N64 Banjo-Tooie any%/100%

2011-03-23 10:57:11 pm

Behind the Waterfall

Those boss runs are beyond impressive, Mega. The napalm cannons on HAG 1 were hilarious! I don't think I've even beaten it in replays because I got so frustrated with the aiming.

Also, since this thread seems to be active for the time being, I've been writing my own XBLA leaderboard speedrun from scratch in an attempt to be original. Haven't read or watched any other complete routes yet, just tricks here and there. So far I've just opened JRL and TDL with 23 Jiggies (+1 White Jinjo jiggy, so 24) at a time of 1:19:06, though I've found a few improvements I'll add into my second attempt. From those experienced with the run, do you think I might be on track for the top 10, or under 6 hours?

Jacky Durand

2011-03-24 02:19:05 am

Megadestructor - I have looked for a decent HAG 1 battle for a long time. Your videos are incredible! It's been some time since i last played those battles - does your plain blue eggs normally shoot at this fire rate, or is there some trick to do it that fast?

Quote from DolphInspired:

Also, since this thread seems to be active for the time being, I've been writing my own XBLA leaderboard speedrun from scratch in an attempt to be original. Haven't read or watched any other complete routes yet, just tricks here and there. So far I've just opened JRL and TDL with 23 Jiggies (+1 White Jinjo jiggy, so 24) at a time of 1:19:06, though I've found a few improvements I'll add into my second attempt. From those experienced with the run, do you think I might be on track for the top 10, or under 6 hours?

That time could very well be top 3 potential depending on which jiggies you've taken so far. Seems it could match my time. My time for 20 jiggies and opening the two worlds you've mentioned were 1:15:31. At that time I had already done the lenghty Saucer of Peril and Dodgem Dome, but I assume you've got those as well.

Megadestructor - I have looked for a decent HAG 1 battle for a long time. Your videos are incredible! It's been some time since i last played those battles - does your plain blue eggs normally shoot at this fire rate, or is there some trick to do it that fast?

[quote="DolphInspired"]
Also, since this thread seems to be active for the time being, I've been writing my own XBLA leaderboard speedrun from scratch in an attempt to be original.  Haven't read or watched any other complete routes yet, just tricks here and there.  So far I've just opened JRL and TDL with 23 Jiggies (+1 White Jinjo jiggy, so 24) at a time of 1:19:06, though I've found a few improvements I'll add into my second attempt.  From those experienced with the run, do you think I might be on track for the top 10, or under 6 hours?[/quote]

That time could very well be top 3 potential depending on which jiggies you've taken so far. Seems it could match my time. My time for 20 jiggies and opening the two worlds you've mentioned were 1:15:31. At that time I had already done the lenghty Saucer of Peril and Dodgem Dome, but I assume you've got those as well.

KlydeStorm

2011-03-24 03:10:37 am

Completely useless, but I figured I should post it anyways.

You have to take some form of damage that makes Banjo flail like an idiot, but not collapse, then Sack Pack. Jumping, water, leaving the area, or canceling the Sack Pack ends it.

DolphInspired

Edit history:

DolphInspired: 2011-03-24 04:14:37 am

DolphInspired: 2011-03-24 04:14:07 am

2011-03-24 04:11:49 am

Behind the Waterfall

Quote from Jacky Durand:

That time could very well be top 3 potential depending on which jiggies you've taken so far. Seems it could match my time. My time for 20 jiggies and opening the two worlds you've mentioned were 1:15:31. At that time I had already done the lenghty Saucer of Peril and Dodgem Dome, but I assume you've got those as well.

I have done both of those. I actually missed the Jinjo on top of Dodgems dome (slipped my mind is all) but the fat kid is right there, so that won't be much of a loss on trip 2. Mr. Patch is done, got really lucky and knocked him out in about a minute, usually takes me 3-4 minutes (the videos were helpful)! Good to hear my route's on track, and my end goal actually was to get sub-5 and end up in the top 3, so that's excellent news! Now I have to keep planning, and JRL's far from the easiest level to plan.

Without getting too wordy, here's what I'm backtracking for at this point (after TDL):
MM: Kickball (waiting 'til HFP of course), Prison compound wading jiggy, Columns vault jiggy via CC egg, and Dilberta, which leads into...
GGM: A whole mess of notes, crushing shed jiggy, toxic cave Jinjo, Treble Clef and Water Storage Jinjo via CC egg
WW: not yet, need claw clamber first

Then opening GI and HFP, but I highly doubt I'll have enough for CCL. An extra trip for a puzzle means an extra minute-long segment, but oh well. I'll see when I get there. On a positive note, I used the tricks to skip Klungo's cutscene (twice, it's much easier the second time when you can grip grab) and to get Bloatazin's relic thingy incredibly quickly. I plan on utilizing a lot of what I've learned in this thread. So thanks... everyone!

On the subject of videos, is there a video for how to get the tintop jiggy in GI quickly using a CC egg? I guess it's just a matter of aiming in the right spot so it falls right over the jiggy, but any other information would be appreciated.

EDIT: I totally forgot about Chuffy. Haven't gotten that up and running yet. Don't worry about that, just ignore that list up there. I won't do any of it 'til I can use Chuffy to go to GI.

