Kirby's Dreamland 2

Phở

Edit history:

Phở: 2010-05-15 06:43:11 pm

2010-04-25 10:25:16 pm

Too cool for 7th grade.

THE TRILOGY NEEDS COMPLETION!
I read Aqua Tiger had a run for Radix 4 years ago, but it's not on the Game List? MYSTERY! So, I decided that Game Gear Sonic 2 is too evil of a game to run, and that I'll try running this one instead. Tongue

I'm planning a SS any% run, which gives you the "meh" ending and avoids the Dark Matter fight.
Goals for this run:
-Sub 50 minutes
-Mash the A button for 50 minutes straight. Like a man.
A sub 50 min 100% like the TAS is pretty much impossible. A lot of the run is mashing the A button with Coo and Kine like the TAS, but Soulrivers is presing A every second frame, which I'm pretty sure isn't humanly possible. Unless you rip off your shirt and show off your muscles like Frezy, then maybe.

Terminology I use:
Fire-Dash - what Kirby does with the Fire Ability
Spit out abilities - Press select, and Kirby gets rid of his ability. The ability turns into a star you can either swallow again or spit at an enemy.
Coo - Kirby's owl friend - allows you to fly faster
Kine - Kirby's fish friend - allows you to swim faster
double hit - you can swallow two enemies/items/stars at the same time! Spitting these out simultaneously gives an enemy 2x damage.
umbrella-spin - Coo with the Parasol Ability allows Kirby to spin while flying.

Game Plan
Grassland
1-1: jump over everyone
1-2: grab fire ability, fire-dash to the mid-boss. Fire-dash 1/3 of his health in case he doesn't do a straight attack.
1-3: fire-dash to the end.
Whispy Woods: Spit out fire, hit him. Then, hit him with falling apples.

Big Forest
2-1: get Coo, get Parasol Ability, insta-invinciblity!
2-2: fly/umbrella-spin through the level
2-3: fly/umbrella spin to mid-boss. Get Spike Ability to kill mid boss. finish the level.
Nruff: Spit out Ability, hit him. Then hit him with his furry friends.

Ripple Field
3-1: fly with Coo until the second rock enemy. Get Rock ability. Swim to the end.
3-2: swim to the jellyfish boss and kill him with rock ability. The fastest way is to stone him and take damage, then double hit him with a star he throws and a star you spit out from getting rid of rock ability. Swim to the end with Kine.
3-3: Swim to the end.
Sweet Stuff: Kill him with Kine/Spark Ability.

Iceberg
4-1: Get fire ability. Fire-Dash to the mid-boss. Kill mid boss get rock ability. It's faster to free fall off the ledges after this fight, but it's harder than it looks.
4-2: Wind blows you to the mid-boss. kill him with rock ability, get coo and umbrella ability. Then you get fire ability, and you fly to the end.
4-3: Fly to the mid-boss, get Kine and Ice ability, swim to the end.
4-4: Keep Kine and get fire ability.
Ice Dragon: Kill him with a Kine/Fire combo.

Red Canyon
5-1: Fire dash to the end
5-2: fire dash to mid boss. Get Cutter ability. screen scrolls to the end
5-3: Get Coo, fly to the end.
5-4: Fly to the water, swim the rest of the way.
5-5: Get rid of Coo, get to the end.
-Go to 5-3, get Rick. Go to 5-2, get Spike-
Mr. Shine and Mr. Bright: Rick/Spike is waaaaaaaaay faster.

Cloudy Park
6-1: Fly to the end
6-2: I sadly have to get rid of Coo in order to go on. Sad

-Go back to 5-3, get Coo
6-3: Fly to the end.
6-4: Fly to the end.
6-5: Fly to the end.
6-6: Fly to end. Tongue

-Go back to Level 5, get Rick/Spike-
Kracko: Rick/Spike Ability. Does 2-4 damage on Kracko's first form and 1-2 damage on his second. So fast!!
-Go back to level 5, get Coo-

Dark Castle
7-1: Fly to the end.
7-2: Fly to the end.
7-3: Fly to the end.
7-4: Fly to the end.
7-5: Pick up Ice Ability. Fly to the end.
7-6: Fly to the end.
7-7: Grab an umbrella and umprella spin all the way up.
-Ditch Coo, go back to 7-2 and get Rock Ability-
King DeDeDe: Spam Rock Ability. King DeDeDe's hitbox is weird, so half of Kirby can touch King DeDeDe without taking damage.

