Golden Sun: The Lost Age

2012-06-27 06:30:09 pm

Sounds good...ill just work on any% or play OoT in the meantime. Take it easy man

2012-06-27 09:29:44 pm

So I just fought Posiedon and used the same strategy as last time only with shitty planning and piers and jenna's roles were switched. Because i forgot to give the spirit ring to piers it was hard to keep everyone healed fully, but sheba could cast wish every other turn (instead of using shade or steam) and felix could single target heal if necessary. I kinda just flew by the seat of my pants and ended up using a Meteor then Boreas then another Meteor to kill him. He felt very easy using this setup and my levels were 20/21/23/20. Additionally I outfitted in Apojii as well as in Champa which I think will help immensely in a single segment run. Going to finish off this run soon (maybe tonight) but i wont have a time estimate because i was using the emulator speed-up the entire time (i just wanted a fast run so i could learn the dungeons as I didnt know the route through them at all). If i can finish this then i will do another run real speed and add in any tricks i missed (like the shrine of the sea god retreat glitch) and hopefully memorize the dungeons and plan out which chests i will get (mainly just the weapons).

So I just fought Posiedon and used the same strategy as last time only with shitty planning and piers and jenna's roles were switched.  Because i forgot to give the spirit ring to piers it was hard to keep everyone healed fully, but sheba could cast wish every other turn (instead of using shade or steam) and felix could single target heal if necessary.  I kinda just flew by the seat of my pants and ended up using a Meteor then Boreas then another Meteor to kill him.  He felt very easy using this setup and my levels were 20/21/23/20.  Additionally I outfitted in Apojii as well as in Champa which I think will help immensely in a single segment run.  Going to finish off this run soon (maybe tonight) but i wont have a time estimate because i was using the emulator speed-up the entire time (i just wanted a fast run so i could learn the dungeons as I didnt know the route through them at all).  If i can finish this then i will do another run real speed and add in any tricks i missed (like the shrine of the sea god retreat glitch) and hopefully memorize the dungeons and plan out which chests i will get (mainly just the weapons).

EllomenoP

2012-06-29 12:36:39 am

OK so i just beat Doom Dragon and it wasnt terrible. Took me a couple tries because djinni storm is so devastating. My main strategy was for Sheba to spam Shade while Jenna spammed the fire djinni equivalent (Spark maybe? i forget). They would take turns using and setting so i had protection at all times. I then spammed attack with felix (he has sol blade with valkyrie mail, aegis shield, and hyper boots) while piers alternated between buffing felix and healing. If I needed to i could use the group heal Mercury djinni with sheba to hold over a turn or if i need to stop hauntings or death wishes i had the status clear mercury djinni on sheba as well. first and second phase are quite easy with this strategy as you should take basically no damage. However the whole trick is to be able to cope with djinni storm. When i finally killed him I lasted through a couple of the single target djinni burns as well as a djinni storm without instalosing. The key was immediately switch in a healer and block with evveryone else then slowly keep switching in isaacs party and/or reviving and holding out untill i can start the shield up again. It was pretty difficult but after about 5 turns of close call I was able to reestablish my safe strat from before the djinnistorm and won the battle.

For levels i believe i was 32/33/33/32 or something around there (i forgot to check but could go back if necessary). I kept all djinnis set with their proper owners except I switched all the mercury with all the jupiter djiniis as i did with the serpent. The power in this is that anyone (except isaac and garet) can party heal (felix has spirit ring) and this help you survive greatly. I kept all my djinnis set for the entire fight and killed him solely with meggido. I feel while some faster strats could be made...mine would make the most sense in a SS or RTA. you just need the stats from the djinnis too badly to be summoning.

Also I tried Othin's summon rush third phase strategy but it simply could not do enough damage and i would basically just be summoning and then instadying because my hp and stats would now be so low. I tried to work it into my shield strat as well but it was just too unstable in my opinion.

Anyways, bump once again and hopefully i see some more interest in here.