[quote="Jacky Durand"]
That time could very well be top 3 potential depending on which jiggies you've taken so far. Seems it could match my time. My time for 20 jiggies and opening the two worlds you've mentioned were 1:15:31. At that time I had already done the lenghty Saucer of Peril and Dodgem Dome, but I assume you've got those as well. 
[/quote]

I have done both of those.  I actually missed the Jinjo on top of Dodgems dome (slipped my mind is all) but the fat kid is right there, so that won't be much of a loss on trip 2.  Mr. Patch is done, got really lucky and knocked him out in about a minute, usually takes me 3-4 minutes (the videos were helpful)!  Good to hear my route's on track, and my end goal actually was to get sub-5 and end up in the top 3, so that's excellent news!  Now I have to keep planning, and JRL's far from the easiest level to plan.

Without getting too wordy, here's what I'm backtracking for at this point (after TDL):
MM: Kickball (waiting 'til HFP of course), Prison compound wading jiggy, Columns vault jiggy via CC egg, and Dilberta, which leads into...
GGM: A whole mess of notes, crushing shed jiggy, toxic cave Jinjo, Treble Clef and Water Storage Jinjo via CC egg
WW: not yet, need claw clamber first

Then opening GI and HFP, but I highly doubt I'll have enough for CCL.  An extra trip for a puzzle means an extra minute-long segment, but oh well.  I'll see when I get there.  On a positive note, I used the tricks to skip Klungo's cutscene (twice, it's much easier the second time when you can grip grab) and to get Bloatazin's relic thingy incredibly quickly.  I plan on utilizing a lot of what I've learned in this thread.  So thanks... everyone!

On the subject of videos, is there a video for how to get the tintop jiggy in GI quickly using a CC egg?  I guess it's just a matter of aiming in the right spot so it falls right over the jiggy, but any other information would be appreciated.

EDIT: I totally forgot about Chuffy.  Haven't gotten that up and running yet.  Don't worry about that, just ignore that list up there.  I won't do any of it 'til I can use Chuffy to go to GI.

DolphInspired

2011-03-27 05:09:59 am

Behind the Waterfall

I noticed mention in this thread of being able to take the alternate route from Jinjo Village to Wooded Hollow in order to bypass the initial cutscene upon entering the hollow. Interesting trick, but how does it work? That early in the game you can't grip grab to get to that door, you can't jump far enough to get to the ledge from a Jinjo house doorframe, and I haven't been able to flap/ground pound to get up on the ledge. Anybody got a video on this trick, or at least a tip?

Oh yeah, and a somewhat interesting minor glitch I encountered: if you dashboard quit after completing the GI puzzle, before the light beam hits the door, the world entry will be open but the "NO ENTRY" sign will be floating in midair (it's not solid, of course). This appears to correct itself once the game is reset. Utterly useless, but maybe new? Haven't tried to duplicate it yet.

Also, regarding my own XBLA run progress, I have finished JRL's first trip and opened GI with 29 Jiggies and a time of 1:50:06 for my trial run, which has room for improvement. Underwater objectives never fail to frustrate. Currently (re)writing TDL and the big foray into some serious backtracking.

I noticed mention in this thread of being able to take the alternate route from Jinjo Village to Wooded Hollow in order to bypass the initial cutscene upon entering the hollow.  Interesting trick, but how does it work?  That early in the game you can't grip grab to get to that door, you can't jump far enough to get to the ledge from a Jinjo house doorframe, and I haven't been able to flap/ground pound to get up on the ledge.  Anybody got a video on this trick, or at least a tip?

Oh yeah, and a somewhat interesting minor glitch I encountered: if you dashboard quit after completing the GI puzzle, before the light beam hits the door, the world entry will be open but the "NO ENTRY" sign will be floating in midair (it's not solid, of course).  This appears to correct itself once the game is reset.  Utterly useless, but maybe new?  Haven't tried to duplicate it yet.

Also, regarding my own XBLA run progress, I have finished JRL's first trip and opened GI with 29 Jiggies and a time of 1:50:06 for my trial run, which has room for improvement.  Underwater objectives never fail to frustrate.  Currently (re)writing TDL and the big foray into some serious backtracking.

Timic83

2011-03-27 06:47:43 am

Quote from DolphInspired:

I noticed mention in this thread of being able to take the alternate route from Jinjo Village to Wooded Hollow in order to bypass the initial cutscene upon entering the hollow. Interesting trick, but how does it work? That early in the game you can't grip grab to get to that door, you can't jump far enough to get to the ledge from a Jinjo house doorframe, and I haven't been able to flap/ground pound to get up on the ledge. Anybody got a video on this trick, or at least a tip?

Go on the top of the while Jinjo house door, talon trot, do a very long jump to the ledge, feather flap (a in midair) and groundpound. this even works in pal. unfortunately, before u get jingalings jiggy you cant go through the door.

mike89

2011-03-27 07:43:58 am

SEGA Junkie

Hey MD9, I'll say this now so I don't have to say it in verification: I think your Hag 1 is slightly improvable. In phase 5 of the fight (60 -> 50 HP), I think it would be slightly faster to fight from the ground so you don't have to spend time running slowly around with the CK Egg. It wouldn't be faster for phase 6 though, because you stay in Breegull Blaster mode for the rest of the fight after that, so you can't get back up on top of the drill.

Incidentally, it looks like manual aiming is much harder (or at least slower) on the 360 version: on the N64 version I can just press C-down for about half a second and it aims at the right height for me to hit Grunty from the ground, and if I don't move too much it'll stay at that height without me doing anything. In phase 9 you seem to be aiming up after every shot! So kudos for that at least.