Best time so far: 47:33!! Let's go for 46!

Thread title:

THE TRILOGY NEEDS COMPLETION!
I read Aqua Tiger had a run for Radix 4 years ago, but it's not on the Game List? MYSTERY! So, I decided that Game Gear Sonic 2 is too evil of a game to run, and that I'll try running this one instead. :P
I'm planning a SS any% run, which gives you the "meh" ending and avoids the Dark Matter fight.
Goals for this run:
-Sub 50 minutes
-Mash the A button for 50 minutes straight. Like a man.
[url=http://tasvideos.org/1555S.html]A sub 50 min 100% like the TAS[/url] is pretty much impossible. A lot of the run is mashing the A button with Coo and Kine like the TAS, but Soulrivers is presing A every second frame, which I'm pretty sure isn't humanly possible. Unless you rip off your shirt and show off your muscles like Frezy, then maybe.

Terminology I use:
[u]Fire-Dash[/u] - what Kirby does with the Fire Ability
[u]Spit out abilities[/u] - Press select, and Kirby gets rid of his ability. The ability turns into a star you can either swallow again or spit at an enemy.
[u]Coo[/u] - Kirby's owl friend - allows you to fly faster
[u]Kine[/u] - Kirby's fish friend - allows you to swim faster
[u]double hit[/u] - you can swallow two enemies/items/stars at the same time! Spitting these out simultaneously gives an enemy 2x damage.
[u]umbrella-spin[/u] - Coo with the Parasol Ability allows Kirby to spin while flying.

[i][b]Game Plan[/b][/i]
[u]Grassland[/u]
1-1: jump over everyone
1-2: grab fire ability, fire-dash to the mid-boss. Fire-dash 1/3 of his health in case he doesn't do a straight attack.
1-3: fire-dash to the end.
Whispy Woods: Spit out fire, hit him. Then, hit him with falling apples.

[u]Big Forest[/u]
2-1: get Coo, get Parasol Ability, insta-invinciblity!
2-2: fly/umbrella-spin through the level
2-3: fly/umbrella spin to mid-boss. Get Spike Ability to kill mid boss. finish the level.
Nruff: Spit out Ability, hit him. Then hit him with his furry friends.

[u]Ripple Field[/u]
3-1: fly with Coo until the second rock enemy. Get Rock ability. Swim to the end.
3-2: swim to the jellyfish boss and kill him with rock ability. The fastest way is to stone him and take damage, then double hit him with a star he throws and a star you spit out from getting rid of rock ability. Swim to the end with Kine.
3-3: Swim to the end.
Sweet Stuff: Kill him with Kine/Spark Ability.

[u]Iceberg[/u]
4-1: Get fire ability. Fire-Dash to the mid-boss. Kill mid boss get rock ability. It's faster to free fall off the ledges after this fight, but it's harder than it looks.
4-2: Wind blows you to the mid-boss. kill him with rock ability, get coo and umbrella ability. Then you get fire ability, and you fly to the end.
4-3: Fly to the mid-boss, get Kine and Ice ability, swim to the end. 
4-4: Keep Kine and get fire ability. 
Ice Dragon: Kill him with a Kine/Fire combo.

[u]Red Canyon[/u]
5-1: Fire dash to the end
5-2: fire dash to mid boss. Get Cutter ability. screen scrolls to the end
5-3: Get Coo, fly to the end.
5-4: Fly to the water, swim the rest of the way.
5-5: Get rid of Coo, get to the end.
-Go to 5-3, get Rick. Go to 5-2, get Spike-
Mr. Shine and Mr. Bright: Rick/Spike is waaaaaaaaay faster.

[u]Cloudy Park[/u]
6-1: Fly to the end
6-2: I sadly have to get rid of Coo in order to go on. :(
-Go back to 5-3, get Coo
6-3: Fly to the end.
6-4: Fly to the end.
6-5: Fly to the end.
6-6: Fly to end. :P
-Go back to Level 5, get Rick/Spike-
Kracko: Rick/Spike Ability. Does 2-4 damage on Kracko's first form and 1-2 damage on his second. So fast!!
-Go back to level 5, get Coo-

[u]Dark Castle[/u]
7-1: Fly to the end.
7-2: Fly to the end.
7-3: Fly to the end.
7-4: Fly to the end.
7-5: Pick up Ice Ability. Fly to the end.
7-6: Fly to the end.
7-7: Grab an umbrella and umprella spin all the way up.
-Ditch Coo, go back to 7-2 and get Rock Ability-
King DeDeDe: Spam Rock Ability. King DeDeDe's hitbox is weird, so half of Kirby can touch King DeDeDe without taking damage.

