Just Cause 2

2010-04-25 04:02:09 pm

For justice.

Stereotype Island. Everyone's favorite playground for destroying government property and flying around using a grappling hook and seemingly infinite parachutes. I guess someone had to suggest it.

The biggest issue I can see about this run is how to build up Chaos. Aside from faction missions, clearing areas of all pickups and government property (water towers, etc.) gives a good bonus, so I think this would be the fastest way to get from one agency mission to another. It'd be better to stay away from clearing out military bases as this is rather difficult. There is a lot of defense around these areas.

Another issue would be transportation. Extractions are obviously best for long distances (if we've previously visited an area near the destination), but for shorter distances, it's down to slingshotting with the parachute and grappling hook or calling for/highjacking a vehicle.

Which weapons or vehicles should be upgraded? What's more important with weapon upgrades, ammo capacity or how long it takes to kill? I think the best would be the SMG or another automatic weapon because it has a good balance of ammo capacity and kill time, or the revolver. I recall hearing a claim from a friend that, when fully upgraded, a single shot from a revolver can kill a non-elite enemy. This is obviously open for debate.

What about vehicle upgrades? The fastest vehicle is the Silverbolt jet plane, no doubt, but is it really the best for a speed run? Being a plane, it needs a distance to take off. This may not always be convenient, and the controls of planes while they're on the ground are a bit clumsy (no reverse gear? Really?) I don't think the boat should be upgraded because it isn't exactly common to travel extended distances across water, and when there is, it's more convenient and possibly faster to use a plane. When confronted with a river that needs to be crossed, it's seldom too wide that one can't simply parachute across.

Thread title:

Stereotype Island. Everyone's favorite playground for destroying government property and flying around using a grappling hook and seemingly infinite parachutes. I guess someone had to suggest it.

The biggest issue I can see about this run is how to build up Chaos. Aside from faction missions, clearing areas of all pickups and government property (water towers, etc.) gives a good bonus, so I think this would be the fastest way to get from one agency mission to another. It'd be better to stay away from clearing out military bases as this is rather difficult. There is a lot of defense around these areas.

Another issue would be transportation. Extractions are obviously best for long distances (if we've previously visited an area near the destination), but for shorter distances, it's down to slingshotting with the parachute and grappling hook or calling for/highjacking a vehicle.

Which weapons or vehicles should be upgraded? What's more important with weapon upgrades, ammo capacity or how long it takes to kill? I think the best would be the SMG or another automatic weapon because it has a good balance of ammo capacity and kill time, or the revolver. I recall hearing a claim from a friend that, when fully upgraded, a single shot from a revolver can kill a non-elite enemy. This is obviously open for debate.

What about vehicle upgrades? The fastest vehicle is the Silverbolt jet plane, no doubt, but is it really the best for a speed run? Being a plane, it needs a distance to take off. This may not always be convenient, and the controls of planes while they're on the ground are a bit clumsy (no reverse gear? Really?) I don't think the boat should be upgraded because it isn't exactly common to travel extended distances across water, and when there is, it's more convenient and possibly faster to use a plane. When confronted with a river that needs to be crossed, it's seldom too wide that one can't simply parachute across.

Jackic

2010-04-25 04:50:42 pm

Hi, a speedrun of this game would surely be spectacular, I finished the game a couple times and what I think would be the fastest way of transportation is doing a segment with the fastest plane, just after finishing the Panau Casino, flying over and discovering the locations of the agency missions the the missions you choose to do, this way there will be no need to travel as you can call the smuggler to be deployed at least near of where you are headed. The missions should be chosen taking into consideration mainly the time you need to finish them (and some of them are ridiculously fast with a gunship).

As for upgrades, sincerely I don't think there's need to upgrade anything If playing normal or hard, even the hardest setting (can't remember the name) because most missions should be easy and fast enough with some planning and testing, although if there's something I believe would be somewhat useful upgrading in a run it would be the rigged explosives so you can take more with you and because you can take out any vehicle (even a helicopter) with one or two of these explosives.

Good luck if you try to run the game, I'd love to but I have already spent like 100 hours in it, also I'm extremely lazy when it comes to plan or test strategies.

Hi, a speedrun of this game would surely be spectacular, I finished the game a couple times and what I think would be the fastest way of transportation is doing a segment with the fastest plane, just after finishing the Panau Casino, flying over and discovering the locations of the agency missions the the missions you choose to do, this way there will be no need to travel as you can call the smuggler to be deployed at least near of where you are headed. The missions should be chosen taking into consideration mainly the time you need to finish them (and some of them are ridiculously fast with a gunship).

As for upgrades, sincerely I don't think there's need to upgrade anything If playing normal or hard, even the hardest setting (can't remember the name) because most missions should be easy and fast enough with some planning and testing, although if there's something I believe would be somewhat useful upgrading in a run it would be the rigged explosives so you can take more with you and because you can take out any vehicle (even a helicopter) with one or two of these explosives.

Good luck if you try to run the game, I'd love to but I have already spent like 100 hours in it, also I'm extremely lazy when it comes to plan or test strategies.

Vardinator

2010-04-25 06:06:00 pm

For justice.

I didn't think of using the plane to get all the necessary extraction points before one would need them. That'll have to be considered.

The whole idea of weapon upgrades isn't to complete missions easier, but faster. As long as we're getting weapon parts from missions and the environment, we might as well use them. I like your idea of getting a better capacity for explosives, but normally when they're required, they're in a box somewhere just a few meters from whatever needs to be blown up, and you can buy the from Sheldon.

And then he asks you not to break them...

As for taking out vehicles, I find the most efficient way of doing that is simply to hijack the vehicle. Planting C4 is okay, but punching a helicopter pilot in the face three times is more satisfying, I think quicker, and you get a gunship out it.

