Molotov! In need of DMC! [locked]

Edit history:

HeroPenguin: 2005-05-05 10:04:24 am

2005-05-05 10:02:58 am

Rock on, Earthbound. Rock on.

There hasn't been any update on the Dante, No Damage run from Molotov... If you're not busy working like the madman you are for attempting it, can you give some sort of update? I'm going stir-crazy for Dante insanity since picking up DMC3 and beginning to appreciate what pure awesome it is, and I *REALLY* would like to see this run completed!

Also, on a side comment, does anybody here have any good links to a DMC3 speedplay at a high level? Specifically, I'd love to see something like an SS-rank playthrough, but any kind will do, really.

DMC3 devoured my soul in less than 5 hours... T_T

Thread title:

Molotov

2005-05-05 05:37:25 pm

Hey. Well, I canned that run, but it's still sitting on my hard drive and memory card.

I was planning to let the topic die out, but if you want to see it completed, I'll give it another shot. I'd much rather do a single-segment (or segmented) run of Normal mode with Dante, not going for ranks or caring about damage.

I did a practice run with Sparda single-segment (not recording of course), and I got a time of 1:12.32 (it might not have had that .32 at the end though)...which I guess is fairly good for a run with a ton of mistakes.

It was kind of funny during mission 20 though, Nightmare 3 landed on me, and I thought I was dead. I sat there for a while (with a literal speck of health), waiting for the screen to fade...but it didn't, so I got out of there and finished the fight (with a Vital Star of course).

Weird thing is, at least one of his snake-like minions did the self-destruct attack on me, but it did nothing. Maybe he magically missed, but I doubt it.

Anyway, just let me know which one you want to see, and I'll work on it. If you choose the no damage run though, it will take a lot longer (Griffon 3 hates me).

Hey. Well, I canned that run, but it's still sitting on my hard drive and memory card.

I was planning to let the topic die out, but if you want to see it completed, I'll give it another shot. I'd much rather do a single-segment (or segmented) run of Normal mode with Dante, not going for ranks or caring about damage.

I did a practice run with Sparda single-segment (not recording of course), and I got a time of 1:12.32 (it might not have had that .32 at the end though)...which I guess is fairly good for a run with a ton of mistakes.

It was kind of funny during mission 20 though, Nightmare 3 landed on me, and I thought I was dead. I sat there for a while (with a literal speck of health), waiting for the screen to fade...but it didn't, so I got out of there and finished the fight (with a Vital Star of course).

Weird thing is, at least one of his snake-like minions did the self-destruct attack on me, but it did nothing. Maybe he magically missed, but I doubt it.

Anyway, just let me know which one you want to see, and I'll work on it. If you choose the no damage run though, it will take a lot longer (Griffon 3 hates me).

HeroPenguin

2005-05-05 11:41:58 pm

Rock on, Earthbound. Rock on.

Personally, the idea of a no damage DMC run makes me giddy all over, on any difficulty. I'm not terribly interested in any of the extras (Super Dante, LDK, etc.), but an extra-skillful play through the normal game with the default character really makes me excited. If it's giving you too much trouble, though (I cringe at the thought of a no-damage Nightmare fight...) I won't think any less of you. the fact that you could GET that far is impressive in its own right. Long story short, I'd *prefer* to see the No Damage run completed, but I'd still love to see a normal Dante run, or a LDK run (in that order). Good luck.

P.S. any chance that you may try a DMC3 run at any point? 'tis an awesome spectacle indeed. Cheesy

Molotov

2005-05-06 12:36:59 am

Hey. I'll work on a single-segment Dante Normal run first, and if I feel crazy afterwards, I'll try to finish the no damage run.

Sadly, a no damage run will not count as a seperate section other than an all S rank run. So, if someone did a faster S rank run with damage, it's gone.

I'm not sure what time to aim for exactly with a Dante Normal run though.

For Super Dante, my first challenge was to go under an hour in one sitting, but that's easy when you know what you're doing.

I then aimed for a time under 50 minutes, which is amazing I even achieved, considering how sloppy my run got near the end.

Anyway, under an hour might be possible for me, but I can't promise anything.

I don't own Devil May Cry 3, and I've never played it (I'd like to though, especially since I know Sparda is playable in that game too). Eventually, I'll buy it, but it's not really high on my priority list.

HeroPenguin

2005-05-06 05:05:53 am

Rock on, Earthbound. Rock on.

It should be. Heh, in my insanity, I spent the better part of the early morning (yaaaay insomnia!) on a DMC forum at the IGN boards... to get an idea of the supreme balance that reigns... uh... supreme in the game, I ran into at least five groups of debates over the best devilarm/firearm/style combination, and nearly everyone had a different opinion, and everybody had good reasoning behind their choice... EVERYTHING in the game is balanced, even if it's ludicrously hard to start with.

The sheer volume of strategies that are viable for going through that game is mindboggling, and while it may not offer any real sequence break opprotunities (a sad say when I discovered I couldn't Sky Star to grab an item I needed to get into a certain door three missions early, because an invisible barrier blocked my path -_-), the pure volume of strategies available makes it intriguing to see done for speed.