OK so i just beat Doom Dragon and it wasnt terrible.  Took me a couple tries because djinni storm is so devastating.  My main strategy was for Sheba to spam Shade while Jenna spammed the fire djinni equivalent (Spark maybe? i forget).  They would take turns using and setting so i had protection at all times.  I then spammed attack with felix (he has sol blade with valkyrie mail, aegis shield, and hyper boots) while piers alternated between buffing felix and healing.  If I needed to i could use the group heal Mercury djinni with sheba to hold over a turn or if i need to stop hauntings or death wishes i had the status clear mercury djinni on sheba as well.  first and second phase are quite easy with this strategy as you should take basically no damage.  However the whole trick is to be  able to cope with djinni storm.  When i finally killed him I lasted through a couple of the single target djinni burns as well as a djinni storm without instalosing.  The key was immediately switch in a healer and block with evveryone else then slowly keep switching in isaacs party and/or reviving and holding out untill i can start the shield up again.  It was pretty difficult but after about 5 turns of close call I was able to reestablish my safe strat from before the djinnistorm and won the battle.

For levels i believe i was 32/33/33/32 or something around there (i forgot to check but could go back if necessary).  I kept all djinnis set with their proper owners except I switched all the mercury with all the jupiter djiniis as i did with the serpent.  The power in this is that anyone (except isaac and garet) can party heal (felix has spirit ring) and this help you survive greatly.  I kept all my djinnis set for the entire fight and killed him solely with meggido.  I feel while some faster strats could be made...mine would make the most sense in a SS or RTA.  you just need the stats from the djinnis too badly to be summoning.

Also I tried Othin's summon rush third phase strategy but it simply could not do enough damage and i would basically just be summoning and then instadying because my hp and stats would now be so low.  I tried to work it into my shield strat as well but it was just too unstable in my opinion.

Anyways, bump once again and hopefully i see some more interest in here.

FlamingMage

2012-06-29 10:36:25 am

I've been reading and am interested, I've just taken a break from seriously looking at GS until the full extent of retreatglitch+save/load is understood. I do totally support your run though, it sounds like you know what you're doing.

Tiberius

2012-06-29 11:53:13 am

Make it so.

Throwing in my support for this as well, Golden Sun have always been some of my favourite games and I'd personally love to do a glitchless SS sometime too. So yeah, you go EllomenoP!

EllomenoP

2012-06-29 01:06:25 pm

Thanks for the support guys :D.

I just started doing another run with the goal of getting as low of a time on the in-game timer as possible. Its currently at 41 minutes and I just left the Kimbombo mountains. The one thing ive really messed up so far is that i forgot to grab the mysterious card and thus I don't have avoid. This is especially brutal on tricks like Gondowan early where you are severely underleveled and you cant save during the trick for first strike because i think that will mess up the retreat + save and reset glitch. Also its making it hard for me because i have to save and reset every third second which probably wastes time in the menu each time (as well as making it take much longer for me). However I'm playing on emulator atm (I have a gba and gs:tla tucked away somewhere, I should find them) so I have speedup which helps immensely with my sanity when im resetting so much for first strike. The other major mistakes were Jenna dying during the final turn of the King Scorpion fight so she got no exp as well as both sheba and felix dying during gondowan early (which i accepted as inevitable without avoid).

Anyways thanks again for the support...I'm hoping to move towards an RTA run when I have a full day to do it.

P.S. Im more of an SRL guy than an SDA one so I'm not sure of the stigmas/rulesets around here, but because of the usefulness of sanctum warps and the retreat + save/reset glitch, I don't think SS would be that great. I probably wouldnt be looking to submit my run anywhere, rather I would just be getting a good time for my own satisfaction. Because of this, I will time it as I've always timed my OoT runs...with RTA. I took a quick look into the RTA ruling thread and it seemed many of the arguments were off point. I feel the point isn't to keep resetting till you hit a trick, but rather to allow a more natural speedrun that can employ tricks that require resets. I don't really want to start up that discussion though.

Mainly, I'm posting here because SDA is where I saw interest. Wersterlobe Cerpin and Sylux were racing "Defeat Briggs" a couple months ago on SRL but other than that I haven't found anyone who went as in depth as Othin or Manocheese, so I'm grateful for the thought they put in to make it easy for me to pick up.

I'll update as I do more runs.

Thanks for the support guys :D.