Jackic

2010-04-26 06:10:14 am

Sure, if the upgrades are on the way you might as well spend them but like 80 or so are needed in order to make a real difference in power. Also I'd like to point that the last playing I didn't even meet with the roaches, finishing every other mission from the ular boys and the reapers was more than enough to get all the chaos needed to finish the game, that's what I think should be the way to go as the missions that need more time to finish besides the agency ones are the ones where capturing a facility is needed and you have to protect the (god I hate him) technician while he does his thing.

My point with the explosives is basically for missions wheer you have to take out strong individuals or more than one vehicle like the one you need to take out some jets, another one where a silo is to be protected (and like 4 tanks and 30 enemies come for you) and the second to last mission agency where you face the russian, japanese and chinese guys, also the last boss in the submarine is a piece of cake if you manage to knock him out of the catwalk with a bomb, aw man, I should't visit this post anymore, now I feel like playing this again XD.

Sure, if the upgrades are on the way you might as well spend them but like 80 or so are needed in order to make a real difference in power. Also I'd like to point that the last playing I didn't even meet with the roaches, finishing every other mission from the ular boys and the reapers was more than enough to get all the chaos needed to finish the game, that's what I think should be the way to go as the missions that need more time to finish besides the agency ones are the ones where capturing a facility is needed and you have to protect the (god I hate him) technician while he does his thing.

My point with the explosives is basically for missions wheer you have to take out strong individuals or more than one vehicle like the one you need to take out some jets, another one where a silo is to be protected (and like 4 tanks and 30 enemies come for you) and the second to last mission agency where you face the russian, japanese and chinese guys, also the last boss in the submarine is a piece of cake if you manage to knock him out of the catwalk with a bomb, aw man, I should't visit this post anymore, now I feel like playing this again XD.

Vardinator

2010-05-09 06:52:24 pm

For justice.

... I guess I'll have to steal a Dazzle and put up some test segments if I want to rally interest. -_-

Heidrage

2010-05-09 11:45:41 pm

Willing to teach you the impossible

OOHHHHHH!!!!! I just started playing this game and I'm crack addicted, like i have played 12 hours over the last 2 days... and the only reason i stopped was to check SDA and a lil nap here and there. I have the PC version but Ill gladly help out. I wanna see this thing done

flicky

2010-05-12 07:06:38 am

$15 per rant/allegory

A speed run of this would be pretty crazy, I'll dump in my few points:

I personally think the Shotgun is a good upgrade option. Although it takes a while to get from the black market, if you have enough parts, then I like the idea. The shotgun kills most enemies in one hit and is very powerful at killing fuel depots and so on. Also, the pre-order DLC sniper rifle (If it's allowed) might be necessary to make killing Colonels (I'm pretty sure you're forced to fight at least one) as fast as possible. If I'm not confusing rifles, then you can snipe him.

As for Chaos and factions, I don't know if it's quicker to use less than 3 factions, but the Roaches (The rich drug guys) would be a smart option. There's lots of Base jump races and missions very close to each other in Panau city which I'm sure would be a quick way to build chaos.

If you're not choosing to fly all around the map with that plane to start with (sounds logical to me), at least consider flying over the Military airport with the G9 and the Leopard planes. No need to clear the area 100% to be able to take these planes. I can't remember the co-ords but it's the one to the right of the horse-shoe harbour.

A speed run of this would be pretty crazy, I'll dump in my few points:

I personally think the Shotgun is a good upgrade option. Although it takes a while to get from the black market, if you have enough parts, then I like the idea. The shotgun kills most enemies in one hit and is very powerful at killing fuel depots and so on. Also, the pre-order DLC sniper rifle (If it's allowed) might be necessary to make killing Colonels (I'm pretty sure you're forced to fight at least one) as fast as possible. If I'm not confusing rifles, then you can snipe him.

As for Chaos and factions, I don't know if it's quicker to use less than 3 factions, but the Roaches (The rich drug guys) would be a smart option. There's lots of Base jump races and missions very close to each other in Panau city which I'm sure would be a quick way to build chaos.

If you're not choosing to fly all around the map with that plane to start with (sounds logical to me), at least consider flying over the Military airport with the G9 and the Leopard planes. No need to clear the area 100% to be able to take these planes. I can't remember the co-ords but it's the one to the right of the horse-shoe harbour.

\/ardinator

2010-05-12 01:27:12 pm

Quote from Flicky:

A speed run of this would be pretty crazy, I'll dump in my few points:

I personally think the Shotgun is a good upgrade option. Although it takes a while to get from the black market, if you have enough parts, then I like the idea. The shotgun kills most enemies in one hit and is very powerful at killing fuel depots and so on. Also, the pre-order DLC sniper rifle (If it's allowed) might be necessary to make killing Colonels (I'm pretty sure you're forced to fight at least one) as fast as possible. If I'm not confusing rifles, then you can snipe him.

As for Chaos and factions, I don't know if it's quicker to use less than 3 factions, but the Roaches (The rich drug guys) would be a smart option. There's lots of Base jump races and missions very close to each other in Panau city which I'm sure would be a quick way to build chaos.

If you're not choosing to fly all around the map with that plane to start with (sounds logical to me), at least consider flying over the Military airport with the G9 and the Leopard planes. No need to clear the area 100% to be able to take these planes. I can't remember the co-ords but it's the one to the right of the horse-shoe harbour.

Heh, guest post

The shotgun would be nice, but it requires getting close to the enemy. Everything else like SMGs and assault rifles can work from any range. Because Rico is just THAT accurate.

The race missions are very good for building up money, yes. But they build no chaos.

Would you say those planes are fastest? I'm thinking the Silverbolt would be better, provided you:

A. Can't extract or are very proximate to your destination.
B. Have a runway.

[quote="Flicky"]
A speed run of this would be pretty crazy, I'll dump in my few points:

I personally think the Shotgun is a good upgrade option. Although it takes a while to get from the black market, if you have enough parts, then I like the idea. The shotgun kills most enemies in one hit and is very powerful at killing fuel depots and so on. Also, the pre-order DLC sniper rifle (If it's allowed) might be necessary to make killing Colonels (I'm pretty sure you're forced to fight at least one) as fast as possible. If I'm not confusing rifles, then you can snipe him.