[b]Best time so far: 47:33!! Let's go for 46![/b]

Phở

Edit history:

Phở: 2010-04-29 11:03:20 am

2010-04-29 09:56:22 am

Too cool for 7th grade.

There's no love for this game? Sad

Tips or changes to the game plan would be appreciated!

I changed the plan a little. Going back to 5-3 after 6-2 to get Coo doesn't waste much time. I'm sure I make up for it by being able to fly faster.

agumike

2010-05-01 08:04:49 pm

Oooooo! There is still love for this game! I don't know the tricks for a speedrun of this one, but if you are goin for an any % SS, I would assume Coo is the best indefinitely. I dont know if you slow down much with the Parasol Coo, but if you don't slow down much, its a great way to go safely

Phở

2010-05-01 10:59:29 pm

Too cool for 7th grade.

HOORAY! LOVE FOR KIRBY!

Anyway, Coo/Parasol goes as fast as regular flying. The only time it doesn't work is in one of the Dark Castle stages because there are too many enemies.

agumike

2010-05-02 01:29:34 am

I personally liked using Coo/Cutter because it covered a good area, but I don't know if it gives enough cover. It doesn't last as long as a Parasol, so in that sense, you can go faster

Phở

2010-05-03 12:47:06 am

Too cool for 7th grade.

Coo stops for a second when she uses cutter, and you're not invincible using cutter as well, sadly. I might be doing something wrong, but I need to get really close to mini-bosses to get full damage with Coo/Cutter. I read in Aqua Tiger's old topic that Coo/Cutter does a lot on the second boss, but I get a faster kill with spitting furries at him.

agumike

2010-05-03 08:58:20 pm

I looked at the old TAS and didn't see much variation. Looks like all you have to do is perfect the techniques and slowly work that time down. Although, there IS that Boss Rush TAS that you could adapt a few strategies from for some bosses.

Phở

2010-05-03 09:47:03 pm

Too cool for 7th grade.

There's a Boss Rush TAS? My Google skills fail. Sad

And yeah, I am copying a lot of the TAS, but like I said, Soulrivers presses the A button every two frames; that's why he flies so fast. The luck manipulation for this game is more insane than it looks also. The Kracko fight is a good example. In the TAS, I think it only lasts 30 seconds? But that fight can take up to 2 minutes because Kracko attacks with lightning bolts more than he pops out enemies for you to spit back at him. That's why I'm using Rick/Spike Ability on him so I can fight bosses as fast as the TAS.

agumike

2010-05-04 12:54:47 am

Well, the problem is that the Boss Rush TAS that I find is only on Nico, and it is really old as well. As for which of ANY of the methods is faster, I still don't know. testing is hard since i'd have to clear the game many time to get to said bosses and experiment everything.

So unless you have a Nico account, doesn't look like i can find it anywhere else

Phở

2010-05-04 09:09:16 pm

Too cool for 7th grade.

Easiest way to test is to exit the boss fight before beating him and going to another level to pick up a friend/ability.
I.E. I can go to the 2nd boss and see if Coo/Parasol works. It fails, so I exit and go get Spike Ability from 2-2. Speaking of that, if the 2nd boss decides to run half-way across the screen and then turn around, I can spam Coo/Spike on him for a ridiculously fast fight. Cheesy

I also tested going back to level 2 to get Coo after Level 3, which skips a mini-boss fight in level 4-1, but I couldn't make up the time. The penguins are so random and EVIL.... dood.

Phở

2010-05-05 11:23:08 am

Too cool for 7th grade.

49:37!!

I died on one of the scrolling parts and the King DeDeDe fight was kinda meh, so something below my time is very possible. Cheesy

agumike

2010-05-05 06:10:22 pm

Wow, you can really do it if you got that kind of time. Just remember, TAKE BREAKS. You always do better after a long break

Phở

2010-05-05 11:46:44 pm

Too cool for 7th grade.