I just started doing another run with the goal of getting as low of a time on the in-game timer as possible.  Its currently at 41 minutes and I just left the Kimbombo mountains.  The one thing ive really messed up so far is that i forgot to grab the mysterious card and thus I don't have avoid.  This is especially brutal on tricks like Gondowan early where you are severely underleveled and you cant save during the trick for first strike because i think that will mess up the retreat + save and reset glitch.  Also its making it hard for me because i have to save and reset every third second which probably wastes time in the menu each time (as well as making it take much longer for me).  However I'm playing on emulator atm (I have a gba and gs:tla tucked away somewhere, I should find them) so I have speedup which helps immensely with my sanity when im resetting so much for first strike.  The other major mistakes were Jenna dying during the final turn of the King Scorpion fight so she got no exp as well as both sheba and felix dying during gondowan early (which i accepted as inevitable without avoid).

Anyways thanks again for the support...I'm hoping to move towards an RTA run when I have a full day to do it.

P.S.  Im more of an SRL guy than an SDA one so I'm not sure of the stigmas/rulesets around here, but because of the usefulness of sanctum warps and the retreat + save/reset glitch, I don't think SS would be that great.  I probably wouldnt be looking to submit my run anywhere, rather I would just be getting a good time for my own satisfaction.  Because of this, I will time it as I've always timed my OoT runs...with RTA.  I took a quick look into the RTA ruling thread and it seemed many of the arguments were off point.  I feel the point isn't to keep resetting till you hit a trick, but rather to allow a more natural speedrun that can employ tricks that require resets.  I don't really want to start up that discussion though.

Mainly, I'm posting here because SDA is where I saw interest.  Wersterlobe Cerpin and Sylux were racing "Defeat Briggs" a couple months ago on SRL but other than that I haven't found anyone who went as in depth as Othin or Manocheese, so I'm grateful for the thought they put in to make it easy for me to pick up.

I'll update as I do more runs.

TheOthin

2012-07-03 08:54:06 am

Oh, hey, someone appeared! Awesome!

For early Gondowan, I didn't have issues with using save/load to flee the battles. Can't imagine getting through without it. It usually takes a hard reset at the end, though.

EllomenoP

2012-07-07 02:56:58 am

OK Im dumb and never tried it... :/ not sure why not woulda made life much easier. Not really hardcore optimizing this run and been pretty busy but hopefully ill get back into it soon and have time.

If i ever start trying to RTA it ill probably just not finish runs in one sitting until im ready to do a legit RTA and be happy with myself. Have to set a day aside for just GS when that time comes though haha...gonna be a long one

Plexa

Edit history:

Plexa: 2013-01-29 07:49:21 pm

Plexa: 2013-01-29 05:31:20 pm

Plexa: 2013-01-29 05:29:30 pm

Plexa: 2013-01-29 04:13:11 pm

Plexa: 2013-01-29 03:57:15 pm

Plexa: 2013-01-29 03:55:25 pm

2013-01-29 03:54:03 pm

Hi guys! If you've seen the GS1 thread you know I've been working on routing a GS1+GS2 all djinn all summon RTA run. Part of that has been testing as many places as possible for instances of retreat glitching and retreat save glitching. I know a lot of stuff has already been mapped out which has been really helpful but here are some useful things that I've found over the course of the past week.

Firstly, a marginally easier Gondowan skip:
Navigate to this place, and just walk up until the screen stops shaking. Then go right one square (doesn't have to be precise, so hold right for a about a second) then go left+up and you should warp out of Gondowan. The other skip that is posted on YT and whatnot is a little tricky and if things go wrong you can warp on the wrong side of the cliffs. This seems quicker and safer.

Next, a reverse Yampi Desert glitch;
I found this guy while looking for an early Daedalus (would have made Serpent sooo much quicker T_T). I didn't find a way into the interior of Yampi Desert Cave (although I can get to the first room with the teleport leading to the rest of the cave very easily - netting only a water of life for my trouble) but I did find a way back through Yampi. Simply enter from the Air's Rock side, retreat warp on the door, navigate to right side of the rock and walk straight up. If the screen flashes red, walk immediately right to warp out (if it doesn't flash you will warp out!). As a result of this I'm working on seeing whether going Madra-Yampi-Air's Rock-Garoh Sanctum Warp-Alhafra or Madra-Mikasalla (sour)-Air's Rock-Garoh Warp-Alhafra-Yampi Desert is faster. My initial tests suggest that the former is 3~ minutes quicker but my Garoh-Briggs split in the latter run seemed strangely slow.