As for Chaos and factions, I don't know if it's quicker to use less than 3 factions, but the Roaches (The rich drug guys) would be a smart option. There's lots of Base jump races and missions very close to each other in Panau city which I'm sure would be a quick way to build chaos.

If you're not choosing to fly all around the map with that plane to start with (sounds logical to me), at least consider flying over the Military airport with the G9 and the Leopard planes. No need to clear the area 100% to be able to take these planes. I can't remember the co-ords but it's the one to the right of the horse-shoe harbour.
[/quote]

Heh, guest post

The shotgun would be nice, but it requires getting close to the enemy. Everything else like SMGs and assault rifles can work from any range. Because Rico is just THAT accurate.

The race missions are very good for building up money, yes. But they build no chaos.

Would you say those planes are fastest? I'm thinking the Silverbolt would be better, provided you:

A. Can't extract or are very proximate to your destination.
B. Have a runway.

Vardinator

2010-05-12 06:56:46 pm

For justice.

I also forgot to mention, that I kill Colonels with the standard sniper rifle before any upgrades and escape while the guards are too far away to react.

MAS8705

2010-05-12 07:47:05 pm

SDA Apprentice -- (3-1)

With the inclusions of the downloadable content, I wonder if that will offer any new ideas or if the runner may use it... The jet pack parachute can be very handy I can imagine, while the lock on rocket launcher is a lock on rocket launcher ('nuff said)... The only downside I can see for that would be that the cost of the items can be pretty expensive, and dieing results in having to buy yet another one...

I just find it hard to believe that a speed run can be put together for this game, but unless if you can find the locals that give out mass chaos, most other places may seem to be a waste of time... Still, I'll be happy to help with the planning as much as I can...

Vardinator

Edit history:

Vardinator: 2010-05-13 08:38:08 pm

2010-05-13 02:59:36 pm

For justice.

I was thinking of recording some segments myself (and will once I find a means of recording), but I'd only be able to use non-exclusive weapons and everything.

Except that armored ice-cream truck. I have that.

EDIT: I also looked at footage of that jet-powered parachute you were talking about. I can go faster with just the parachute and grappling hook. The only practical use I can see would be easier vertical ascension via the parachute, but I can do that rather quickly as well.

Zejiro

2010-07-07 01:53:27 pm

Someone has to do this speedrun, seriously. Smiley

Kick-ass game. I'm on my second play-through now, about to go to mission 5 on Hardcore. Once I beat the game on Hardcore I will get the platinum trophy.

One of the best games ever, and it would be an awesome speedrun! Come on people!

Heidrage

2010-07-07 04:31:07 pm

Willing to teach you the impossible

i would run it, but i need to upgrade my processor and video card (just over $400 for both) before i can do it.

Zejiro

2010-07-07 05:12:38 pm

Sweet.
Hm, how long would the run be approximately? I bet it's really hard to say which is the fastest way of beating the game but.. Tongue

I mean I try to play through the game quickly this time, since I'm only after the trophies, but I will probably beat it in like 15 hours.

Do you need less chaos to unlock missions if you play Easy mode compared to Normal/Hardcore?
I would like to run this game too, but I know how it would end eventually... Tongue

Master ZED

Edit history:

Master ZED: 2010-07-28 03:24:11 am

2010-07-27 01:12:09 pm

So I can't help but wonder about doing a speed run on this game either. I've some questions before I do any serious research though:

1. The post before mine posed a good question on difficulty. I've also heard the weapons enemies carry changes with lesser difficulties, for example there's a plethora of shotguns on Hardcore, but they're actually quite rare as you decrease the difficulty (more assault rifles and machine guns I assume). I haven't played any lesser difficulties except for whatever the demo was; can anyone give us more enemy weapons data, like how common assault rifles are on Casual? If this difficulty effect is true, I wouldn't expect machine guns to exist on Casual (sadly).

2. Ever since I purchased a Level 6 Razorback on the black market, I've begun seeing them pop up at certain bases, whereas I don't remember ever seeing them before. Is this a first-time buyer bonus for vehicles or just another example of me being blind?

3. What uses could a Lv. 1 rocket launcher serve? There's a few here and there on Panau if you know where to look, though I only remember locations in the south (the island off Pekar Kesuma, one of the Ular strongholds, and one next to a small shrine atop a hill behind a random gas station) along with one in the mountains (where the fourth Agency mission takes place; one is with a SAM on top of a tower that's easy to extract to and from without being seen). I ask this because I was turned off from rockets for a long time because the Lv. 1 launcher seemed a bit wimpy.

3.5. What about the grenade launcher? I'm not talking about a speed run on this query; it just seems useless to me.

4. For that matter, how destructive is a sniper rifle in general? It's the first two-handed weapon you can acquire and upgrade off the black market and it claims to have a lot of power, not to mention it's a cheap purchase ($35000). However, finding one in the field isn't very common, with only the rocket launcher and grenade launcher in that order being more rare.

5. Would certain faction missions be preferable to random Chaos in general? I think this one may come down to personal preference given just how damn open-ended the game is in this respect, but I want to hear more thoughts on the matter.

On random Chaos, I find helicopters much more devastating, but harder to keep alive, than the G9 Eclipse (I'd like it to be the only choice for this task, but most likely it'll fall to the Leopard). The problem with the G9 is that, while more devastating, there is the problem with targeting (no moving a turret, only the jet itself), and an even bigger problem with spawning. Generally you have to be within half to three fourths of a mile within a target's radius for the thing to become vulnerable, leaving only a few seconds to strike an entire base before pulling up from a potential fiery death.

Still, I agree with the idea of setting up extraction points early with a plane, and for that, random hellfire should definitely be thrown into the mix wherever applicable. I'm not sure if you have to do the initial stronghold takeovers for all three factions or not (one is required at least for the next-to-last mission AFAIK, but other than that, I'm not sure what the minimum faction work requirement is to complete the game), but if you have to do all three or not, the first Reaper stronghold puts you in a good diving position onto an airport with Leopards taking off from it.

