you the impossible

What is the difference between super bombs and normal bombs? I dont really notice a difference.

LLCoolDave

2013-07-28 12:12:30 pm

large blast radius => stronger bomb jumps

SteveOlofsson

2013-07-29 01:28:23 pm

Just wanted to say its super awesome to read what you guys are finding so far! If you have suggestions for improvements/patches i would love to hear them, I really respect your opinions! Really low on time at the moment but I will be back and reading/responding when I have more time.

SteveOlofsson

2013-07-29 01:29:29 pm

By the way, there are still 5 keys remaining Smiley

Onin

Edit history:

Onin: 2013-07-29 05:59:17 pm

Onin: 2013-07-29 01:53:34 pm

2013-07-29 01:53:15 pm

In that case, two things:
1. Some characteristics of the physics are rather tediously slow. Especially the water physics, they make going through the jungle just an awful slog and makes every misstep cost stupid amounts of time. Most mistakes, like getting hit or missing a platform, just feel like they cost a lot more time than they should.
2. The path to the Acid Golem is just insane. Even if you execute it perfectly you still need over 100 health to even get close to surviving that much lava. It really feels like there was intended to be a life upgrade (and with it a free refill) in the middle of that section, but there's only one right at the very end where you don't need it anymore. Hell there's only a single stack of boxes to get health drops from.

I know Dave would love to be able to reach the super bombs without having to pick up regular bombs, but asking you to design in a new sequence break would be a little silly :>

(Oh and if you were to accidentally leave a nice oob or zipping glitch in somewhere, that could make the run more interesting. ;3)

In that case, two things:
1. Some characteristics of the physics are rather tediously slow. Especially the water physics, they make going through the jungle just an awful slog and makes every misstep cost stupid amounts of time. Most mistakes, like getting hit or missing a platform, just feel like they cost a lot more time than they should.
2. The path to the Acid Golem is just insane. Even if you execute it perfectly you still need over 100 health to even get close to surviving that much lava. It really feels like there was intended to be a life upgrade (and with it a free refill) in the middle of that section, but there's only one right at the very end where you don't need it anymore. Hell there's only a single stack of boxes to get health drops from.

I know Dave would love to be able to reach the super bombs without having to pick up regular bombs, but asking you to design in a new sequence break would be a little silly :>

(Oh and if you were to accidentally leave a nice oob or zipping glitch in somewhere, that could make the run more interesting. ;3)

Heidrage

2013-07-29 06:50:42 pm

Willing to teach you the impossible

It is no fun if he programs it in. Our job is to find the flaws, not ask him to make some.

LLCoolDave

2013-07-29 07:12:56 pm

38:53 before the final boss fight, no super charge, 130 HP, 15 bombs. This route is a bit dull, though, wish we could spice it up some more.

Some serious bugs I'd like to report:
-The end game screen displays the time of the last save file you loaded and disregards the time that has passed since then.
-Occassionally the hammer swinging animation stop working and the hammer keeps being stuck on your back.
-Vertical jump pads don't restore your double jump although I feel like they should.

Here's some small bugs we discovered that we actually really enjoy and don't hurt anybody playing the game casually, so I would recommend against fixing them:
-On a vertical jump pad, if you stand slightly on the edge of it 1 pixel away from it launching you upwards, then jump and move in my a pixel and buffer a jump for when you land on it you gain additional height.
-The diagonal launch pad super jump is already posted on the first page, but I now have a fairly consistent setup for it.
-If you are flat against a wall, swing the bouncy hammer and turn around immediately, you bounce straight up along the wall.
-You can do bomb jumps, especially with super bombs.

I've got more balancing ideas I'll present later, along with some general feedback.

38:53 before the final boss fight, no super charge, 130 HP, 15 bombs. This route is a bit dull, though, wish we could spice it up some more.

Some serious bugs I'd like to report: 
-The end game screen displays the time of the last save file you loaded and disregards the time that has passed since then.
-Occassionally the hammer swinging animation stop working and the hammer keeps being stuck on your back.
-Vertical jump pads don't restore your double jump although I feel like they should.

Here's some small bugs we discovered that we actually really enjoy and don't hurt anybody playing the game casually, so I would recommend against fixing them:
-On a vertical jump pad, if you stand slightly on the edge of it 1 pixel away from it launching you upwards, then jump and move in my a pixel and buffer a jump for when you land on it you gain additional height.
-The diagonal launch pad super jump is already posted on the first page, but I now have a fairly consistent setup for it.
-If you are flat against a wall, swing the bouncy hammer and turn around immediately, you bounce straight up along the wall.
-You can do bomb jumps, especially with super bombs.

I've got more balancing ideas I'll present later, along with some general feedback.

LLCoolDave

Edit history:

LLCoolDave: 2013-08-01 03:58:21 pm

2013-07-31 01:58:07 pm

Hmm, I'm afraid this route might be the best we can do in the current version, I can't think of much else to optimize except for skipping some health upgrades, which makes the acid golem and final boss a bit scary. I'll stream some attempts after SGDQ Bonus Stream has ended going for sub 40.

Edit: 38:34 http://www.twitch.tv/llcooldave/c/2675560 Probably 1:30 of really stupid mistakes, so sub 37 is very reasonable for this route. Satisfied with that for now.

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