I'm thinking of getting into speedrunning.

2009-03-22 04:40:43 am

Making A Ruckus Since 1991

More then one person I've talking to is amazed at how fast I beat games so I thought why not. I was thinking of doing RE5, but after looking around I see there is too much interest in it. I don't want my first run to be something that could very well be beaten soon. Anyway my main reason for making this topic is to ask for any 'starting up' tips. I read the rules and FAQ, but I'm mostly wondering if there is anything else I should know or do before I go ahead and start making a run.

Thanks in advance.

(Oh and I think this would be the right forum for this topic and if it isn't I'm sorry.)

Thread title:

dex

2009-03-22 04:56:20 am

Invisible avatar

Pick a game you like, it'll certainly help your sanity.

Prepare for frantic restarting - if you want your run to be great quality, restarting a lot is a necessity.

Don't give up if you run into problems.

Also I think this fits better in Gaming Discussion, but the distinction between that and SDA Discussion is really small, so no problem there. I've moved the topic.

groobo

2009-03-22 05:02:12 am

boss

Welcome to SDA!

Best thing to do before recording a run is to get to know your game in and out. This is essential for planning, which is the most important thing here (well planned run >>>>>>>>>>> everything). Another good thing to do is to look for tricks, glitches, or even better: other speedruns, at google or youtube in case there's something you don't already know that would make your run even faster. If it's an older console game the place you'd want to check first for all of the above is tasvideos.org. Good luck!

Lag.Com

2009-03-22 05:22:37 am

sda loyalist

Everything groobo and dex have said is valid; I would add that you need a lot of perseverance. Even with infinitely good planning, you still need the run to come clean after all. For games with heavy luck-based play, this will necessitate many, many tries. For heavy skill-based games, your execution should be nearly flawless. Show lots of small videos of progress or tricks you find on the forum; listen to what people say. The users here are incredibly eclectic, so you're almost certain to get some advice on a game no matter how obscure or terrible it is.

Looking forward to seeing you more!

moooh

2009-03-22 06:01:11 am

Exoray

Get a stress reliever, basically anything you can punch or throw to let off some steam. Broken hardware due to frustration is not something you want to aim for Smiley

Hyren575

2009-03-22 06:07:34 am

Making A Ruckus Since 1991

Thanks for the warm welcome.

Also any suggestions for a good DVD recorder? I will need to invest in one and any recommendations for a good brand and model would definately be helpful.

Hattori HANZo

2009-03-22 06:55:50 am

contraddicted

Quote from Hyren575:

Also any suggestions for a good DVD recorder? I will need to invest in one and any recommendations for a good brand and model would definately be helpful.

The knowledge base has a page about recording hardware: http://speeddemosarchive.com/kb/index.php/Video_Capture_Devices
I am not sure how up to date it is though. Taking a look at the Tech Support forums is never wrong if you don't know what to buy.

You might want to invest in a DVD recorder with a HDD, like tri-hex did recently: http://speeddemosarchive.com/forum/index.php/topic,7949.msg263405.html#msg263405
HDD means more money, but less fiddling with discs. The one he got has no lag (see below), according to him.

You should go for a DVD Recorder, be it with HDD or not, with no lag. Some recorders don't just pass through the input signal, but put out what they just recorded, which results in a delay of several frames. This means the game is actually ahead of what you see. To get around this, you would need a splitter and additional cables. This is probably more expensive than just getting the right recorder Wink

[quote="Hyren575"]
Also any suggestions for a good DVD recorder? I will need to invest in one and any recommendations for a good brand and model would definately be helpful.
[/quote]

The knowledge base has a page about recording hardware: http://speeddemosarchive.com/kb/index.php/Video_Capture_Devices
I am not sure how up to date it is though. Taking a look at the Tech Support forums is never wrong if you don't know what to buy.

You might want to invest in a DVD recorder with a HDD, like tri-hex did recently: http://speeddemosarchive.com/forum/index.php/topic,7949.msg263405.html#msg263405
HDD means more money, but less fiddling with discs. The one he got has no lag (see below), according to him.

You should go for a DVD Recorder, be it with HDD or not, with no lag. Some recorders don't just pass through the input signal, but put out what they just recorded, which results in a delay of several frames. This means the game is actually ahead of what you see. To get around this, you would need a splitter and additional cables. This is probably more expensive than just getting the right recorder ;)

Sir VG

2009-03-22 06:58:49 am

Fucking Weeaboo

Quote from Hyren575:

Thanks for the warm welcome.