As far as DLC is concerned, I need to hit YT and see what this crap can do. The two freebies I have aren't useful to a speed run AFAIK (unless you guys know a trick or two with the Boom Boom that hasn't occurred to me). Besides, isn't all but one DLC weapon two-handed? On Hardcore, one-handed weapons are much less common in my experience than two-handed weapons, and the single one-handed DLC weapon (Rico's pistol), from what I've heard, can't even match the Lv. 6 Revolver, though I guess since that wouldn't be available to a speed runner anyway, the DLC might still have some theoretical usage.

There's also the in-game cost issue, but causing any Chaos does make some money, so I dunno. If one were really good at blowing just about anything to hell in the blink of an eye (or just setting it on fire so it blows up on its own), that might not even be an issue for all I know.

One last thing: how's the recent patch? Anything that would help or hinder a run? I'd imagine that no one firing on you during a hijacking crap is useful, though admittedly it's rather wimpy and I don't like such an unnecessary difficulty decrease (was it really an issue to begin with? Yeah I got killed a handful of times for it, but that's just a risk you have to take, or did have to take...). The stability thing sounds nice too, but sometimes you really don't want civilians spawning, y'know? I've avoided downloading it so far.

Anyway, random thought post over.

EDIT: Messed around with Casual a little bit, some thoughts:

1. Complete reversal of weapon availability, as I had heard. Hardcore has a lot of two-handed weapons available, Casual has many of them using one-handed equipment (and they're the weaker kind of course, so not as much ammo is required... but normal enemies all fall to a headshot anyway).

2. I was able to get through the third Agency mission and a couple of Stronghold takeovers within the couple of hours I was messing around due mainly to storming bases with jets. While I used the Leopard in particular since I did the Reaper takeover first, I'm nearly convinced the Ulars should be first on the list since you're put close by a small airport that can lead you to Kem Udara Wau Pantas, an area with the G9 Eclipse. Taking that thing by offshore rigs is a nice start, gunning down propaganda trailers and Panay statues on the way is great, and Berapi Island... well that place should be raided ASAP. The G9 should be that island's worst nightmare.

3. A Casual run will see some usefulness in dual wielding. For example, at the end of the third Agency mission, two SMG's are actually better than the gatling provided because the enemies drop a lot of SMG ammo and, since you're not lugging around a weighty POS, you have maneuverability on your side. Too bad Sheldon just walks around the place like he's at home, but maybe dual hooking him a few times will speed things up, hm?

On a side note, since Sheldon is so slow (and if dual hooking him doesn't really help), completing Rajang Temple during the mission isn't a bad idea. It's only 500 Chaos and $2500, but it shouldn't cost any time and it's only three easy items.

That aside, with lots of one-handed's available, dual wielding has an occasional point on Casual.

4. Storyline enemies don't change their weapons, so even on Casual, you can grab a rocket launcher from a tower enemy on the first Ular takeover temporarily for some additional easier Chaos. I'm close to saying the sniper rifle is the best two-handed weapon for that difficulty too since there aren't very many two-handed weapons to begin with.

So I can't help but wonder about doing a speed run on this game either.  I've some questions before I do any serious research though:

1. The post before mine posed a good question on difficulty.  I've also heard the weapons enemies carry changes with lesser difficulties, for example there's a plethora of shotguns on Hardcore, but they're actually quite rare as you decrease the difficulty (more assault rifles and machine guns I assume).  I haven't played any lesser difficulties except for whatever the demo was; can anyone give us more enemy weapons data, like how common assault rifles are on Casual?  If this difficulty effect is true, I wouldn't expect machine guns to exist on Casual (sadly).

2. Ever since I purchased a Level 6 Razorback on the black market, I've begun seeing them pop up at certain bases, whereas I don't remember ever seeing them before.  Is this a first-time buyer bonus for vehicles or just another example of me being blind?

3. What uses could a Lv. 1 rocket launcher serve?  There's a few here and there on Panau if you know where to look, though I only remember locations in the south (the island off Pekar Kesuma, one of the Ular strongholds, and one next to a small shrine atop a hill behind a random gas station) along with one in the mountains (where the fourth Agency mission takes place; one is with a SAM on top of a tower that's easy to extract to and from without being seen).  I ask this because I was turned off from rockets for a long time because the Lv. 1 launcher seemed a bit wimpy.

3.5. What about the grenade launcher?  I'm not talking about a speed run on this query; it just seems useless to me.

4. For that matter, how destructive is a sniper rifle in general?  It's the first two-handed weapon you can acquire and upgrade off the black market and it claims to have a lot of power, not to mention it's a cheap purchase ($35000).  However, finding one in the field isn't very common, with only the rocket launcher and grenade launcher in that order being more rare.

5. Would certain faction missions be preferable to random Chaos in general?  I think this one may come down to personal preference given just how damn open-ended the game is in this respect, but I want to hear more thoughts on the matter.

On random Chaos, I find helicopters much more devastating, but harder to keep alive, than the G9 Eclipse (I'd like it to be the only choice for this task, but most likely it'll fall to the Leopard).  The problem with the G9 is that, while more devastating, there is the problem with targeting (no moving a turret, only the jet itself), and an even bigger problem with spawning.  Generally you have to be within half to three fourths of a mile within a target's radius for the thing to become vulnerable, leaving only a few seconds to strike an entire base before pulling up from a potential fiery death.

[i]Still[/i], I agree with the idea of setting up extraction points early with a plane, and for that, random hellfire should definitely be thrown into the mix wherever applicable.  I'm not sure if you have to do the initial stronghold takeovers for all three factions or not (one is required at least for the next-to-last mission AFAIK, but other than that, I'm not sure what the minimum faction work requirement is to complete the game), but if you have to do all three or not, the first Reaper stronghold puts you in a good diving position onto an airport with Leopards taking off from it.