BluBotL

2011-03-27 10:18:14 pm

Blu`BotL

I just saw the dispute about the Banjo-Kazooie improvement. Even though it's a whole different case to Banjo-Tooie (the skips in BK are all possible on PAL, whereas the skips on BT aren't), I am now even more convinced that an improvement to BT must be done on the NTSC version or not at all. There would be about 20 minutes' difference in 100% and possibly the same or more in any% (because you'd be able to skip Chuffy entirely), and the entertainment factor would be far higher.

Anyway, I was wondering if anyone would be interested in starting up a small team to plan a new 100% route for the game. We might not have a willing NTSC player (or do we?) but we can still test things out and make a route that's as optimal as possible. I think this would give us the best shot at making the "perfect" route, and finding as many time savers as possible.

Mr. Piggy

Edit history:

Mr. Piggy: 2011-04-04 05:11:44 pm

Mr. Piggy: 2011-04-04 04:29:51 pm

Mr. Piggy: 2011-04-04 04:25:26 pm

Mr. Piggy: 2011-04-04 04:19:21 pm

Mr. Piggy: 2011-04-04 04:18:11 pm

Mr. Piggy: 2011-04-04 04:15:53 pm

Mr. Piggy: 2011-04-04 04:10:09 pm

Mr. Piggy: 2011-04-03 07:02:09 pm

Mr. Piggy: 2011-04-03 06:47:05 pm

Mr. Piggy: 2011-04-03 06:46:34 pm

2011-04-02 09:30:58 pm

In the infinite

Although I haven't played the game in forever and I'm sure many of the people here are much more knowledgeable about BT than me, I'd be willing to help w/ 100% routing if we got small team together; I'm sure others would be willing to help. (also I play on Xbox if that matters)

EDIT:
Just started playing the game again today and came up with this. There's bound to be mistakes so hopefully you guys can help out.

Segment 1
-grab running shoes, defeat klungo
-activate transport silo by jinjo houses
-king jingaling jiggy (1 jiggy)
-activate wooded hollow silo
-grab jinjo in cave by jiggywiggy (1/4 in isle o hags)
-open Mayahem Temple, go inside
-notes along the way to egg aim(40 notes)
-learn egg aim, get next notes along the way to treasure chamber (60 notes)
-open treasure chamber, talk to bloatizan
-to mumbos, pick up notes(65 notes)
-get glowbo, become mumbo
-pick up rest of notes and jump down to mumbo pad (100 notes)
-w/ goliath destroy rock w/ flypad underneath, grab jinjo in water, open next area, and grab the jiggy; should be able to make it back to mumbo pad with some time left (2 jiggys ,1/5 MT jinjos)
-after time runs out, deathwarp w/ mumbo, and go back to banjo and kazooie
-warp to starting area
-run over and learn grip grab
-backflip beak slam to grab jinjo behind grip grab (2/5 MT jinjos)
-activate warp by wumba and warp to start, then go to fly pad
-fly to jinjo on kickball arena, jiggy on top of targitzan’s arena, and cheato page on treasure chamber (3 jiggys, 1 cheato page, 3/5 MT jinjos)
-to unga bunga’s cave and get relic, bring relic to bloatizan for jiggy, grab jiggy and honeycomb (4 jiggys, 1/3 MT honeycombs)
-go learn breegull blaster
-go to targitzan’s arena, grab jinjo and the 2 jiggys, s&q (4/5 MT jinjos, 6 jiggys)

What I'm thinking for the second trip:
-cwk egg at start for honeycomb
-warp to mumbo's house
-go across bridge for jinjo, jiggy, and honeycomb
-jump down and grenade the entrance to prison compound
-activate prison warp pad, get cheeto page, and jiggy w/ cwk egg, get swamp jiggy
-free dilberta, go to GGM & get jiggy, go back to MT & warp to wumba area
-grab snake jiggy and cheeto page, then become stoney for kickball tournaments in both MT and HP if possible

Again, there's probably a few things wrong with this route, and many things will be changed later on, but I figured I might as well get the ball rolling. It's so difficult to try to remember and plan for later things in the game when I haven't played the game in so long.

EDIT 2: If we don't open up the prison compound with the golden goliath, and instead we destroy the rock, grab the jinjo, grab the jiggy, and go back to the pad by mumbo, it would save some time (~7ish seconds?), but then we would start out with less jiggys.

Although I haven't played the game in forever and I'm sure many of the people here are much more knowledgeable about BT than me, I'd be willing to help w/ 100% routing if we got small team together; I'm sure others would be willing to help. (also I play on Xbox if that matters)

EDIT:
Just started playing the game again today and came up with this. There's bound to be mistakes so hopefully you guys can help out.