Back to the topic at hand, though, under an hour seems to be fine, and if it looks like you'll beat it, then lower it. basically, the same as you did for Super Dante. Sadly, I must admit I don't have a great familiarity with the game, so I couldn't say what a good goal would be. Good luck, though, and if nothign else, maybe this will set off a competition for the game series. ^_^

It should be.  Heh, in my insanity, I spent the better part of the early morning (yaaaay insomnia!) on a DMC forum at the IGN boards...  to get an idea of the supreme balance that reigns... uh... supreme in the game, I ran into at least five groups of debates over the best devilarm/firearm/style combination, and nearly everyone had a different opinion, and everybody had good reasoning behind their choice...  EVERYTHING in the game is balanced, even if it's ludicrously hard to start with.

The sheer volume of strategies that are viable for going through that game is mindboggling, and while it may not offer any real sequence break opprotunities (a sad say when I discovered I couldn't Sky Star to grab an item I needed to get into a certain door three missions early, because an invisible barrier blocked my path -_-), the pure volume of strategies available makes it intriguing to see done for speed.

Back to the topic at hand, though, under an hour seems to be fine, and if it looks like you'll beat it, then lower it.  basically, the same as you did for Super Dante.  Sadly, I must admit I don't have a great familiarity with the game, so I couldn't say what a good goal would be.  Good luck, though, and if nothign else, maybe this will set off a competition for the game series.  ^_^

Molotov

Edit history:

Molotov: 2005-05-07 12:32:10 am

2005-05-06 04:06:21 pm

Hey. Yeah, you can use all kinds of combinations to do things, but only in boss fights. When it comes to running around normally, everyone should know Alastor is the best (no question).

Even if you're not using Devil Trigger, Stinger level 2 is faster than running...but it's still a pain at times to aim correctly.

For boss fights, I think Alastor is the best until you reach Griffon 3. From there on, Meteor level 2 does wonders, if you have enough of a gauge to make good use of it.

If not, Alastor's Air Raid is a decent replacement, on the lower difficulties. On the higher ones, Ifrit is probably the only smart choice.

I know Nelo 2 doesn't like Meteor level 2 or Inferno, but it's too slow for my tastes (when I'm not using Super Dante).

Anyway, Ebony & Ivory and the grenade launcher are probably the only truly useful guns for a speed run. I don't really care for the Shotgun (though I've seen it used against Mundus 2, with great effect), or the Nightmare Beta.

I'll stop my rambling before it gets out of hand (possibly too late). I'll work on one right now and edit this post with the result. Grin

[Edit]: I went through the game (after some botched attempts) and got a time of 1:05.28. That's actually very good, considering it was a terrible run.

I retried twice (Griffon 3, Nelo 3), and had poor orb management. It was so poor, I didn't buy Inferno or Air Hike throughout the run...which obviously costs time.

I learned that Alastor is very effective against Nightmare 1 and 2 though, so that's good. Nightmare 3 is a tough cookie, so Inferno should still be my best bet.

I absolutely abused Untouchables and Devil Stars, all on Mundus 1 and 2. I bought another one and used it to get out of the Underworld faster (Mission 24).

So, under an hour should be fairly simple to accomplish. Under 55 minutes should be a challenge though...

Hey. Yeah, you can use all kinds of combinations to do things, but only in boss fights. When it comes to running around normally, everyone should know Alastor is the best (no question).

Even if you're not using Devil Trigger, Stinger level 2 is faster than running...but it's still a pain at times to aim correctly.

For boss fights, I think Alastor is the best until you reach Griffon 3. From there on, Meteor level 2 does wonders, if you have enough of a gauge to make good use of it.

If not, Alastor's Air Raid is a decent replacement, on the lower difficulties. On the higher ones, Ifrit is probably the only smart choice.

I know Nelo 2 doesn't like Meteor level 2 or Inferno, but it's too slow for my tastes (when I'm not using Super Dante).

Anyway, Ebony & Ivory and the grenade launcher are probably the only truly useful guns for a speed run. I don't really care for the Shotgun (though I've seen it used against Mundus 2, with great effect), or the Nightmare Beta.

I'll stop my rambling before it gets out of hand (possibly too late). I'll work on one right now and edit this post with the result.  ;D

[Edit]: I went through the game (after some botched attempts) and got a time of 1:05.28. That's actually very good, considering it was a terrible run.

I retried twice (Griffon 3, Nelo 3), and had poor orb management. It was so poor, I didn't buy Inferno or Air Hike throughout the run...which obviously costs time.

I learned that Alastor is very effective against Nightmare 1 and 2 though, so that's good. Nightmare 3 is a tough cookie, so Inferno should still be my best bet.

I absolutely abused Untouchables and Devil Stars, all on Mundus 1 and 2. I bought another one and used it to get out of the Underworld faster (Mission 24).

So, under an hour should be fairly simple to accomplish. Under 55 minutes should be a challenge though...

HeroPenguin

2005-05-06 11:21:13 pm

Rock on, Earthbound. Rock on.