As far as DLC is concerned, I need to hit YT and see what this crap can do.  The two freebies I have aren't useful to a speed run AFAIK (unless you guys know a trick or two with the Boom Boom that hasn't occurred to me).  Besides, isn't all but one DLC weapon two-handed?  On Hardcore, one-handed weapons are much less common in my experience than two-handed weapons, and the single one-handed DLC weapon (Rico's pistol), from what I've heard, can't even match the Lv. 6 Revolver, though I guess since that wouldn't be available to a speed runner anyway, the DLC might still have some theoretical usage.

There's also the in-game cost issue, but causing any Chaos does make some money, so I dunno.  If one were really good at blowing just about anything to hell in the blink of an eye (or just setting it on fire so it blows up on its own), that might not even be an issue for all I know.

One last thing: how's the recent patch?  Anything that would help or hinder a run?  I'd imagine that no one firing on you during a hijacking crap is useful, though admittedly it's rather wimpy and I don't like such an unnecessary difficulty decrease (was it really an issue to begin with?  Yeah I got killed a handful of times for it, but that's just a risk you have to take, or did have to take...).  The stability thing sounds nice too, but sometimes you really don't want civilians spawning, y'know?  I've avoided downloading it so far.

Anyway, random thought post over.

EDIT: Messed around with Casual a little bit, some thoughts:

1. Complete reversal of weapon availability, as I had heard.  Hardcore has a lot of two-handed weapons available, Casual has many of them using one-handed equipment (and they're the weaker kind of course, so not as much ammo is required... but normal enemies all fall to a headshot anyway).

2. I was able to get through the third Agency mission and a couple of Stronghold takeovers within the couple of hours I was messing around due mainly to storming bases with jets.  While I used the Leopard in particular since I did the Reaper takeover first, I'm nearly convinced the Ulars should be first on the list since you're put close by a small airport that can lead you to Kem Udara Wau Pantas, an area with the G9 Eclipse.  Taking that thing by offshore rigs is a nice start, gunning down propaganda trailers and Panay statues on the way is great, and Berapi Island... well that place should be raided ASAP.  The G9 should be that island's worst nightmare.

3. A Casual run will see some usefulness in dual wielding.  For example, at the end of the third Agency mission, two SMG's are actually better than the gatling provided because the enemies drop a lot of SMG ammo and, since you're not lugging around a weighty POS, you have maneuverability on your side.  Too bad Sheldon just walks around the place like he's at home, but maybe dual hooking him a few times will speed things up, hm?

On a side note, since Sheldon is so slow (and if dual hooking him doesn't really help), completing Rajang Temple during the mission isn't a bad idea.  It's only 500 Chaos and $2500, but it shouldn't cost any time and it's only three easy items.

That aside, with lots of one-handed's available, dual wielding has an occasional point on Casual.

4. Storyline enemies don't change their weapons, so even on Casual, you can grab a rocket launcher from a tower enemy on the first Ular takeover temporarily for some additional easier Chaos.  I'm close to saying the sniper rifle is the best two-handed weapon for that difficulty too since there aren't very many two-handed weapons to begin with.

Master ZED

Edit history:

Master ZED: 2010-07-29 04:26:29 am

2010-07-29 04:04:41 am

Just finished a casual run in 8:35. Died a few times (some going Rambo, some from horrid luck), had no plan, forgot to pass over the town for the Three Kings mission (oops...), didn't even remember where I was supposed to activate Mountain Rescue (didn't touch the northeastern part of Panau before it popped up, hell I never went to the northwestern part at all), watched most of the cutscenes and even had one freeze the game on me (skipped it the second time). For going in "blind," (read: winged it with all the skills I acquired going for the Platinum trophy) that time's not bad.

I'm very close to reconsidering my jet idea. Yes, helicopters are slow, especially compared to a G9, but it'd be a treat to see a run purely done on a G9 Eclipse or Leopard just because I can't use the damn thing well at all without a SAM blowing me up. It has power and speed, but targeting falls entirely on moving the jet itself... still, it'll have to do for getting to the 85000 Chaos mark at least so the runner can unlock Extraction (well, 95000, but the Agency missions are worth 10000 by themselves (at least 3, 4, and 5 are)). My current general plan is this:

- Agency missions 1 and 2
- Ular stronghold (if required... not sure if any faction work actually matters)
- Leopard or G9 warpath (if a stronghold isn't required, the Leopard will be used, otherwise the G9 is optimal I think)
- Agency mission 3
- KILL EVERYTHING! EVERYONE AND HIS GAS CAN IS HEREBY DECLARED MULCH!!!
- Agency missions 4 and 5
- Recruit Reapers
- Agency missions 6 and 7
- The End

Which order mission 3 and rampant genocide go depends entirely on the trail of tears taken. Figuring out the best path will take awhile, and I don't have any good ideas right now other than Berapi Island would best be handled by chopper. That island's worth tens of thousands of Chaos by itself and shouldn't be concentrated on via plane (maybe... or maybe I just need to learn how to fly better).

In fact, I fully expect whoever verifies this game won't be able to criticize the path taken without sounding like a tool.

Whatever the case may be, this game's not gonna beat FFX in terms of longest speed run ever, and the beauty of the eventual run will be in the planning, not really the execution of it.

Just finished a casual run in 8:35.  Died a few times (some going Rambo, some from horrid luck), had no plan, forgot to pass over the town for the Three Kings mission (oops...), didn't even remember where I was supposed to activate Mountain Rescue (didn't touch the northeastern part of Panau before it popped up, hell I never went to the northwestern part at all), watched most of the cutscenes and even had one freeze the game on me (skipped it the second time).  For going in "blind," (read: winged it with all the skills I acquired going for the Platinum trophy) that time's not bad.