Segment 1
-grab running shoes, defeat klungo
-activate transport silo by jinjo houses
-king jingaling jiggy (1 jiggy)
-activate wooded hollow silo
-grab jinjo in cave by jiggywiggy (1/4 in isle o hags)
-open Mayahem Temple, go inside
-notes along the way to egg aim(40 notes)
-learn egg aim, get next notes along the way to treasure chamber (60 notes)
-open treasure chamber, talk to bloatizan
-to mumbos, pick up notes(65 notes)
-get glowbo, become mumbo
-pick up rest of notes and jump down to mumbo pad (100 notes)
-w/ goliath destroy rock w/ flypad underneath, grab jinjo in water, open next area, and grab the jiggy; should be able to make it back to mumbo pad with some time left (2 jiggys ,1/5 MT jinjos)
-after time runs out, deathwarp w/ mumbo, and go back to banjo and kazooie
-warp to starting area
-run over and learn grip grab
-backflip beak slam to grab jinjo behind grip grab (2/5 MT jinjos)
-activate warp by wumba and warp to start, then go to fly pad
-fly to jinjo on kickball arena, jiggy on top of targitzan’s arena, and cheato page on treasure chamber (3 jiggys, 1 cheato page, 3/5 MT jinjos)
-to unga bunga’s cave and get relic, bring relic to bloatizan for jiggy, grab jiggy and honeycomb (4 jiggys, 1/3 MT honeycombs)
-go learn breegull blaster
-go to targitzan’s arena, grab jinjo and the 2 jiggys, s&q (4/5 MT jinjos, 6 jiggys)

What I'm thinking for the second trip:
-cwk egg at start for honeycomb
-warp to mumbo's house
-go across bridge for jinjo, jiggy, and honeycomb
-jump down and grenade the entrance to prison compound
-activate prison warp pad, get cheeto page, and jiggy w/ cwk egg, get swamp jiggy
-free dilberta, go to GGM & get jiggy, go back to MT & warp to wumba area
-grab snake jiggy and cheeto page, then become stoney for kickball tournaments in both MT and HP if possible

Again, there's probably a few things wrong with this route, and many things will be changed later on, but I figured I might as well get the ball rolling. It's so difficult to try to remember and plan for later things in the game when I haven't played the game in so long.

EDIT 2: If we don't open up the prison compound with the golden goliath, and instead we destroy the rock, grab the jinjo, grab the jiggy, and go back to the pad by mumbo, it would save some time (~7ish seconds?), but then we would start out with less jiggys.

KlydeStorm

2011-04-05 02:39:18 pm

Just wanted to add, you can get the Treble Clef in Jinjo Village without Grip Grab.

Also, in Jade Snake Grove, when you're passing through with the Golden Goliath, you can actually kick the Jinjo in the alcove to collect it.

Mr. Piggy

Edit history:

Mr. Piggy: 2011-04-09 12:25:49 pm

Mr. Piggy: 2011-04-08 07:12:09 pm

Mr. Piggy: 2011-04-08 07:10:15 pm

2011-04-08 07:10:00 pm

In the infinite

Timed a few things and re-worked the second trip to MT.

Second Trip (coming from Hailfire Peaks)
-warp to wumba's, grab snake jiggy and cheato page (2/3 cheato pages)
-become a stony, do both MT and HP kickball games, deathwarp, become banjo/kazooie
-warp to start, shoot cwk egg for honeycomb at start (2/3 honeycombs)
-warp to mumbo's house, run across bridge for jinjo, get jiggy from cow, honeycomb, go to prison compound (5/5 MT jinjos, 3/3 honeycombs)
-grab cheato page and jiggy on right side (jiggy w/ cwk egg), jump down, go get swamp boots and get jiggy across swamp, jump in swamp, free dilberta (3/3 cheato pages)

Then get the rest of the jiggys in GGM

It would be really nice if we could get 2 jiggys from jinjos after the first trip from GGM so we could open up WW and JRL at the same time, assuming we get 6 in GGM. If we don't, idk how much time this route loses to Dragorn's.

Also, I found that you can grab the honeycomb piece in the rock in front of bullion bill's house using the beak barge. It wouldn't really save that much time if at all but maybe it can be used to grab other things too.

Timed a few things and re-worked the second trip to MT.

[u]Second Trip (coming from Hailfire Peaks)[/u]
-warp to wumba's, grab snake jiggy and cheato page (2/3 cheato pages)
-become a stony, do both MT and HP kickball games, deathwarp, become banjo/kazooie
-warp to start, shoot cwk egg for honeycomb at start (2/3 honeycombs)
-warp to mumbo's house, run across bridge for jinjo, get jiggy from cow, honeycomb, go to prison compound (5/5 MT jinjos, 3/3 honeycombs)
-grab cheato page and jiggy on right side (jiggy w/ cwk egg), jump down, go get swamp boots and get jiggy across swamp, jump in swamp, free dilberta (3/3 cheato pages)

Then get the rest of the jiggys in GGM

It would be really nice if we could get 2 jiggys from jinjos after the first trip from GGM so we could open up WW and JRL at the same time, assuming we get 6 in GGM. If we don't, idk how much time this route loses to Dragorn's.

Also, I found that you can grab the honeycomb piece in the rock in front of bullion bill's house using the beak barge. It wouldn't really save that much time if at all but maybe it can be used to grab other things too.

Mr. Piggy

Edit history:

Mr. Piggy: 2011-04-15 01:00:16 pm

Mr. Piggy: 2011-04-15 12:56:32 pm

Mr. Piggy: 2011-04-12 09:16:52 pm

Mr. Piggy: 2011-04-12 09:15:25 pm

Mr. Piggy: 2011-04-12 06:42:01 pm

2011-04-12 06:39:18 pm

In the infinite

Segment 2
-open up GGM
-10 notes on top of sign (130 notes)
-activate plateau teleporter
-learn fire eggs, enter GGM
-grab cheato page at start (1/3 cheato pages)
-grab running shoes, activate starting warp pad, grab glowbo, learn bill drill, run over and drill rock by mumbo’s and grab glowbo, jump up and grab note nest, activate mumbo warp pad, warp to start (135 notes)
-grab running shoes, run to activate warp pad outside crushing shed, then run to wumba’s and become tnt guy (or vice versa, whichever is faster; if wumba’s first is faster,activate crushing shed after activating the warp pad, then warp back to wumba’s)
-warp to mumbos, blow up tnt in gloomy caverns, go back to mumbo warp and warp to start
-go to fuel depot, collect notes and blow up tnt, then deathwarp (165 notes)
-save canary mary, become banjo/kazooie again, warp to outside crushing shed
-activate crushing shed button, warp to start, run to ordinance storage, learn beak bayonet, play tnt game and get jiggy (7 jiggies)
-canary mary race (8 jiggies)
-activate warp pad and grab jinjo on cliff in rock (unless jinjo can be gotten on the way to waterfall cavern before the gate closes, then get it then), then warp to mumbo’s (1/5 GGM jinjos)
-become mumbo
-w/ mumbo grab 10 notes outside then warp to crushing shed, raise boulder, then warp to train station, grab honeycomb piece and lift train, warp back to mumbo’s house, become banjo/kazooie (175 notes, 1/3 honeycomb pieces)
-run to mine entry 2 and grab the jinjo in the prison, then grab the jiggy in the fire generator room, and then the jiggy in the powerhouse basement, then deathwarp (10 jiggys, 2/5 GGM jinjos)
-warp to train station and fight chuffy for jiggy (11 jiggys)
-race canary mary again for cheato page (2/3 cheato pages)
-run to starting area, grab running shoes, warp to crushing house area, grab the two jiggy parts farthest from the hill, run to toxic gas cave, grab honeycomb and jinjo, then run out and grab notes on hill and last jiggy piece for jiggy, then warp to start (12 jiggies, 175 notes, 2/3 honeycombs, 3/5 GGM jinjos)
-grab running shoes, hit waterfall switch, grab 15 notes outside of bullion bills (if facing bullion bill’s house, the three note nests to the right side) grab jinjo on tracks, then enter waterfall cavern (4/5 GGM jinjos, 200 notes)
-waterfall jiggy, flooded caves jiggy, save and quit (14 jiggys)

SECOND TRIP
-get dilberta jiggy
-go outside and grab notes and honeycomb by bullion bill’s house, S&Q (3/3 honeycombs)
THEN 3rd TRIP COMING FROM JRL
-grab jinjo, cheato page, and treble clef (5/5 GGM jinjos, 3/3 cheato pages)
-run outside and grab the jiggy behind the waterfall S&Q

I'm thinking with this new route we save around 20sec or more (actually it's probably closer to 25 or 30), any thoughts?
Do you guys think it would be faster to get grenade eggs and then go to GGM or to wait and get the grenade eggs afterward? Chuffy doesn't seem that slow w/ normal eggs (not sure about fire eggs, do they even hurt him?) but idk what's fastest.

EDIT: I just read in the low%/100% definitions thread that the ice key and mega glowbo aren't required, so this works out really well if for the second/third trip.

Segment 2
-open up GGM
-10 notes on top of sign (130 notes)
-activate plateau teleporter
-learn fire eggs, enter GGM
-grab cheato page at start (1/3 cheato pages)
-grab running shoes, activate starting warp pad, grab glowbo, learn bill drill, run over and drill rock by mumbo’s and grab glowbo, jump up and grab note nest, activate mumbo warp pad, warp to start (135 notes)
-grab running shoes, run to activate warp pad outside crushing shed, then run to wumba’s and become tnt guy (or vice versa, whichever is faster; if wumba’s first is faster,activate crushing shed after activating the warp pad, then warp back to wumba’s) 
-warp to mumbos, blow up tnt in gloomy caverns, go back to mumbo warp and warp to start
-go to fuel depot, collect notes and blow up tnt, then deathwarp (165 notes)
-save canary mary, become banjo/kazooie again, warp to outside crushing shed
-activate crushing shed button, warp to start, run to ordinance storage, learn beak bayonet, play tnt game and get jiggy (7 jiggies)
-canary mary race (8 jiggies)
-activate warp pad and grab jinjo on cliff in rock (unless jinjo can be gotten on the way to waterfall cavern before the gate closes, then get it then), then warp to mumbo’s (1/5 GGM jinjos)
-become mumbo
-w/ mumbo grab 10 notes outside then warp to crushing shed, raise boulder, then warp to train station, grab honeycomb piece and lift train, warp back to mumbo’s house, become banjo/kazooie (175 notes, 1/3 honeycomb pieces)
-run to mine entry 2 and grab the jinjo in the prison, then grab the jiggy in the fire generator room, and then the jiggy in the powerhouse basement, then deathwarp (10 jiggys, 2/5 GGM jinjos)
-warp to train station and fight chuffy for jiggy (11 jiggys)
-race canary mary again for cheato page (2/3 cheato pages)
-run to starting area, grab running shoes, warp to crushing house area, grab the two jiggy parts farthest from the hill, run to toxic gas cave, grab honeycomb and jinjo, then run out and grab notes on hill and last jiggy piece for jiggy, then warp to start (12 jiggies, 175 notes, 2/3 honeycombs, 3/5 GGM jinjos)
-grab running shoes, hit waterfall switch, grab 15 notes outside of bullion bills (if facing bullion bill’s house, the three note nests to the right side) grab jinjo on tracks, then enter waterfall cavern (4/5 GGM jinjos, 200 notes)
-waterfall jiggy, flooded caves jiggy, save and quit (14 jiggys)

SECOND TRIP
-get dilberta jiggy
-go outside and grab notes and honeycomb by bullion bill’s house, S&Q (3/3 honeycombs)
THEN 3rd TRIP COMING FROM JRL
-grab jinjo, cheato page, and treble clef (5/5 GGM jinjos, 3/3 cheato pages)
-run outside and grab the jiggy behind the waterfall S&Q

I'm thinking with this new route we save around 20sec or more (actually it's probably closer to 25 or 30), any thoughts?
Do you guys think it would be faster to get grenade eggs and then go to GGM or to wait and get the grenade eggs afterward? Chuffy doesn't seem that slow w/ normal eggs (not sure about fire eggs, do they even hurt him?) but idk what's fastest.