I say shoot for the 55 minutes. XD

Also, I should clarify... When I referred to the wide variety of styles and weapons that make for viable strategies, I was referring to DMC3, not the original. They break down into five devil arms (Rebellion, Cerberus, Agni & Rudra, Nevan, and Beowulf), five firearms (Ebony & Ivory, Shotgun, Artemis, Spiral, and Kalina Ann), and six styles, four of which start out available, two of which are unlocked later (Trickster, Swordmaster, Gunslinger, Royal Guard, and the two hidden styles, Quicksilver and Doppelganger). I've read posts defending all sorts of combinations, ranging from Rebellion/Beowulf with E&I/Kalina Ann on Trickster to Agni & Rudra/Nevan with Shotgun/Artemis on Gunslinger.

To explain all those names, most of which probably don't make sense without prior knowledge, Rebellion is an Alastor-esque sword with no elemental property, Cerberus is a three-headed nunchaku-esque weapon with the ice element, Agni & Rudra are twin demon swords which embody fire and wind, respectively, Nevan is an electric guitar in every sense of the word hat allows you to summon bats to attack and defend and use Alastor-esque attacks in Devil Trigger (the ONLY weapon to give you unique attacks while in DT), and Beowulf is a set of light-imbued gauntlets and greaves that function similarly to Ifrit, and Swordmaster gives access to moves very similar to Ifrit's old DT style attacks.

Of the guns, E&I and the shotgun need no explanation, but Artemis is a demon gun that shoots energy arrows and has the ability to lock-on and fire at multiple targets at once after charging the weapon for a time, Spiral is a rifle that has amazing damage potential but a very slow firing rate, and Kalina Ann is a very confused rocket launcher, that has a grappling hook/bayonet built in.

The styles all change the function of the circle button, allowing you a whole new set of moves on top of all of Dante's normal capabilities, many of which can and will completely change your mode of play. Trickster enables Dante to perform an invincible dash in any direction to avoid enemy attacks and gain a strategic advantage, as well as some other evasive moves. Swordmaster maximizes the potential of the Devil Arms, by allowing you to preform additional moves while using them, many of which are powerful, and often wind up completey changing the way you use the weapon to begin with. Gunslinger allows you to do special tricks with your firearms, ranging from shooting in two seperate directions with E&I, to richochet shots with Spiral that hit multiple enemies, to a wonderful little number with the shotgun that can only be described one way: Shotgun-chucks. :O

Yeah, DMC3 gives you flexibility, and EVERYTHING in the game is viable. In a speedplay, for just running around, though, I imagine Rebellion and Cerberus would be best, giving you access to Stinger level 2 and DT gliding with Rebellion, and a significant boost in run and attack speed in DT with Cerberus. In case you were wondering why I listed two weapons in each type for each combination, you can switch freely between them, even mid-combo, allowing you to do pretty mcuh anything your imagination comes up with. Awesomesauce. Cheesy

Sorry if you knew any of the stuff I already detaled, but it's all worth saying a hundred times over. DMC3 rocks. XD Now, back to your regularly scheduled absurdity, and I can't wait for news about that speedrun.

I say shoot for the 55 minutes.  XD

Also, I should clarify...  When I referred to the wide variety of styles and weapons that make for viable strategies, I was referring to DMC3, not the original.  They break down into five devil arms (Rebellion, Cerberus, Agni & Rudra, Nevan, and Beowulf), five firearms (Ebony & Ivory, Shotgun, Artemis, Spiral, and Kalina Ann), and six styles, four of which start out available, two of which are unlocked later (Trickster, Swordmaster, Gunslinger, Royal Guard, and the two hidden styles, Quicksilver and Doppelganger).  I've read posts defending all sorts of combinations, ranging from Rebellion/Beowulf with E&I/Kalina Ann on Trickster to Agni & Rudra/Nevan with Shotgun/Artemis on Gunslinger.

To explain all those names, most of which probably don't make sense without prior knowledge, Rebellion is an Alastor-esque sword with no elemental property, Cerberus is a three-headed nunchaku-esque weapon with the ice element, Agni & Rudra are twin demon swords which embody fire and wind, respectively, Nevan is an electric guitar in every sense of the word hat allows you to summon bats to attack and defend and use Alastor-esque attacks in Devil Trigger (the ONLY weapon to give you unique attacks while in DT), and Beowulf is a set of light-imbued gauntlets and greaves that function similarly to Ifrit, and Swordmaster gives access to moves very similar to Ifrit's old DT style attacks.

Of the guns, E&I and the shotgun need no explanation, but Artemis is a demon gun that shoots energy arrows and has the ability to lock-on and fire at multiple targets at once after charging the weapon for a time, Spiral is a rifle that has amazing damage potential but a very slow firing rate, and Kalina Ann is a very confused rocket launcher, that has a grappling hook/bayonet built in.

The styles all change the function of the circle button, allowing you a whole new set of moves on top of all of Dante's normal capabilities, many of which can and will completely change your mode of play.  Trickster enables Dante to perform an invincible dash in any direction to avoid enemy attacks and gain a strategic advantage, as well as some other evasive moves.  Swordmaster maximizes the potential of the Devil Arms, by allowing you to preform additional moves while using them, many of which are powerful, and often wind up completey changing the way you use the weapon to begin with.  Gunslinger allows you to do special tricks with your firearms, ranging from shooting in two seperate directions with E&I, to richochet shots with Spiral that hit multiple enemies, to a wonderful little number with the shotgun that can only be described one way:  Shotgun-chucks.  :O

Yeah, DMC3 gives you flexibility, and EVERYTHING in the game is viable.  In a speedplay, for just running around, though, I imagine Rebellion and Cerberus would be best, giving you access to Stinger level 2 and DT gliding with Rebellion, and a significant boost in run and attack speed in DT with Cerberus.  In case you were wondering why I listed two weapons in each type for each combination, you can switch freely between them, even mid-combo, allowing you to do pretty mcuh anything your imagination comes up with.  Awesomesauce.  :D

Sorry if you knew any of the stuff I already detaled, but it's all worth saying a hundred times over.  DMC3 rocks.  XD  Now, back to your regularly scheduled absurdity, and I can't wait for news about that speedrun.

sabikage

2005-05-08 07:54:10 am

I love YaBB 1G - SP1!