Okay so that's quite boring. While I was mucking around with retreat on the exterior of Air's rock I found this fun stuff that you probably didn't know. Retreat mode actually messes up chests as well! Here's a simple illustration:

So far I haven't found any use for this but I've only really tested Air's Rock Exterior and Treasure Isle. Fun fact: this glitch *also* works on mimics:

What I think is happening is that the game has all the chests in the rooms numbered, by entering retreat mode the game thinks you are in first screen of the dungeon (which we know from save+retreat) so by talking to a chest while in retreat mode the game attempts to recall the data from chests from the first screen - different chests have different numbers and will link back to different chests in the first screen. The only problem with my theory is that Treasure Isle recalls stuff from rooms coming off of the first screen - so it might be even weirder with the game attempting to recall chest data and ending up recalling data from elsewhere.

Now for some fun stuff which supports the 'recalling data from elsewhere' hypothesis. When I was messing around in treasure isle I came across this:

You get some really missed up conversations from some people - I don't know where those people have come from either (one is possibly from Naribwe? and one looks like from Gondowan Settlement? My guess is that these people aren't all from the same town). Also I illustrate that the game is opening chests from other parts of the dungeon in the second half of the video. Note that (as with other retreat mode glitches) that chests opened in the first screen will behave as normal.

EDIT: I have since found that the conversation with the top left chest does indeed link to someone in Naribwe. It is the young girl standing next to the tree near the fire. EXCEPT the "seek them out" part of the conversation - that I believe is part of the conversation with the fortune teller. I have no idea what is going on there lol.

EDIT 2: Works on barrels as well.
Unsure as to whether this works only on barrels which normally contain items or whether its only barrels which contain items.

Hi guys! If you've seen the GS1 thread you know I've been working on routing a GS1+GS2 all djinn all summon RTA run. Part of that has been testing as many places as possible for instances of retreat glitching and retreat save glitching. I know a lot of stuff has already been mapped out which has been really helpful but here are some useful things that I've found over the course of the past week.

Firstly, a marginally easier Gondowan skip: http://youtu.be/AEaYMVn5cH0
Navigate to this place, and just walk up until the screen stops shaking. Then go right one square (doesn't have to be precise, so hold right for a about a second) then go left+up and you should warp out of Gondowan. The other skip that is posted on YT and whatnot is a little tricky and if things go wrong you can warp on the wrong side of the cliffs. This seems quicker and safer.

Next, a reverse Yampi Desert glitch; http://youtu.be/CjC9Dt9wUp0
I found this guy while looking for an early Daedalus (would have made Serpent sooo much quicker T_T). I didn't find a way into the interior of Yampi Desert Cave (although I can get to the first room with the teleport leading to the rest of the cave very easily - netting only a water of life for my trouble) but I did find a way back through Yampi. Simply enter from the Air's Rock side, retreat warp on the door, navigate to right side of the rock and walk straight up. If the screen flashes red, walk immediately right to warp out (if it doesn't flash you will warp out!). As a result of this I'm working on seeing whether going Madra-Yampi-Air's Rock-Garoh Sanctum Warp-Alhafra or Madra-Mikasalla (sour)-Air's Rock-Garoh Warp-Alhafra-Yampi Desert is faster. My initial tests suggest that the former is 3~ minutes quicker but my Garoh-Briggs split in the latter run seemed strangely slow.

Okay so that's quite boring. While I was mucking around with retreat on the exterior of Air's rock I found this fun stuff that you probably didn't know. Retreat mode actually messes up chests as well! Here's a simple illustration: http://youtu.be/942GuDl-LQA

So far I haven't found any use for this but I've only really tested Air's Rock Exterior and Treasure Isle. Fun fact: this glitch *also* works on mimics: http://youtu.be/V4XJGVoqJ6s

What I think is happening is that the game has all the chests in the rooms numbered, by entering retreat mode the game thinks you are in first screen of the dungeon (which we know from save+retreat) so by talking to a chest while in retreat mode the game attempts to recall the data from chests from the first screen - different chests have different numbers and will link back to different chests in the first screen. The only problem with my theory is that Treasure Isle recalls stuff from rooms coming off of the first screen - so it might be even weirder with the game attempting to recall chest data and ending up recalling data from elsewhere.