I'm very close to reconsidering my jet idea.  Yes, helicopters are slow, especially compared to a G9, but it'd be a treat to see a run purely done on a G9 Eclipse or Leopard just because I can't use the damn thing well at all without a SAM blowing me up.  It has power and speed, but targeting falls entirely on moving the jet itself... still, it'll have to do for getting to the 85000 Chaos mark at least so the runner can unlock Extraction (well, 95000, but the Agency missions are worth 10000 by themselves (at least 3, 4, and 5 are)).  My current general plan is this:

- Agency missions 1 and 2
- Ular stronghold (if required... not sure if any faction work actually matters)
- Leopard or G9 warpath (if a stronghold isn't required, the Leopard will be used, otherwise the G9 is optimal I think)
- Agency mission 3
- [i][b]KILL EVERYTHING!  EVERYONE AND HIS GAS CAN IS HEREBY DECLARED MULCH!!![/b][/i]
- Agency missions 4 and 5
- Recruit Reapers
- Agency missions 6 and 7
- The End

Which order mission 3 and rampant genocide go depends entirely on the trail of tears taken.  Figuring out the best path will take awhile, and I don't have any good ideas right now other than Berapi Island would best be handled by chopper.  That island's worth tens of thousands of Chaos by itself and shouldn't be concentrated on via plane (maybe... or maybe I just need to learn how to fly better).

In fact, I fully expect whoever verifies this game won't be able to criticize the path taken without sounding like a tool.

Whatever the case may be, this game's not gonna beat FFX in terms of longest speed run ever, and the beauty of the eventual run will be in the planning, not really the execution of it.

Evil_Toaster

2010-07-29 07:12:44 pm

I've been thinking about running this game too. Are using DLC items allowed? Because if so that would help a lot, having fully upgraded weapons, jetpack parachute, etc. Still have to buy them with the in game money though.

Master ZED

2010-07-29 09:19:39 pm

Quote from Evil_Toaster:

I've been thinking about running this game too. Are using DLC items allowed? Because if so that would help a lot, having fully upgraded weapons, jetpack parachute, etc.

I don't see why not, though I'd rather not use any of it (or cough up the real cash in the first place).

Quote from Evil_Toaster:

Still have to buy them with the in game money though.

Unless they're obscenely expensive, I don't think this will be a problem. Any Chaos caused that isn't part of a location or mission reward grants you at least 5X that amount in money (vehicles are 6X), so if you were to raid the oil refinery that the Roaches send you to on their second stronghold takeover and take down the (I think) 12 chimneys there, that alone's an easy 30 grand. I had next to 2 million left in the bank by the end of my Casual waltz, and I really don't think, at least on Casual, there's any reason to bother buying things off the Black Market until Mountain Rescue (unless buying a Silverbolt is both faster and practical for getting to the Beacon on mission 3).

[quote="Evil_Toaster"]
I've been thinking about running this game too. Are using DLC items allowed? Because if so that would help a lot, having fully upgraded weapons, jetpack parachute, etc.[/quote]I don't see why not, though I'd rather not use any of it (or cough up the real cash in the first place).

[quote="Evil_Toaster"]Still have to buy them with the in game money though.
[/quote]Unless they're [i]obscenely[/i] expensive, I don't think this will be a problem.  Any Chaos caused that isn't part of a location or mission reward grants you at least 5X that amount in money (vehicles are 6X), so if you were to raid the oil refinery that the Roaches send you to on their second stronghold takeover and take down the (I think) 12 chimneys there, that alone's an easy 30 grand.  I had next to 2 million left in the bank by the end of my Casual waltz, and I really don't think, at least on Casual, there's any reason to bother buying things off the Black Market until Mountain Rescue (unless buying a Silverbolt is both faster and practical for getting to the Beacon on mission 3).

Evil_Toaster

2010-07-31 12:25:24 am

I just finished a run on casual difficulty at 6:32. Some of the DLC items saved a bit of time (not surprisingly.) The cluster bomb launcher made the final battle hilariously easy, the quad rocket launcher made some of the missions a lot easier. The auto sniper rifle made headshots a lot easier, thus everything easier. And of course the jetpack parachute makes everything go faster.

So obviously I'm gonna put my vote up for the use of DLC. It don't know if it will be approved but it would certainly make this run smoother. My justification for them would be that the DLC items still cost in game money and ammo to buy and use, so it's not like "pay money, get free chaos" or something.

I had no route plan as far as missions or anything. What I ended up doing was doing only Ular and Reaper missions and never even doing a Roach stronghold mission. I'll try to remember what I did since I didn't write any of it down.

After agency mission 2, I went for the ular takeover, did the mission with the laptops since it's quick and easy, then flew a plane to the start of the mountain rescue mission so I could fast travel there later.

Then I went to the desert area and caused tons of chaos. I went there so I would be close to the 3rd mission. After doing that, more and more chaos. One of the best spots btw is the island in the middle of the map. There's tons of things to blow up there. I used a rocket shooting helicopter for most of the chaos causing outside of missions. Looking back on it I probably should have done some work for the reapers because a lot of their quick missions are around here.

After mountain rescue I started doing more missions which I think got me chaos faster than just blowing things up anywhere I could. It was also at this point I started doing Reaper missions. What would really help this run is a list of missions that can be completed quickly. Some missions are as simple as "go here and snipe this dude" while some are "fly to this island, drive this truck, take out these three towers, drive truck out again" etc.

The Three Kings was surprisingly easy, and probably could have been easier if I made more use of the DLC grenade launcher. After that, I did even more missions for both factions. That's really all you can do at this point. I'm not sure if utilizing the Roaches would have helped.

The last missions were pretty smooth. I got away with dual welding SMG's and a quad rocket launcher but there wasn't a lot of SMG ammo around the mission, but it worked so I'm okay with it. Inside the dome I just cleared out the area around the panel (not killing the helicopter) and just hacked it as fast as I could. Took a few tries but once I did it I flew out with the jetpack quickly. On the submarine I quickly got on the back and hacked the door open. I flooded Panay with cluster bombs and he died surprisingly quick, the ninjas gave me no trouble. The last part is just how fast you can hack, and I can do it pretty fast so I can get two rockets on one down. Then it's game over.