Holy monkey cow. 65 minutes? How do you even?

I decided to play around and attempt a speedrun, segmented, but finals intervened and I sort of gave up halfway through. As I currently stand, I've completed missions 1-12 with all S-ranks - with a running time of 45 minutes.

Now, I staunchly believed that going for S-ranks was the fastest way to do this - it requires that levels be completed quickly and with no/minimal damage to begin with, and it gives me a LOT of red orbs with which to play. Also, since I'm doing a segmented run, I should theoretically be able to accomplish individual segments faster than the comparable segments on your end, but I'm obviously doing something wrong.

Would you object to elaborating on your route and explaining any major time-saving events?

BDA

2005-05-08 03:26:21 pm

Let's fight to computer!

HeroPenguin: If you're thinking of speedrunning DMC3 you'll probably want to use Royalguard on bosses. If you can get the hang of Just Guards and fully-charged Just Releases you can do HUGE damage on bosses (like, half a life bar on Dante Must Die).

Molotov

2005-05-08 07:00:04 pm

Quote:

Now, I staunchly believed that going for S-ranks was the fastest way to do this - it requires that levels be completed quickly and with no/minimal damage to begin with, and it gives me a LOT of red orbs with which to play. Also, since I'm doing a segmented run, I should theoretically be able to accomplish individual segments faster than the comparable segments on your end, but I'm obviously doing something wrong.

Would you object to elaborating on your route and explaining any major time-saving events?

Hey. Going for all S ranks isn't the fastest way, since that wouldn't allow you to use Holy Waters (I think) or Untouchables.

Damage is faster in one way I can think of though, and that's while Air Raiding through spikes. He doesn't fly back like usual, and you should be able to manage the health loss because of the regeneration on Normal.

I don't mind telling you my route at all, but most of it is in my 49:35 Super Dante run.

Mission 1: 4 hit combo ending with High Time (without jump) and some pistol usage. Other than that, I just use the 100 red orbs on the statue and jump at the wall and down-left to get the first Rusty Key quicker.

Mission 2: Grab Alastor enter the next room. Jump right at the wall and then left to get on the second floor. Leave the room and use the Rusty Key. Run to the wall, jump, and jump off to the door.

Mission 3: Examine the door, which unlocks it (quicker than checking the Pride of Lion). Run across the bridge and back, fry the skulls. For Phantom, I do a lot of jump slashes to his back, and hopefully I'll land on him eventually. Throw in a Stinger when the last two lava pillars miss.

I have a new strategy when crossing the bridge now, but I'm not sure what's faster exactly. I jump before the lightning fries me, and it seems quicker.

Mission 4: Wall jump to get the Death Sentence, and kill Nelo 1 with lots of 4 hit combos + Stinger for a finish (maybe through in a High Time for entertainment value).

The important thing to remember here is that Nelo 1 can't block an entire Alastor (Devil Trigger) combo, so pound him non-stop.

Mission 5: Try to get next to the door before the Shadow dies, and use a jump slash in the Sin Scythe room.

Mission 6: Air Raid the bugs and use a Holy Water on the Death Scythe.

Mission 7: Run from Phantom and Air Raid the Sin Scythes. If you're feeling lucky, jump off the rising platform early to save time, but if you mess up, it's pretty much over (single-segment that is).

I find it's better safe than sorry, especially for just a few seconds.

Mission 8: Stinger level 2 before the gap to save time. Wall jump to the door, and use the same strategy as before on Phantom. Throw in an Air Raid if he's near death maybe.

Use the Trident and jump into the left pool, then back out.

Mission 9: Grab the Devil Star behind the stone, and jump over the stair rail, then start running again. Stinger to the next scene and then run to the Ifrit room.

My best time saver is in this room. Jump up on the right side around the Yellow Orb (left side should work, but I use the right). Without Air Hike, it's a bit more complicated.

Jump off the wall and Air Raid to the lowest block floating out there. Land and jump to the next one, jump, and Air Raid over to Ifrit, then land.

For extra speed (I think), jump off the Ifrit platform and do a flame kick when you're low enough. Too high puts you in front of the rune stone. Remember to jump out of it when you land, if you can.

Skip Griffon 1, Air Raid puppets (using the grenade launcher and Stinger when necessary), and grab the Holy Water.

Mission 10: Stinger and use the grenade launcher on the puppets in your way. Jump or Stinger (jumping is easier) through the correct exit. Air Raid the enemies in room 2 and 3 doing the same thing to exit.