Now for some fun stuff which supports the 'recalling data from elsewhere' hypothesis. When I was messing around in treasure isle I came across this: http://youtu.be/HsHbpN3t5DA

You get some really missed up conversations from some people - I don't know where those people have come from either (one is possibly from Naribwe? and one looks like from Gondowan Settlement? My guess is that these people aren't all from the same town). Also I illustrate that the game is opening chests from other parts of the dungeon in the second half of the video. Note that (as with other retreat mode glitches) that chests opened in the first screen will behave as normal.

EDIT: I have since found that the conversation with the top left chest does indeed link to someone in Naribwe. It is the young girl standing next to the tree near the fire. EXCEPT the "seek them out" part of the conversation - that I believe is part of the conversation with the fortune teller. I have no idea what is going on there lol.

EDIT 2: Works on barrels as well. http://youtu.be/TrQWPy4gysU
Unsure as to whether this works only on barrels which normally contain items or whether its only barrels which contain items.

Manocheese

2013-01-29 06:38:20 pm

Yes, a cucco riding the ground.

I wonder if the chest glitch can be extended to chests in different areas. If we could use it to get psynergy items like the Teleport Lapis early, we could seriously break the game.

Plexa

Edit history:

Plexa: 2013-02-04 12:00:34 am

Plexa: 2013-02-03 11:59:44 pm

Plexa: 2013-02-02 12:15:37 am

Plexa: 2013-02-02 12:00:43 am

Plexa: 2013-01-30 04:53:14 pm

Plexa: 2013-01-30 04:50:32 pm

2013-01-29 11:38:07 pm

So far no Teleport Lapis, but I did manage to obtain an "Unknown Item" which has no use as far as I can tell. is one location you can get it.

Here is a running log of places I've tested, don't have anymore time today to test things but will continue tomorrow:

Air's Rock: Garbage on the exterior (sleep bombs/smoke bombs/lucky medal), interior needs checking.
Aqua Rock: Garbage on the exterior (empty chests), garbage on the inside except for the Unknown Item (which is interesting, but useless)
Gaia Rock: Most chests will not activate in retreat mode. The chest at the summit where you obtain the dancing doll, however, will activate and give some garbage text and an unknown item. The altar will give a nut, and will not activate after the idol has been taken. Interestingly, I noticed that when the screen changes (like when the lights are shone onto the serpent) if you are in retreat mode you will warp outside of Gaia rock. Not sure of the implications of this, but good to have written down.
Lemurian Ship: Garbage - elixers and whatnot.
Izumo Ruins: Chests will not activate
Madra Catacombs: Nothing useful
Tundaria Tower: No chests will activate (dammit), didn't test what happens when you pick up the right prong in retreat mode, and its possible I missed two chests.

Update:
Ankhol Ruins: No chests will activate (expected, yet sad)
Shaman Village: First chest on trial road links to the barrel in the bottom floor of Moapa's house - which means that chests and barrels are linked. Also interesting is that the barrel actually links to the chest as well - unsure as to whether this is a general fact or lucky coincidence. No confirmation as to whether empty barrels link to chests/barrels yet.

In the bottom floor of the inn the pot which normally gives an elixer will give a long sword and garbage text.

EDIT: the chest which gives the spirit gloves also links to the hard nut chest - meaning the first instance was most likely a coincidence.

EDIT 2: Not worth bumping the thread for this, but, a 100% run probably won't be able to do all of alhafra in one trip (using the Gondowan skip). Not only is the orb in the mayor's house there until Briggs is defeated, but also the cave hasn't collapsed in the Madra Catacombs meaning, unless there is a miraculous save+warp that I've missed, Moloch will be unobtainable. The tremor bit is absolutely necessary to grab Rime in Old Lemuria (as well as the one in Sea of Time Islet, but I assume you have tremor by then) so I don't really see any solution to this...