Planning a 'perfect' route for this game would be near impossible. Not just because there are endless possible routes, all of which could be viable, but there are a lot of random elements in the game that could affect the run such as traffic, the chance of enemies actually hitting you, physics kills (happened to me once) and so on. As well as a large number of small things that could add up, such as faction items or the hundreds of fuel depots.

To me, if a route is to be planned, it should not be planned as if everything will go right, and should not be planned that you know you will have this set amount of chaos by the end of this mission in your route. It would be smartest to plan a route longer than needed, and to run along it until you have the chaos needed to finish the game. In other words, a very very flexible route.

I'll try running it some more later. I do hope DLC items are allowed now.

I just finished a run on casual difficulty at [b]6:32[/b]. Some of the DLC items saved a bit of time (not surprisingly.) The cluster bomb launcher made the final battle hilariously easy, the quad rocket launcher made some of the missions a lot easier. The auto sniper rifle made headshots a lot easier, thus everything easier. And of course the jetpack parachute makes [b]everything[/b] go faster.

So obviously I'm gonna put my vote up for the use of DLC. It don't know if it will be approved but it would certainly make this run smoother. My justification for them would be that the DLC items still cost in game money and ammo to buy and use, so it's not like "pay money, get free chaos" or something.

I had no route plan as far as missions or anything. What I ended up doing was doing only Ular and Reaper missions and never even doing a Roach stronghold mission. I'll try to remember what I did since I didn't write any of it down.

After agency mission 2, I went for the ular takeover, did the mission with the laptops since it's quick and easy, then flew a plane to the start of the mountain rescue mission so I could fast travel there later.

Then I went to the desert area and caused tons of chaos. I went there so I would be close to the 3rd mission. After doing that, more and more chaos. One of the best spots btw is the island in the middle of the map. There's tons of things to blow up there. I used a rocket shooting helicopter for most of the chaos causing outside of missions. Looking back on it I probably should have done some work for the reapers because a lot of their quick missions are around here.

After mountain rescue I started doing more missions which I think got me chaos faster than just blowing things up anywhere I could. It was also at this point I started doing Reaper missions. What would really help this run is a list of missions that can be completed quickly. Some missions are as simple as "go here and snipe this dude" while some are "fly to this island, drive this truck, take out these three towers, drive truck out again" etc.

The Three Kings was surprisingly easy, and probably could have been easier if I made more use of the DLC grenade launcher. After that, I did even more missions for both factions. That's really all you can do at this point. I'm not sure if utilizing the Roaches would have helped.

The last missions were pretty smooth. I got away with dual welding SMG's and a quad rocket launcher but there wasn't a lot of SMG ammo around the mission, but it worked so I'm okay with it. Inside the dome I just cleared out the area around the panel (not killing the helicopter) and just hacked it as fast as I could. Took a few tries but once I did it I flew out with the jetpack quickly. On the submarine I quickly got on the back and hacked the door open. I flooded Panay with cluster bombs and he died surprisingly quick, the ninjas gave me no trouble. The last part is just how fast you can hack, and I can do it pretty fast so I can get two rockets on one down. Then it's game over.

Planning a 'perfect' route for this game would be near impossible. Not just because there are endless possible routes, all of which could be viable, but there are a lot of random elements in the game that could affect the run such as traffic, the chance of enemies actually hitting you, physics kills (happened to me once) and so on. As well as a large number of small things that could add up, such as faction items or the hundreds of fuel depots.

To me, if a route is to be planned, it should not be planned as if everything will go right, and should not be planned that you [b]know[/b] you will have this set amount of chaos by the end of this mission in your route. It would be smartest to plan a route longer than needed, and to run along it until you have the chaos needed to finish the game. In other words, a very very flexible route.

I'll try running it some more later. I do hope DLC items are allowed now.

Master ZED

2010-07-31 09:44:32 pm

What's your recording setup like? Presently, I can only record to DVD in composite (hence why my Batman run might look a little funny), so if you've got an HD setup and you're willing to go through with this, I'll just do some more research instead of trying to submit anything.

I wouldn't say that normally, but JC2's HUD is aggravating on an SD setup, like being forced to read a large print book.

Evil_Toaster

2010-07-31 10:13:25 pm

Quote from Master ZED:

What's your recording setup like? Presently, I can only record to DVD in composite (hence why my Batman run might look a little funny), so if you've got an HD setup and you're willing to go through with this, I'll just do some more research instead of trying to submit anything.

I wouldn't say that normally, but JC2's HUD is aggravating on an SD setup, like being forced to read a large print book.

I'm actually playing on the PC version. However I'm using an Xbox 360 controller because for some reason I prefer the controls on it, which I normally don't for FPS's. I also get the amazing ability to crouch in the PC version which may or may not help me but it might help me get behind cover as I hack something or who knows what.

Sooo since I'm on PC I can use fraps (which I have) or something to record it with. I have lots of space for recordings so it shouldn't be a problem. I am worried however how it will handle the framerate while playing and recording.

Master ZED

2010-07-31 11:58:05 pm

Quote from Evil_Toaster:

However I'm using an Xbox 360 controller because for some reason I prefer the controls on it, which I normally don't for FPS's.

Well, this isn't an FPS, so that would help explain it.

Quote from Evil_Toaster:

I also get the amazing ability to crouch in the PC version which may or may not help me but it might help me get behind cover as I hack something or who knows what.

You mean you get more flexibility with the crouch, right? 'cause that's not exactly a PC exclusive ability. I'm playing on the PS3 and I have a crouch button.

Quote from Evil_Toaster:

Sooo since I'm on PC I can use fraps (which I have) or something to record it with. I have lots of space for recordings so it shouldn't be a problem. I am worried however how it will handle the framerate while playing and recording.

Even if I had the PC version, my internal hard drive isn't exactly reliable for video recording, especially Fraps. If it works fine for you, then I guess I have to stand aside on technical issues... as much as that pisses me off.

[quote="Evil_Toaster"]However I'm using an Xbox 360 controller because for some reason I prefer the controls on it, which I normally don't for FPS's.[/quote]Well, this isn't an FPS, so that would help explain it.