Air Raid the rock spiders and use any remaining Devil Trigger to grab the Holy Water (Stinger level 2 if necessary). Make sure to end the mission full though.

Mission 11: Do all the necessary things and jump through the planter in the middle to save time. For Nelo 2, I use the same old Alastor strategy, but with a grenade after every combo ends.

If you have Air Hike, you can take another small shortcut. Stand in place, get your orbs, jump in place, and then jump toward the screen. You should be on top of the middle platform.

After using the Chalice, run to the edge, stop, and then jump.

Mission 12: Make sure to have at least one Holy Water going into this mission. Get in the boat, and grab the Untouchable, then get out of the water. Stinger toward the stairs.

Grab the needle gun and the Devil Star. For the fight with Death Scythe, it takes 5 Alastor jump slashes. As soon as you can (around the time he slings the scythe on his shoulder), jump slash twice.

I usually mess this up, and it has killed a single-segment for me before (last time I did it, he ended up killing me with one of the special scenes).

Anyway, wait for him to attack, and give him 2 more. Wait for the attack again, and then give him the last one.

For Griffon 2, run toward the middle of the ship and wait for a bit. When the time is right (it comes with practice), use a Holy Water. After that, pound on him with Air Raid.

If you can get a good view (and no phoenix on you), abuse charged pistol shots instead, they work wonders.

Mission 13: Swim around the right side, kill the enemies, swim out. Swim above the enemies, then down (in the next room).

Mission 14: Grab the Holy Water, dodge the spikes (or fly through them if you have Vortex), and make your way down the mountain.

You can use Stinger to get down faster, but I think you need a certain enemy spawn to do it, I'm not sure (thanks auto-aim).

Skip all enemies in this mission and leave.

Mission 15: Go to the blue shield room, and Stinger + taunt the Fetish for any Devil Trigger you may need. Air Raid through the next room and kill as many Sin Scythes as you can.

Recharge at the special room, and Air Raid to the lances and back. Start the fight with Griffon 3 and abuse Meteor level 2 if you're using Super Dante, or have a lot of Devil Trigger runes.

If not, and this is basically the case with Dante, use Air Raid/charged pistol shots. Chop him up when he gets close, but I don't think charging him is the safest idea. For single-segment, there's too much risk involved.

Mission 16: Skip the Blue Orb, and activate the rune stone. Jump toward the stair rail, and Inferno on the way down (instant kill). If you don't have it, I'd use the Ifrit ground combo with Devil Trigger.

Start the fight with Nightmare 1, and try to stay in front of him to lure the ice beam attack. When he's using it, pound him with Inferno or Alastor combos (in Devil Trigger when available).

Alastor might actually be better for Nightmare 1, since it doesn't drain the gauge like Inferno does. Use whichever you prefer, but remember that Inferno is somewhat safer from attack.

Vortex level 2 over the broken bridge if you have it. If not, Air Raid is a good replacement.

Continued in the next post.

[quote]Now, I staunchly believed that going for S-ranks was the fastest way to do this - it requires that levels be completed quickly and with no/minimal damage to begin with, and it gives me a LOT of red orbs with which to play. Also, since I'm doing a segmented run, I should theoretically be able to accomplish individual segments faster than the comparable segments on your end, but I'm obviously doing something wrong.

Would you object to elaborating on your route and explaining any major time-saving events?[/quote]

Hey. Going for all S ranks isn't the fastest way, since that wouldn't allow you to use Holy Waters (I think) or Untouchables.

Damage is faster in one way I can think of though, and that's while Air Raiding through spikes. He doesn't fly back like usual, and you should be able to manage the health loss because of the regeneration on Normal.

I don't mind telling you my route at all, but most of it is in my 49:35 Super Dante run.

Mission 1: 4 hit combo ending with High Time (without jump) and some pistol usage. Other than that, I just use the 100 red orbs on the statue and jump at the wall and down-left to get the first Rusty Key quicker.

Mission 2: Grab Alastor enter the next room. Jump right at the wall and then left to get on the second floor. Leave the room and use the Rusty Key. Run to the wall, jump, and jump off to the door.

Mission 3: Examine the door, which unlocks it (quicker than checking the Pride of Lion). Run across the bridge and back, fry the skulls. For Phantom, I do a lot of jump slashes to his back, and hopefully I'll land on him eventually. Throw in a Stinger when the last two lava pillars miss.

I have a new strategy when crossing the bridge now, but I'm not sure what's faster exactly. I jump before the lightning fries me, and it seems quicker.

Mission 4: Wall jump to get the Death Sentence, and kill Nelo 1 with lots of 4 hit combos + Stinger for a finish (maybe through in a High Time for entertainment value).

The important thing to remember here is that Nelo 1 can't block an entire Alastor (Devil Trigger) combo, so pound him non-stop.

Mission 5: Try to get next to the door before the Shadow dies, and use a jump slash in the Sin Scythe room.

Mission 6: Air Raid the bugs and use a Holy Water on the Death Scythe.

Mission 7: Run from Phantom and Air Raid the Sin Scythes. If you're feeling lucky, jump off the rising platform early to save time, but if you mess up, it's pretty much over (single-segment that is).

I find it's better safe than sorry, especially for just a few seconds.