Yeah, in my 49 min run, I didn't use Coo in the beginning and end of Dark Castle, so I was able to swim through some parts faster. I didn't realize how much Coo slows you down in water. I also got Coo from a bag in 7-3 (I think), so I didn't need to go back to level 5 for her. I may have to rely on Flame Ability instead of Coo on more parts just to be faster.

I totally need a break though lol.

agumike

2010-05-06 02:03:13 am

Well, Coo's downward movement in water is great, but her upwards movement is absolutely horrible. xD;

Well, using Fire is always a for sure way, and it requires less button presses

Floogal

Edit history:

Floogal: 2010-05-06 02:26:38 am

2010-05-06 02:08:35 am

Most likely a bit late, but you might find this information useful nonetheless. Reference this page for names.

Efrite - 30
Mr. Frosty - 30
Waiyu - 30
Blocky - 30
Jumpershoot - 30
Master Green - 30
Captain Stitch - 30

Whispy Woods - 60
Nruff - 60
Sweet Stuff - 60 (10 damage per deflected starfish)
Ice Dragon - 60
Mr. Shine - 40
Mr. Bright - 40
Kracko Jr. - 35
Kracko - 80
Dedede - 120
Dark Matter (1) - 120, 10 damage per reflected part
Dark Matter (2) - 120, 20 damage per reflected part

Attack damage:
Normal - 10 (single), 20 (double)
Water Spout - 2
Rainbow Sword - 2 (swing)

Parasol - 3 (swing), 2 (hold), 1 (contact)
Fire - 4
Ice - 2 (breath), 8 (block)
Needle - 5
Stone - 6
Electric - 3
Cutter - 3

Parasol - 4 (swing), 2 (hold)
Fire - 3
Ice - 2 (shield), 8 (block)
Needle - 8
Stone - 2
Electric - 2
Cutter - 4

Parasol - 2
Fire - 4
Ice - 2 (breath), 8 (block)
Needle - 4
Stone - 4
Electric - 3 (kirby), 2 (bolt)
Cutter - 2 per feather

Parasol - 4
Fire - 5
Ice - 2 (shield), 8 (block)
Needle - 6
Stone - 8
Electric - 2 (bulb hold), 4 (bulb shot), 2 (explosion)
Cutter - 4

So, thoughts:
I see you've already noticed that Rick+Needle is very strong. The only other attack with at least as much power (and that doesn't require a projectile off of the boss) is Kine+Stone, which is much harder to efficiently hit with.

When using Coo, try to have Cutter for bosses -- properly positioned, getting all 3 feathers to hit at the same time does 6 damage, enough to 5-shot minibosses. But fire does in a pinch for a slower but much easier fight.

As useful as Electric is for Kine regarding ordinary enemies, it's not the highest tier for bosses. Fire, needle, and stone do increaing amounts of damage -- also in increasing amounts of difficulty to safely hit with. I can't test right now, but I believe that you can stone yourself right in front of the enemy, and graze their side on the way down, allowing you to immediately transform back to normal and scrape their face again. This strategy is only worth it for Kine -- all other forms of stone don't do enough damage to warrant the risk.

In general, the only real thing to worry about is to have an actual ability to tackle bosses with so you're not wasting time waiting for projectiles. Detouring for slightly more powerful abilities probably isn't worth it if it hinders your progress through the levels. If you're using a weak attack against a boss, be sure to drop it when an edible is produced, quickly spit the gift back, then reclaim your weak ability to continue the pummelling.

Most likely a bit late, but you might find this information useful nonetheless.  Reference [url=http://www.kirbysrainbowresort.net/multimedia/pictures/dreamland2/]this page[/url] for names.

[spoiler="Miniboss HP"]
Efrite - 30
Mr. Frosty - 30
Waiyu - 30
Blocky - 30
Jumpershoot - 30
Master Green - 30
Captain Stitch - 30[/spoiler]
[spoiler="Boss HP"]
Whispy Woods - 60
Nruff - 60
Sweet Stuff - 60 (10 damage per deflected starfish)
Ice Dragon - 60
Mr. Shine - 40
Mr. Bright - 40
Kracko Jr. - 35
Kracko - 80
Dedede - 120
Dark Matter (1) - 120, 10 damage per reflected part
Dark Matter (2) - 120, 20 damage per reflected part
[/spoiler]