[quote="Evil_Toaster"]I also get the amazing ability to crouch in the PC version which may or may not help me but it might help me get behind cover as I hack something or who knows what.[/quote]You mean you get more flexibility with the crouch, right?  'cause that's not exactly a PC exclusive ability.  I'm playing on the PS3 and I have a crouch button.

[quote="Evil_Toaster"]Sooo since I'm on PC I can use fraps (which I have) or something to record it with. I have lots of space for recordings so it shouldn't be a problem. I am worried however how it will handle the framerate while playing and recording.
[/quote]Even if I had the PC version, my internal hard drive isn't exactly reliable for video recording, especially Fraps.  If it works fine for you, then I guess I have to stand aside on technical issues... as much as that pisses me off.

Evil_Toaster

2010-08-01 01:00:27 am

Yeah well you know what I mean. Games where you aim things. Games where you would normally use a mouse.

There's a crouch button on console version? I've never seen/used it. But I dunno, maybe there's something else somewhere on the keyboard that I can press that would somehow benefit this.

And I'll do a test to see how my comp handles JC2 + fraps + speed running later. At any rate I can lower the settings. Surely I don't neeed SSAO right?

Nystroem

2010-08-02 02:13:10 am

Nice work guys. As you said this is a game that is basically impossible to plan a perfect run for, but I'll try to help in any way I can.

A thought.. I don't know if this is a good idea, but hey..
There are a few villages that are extremely easy to 100%. Some only contain ONE item, some contain 2, 3 or 4 but are still really quick. Is it worth 100%'ing them? I know you don't get very much chaos and money for it, but since you can get them really fast and a few of them are right next to each other I figured it might be worth checking out.

As for the crouching button on the console version, IIRC you press L3 on the PS3 controller to crouch. Not that it matters. Tongue

Master ZED

2010-08-02 02:44:28 am

That 6 hour time with missions kinda stuns me... I thought for sure the fastest route wouldn't have any outside the Agency. Still, if it works, I'm not gonna complain.

The reason I mentioned the second Roaches stronghold wasn't because I did anything for them, but because I ran into the place while on my helicopter murder spree and noticed just how much Chaos I could build there. Military strongholds may not be marked on the map, but obviously you can still visit and destroy them. Oddly, there's usually a smaller army contingent at these places prior to the actual missions than there are at normal bases.

BTW, the name of the island in the middle of the map is Berapi Island, which I mentioned when detailing my halfassed run. I'm glad you agreed with me on that one. Tongue

Quote from Nystroem:

There are a few villages that are extremely easy to 100%. Some only contain ONE item, some contain 2, 3 or 4 but are still really quick. Is it worth 100%'ing them?

One-item villages might be worth it if they could be worked into a parahook route (may as well call that combo something, and it even covers the dual hook functionality if you say that word out loud). A two item village, if both items are beneficial to a speed runner and are along a parahook route would work as well.

But 500 Chaos? You can get that from a broadcast tower and its generator, or a gas station, a few fuel depots, a SAM, industrial chimneys, twice that from Panay statues... the point is that Chaos-causing objects can easily outdo small location completion when only items are available. Towns that are mostly government property might also be worth something.

Because of the amount of time you spend at Rajang Temple, that place could be worth it too, unless you don't have to wait for Sheldon. I wouldn't be surprised if a good headhunter could just ignore him. There are other minor things on Agency missions that help out too, like getting a Mounted Gun at the end of mission 1 (no ammo wasted + there's a hard time limit after the SAMs are destroyed AFAIK), letting the last jeep live at the end of mission 2 so it destroys a gas station, ripping apart the base on mission 4 (or if you fly in via Silverbolt, crashing it into a Gas Holder or a SAM), stuff like that. I would also say hauling the Demolition Officer to the Panay statue on mission 2 would be a quick 1000 Chaos, but that wouldn't work without an Air Propulsion Gun. :\

That 6 hour time with missions kinda stuns me... I thought for sure the fastest route wouldn't have any outside the Agency.  Still, if it works, I'm not gonna complain.

The reason I mentioned the second Roaches stronghold wasn't because I did anything for them, but because I ran into the place while on my helicopter murder spree and noticed just how much Chaos I could build there.  Military strongholds may not be marked on the map, but obviously you can still visit and destroy them.  Oddly, there's usually a smaller army contingent at these places prior to the actual missions than there are at normal bases.

BTW, the name of the island in the middle of the map is Berapi Island, which I mentioned when detailing my halfassed run.  I'm glad you agreed with me on that one. :P

[quote="Nystroem"]There are a few villages that are extremely easy to 100%. Some only contain ONE item, some contain 2, 3 or 4 but are still really quick. Is it worth 100%'ing them?[/quote]One-item villages might be worth it if they could be worked into a parahook route (may as well call that combo something, and it even covers the dual hook functionality if you say that word out loud).  A two item village, if both items are beneficial to a speed runner and are along a parahook route would work as well.

But 500 Chaos?  You can get that from a broadcast tower and its generator, or a gas station, a few fuel depots, a SAM, industrial chimneys, twice that from Panay statues... the point is that Chaos-causing objects can easily outdo small location completion when only items are available.  Towns that are mostly government property might also be worth something.

Because of the amount of time you spend at Rajang Temple, that place could be worth it too, unless you don't have to wait for Sheldon.  I wouldn't be surprised if a good headhunter could just ignore him.  There are other minor things on Agency missions that help out too, like getting a Mounted Gun at the end of mission 1 (no ammo wasted + there's a hard time limit after the SAMs are destroyed AFAIK), letting the last jeep live at the end of mission 2 so it destroys a gas station, ripping apart the base on mission 4 (or if you fly in via Silverbolt, crashing it into a Gas Holder or a SAM), stuff like that.  I would also say hauling the Demolition Officer to the Panay statue on mission 2 would be a quick 1000 Chaos, but that wouldn't work without an Air Propulsion Gun. :\