EDIT: I just read in the low%/100% definitions thread that the ice key and mega glowbo aren't required, so this works out really well if for the second/third trip.

KlydeStorm

2011-04-13 03:52:38 am

I found this last time I played, you can actually skip blowing up the TNT in front of the Canary Cave by simply using a Clockwork Kazooie Egg to squeeze in the crack in the top of the boulder, then blowing up in front of the cage.

Quote from Mr. Piggy:

-go to split up pad, w/ banjo grab jiggy using double jump to ladder, then deathwarp

If that's the one I'm thinking about (the one in the dark room with generators powered by fire eggs), you can reach that with Banjo and Kazooie together by simply doing a highjump, then beak bombing into the ladder. Not sure which is faster, considering you death warp there.

Mr. Piggy

Edit history:

Mr. Piggy: 2011-04-15 01:01:12 pm

2011-04-13 04:38:37 pm

In the infinite

Quote:

I found this last time I played, you can actually skip blowing up the TNT in front of the Canary Cave by simply using a Clockwork Kazooie Egg to squeeze in the crack in the top of the boulder, then blowing up in front of the cage.

That's really interesting, though if we leave that out until the second trip, we lose a jiggy early on and the races can't really be used for transportation so I doubt much time at all, if any, would be gained. Still pretty cool though.

Quote:

If that's the one I'm thinking about (the one in the dark room with generators powered by fire eggs), you can reach that with Banjo and Kazooie together by simply doing a highjump, then beak bombing into the ladder. Not sure which is faster, considering you death warp there.

I actually tried that a few times and couldn't get it to work; I think I'm just bad Undecided

that could probably be used somewhere in the route. We could grab that jiggy and maybe the powerhouse jiggy before learning split-up and then deathwarp to the start of the level(?) after grabbing either of those. I might look for a good spot to add that in when I get the time. That would give use two more jiggys which would be really nice, and we wouldn't have to depend on jinjos to open up multiple levels at once. Nice finds. Smiley

EDIT: edited the 2nd segment, think anything could be done differently/faster?

[quote]I found this last time I played, you can actually skip blowing up the TNT in front of the Canary Cave by simply using a Clockwork Kazooie Egg to squeeze in the crack in the top of the boulder, then blowing up in front of the cage.[/quote]
That's really interesting, though if we leave that out until the second trip, we lose a jiggy early on and the races can't really be used for transportation so I doubt much time at all, if any, would be gained. Still pretty cool though.

[quote]If that's the one I'm thinking about (the one in the dark room with generators powered by fire eggs), you can reach that with Banjo and Kazooie together by simply doing a highjump, then beak bombing into the ladder. Not sure which is faster, considering you death warp there.[/quote]
I actually tried that a few times and couldn't get it to work; I think I'm just bad :-\ that could probably be used somewhere in the route. We could grab that jiggy and maybe the powerhouse jiggy before learning split-up and then deathwarp to the start of the level(?) after grabbing either of those. I might look for a good spot to add that in when I get the time. That would give use two more jiggys which would be really nice, and we wouldn't have to depend on jinjos to open up multiple levels at once. Nice finds. :)

EDIT: edited the 2nd segment, think anything could be done differently/faster?

Manocheese

2011-04-23 06:54:46 pm

Yes, a cucco riding the ground.

Nice find. Could that save time on the Gruntilda battle?

Rody B. ToMMon

2011-11-08 08:12:01 pm

If done correctly...

I'm not sure if anyone still cares about this game, but I recently made some videos showing some interesting jumps that can be made, with the speed cheat, sadly :(, and I suppose I'll put them here if anyone is interested. By the way, I may show some other interesting things that might lead to some strange discoveries or something, so I'll post those at a later time I suppose. Another thing, I haven't put in descriptions to any of these videos, but I think that everyone here should be able to understand what's going on by looking at the posts before mine; however, if you can't figure out in any way what I did in a video, then ask me your questions below. Here we go:

And, finally, here's a special video too.

Now, I believe some of these tricks have already been discovered, but if anyone has any suggestions on any other jumping challenges I can try out in this game, then give me your suggestions and I'll try them out as soon as I can. Well then, this post has gotten big enough already I'm sure, so I'll just stop here, and if anyone has any questions or suggestions, then inform me of them as soon as I can!