Also any suggestions for a good DVD recorder? I will need to invest in one and any recommendations for a good brand and model would definately be helpful.

http://speeddemosarchive.com/kb/index.php/Video_Capture_Devices

groobo

2009-03-22 07:18:07 am

boss

Cheapest recorder with a hdd from some underground russian bootleggers, plus a splitter is what I did. Works just fine.

bmn

2009-03-22 12:17:32 pm

When starting out, I'd say start out with a short run if possible. Depending on how difficult the actual gameplay is you should shorten or lengthen your definition of "short" - for me 15-25 minutes is the max for the type of games I pick. In my case, it's games where frame-perfect input doesn't matter, but things can still easily go wrong - if you added the input, say a game like Sonic or Mario, I'd lower the time if possible. When I first started out, though, my target time for segments was 10 minutes at the most, and I gradually increased it as I got more consistent.

Picking a short run reduces the amount of work you need to do to get something out, but if you're new to speedrunning at a high standard, I think it's more important because, even in games you know well, you learn new things that will change your runs for the better, and it's a real pain to go back and start again on a long run when you find something that saves a fair bit of time in the very first segment for example. It gets easier to find the best strategies quicker the more you do it.

Research, research, research. If the game you're running is even mildly popular, people will have probably done speedruns of their own on places like Youtube. Get all the info you can to make sure you're not missing a trick, because it really, really sucks to finish a run or segment and then realise a better strategy was there all along and you didn't bother looking for it.

When starting out, I'd say start out with a short run if possible. Depending on how difficult the actual gameplay is you should shorten or lengthen your definition of "short" - for me 15-25 minutes is the max for the type of games I pick. In my case, it's games where frame-perfect input doesn't matter, but things can still easily go wrong - if you added the input, say a game like Sonic or Mario, I'd lower the time if possible. When I first started out, though, my target time for segments was 10 minutes at the most, and I gradually increased it as I got more consistent.

Picking a short run reduces the amount of work you need to do to get something out, but if you're new to speedrunning at a high standard, I think it's more important because, even in games you know well, you learn new things that will change your runs for the better, and it's a real pain to go back and start again on a long run when you find something that saves a fair bit of time in the very first segment for example. It gets easier to find the best strategies quicker the more you do it.

Research, research, research. If the game you're running is even mildly popular, people will have probably done speedruns of their own on places like Youtube. Get all the info you can to make sure you're not missing a trick, because it really, [i]really[/i] sucks to finish a run or segment and then realise a better strategy was there all along and you didn't bother looking for it.

ColonelFatso

2009-03-22 12:31:14 pm

Quote:

Research, research, research. If the game you're running is even mildly popular, people will have probably done speedruns of their own on places like Youtube. Get all the info you can to make sure you're not missing a trick, because it really, really sucks to finish a run or segment and then realise a better strategy was there all along and you didn't bother looking for it.

Especially heed this. Part of my frustration with a game like Pugsley's Scavenger Hunt is the fact that all I have to work with is a TAS in which half of the tricks are utterly unusable by a human.

DavizZz

2009-03-22 01:36:49 pm

youtube.com/DavizZz2106

I think RE5 is just too new to speedrun it. We dont have much experience in this game. You like RE5, so may be you played similar games like re4 or Silent Hill, Metal Gear etc. Check out games you own and games which are available here on SDA. Watch the speedruns and compare them to your skills. At the beginning you should better try a game which was already run. It just dont have to be submitted. Just test your skills and your patience.

I did a speedrun in a category I have never seen anywhere and I made a lot of mistakes. So my speedrun could be beaten really fast, but not many people play this mode. But RE5 is out for some days and probably some japanese people already start checking out the fastest strategies. Or just do a Speedrun in re5, but i wouldnt submit it.

I think SDA should say NO to any run which was made in a game which was released some weeks ago like re5.

Lag.Com

2009-03-22 01:55:47 pm

sda loyalist

Quote from DAVIS:

I think SDA should say NO to any run which was made in a game which was released some weeks ago like re5.

I've always agreed with this but a few things recently have given me pause for thought.

1. If someone is genuinely good at the game a good run might be turned away for an arbitrary reason.
2. Getting a speedrun of a new game out might drive up the popularity of the site and reach the attentions of video game media, possibly opening up cool things in the future.

Hattori HANZo

2009-03-22 03:13:54 pm

contraddicted

Quote from DAVIS:

I think SDA should say NO to any run which was made in a game which was released some weeks ago like re5.

Because of what?
If someone produces a badly played run it will be stopped at verification. And just because a game is released just for some weeks this doesn't mean that the runner hasn't played it for several hundert hours Wink

Of course it is unlikely that after just some weeks the route is ideal and every glitch has been found. But afaik the site is about good playing skills in the first place, not exploiting glitches. So if the run is played well and there's no obviously way better route known, why reject it?

Lag also has a point with the popularity\media attention thing.

QuestionMark

2009-03-22 07:32:15 pm

To append with the length of the run, you may want to consider trying a segmented run if it is a longer game (think an hour or more rather than 15-20 minutes) rather than single segment.