Mission 8: Stinger level 2 before the gap to save time. Wall jump to the door, and use the same strategy as before on Phantom. Throw in an Air Raid if he's near death maybe.

Use the Trident and jump into the left pool, then back out.

Mission 9: Grab the Devil Star behind the stone, and jump over the stair rail, then start running again. Stinger to the next scene and then run to the Ifrit room.

My best time saver is in this room. Jump up on the right side around the Yellow Orb (left side should work, but I use the right). Without Air Hike, it's a bit more complicated.

Jump off the wall and Air Raid to the lowest block floating out there. Land and jump to the next one, jump, and Air Raid over to Ifrit, then land.

For extra speed (I think), jump off the Ifrit platform and do a flame kick when you're low enough. Too high puts you in front of the rune stone. Remember to jump out of it when you land, if you can.

Skip Griffon 1, Air Raid puppets (using the grenade launcher and Stinger when necessary), and grab the Holy Water.

Mission 10: Stinger and use the grenade launcher on the puppets in your way. Jump or Stinger (jumping is easier) through the correct exit. Air Raid the enemies in room 2 and 3 doing the same thing to exit.

Air Raid the rock spiders and use any remaining Devil Trigger to grab the Holy Water (Stinger level 2 if necessary). Make sure to end the mission full though.

Mission 11: Do all the necessary things and jump through the planter in the middle to save time. For Nelo 2, I use the same old Alastor strategy, but with a grenade after every combo ends.

If you have Air Hike, you can take another small shortcut. Stand in place, get your orbs, jump in place, and then jump toward the screen. You should be on top of the middle platform.

After using the Chalice, run to the edge, stop, and then jump.

Mission 12: Make sure to have at least one Holy Water going into this mission. Get in the boat, and grab the Untouchable, then get out of the water. Stinger toward the stairs.

Grab the needle gun and the Devil Star. For the fight with Death Scythe, it takes 5 Alastor jump slashes. As soon as you can (around the time he slings the scythe on his shoulder), jump slash twice.

I usually mess this up, and it has killed a single-segment for me before (last time I did it, he ended up killing me with one of the special scenes).

Anyway, wait for him to attack, and give him 2 more. Wait for the attack again, and then give him the last one.

For Griffon 2, run toward the middle of the ship and wait for a bit. When the time is right (it comes with practice), use a Holy Water. After that, pound on him with Air Raid.

If you can get a good view (and no phoenix on you), abuse charged pistol shots instead, they work wonders.

Mission 13: Swim around the right side, kill the enemies, swim out. Swim above the enemies, then down (in the next room).

Mission 14: Grab the Holy Water, dodge the spikes (or fly through them if you have Vortex), and make your way down the mountain.

You can use Stinger to get down faster, but I think you need a certain enemy spawn to do it, I'm not sure (thanks auto-aim).

Skip all enemies in this mission and leave.

Mission 15: Go to the blue shield room, and Stinger + taunt the Fetish for any Devil Trigger you may need. Air Raid through the next room and kill as many Sin Scythes as you can.

Recharge at the special room, and Air Raid to the lances and back. Start the fight with Griffon 3 and abuse Meteor level 2 if you're using Super Dante, or have a lot of Devil Trigger runes.

If not, and this is basically the case with Dante, use Air Raid/charged pistol shots. Chop him up when he gets close, but I don't think charging him is the safest idea. For single-segment, there's too much risk involved.

Mission 16: Skip the Blue Orb, and activate the rune stone. Jump toward the stair rail, and Inferno on the way down (instant kill). If you don't have it, I'd use the Ifrit ground combo with Devil Trigger.

Start the fight with Nightmare 1, and try to stay in front of him to lure the ice beam attack. When he's using it, pound him with Inferno or Alastor combos (in Devil Trigger when available).

Alastor might actually be better for Nightmare 1, since it doesn't drain the gauge like Inferno does. Use whichever you prefer, but remember that Inferno is somewhat safer from attack.

Vortex level 2 over the broken bridge if you have it. If not, Air Raid is a good replacement.

Continued in the next post.

Molotov

2005-05-08 07:00:46 pm

Continued from the last post.

Mission 17: Inferno the Frosts if you can, and use Ifrit combos as a replacement if need be. A Holy Water might be the best idea though.

Kick the T-Rex's butt with his own fireballs, move the mirror in place, run forward, and jump up the right wall (from Dante's point of view). Jump onto the next platform, and Air Raid/Vortex to the Quicksilver.

Jump down, and Stinger off the platform. Start the fight with Nelo 3 with Ifrit ready and as many runes filled as you can.

From the start, use Meteor level 2 as much as you can (full charge to less charge as he gets closer). When you're out, start charging back up with Alastor and the grenade launcher.

When full again, you should probably use Inferno if you have it. If not, definitely go with the old "pound Nelo with Alastor Devil Trigger and grenades" strategy.

Mission 18: Equip the Alastor, and make your way to the rune stone. Charge it, swim up to the egg platform, and wait for your chance to grab it.

After that, jump a tiny bit off the rail. You should land near the door to Nightmare 2, if done correctly. Start the fight, and use the exact same strategy as before.

Mission 19: Grab the Untouchable on the bed when you can, and skip the Nightmare Beta. When the Nobodies show up, jump up on the platform like you're running away, and skip the scene.

