lego bionicle (gba)

2016-01-04 03:26:11 pm

Watching AGDQ reminded me how much I missed running this game. Sorry I was gone so long.
AND HOLY SHIT YOU GOT THROUGH THE WALL!!!!!!!!
Sucks that the Scorpion quick kill is luck, but whatever. Doesn't suck to much.
That thing about the transitions is really weird.
That ga-koro slide is really nice. Does it really matter that you miss the fruit. We can still throw it anyway because of the item glitch.
Just watched the tas really nice work dude. It's mind boggling to me how far you have taken this run. When I started running this game was a joke, but you've done really nice work.

TheMG2

2016-01-04 03:54:20 pm

Problem with item glitch is that you have to swap inventory more often. Other than that it's not that big a deal. It isn't exactly a slide though, it's a different glitch caused by double activating the launcher. I've been calling them flings because you fly through the air.

I was really happy when I found the wall thing (because it meant a lot less work because that section was kind of a pain).

Now that I have a TAS of this on tasvideos, I'm currently taking a break from this game to look into other games, I'll probably come back to it some day. I'll keep up with any developments though.

Vibex

2016-01-04 07:30:28 pm

That is true, and I was always terrible at inventory management.
Ahh, got it flings.
Alright, good luck with whatever you start running!

TheMG2

2016-01-06 11:19:54 am

I'm a monster, I've led somebody at AGDQ to buy copies of this game. He bought seven copies. SEVEN.

Nobody should own that many copies of this game.

Vibex

Edit history:

Vibex: 2016-01-06 03:25:09 pm

Vibex: 2016-01-06 03:23:51 pm

2016-01-06 03:22:43 pm

SEVEN?!? Why does he need so many!
Though they are only like $1.50 a cart. But still.

EDIT: A little more then that with shipping. But still dirt cheap.
EDIT2: Actually now that I think about it I'm kind of interested if there are any cart differences. Probably not, but I may try my local stores to see if I can find some different versions.

TheMG2

2016-01-06 03:30:54 pm

He bought the store's entire stock.

I know there is a second version with more languages which is likely the european version. No idea about gameplay differences.

Vibex

2016-01-06 03:32:05 pm

Yeah there is definitely a European one, I had a rom of it at one point. Haven't come across any others though.

Vibex

2016-01-06 08:18:54 pm

I've been playing around a lot with the text interup slide/fling thing that you used to go through the wall. I'll post the results here as soon as they finish uploading to youtube. Haven't found any that save time yet, but I think with some better angles, and more trial and error, they could.

TheMG2

2016-01-06 08:37:43 pm

I tried messing with it and whenever I tried to angle downwards I would either end up building up too much downwards vertical speed and end up taking longer to pass through the wall or I ended up in the crevice where I would just bob up and down. I went with the crevice in the end because it got me through the wall fastest. I wouldn't be surprised if it could be done, but I didn't see how.

Vibex

Edit history:

Vibex: 2016-01-06 08:47:14 pm

2016-01-06 08:44:31 pm

Oh actually I meant on different walls. It works everywhere that you get a text box automatically.

This last video is the only one that could be used to save time with some more work

One weird thing I noticed though was that all of these items that I had to run into myself worked, but when I try to run into disks it doesn't. This may have something to do with why you can pick up discs with berries, but not other things.

TheMG2

Edit history:

TheMG2: 2016-01-06 08:59:23 pm

TheMG2: 2016-01-06 08:58:40 pm

2016-01-06 08:55:26 pm

I just couldn't think of any good places to use it. I tried the area with the drill but that ended up being slower the way I was trying.

I think the disc thing is because you actually touch the disc sprite before triggering the text box when you use the launcher. Whenever you touch a sprite when using the launcher and are in midair, you bonk. In the other cases, you activate the textbox before touching the sprite. At least that's my theory. The reason you touch it is because it goes from flat before the text to upright during the text, and I'm guessing how that is triggered is by something touching the sprite. This is probably related to why throwing things work. At least that's my theory.

EDIT: Interesting idea with the bottom video, I kinda doubt it would be faster for TAS, but it could be faster in the context of rta. Keep in mind that using the drill will allow you to reset your speed to 0, thus allowing you to regain control sooner.

Vibex

2016-01-06 08:59:09 pm

I feel like there must be an angle that takes you with the drill towards the top left of the map. I feel like that should be possible. At least thats what I'm trying for. It's definitely slower to do the glitch through the wall in any%, but in one of my tests I got an angle where I was flung first to the area after the two pillars, and then to the area with the hidden health up. It may be faster in 100% to get it that way, though I haven't been able to recreate it again.

Vibex

2016-01-08 11:02:44 am

Found this whil trying to skip po-koro. Nothing major, but could lead to something.

TheMG2

2016-01-08 12:13:22 pm

My guess is that they thought nobody would go over to those spots because of how close the sign/rock is.

So how loading zones work is that whether you trigger them are controlled by two addresses. These are USUALLY set to your position. These two addresses also are involved in controlling the camera, so if the camera does something weird, it's probably these two addresses. I have found two glitches (launch storage and pause position storage: read this for details) so far that can manipulate them, but the extent of the manipulation is very limited. When these two coordinates match up with the position of a loading zone, you trigger that loading zone. I believe loading zones are usually slightly in front of the edge of the screen and may slightly overlap with it, it varies from loading zone to loading zone.