I thought doing a single segment run would be easier initially because then I don't have to worry about breaking it into parts or any of those complications. However, I quickly found that it is a luxury to be able to start even half way through the game due to a simple mistake.

Hyren575

2009-03-22 08:16:30 pm

Making A Ruckus Since 1991

Thanks for all the continued help.

I was thinking of doing an RE5 run. I've beaten it several times and have over 50 hours in it since last week and my record for running it is 2 hours 30 minutes with places I could definately improve on as I was stopping to collect treasures and things.

The only reason I'm hesitating on trying one is because after reading the topic for it people all seem to be doing a co-op run. If I did a run it would be a single player run. A co-op run would be at least 30 minutes faster then a single player.

Would a single player run go into a different catagory? The differences between having an AI partner and a human is rather extreme.

Manocheese

2009-03-22 08:35:08 pm

Yes, a cucco riding the ground.

Yes, a co-op run and a single-player run would be in separate categories.

Hyren575

2009-03-22 08:39:15 pm

Making A Ruckus Since 1991

That gives me a bit more confidence then.

Wouldn't it be a seperate catagory as well if I used the new game + option?

Like it would be a "single player, new game +" run or something along those lines?

VorpalEdge

2009-03-22 09:06:56 pm

welcome to the machine

Yes.

Hyren575

2009-03-22 09:13:08 pm

Making A Ruckus Since 1991

That good. I don't want to be something too difficult for my first run.

Hyren575

2009-03-22 10:55:37 pm

Making A Ruckus Since 1991

Quick question.

Is this...

http://www.amazon.com/Philips-DVDR3576H-Recorder-160GB-Built/dp/B0013WM0BQ/ref=pd_bbs_5?ie=UTF8&s=electronics&qid=1237783574&sr=8-5

The same product as this...

http://www.walmart.com/catalog/product.do?product_id=10059151#ProductDetail

?

trihex

2009-03-23 12:07:04 am

Yoshi's eggs are at my mercy!

Quote from Hyren575:

Quick question.

Is this...

http://www.amazon.com/Philips-DVDR3576H-Recorder-160GB-Built/dp/B0013WM0BQ/ref=pd_bbs_5?ie=UTF8&s=electronics&qid=1237783574&sr=8-5

The same product as this...

http://www.walmart.com/catalog/product.do?product_id=10059151#ProductDetail

?

Yes. Amazon resellers can do whatever the hell they want. Some overcharge to that extreme because they believe Amazon is starting to become blessed with the "Wal-Mart mentality" syndrome where average consumers assume they have the most competitive prices online throughout and won't bother looking anywhere else and purchase there ... Or at least, that's what I think, because anything else I conclude with trying to make reason out of a $800 price tag makes no sense.

From personal experience, I wouldn't purchase it from either. But looking from what I see on eBay, the seller I got mine from is no longer selling any, which makes the marketplace less competitive as I see the prices ballooning towards $300 now compared to when I purchased mine for $250 with free shipping in January.

Best thing I say to do for now is try to snip bid this one in about four days and see where that takes you.

[quote="Hyren575"]
Quick question.

Is this...

http://www.amazon.com/Philips-DVDR3576H-Recorder-160GB-Built/dp/B0013WM0BQ/ref=pd_bbs_5?ie=UTF8&s=electronics&qid=1237783574&sr=8-5

The same product as this...

http://www.walmart.com/catalog/product.do?product_id=10059151#ProductDetail

?
[/quote]

Yes. Amazon resellers can do whatever the hell they want. Some overcharge to that extreme because they believe Amazon is starting to become blessed with the "Wal-Mart mentality" syndrome where average consumers assume they have the most competitive prices online throughout and won't bother looking anywhere else and purchase there ... Or at least, that's what I think, because anything else I conclude with trying to make reason out of a $800 price tag makes no sense.

From personal experience, I wouldn't purchase it from either. But looking from what I see on eBay, the seller I got mine from is no longer selling any, which makes the marketplace less competitive as I see the prices ballooning towards $300 now compared to when I purchased mine for $250 with free shipping in January.

Best thing I say to do for now is try to snip bid [url=http://cgi.ebay.com/Phillips-DVDR3576H-37-160GB-DVDR-refurbished_W0QQitemZ270361570361QQcmdZViewItemQQptZDVD_Players_Recorders?hash=item270361570361&_trksid=p3286.c0.m14&_trkparms=72%3A1234|66%3A2|65%3A12|39%3A1|240%3A1318|301%3A1|293%3A1|294%3A50]this one[/url] in about four days and see where that takes you.

Hyren575

2009-03-23 12:16:35 am

Making A Ruckus Since 1991

Well I agree the it is a bit (lol) much, that is only the featured price.

There are 3 other new ones on amazon that are 400.

While I don't like paying 100 more, I really do want a good model and I really dislike ebay. This seems like my last option as no local stores carry it.