I'm not sure if anyone still cares about this game, but I recently made some videos showing some interesting jumps that can be made, with the speed cheat, sadly :(, and I suppose I'll put them here if anyone is interested. By the way, I may show some other interesting things that might lead to some strange discoveries or something, so I'll post those at a later time I suppose. Another thing, I haven't put in descriptions to any of these videos, but I think that everyone here should be able to understand what's going on by looking at the posts before mine; however, if you can't figure out in any way what I did in a video, then ask me your questions below. Here we go:

[url]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Y1Amn8F8124[/url]

[url]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LnDzOj4Dkh4[/url]

[url]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2ETL6MibpIw[/url]

[url]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=F_gTEhTuBsM[/url]

[url]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ic-7akIBrjA[/url]

[url]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=deuG5_kTEuU[/url]

And, finally, here's [i]a[/i] special video too.
[url]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=REnmC1zbqW8[/url]

Now, I believe some of these tricks have already been discovered, but if anyone has any suggestions on any other jumping challenges I can try out in this game, then give me your suggestions and I'll try them out as soon as I can. Well then, this post has gotten big enough already I'm sure, so I'll just stop here, and if anyone has any questions or suggestions, then inform me of them as soon as I can!

Pjii

2011-11-09 01:23:27 am

I still care about Banjo-Tooie. So much that I'm in the process of recording a new 100% run. I was going to keep it to myself because, well... I guess I don’t have a good reason.

Anyway, I did a (crap) run for the XBLA leaderboards. I didn't collect Empty Honeycombs, Cheato Pages, and I didn't actually beat the game because the leaderboards only require 90 Jiggies and 900 Notes. I got a time of 4:07:44, giving me the #1 spot (at the time of this post).

After that I decided to seriously run the N64 version. I can't make promises on a final time. The differences between the N64 and XBLA versions will be interesting to see, as far as how much time I can save. Text skipping, more tricks that I can do because I'm running the NTSC version; yes, this'll be fun.

facetouch

Edit history:

facetouch: 2011-11-09 04:13:15 am

2011-11-09 04:03:00 am

Just out of curiosity; Excluding the massive lag reduction, what are some of the version differences that would make one better than the other? From my own experience the over-sensitive Xbox controller makes aiming harder (to me at least) and I'm pretty sure some small glitches have been fixed and the game auto-saves. If an updated run were to be done, which version would be best to run with?

P.S. Somebody please do one because I just replayed this for the first time in years on XBLA and would love to see a new run while it's fresh in my mind! Tongue

P.P.S. Shouldn't those videos be titled "Banjo-Tooie" instead of "Banjo-Kazooie?"

KlydeStorm

2011-11-09 01:12:03 pm

NTSC N64 is the best for a speedrun, since they fixed being able to grab items through walls, as well some other things like getting in Grunty Industries without Chuffy (I think?).

A bit earlier in the topic I posted a video of all the places I found you can grab items through walls with the Taxi Pack (even the useless ones), so that's worth a look. Another example of grabbing things through walls, in Grunty Industries, in the Waste Disposal Plant there's a Jiggy underneath the toxic water behind a grating. If you Shack Pack against the grating and then cancel it while continuing to push towards it, Banjo's nose can sometimes grab the Jiggy right through the grating.

Good luck on your run, Pjii, looking forward to Banjo-Tooie finally getting a new run.

By the way, are you doing single segment or segmented? Since you're doing 100%, if you choose segmented you won't have to repeatedly play through the game to find out where every Jinjo color is and restart when they're in bad places.

Worn_Traveler

2011-11-09 02:57:49 pm

Formerly known as Skullboy

Quote from Pjii:

I still care about Banjo-Tooie. So much that I'm in the process of recording a new 100% run. I was going to keep it to myself because, well... I guess I don’t have a good reason.

Anyway, I did a (crap) run for the XBLA leaderboards. I didn't collect Empty Honeycombs, Cheato Pages, and I didn't actually beat the game because the leaderboards only require 90 Jiggies and 900 Notes. I got a time of 4:07:44, giving me the #1 spot (at the time of this post).

After that I decided to seriously run the N64 version. I can't make promises on a final time. The differences between the N64 and XBLA versions will be interesting to see, as far as how much time I can save. Text skipping, more tricks that I can do because I'm running the NTSC version; yes, this'll be fun.

SDA 100% is " all jiggies, honeycombs, cheato pages, glowbos, notes, jinjos, jamjar's moves" according to the low/100% definitions page so if you haven't added the honeycombs and pages to your route then you'll need to. If you already know or have the full route then I guess you can ignore this. Good luck. Glad to know you'll be using the N64 NTSC version.

[quote="Pjii"]I still care about Banjo-Tooie. So much that I'm in the process of recording a new 100% run. I was going to keep it to myself because, well... I guess I don’t have a good reason.

Anyway, I did a (crap) run for the XBLA leaderboards. I didn't collect Empty Honeycombs, Cheato Pages, and I didn't actually beat the game because the leaderboards only require 90 Jiggies and 900 Notes. I got a time of 4:07:44, giving me the #1 spot (at the time of this post).

After that I decided to seriously run the N64 version. I can't make promises on a final time. The differences between the N64 and XBLA versions will be interesting to see, as far as how much time I can save. Text skipping, more tricks that I can do because I'm running the NTSC version; yes, this'll be fun.[/quote]

SDA 100% is " all jiggies, honeycombs, cheato pages, glowbos, notes, jinjos, jamjar's moves" according to the low/100% definitions page so if you haven't added the honeycombs and pages to your route then you'll need to. If you already know or have the full route then I guess you can ignore this. Good luck. Glad to know you'll be using the N64 NTSC version.

Rody B. ToMMon

2011-11-09 03:02:03 pm

If done correctly...

Quote from facetouch:

P.P.S. Shouldn't those videos be titled "Banjo-Tooie" instead of "Banjo-Kazooie?"