The problem is that every area is encased by a giant wall that you cannot see. I've pretty much gathered this from messing with lavaboard glitch, from plant teleports, etc. This wall is not infinitely thick, but it's thick enough. It's why boundary hopping works, but it means that you cannot go beyond the edge of the screen and behind loading zones. If you do go in the area beyond the edge of the screen and beyond loading zones, you won't be able to get back in. I don't think the wall is infinitely thick but you certainly cannot get through it through normal means. I could be wrong though.

I think there are a couple ways one could potentially skip Po-Koro. The first would be a way of using items in a no-item zone. This could allow you to do either object teleport or large object drag. The second would be a new way of manipulating those two addresses.

My guess is that they thought nobody would go over to those spots  because of how close the sign/rock is.

So how loading zones work is that whether you trigger them are controlled by two addresses. These are USUALLY set to your position. These two addresses also are involved in controlling the camera, so if the camera does something weird, it's probably these two addresses. I have found two glitches (launch storage and pause position storage: read [url=http://pastebin.com/15SpTQbN]this[/url] for details) so far that can manipulate them, but the extent of the manipulation is very limited. When these two coordinates match up with the position of a loading zone, you trigger that loading zone. I believe loading zones are usually slightly in front of the edge of the screen and may slightly overlap with it, it varies from loading zone to loading zone.

The problem is that every area is encased by a giant wall that you cannot see. I've pretty much gathered this from messing with lavaboard glitch, from plant teleports, etc. This wall is not infinitely thick, but it's thick enough. It's why boundary hopping works, but it means that you cannot go beyond the edge of the screen and behind loading zones. If you do go in the area beyond the edge of the screen and beyond loading zones, you won't be able to get back in. I don't think the wall is infinitely thick but you certainly cannot get through it through normal means. I could be wrong though.

I think there are a couple ways one could potentially skip Po-Koro. The first would be a way of using items in a no-item zone. This could allow you to do either object teleport or large object drag. The second would be a new way of manipulating those two addresses.

Vibex

2016-01-08 01:50:42 pm

Okay, didn't really think that they would do much, just figured it was worth mentioning.
Finding a way to use items in no item zones would save a lot of time. It would allow us to skip all of Po-koro(probably), and the second half of onu-koro(definitely).

Vibex

2016-01-10 05:01:57 pm

Just read (most) of that huge pastebin you have. Really interesting stuff. I'm gonna try and get a new run out soon. I think we the new stuff found and with some optimization 13 or lower is probably viable for rta. Also is the guy who bought 7 copies planning on running the game. Would love to have some rta competition.

TheMG2

2016-01-10 05:07:37 pm

He distributed the copies to people and I don't think kept any for himself. I have no idea.

Vibex

2016-01-10 06:19:55 pm

Well hopefully a bunch of people will pick it up then.

Vibex

Edit history:

Vibex: 2016-07-14 10:33:28 am

2016-07-14 09:48:58 am

Was doing some rough timing today. In the Second half of Onu-Koro, not taking out the launcher, and jumping across takes about 5 seconds when done optimally. Taking out the launcher using it, and then taking out the explosive fruit takes about 9. Was pretty sure the jump saved time, but figured I would actually check.

EDIT: TheMG2, I don't know if you are still into this game, but if you are, I was wondering if you could look into something for me. I was thinking about how the game keeps track of which entrance you came in. I'm wondering if that value could be manipulated in any way. If your out of this game for good however I'll look into it myself.

TheMG2

Edit history:

TheMG2: 2016-07-14 12:52:16 pm

2016-07-14 12:37:45 pm

I'm still willing to do research but I'm currently not sure where it's stored. I found addresses relating to where you go when you exit a minigame, but I don't know if I looked into an address for entrances.

EDIT: I'm not sure how it works. I think it might be a part of how the game loads things and I'm not sure how that works to begin with.

Vibex

2016-07-14 12:55:16 pm

Alright, was just a thought I had considering how wonky some of the other values are.
I finally got around to learning how to do slides, and a few other small tech moves. My sum of best right now is 15:04, but with some grinding I think I can get it down to at least a 14.

TheMG2

2016-07-14 01:01:04 pm

Nice work.

Vibex

2017-01-14 06:59:57 pm

So while I haven't posted in a while, AGDQ got me to pick the game up again, and I just found a new skip in the enterance to Po-Koro. Still working out some kinks with it, but should 100% save time (non-TAS at least, not sure about in TAS yet though).

TheMG2

2017-01-14 07:05:47 pm

Sweet. Can you give me a video? If it's using the launcher text interrupt slide with the drill, I've already timed it, it doesn't save time in TAS, but good to know it saves time in RTA.

Vibex

2017-01-14 07:13:25 pm

I'll get a video up asap. And yeah it's with the drill. I'd played with it a lot before, but couldn't find anything that useful before. But this time I went behind the pile of boulders and shot the launcher against the wall. Then I did the text interupt with the drill. It takes you all the way to the end of the level (right next to the green bird and the three blue crabs).