Jump back down and abuse Inferno if possible. Otherwise, use the Stinger + grenade combo, and repeat as necessary.

Vortex 2/Air Raid over the bridge and slap the stone in.

Mission 20: Skip the Frosts, and use the same Nightmare strategy again. When Trish acts up, just go back to what you were doing (kicking Nightmare 3 butt).

When he "dies", use a Holy Water, and laugh at him (while skipping the scene).

Mission 21: Grab the Holy Water, use Vortex 2 to get to and smash the door switch. Use it to get back also.

If you don't have it, Stinger from the door, jump up, smash the thing, Stinger back, and exit.

Vortex/Stinger the tentacles and Inferno/Stinger + grenade the Nobodies. Smack the door open while waiting for the last one to explode.

Run forward and use a Holy Water, then make your way up. If you have Air Hike, you can skip the last rising platform. If not, it's probably possible, but way too risky.

Jump the gap, activate the stone, and Stinger toward the door.

Mission 23: Buy as many Purple Orbs as possible, and use any remaining orbs on Devil Stars. Use your Devil Trigger attack from the start, and abuse all your Devil Stars.

For Mundus 2, shoot him while waiting for the platforms, and then unload on him. If you see he's about to smash the platforms, use an Untouchable and finish him off from the lava next to him if you can (I've done it before).

Mission 24: Buy a Holy Water if you don't have one, and start the mission (make sure you have Vortex). Same strategies apply for the Nobodies, and grab the Untouchable if you have no Devil Stars.

Smash the door early, skip the Frosts, and hitch a ride on the elevator. Jump early to save time, or Air Hike for a bigger time saver.

Run past the puppets, and run down the next hall. When the camera changes, use the Holy Water. Run out the door, and fall down the hole.

Use Vortex to kill Mundus 3, and use a Devil Star (if you have one left) to kill Mundus 4. If not, use an Untouchable.

Fly out, and you're done. Grin

Continued from the last post.

Mission 17: Inferno the Frosts if you can, and use Ifrit combos as a replacement if need be. A Holy Water might be the best idea though.

Kick the T-Rex's butt with his own fireballs, move the mirror in place, run forward, and jump up the right wall (from Dante's point of view). Jump onto the next platform, and Air Raid/Vortex to the Quicksilver.

Jump down, and Stinger off the platform. Start the fight with Nelo 3 with Ifrit ready and as many runes filled as you can.

From the start, use Meteor level 2 as much as you can (full charge to less charge as he gets closer). When you're out, start charging back up with Alastor and the grenade launcher.

When full again, you should probably use Inferno if you have it. If not, definitely go with the old "pound Nelo with Alastor Devil Trigger and grenades" strategy.

Mission 18: Equip the Alastor, and make your way to the rune stone. Charge it, swim up to the egg platform, and wait for your chance to grab it.

After that, jump a tiny bit off the rail. You should land near the door to Nightmare 2, if done correctly. Start the fight, and use the exact same strategy as before.

Mission 19: Grab the Untouchable on the bed when you can, and skip the Nightmare Beta. When the Nobodies show up, jump up on the platform like you're running away, and skip the scene.

Jump back down and abuse Inferno if possible. Otherwise, use the Stinger + grenade combo, and repeat as necessary.

Vortex 2/Air Raid over the bridge and slap the stone in.

Mission 20: Skip the Frosts, and use the same Nightmare strategy again. When Trish acts up, just go back to what you were doing (kicking Nightmare 3 butt).

When he "dies", use a Holy Water, and laugh at him (while skipping the scene).

Mission 21: Grab the Holy Water, use Vortex 2 to get to and smash the door switch. Use it to get back also.

If you don't have it, Stinger from the door, jump up, smash the thing, Stinger back, and exit.

Vortex/Stinger the tentacles and Inferno/Stinger + grenade the Nobodies. Smack the door open while waiting for the last one to explode.

Run forward and use a Holy Water, then make your way up. If you have Air Hike, you can skip the last rising platform. If not, it's probably possible, but way too risky.

Jump the gap, activate the stone, and Stinger toward the door.

Mission 23: Buy as many Purple Orbs as possible, and use any remaining orbs on Devil Stars. Use your Devil Trigger attack from the start, and abuse all your Devil Stars.

For Mundus 2, shoot him while waiting for the platforms, and then unload on him. If you see he's about to smash the platforms, use an Untouchable and finish him off from the lava next to him if you can (I've done it before).

Mission 24: Buy a Holy Water if you don't have one, and start the mission (make sure you have Vortex). Same strategies apply for the Nobodies, and grab the Untouchable if you have no Devil Stars.

Smash the door early, skip the Frosts, and hitch a ride on the elevator. Jump early to save time, or Air Hike for a bigger time saver.

Run past the puppets, and run down the next hall. When the camera changes, use the Holy Water. Run out the door, and fall down the hole.

Use Vortex to kill Mundus 3, and use a Devil Star (if you have one left) to kill Mundus 4. If not, use an Untouchable.

Fly out, and you're done.  ;D

HeroPenguin

2005-05-08 11:03:21 pm

Rock on, Earthbound. Rock on.