Attack damage:
Normal - 10 (single), 20 (double)
Water Spout - 2
Rainbow Sword - 2 (swing)
[spoiler="Kirby alone"]
Parasol - 3 (swing), 2 (hold), 1 (contact)
Fire - 4
Ice - 2 (breath), 8 (block)
Needle - 5
Stone - 6
Electric - 3
Cutter - 3[/spoiler]
[spoiler="Rick"]
Parasol - 4 (swing), 2 (hold)
Fire - 3
Ice - 2 (shield), 8 (block)
Needle - 8
Stone - 2
Electric - 2
Cutter - 4[/spoiler]
[spoiler="Coo"]
Parasol - 2
Fire - 4
Ice - 2 (breath), 8 (block)
Needle - 4
Stone - 4
Electric - 3 (kirby), 2 (bolt)
Cutter - 2 per feather[/spoiler]
[spoiler="Kine"]
Parasol - 4
Fire - 5
Ice - 2 (shield), 8 (block)
Needle - 6
Stone - 8
Electric - 2 (bulb hold), 4 (bulb shot), 2 (explosion)
Cutter - 4[/spoiler]

So, thoughts:
I see you've already noticed that Rick+Needle is very strong.  The only other attack with at least as much power (and that doesn't require a projectile off of the boss) is Kine+Stone, which is much harder to efficiently hit with.

When using Coo, try to have Cutter for bosses -- properly positioned, getting all 3 feathers to hit at the same time does 6 damage, enough to 5-shot minibosses.   But fire does in a pinch for a slower but much easier fight.

As useful as Electric is for Kine regarding ordinary enemies, it's not the highest tier for bosses.  Fire, needle, and stone do increaing amounts of damage -- also in increasing amounts of difficulty to safely hit with.  I can't test right now, but I believe that you can stone yourself right in front of the enemy, and graze their side on the way down, allowing you to immediately transform back to normal and scrape their face again.  This strategy is only worth it for Kine -- all other forms of stone don't do enough damage to warrant the risk.

In general, the only real thing to worry about is to have an actual ability to tackle bosses with so you're not wasting time waiting for projectiles.  Detouring for slightly more powerful abilities probably isn't worth it if it hinders your progress through the levels.  If you're using a weak attack against a boss, be sure to drop it when an edible is produced, quickly spit the gift back, then reclaim your weak ability to continue the pummelling.

Phở

2010-05-06 06:31:53 am

Too cool for 7th grade.

Oh wow, awesome chart. Thanks, Floogal! I didn't know Stone did more than Needle (I thought they were the same). That should Make the King DeDeDe fight faster. I should be able to stone him. DeDeDe's hit box is weird. 1/3 of Kirby's sprite can touch him without taking damage. If I practice hitting Sweet Stuff with Kine/Stone, that fight will go super fast too. I also knew about Coo/Cutter on mini-bosses; I just forgot to edit my strat in the first post.

agumike

2010-05-06 07:44:44 pm

That is teh EXACT kind of chart that would be wanted for this sort of play. That will be more useful

Phở

2010-05-08 05:56:48 pm

Too cool for 7th grade.

Update I guess? I tested not using Coo in parts of level 6 and level 7. Too slow. Sad

So yeah, I'm gonna aim for 46 minutes now.

agumike

2010-05-08 06:28:21 pm

Is there way too much water? I can't remember xD;

Phở

2010-05-08 07:39:59 pm

Too cool for 7th grade.

Not really lol. I just wanted to see what I could do with fire-dashing, but flying with Coo is faster. Unless it's just me, and I suck at the game.

Phở

2010-05-11 12:40:59 pm

Too cool for 7th grade.

I'm gonna take a break from this game. Everytime I try to get a lower time, everything goes wrong. Sad

Plus I have finals, so I should probably stop playing anyway lol.

agumike

2010-05-11 07:39:01 pm

Yes, take a break, study for finals. That is more important xD

Phở

2010-05-14 02:22:58 pm

Too cool for 7th grade.

..............................................

I did a glitch that let me fly through a wall. I have no idea how I did it, and I can't figure out how to do it again. I was in 2-1 with Coo, I swallowed an umbrella while flying down, and I was suddenly in a wall. I tried doing it again, but I can't. If I figure this glitch out, omg this run will be so fast.

agumike

2010-05-14 05:28:44 pm

You went THROUGH a wall??? Interesting

Phở

2010-05-14 09:26:13 pm

Too cool for 7th grade.

Yeh, it might be a frame-precision thing though. Kirby is invincible for like a second while inhaling an enemy, but I never seen him go through a wall...