I call it banjo-kazooie to represent the series as a whole because I may try some jumping challenges in the original game as well, but I'll probably put those videos in the banjo-kazooie thread.

Also, I wish I could help out with the speedrun, but I don't know that much about the speed routes for this game, (I'm paying attention to Donkey Kong 64 right now anyways) so I'm sorry if my videos don't help out at all. Sad

Pjii

Edit history:

Pjii: 2011-11-11 07:49:54 pm

2011-11-09 03:50:17 pm

I’m not crazy enough to do a single segment run. My route doesn’t depend on Jinjos either. Adding the Empty Honeycombs and Cheato Pages was the first thing I did when changing to the N64 version.

One thing I’d like to discuss is getting into Grunty Industries early. Can anyone confirm if it’s any faster to do that in a 100% run? My route right now has me beating Chuffy with the Ice Eggs and then going right to GI. The thing is, there’s an Empty Honeycomb and three Note Nests in the GI train station, so you’ll have to go there anyway.

I’m only 7 segments into my run, so I have time to change some things. I’m going to test and time some things before I finish some segments, but I’m happy with my route right now.

KlydeStorm

Edit history:

KlydeStorm: 2011-11-10 02:24:11 pm

2011-11-10 02:23:15 pm

Quote from Pjii:

One thing I’d like to discuss is getting into Grunty Industries early. Can anyone confirm if it’s any faster to do that in a 100% run? My route right now has me beating Chuffy with the Ice Eggs and then going right to GI. The thing is, there’s an Empty Honeycomb and three Note Nests in the GI train station, so you’ll have to go there anyway.

Do Ice Eggs work well on King Coal? I've always used Grenade Eggs, since they're practically free, requiring only 110 notes and a very short trip into Pine Grove. I guess you have to take a second trip to Glitter Gulch Mine anyways due to the Jiggy up behind the waterfall in the main area.

Keep in mind, to ride Chuffy into Grunty Industries, you have to go in Grunty Industries anyways, then go around the building, press the Train Station button, then go back into another area that Chuffy can go to, and then take Chuffy to Grunty Industries, so I'm leaning towards using the glitch to get in being better.

Pjii

Edit history:

Pjii: 2011-11-10 08:53:17 pm

2011-11-10 03:42:00 pm

How much time does it take to get into Grunty Industries with the glitch? It can’t be much faster than it takes to hit the train switch. I save and quit right after I hit the switch, then move on to my next segment:

-Take silo to Mayahem Temple
-Clockwork Egg for EH near entrance, warp to Prison Compound
-Climb prison for Cheato Page, CWK Egg for Jiggy
-Back, jump on prison for boots then get the swamp Jiggy
-Open prison, go to Glitter Gulch Mine
-Get Jiggy, out hut, get Notes, get EH, get final Notes for GGM
-Run to Wumba’s Wigwam for warp pad - warp to train station
-Beat Old King Coal with Ice Eggs (WAY faster than Grenade Eggs)
-Take train to Grunty Industries

Then I continue the segment through GI. Here’s what I’m saying, if I glitch into GI, I’ll have to go to the train station for the three Note Nests and EH. The Worker’s Quarters as well, for the Cheato Page. I can’t split up and take Kazooie to the train station (for a quick death warp) because I have to use Bill Drill for the Cheato Page in the Worker’s Quarters. This means I’ll have to jump down from the catwalk after glitching in, go to the Worker’s Quarters, then the train station, then learn Claw Clamber from Jamjars, split up and continue the segment as normal.

I’ll have to go in, then out of the train station, which would be slower than starting from there. The only way I could see this glitch being any faster is if getting in through the window with the CWK Egg is much faster than hitting the train switch. Any thoughts? I’ll test this when I get to the segment, but I’m still thinking of not using the glitch.

How much time does it take to get into Grunty Industries with the glitch? It can’t be much faster than it takes to hit the train switch. I save and quit right after I hit the switch, then move on to my next segment:

-Take silo to Mayahem Temple
-Clockwork Egg for EH near entrance, warp to Prison Compound
-Climb prison for Cheato Page, CWK Egg for Jiggy
-Back, jump on prison for boots then get the swamp Jiggy
-Open prison, go to Glitter Gulch Mine
-Get Jiggy, out hut, get Notes, get EH, get final Notes for GGM
-Run to Wumba’s Wigwam for warp pad - warp to train station
-Beat Old King Coal with Ice Eggs (WAY faster than Grenade Eggs)
-Take train to Grunty Industries

Then I continue the segment through GI. Here’s what I’m saying, if I glitch into GI, I’ll have to go to the train station for the three Note Nests and EH. The Worker’s Quarters as well, for the Cheato Page. I can’t split up and take Kazooie to the train station (for a quick death warp) because I have to use Bill Drill for the Cheato Page in the Worker’s Quarters. This means I’ll have to jump down from the catwalk after glitching in, go to the Worker’s Quarters, then the train station, then learn Claw Clamber from Jamjars, split up and continue the segment as normal.

I’ll have to go in, then out of the train station, which would be slower than starting from there. The only way I could see this glitch being any faster is if getting in through the window with the CWK Egg is much faster than hitting the train switch. Any thoughts? I’ll test this when I get to the segment, but I’m still thinking of not using the glitch.

kirbymastah

2011-11-11 12:23:36 am

ice eggs rape king coal, moreso than grenade eggs, and are faster