I'm aware of the Royal Guard strategies. At the moment, in my first playthrough on Easy, I'm trying to get used to the timing on it to do it reliably. Though I have a sneaky suspicion that it'll depend on the bosses... Swordmaster does a pretty good job of boosting your damage potential, and dodging can be faster than blocking, at times... It'll take tests. Once I finish the game, though, I might start working on it myself.

Psychochild

2005-05-09 07:11:29 am

I'm aware of the Royal Guard strategies. At the moment, in my first playthrough on Easy, I'm trying to get used to the timing on it to do it reliably. Though I have a sneaky suspicion that it'll depend on the bosses... Swordmaster does a pretty good job of boosting your damage potential, and dodging can be faster than blocking, at times... It'll take tests. Once I finish the game, though, I might start working on it myself.

Can you say "Vergil 3 in 56 seconds?" I had a video, where by using royal guard, Vergil got completely devestated. It was almost depressing. It was on DMD.

I'm not sure though if you'd want to try using Royal Guard as a style for the levels themselves. Inbetween the levels, I imagine Swordmaster would be the most ideal, since it opens up a ton of crowd control abilities, aerial combos, and god forbid, the Dance Macabre. Clearing enemies out is a priority.

Weapons, E&I's a given, but for the secondary, you won't be using gunslinger, I imagine, so Artemis is out. The Shotgun is useful on... well, without gunslinger, that too is pretty much useless. So it's Spiral vs. Kalina Ann. Spiral when fast swapping between Ebony and Ivory could do insane damage, but Kalina Ann sends those suckers flying. It has a limited range, but I just love that rocket launcher..

Meh. I gotta go back and finisih DMD mode one day...

[b]I'm aware of the Royal Guard strategies.  At the moment, in my first playthrough on Easy, I'm trying to get used to the timing on it to do it reliably.  Though I have a sneaky suspicion that it'll depend on the bosses...  Swordmaster does a pretty good job of boosting your damage potential, and dodging can be faster than blocking, at times...  It'll take tests.  Once I finish the game, though, I might start working on it myself.[/b]

Can you say "Vergil 3 in 56 seconds?"  I had a video, where by using royal guard, Vergil got completely devestated.  It was almost depressing.  It was on DMD.

I'm not sure though if you'd want to try using Royal Guard as a style for the levels themselves.  Inbetween the levels, I imagine Swordmaster would be the most ideal, since it opens up a ton of crowd control abilities, aerial combos, and god forbid, the Dance Macabre.  Clearing enemies out is a priority.

Weapons, E&I's a given, but for the secondary, you won't be using gunslinger, I imagine, so Artemis is out.  The Shotgun is useful on... well, without gunslinger, that too is pretty much useless.  So it's Spiral vs. Kalina Ann.  Spiral when fast swapping between Ebony and Ivory could do insane damage, but Kalina Ann sends those suckers flying.  It has a limited range, but I just love that rocket launcher..

Meh.  I gotta go back and finisih DMD mode one day...

HeroPenguin

2005-05-09 08:31:18 pm

Rock on, Earthbound. Rock on.

In 56 seconds? Okay, that's just ludicrous. I tend to agree, Swordmaster during the levels, with Royalguard for the bosses. But then there's the question of how to do the run... Should they be individual level times with a fully-powered Dante (I cringe at that...), or should they be done from the beginning with a clean slate, opening the path for hardship and strife? The game seems to almost be set up for the express purpose of making you go back and level up (or maybe that's just me and my completist side... damn you Legend of Zelda and your collectible item upgrades and heart containers, giving me something to do for hours upon hours on end!), and it's even been proven that it's impossible to get SS rankings on some of the earlier levels when starting from a clean slate on DMD mode, making any possible SS rank speedruns forced to use a full plate instead of a clean slate... That's the biggest issue with speedrunning this game I can think of, actually. How exactley the game will have to be categorized in order to keep everything fair. :/

That and the fact that I don't actually own the game... it and the PS2 belong to a friend of mine, blast it all. ^_^;;;;

In 56 seconds?  Okay, that's just ludicrous.  I tend to agree, Swordmaster during the levels, with Royalguard for the bosses.  But then there's the question of how to do the run...  Should they be individual level times with a fully-powered Dante (I cringe at that...), or should they be done from the beginning with a clean slate, opening the path for hardship and strife?  The game seems to almost be set up for the express purpose of making you go back and level up (or maybe that's just me and my completist side...  damn you Legend of Zelda and your collectible item upgrades and heart containers, giving me something to do for hours upon hours on end!), and it's even been proven that it's impossible to get SS rankings on some of the earlier levels when starting from a clean slate on DMD mode, making any possible SS rank speedruns forced to use a full plate instead of a clean slate...  That's the biggest issue with speedrunning this game I can think of, actually.  How exactley the game will have to be categorized in order to keep everything fair.  :/

That and the fact that I don't actually own the game...  it and the PS2 belong to a friend of mine, blast it all.  ^_^;;;;

BDA

2005-05-09 08:45:32 pm

Let's fight to computer!

I suppose that'd be for Radix to decide. Personally, I think fresh characters for Normal runs and powered-up characters for DMD runs would be reasonable. In fact, most of the DMD strategies I've seen for DMC3 involve a fully-powered Dante.

Of course, I won't be the one doing the run (I barely managed to beat it on Normal) so it's not my call.