Here are some notes regarding this problem:
- Currently my planned route is tundaria > madra warp > Alhafra > Gaia etc., goal is to be able to get tremor before Lemuria to grab Rime
- Retreat does not work in Alhafra Cave or the Garoh Caves
- I haven't found any nice Madra warps in Yampi Desert
- Retreat glitch is useless in Osenia Cavern (it's all one 'big' room despite looking like two rooms)
- No magic warps in Madra Catacombs as previously mentioned

- Doing Alhafra twice would:
-- (via Airs Rock-Garoh warp) Add about 3 minutes in travel+slightly longer fight
-- (via Airs Rock-Alhafra warp) Add around 2 minutes in travel+fight time
-- (via Tundaria > Briggs > Backtrack) Add a similar time to the Airs Rock-Alhafra version, unless the bridge between Madra-Alhafra gets repaired?
-- (via Mud > Alhafra > Apoji Islands) Might be the quickest way to do things. Would also collect Moloch after Tundaria, need to go to Madra and warp there anyway!
-- First three options can make use of Avoid in my setup
-- I think I'm going to go with Garoh as Ether is an incredibly useful Djinn - and if I need to obtain it I'd rather obtain it early and have it used throughout the game rather than at the end after a Teleport.

EDIT 3: Well, my trial all djinn/summon run came in at 15~ hours combine (gs1+gs2 time with in game time 5:34 and 10:09 respectively) with a lot of mistakes and things unoptimised. I think there is about an 45mins to be saved in the gs1 portion (some route adjustments to account for things in GS2 - turns out there is not a single *extra* djinn that you can obtain quicker in GS1 than you can in GS2. So for that reason I'm going to be skipping Bane/Kite/Tonic/unsure - probably Torch. Also, Golden Boots are imba) and there is probably around 2 hours of optimisation to be done in GS2 (made some serious blunders like forgetting Meld in islet cave lol and various bits of my route not really working out as intended).

I think my route is looking at coming in at around 12 hours total - lol. And while I intend for it to be RTA, I think it makes a lot of sense to break it into two segments as to not penalise for the second menu screens and data transfer between GS1 and GS2 - plus with such a long run with no real point for a break, having a bathroom break/snack is probably best for the health of anyone who runs it lol.

So far no Teleport Lapis, but I did manage to obtain an "Unknown Item" which has no use as far as I can tell.  http://youtu.be/UoBQ_RsFHqs is one location you can get it.

Here is a running log of places I've tested, don't have anymore time today to test things but will continue tomorrow:

Air's Rock: Garbage on the exterior (sleep bombs/smoke bombs/lucky medal), interior needs checking.
Aqua Rock: Garbage on the exterior (empty chests), garbage on the inside except for the Unknown Item (which is interesting, but useless)
Gaia Rock: Most chests will not activate in retreat mode. The chest at the summit where you obtain the dancing doll, however, will activate and give some garbage text and an unknown item. The altar will give a nut, and will not activate after the idol has been taken. Interestingly, I noticed that when the screen changes (like when the lights are shone onto the serpent) if you are in retreat mode you will warp outside of Gaia rock. Not sure of the implications of this, but good to have written down. 
Lemurian Ship: Garbage - elixers and whatnot.
Izumo Ruins: Chests will not activate
Madra Catacombs: Nothing useful 
Tundaria Tower: No chests will activate (dammit), didn't test what happens when you pick up the right prong in retreat mode, and its possible I missed two chests.

Update:
Ankhol Ruins: No chests will activate (expected, yet sad)
Shaman Village: First chest on trial road links to the barrel in the bottom floor of Moapa's house - which means that chests and barrels are linked. Also interesting is that the barrel actually links to the chest as well - unsure as to whether this is a general fact or lucky coincidence. No confirmation as to whether empty barrels link to chests/barrels yet.

In the bottom floor of the inn the pot which normally gives an elixer will give a long sword and garbage text.

EDIT: the chest which gives the spirit gloves also links to the hard nut chest - meaning the first instance was most likely a coincidence.

EDIT 2: Not worth bumping the thread for this, but, a 100% run probably won't be able to do all of alhafra in one trip (using the Gondowan skip). Not only is the orb in the mayor's house there until Briggs is defeated, but also the cave hasn't collapsed in the Madra Catacombs meaning, unless there is a miraculous save+warp that I've missed, Moloch will be unobtainable. The tremor bit is absolutely necessary to grab Rime in Old Lemuria (as well as the one in Sea of Time Islet, but I assume you have tremor by then) so I don't really see any solution to this...

Here are some notes regarding this problem:
- Currently my planned route is tundaria > madra warp > Alhafra > Gaia etc., goal is to be able to get tremor before Lemuria to grab Rime
- Retreat does not work in Alhafra Cave or the Garoh Caves
- I haven't found any nice Madra warps in Yampi Desert
- Retreat glitch is useless in Osenia Cavern (it's all one 'big' room despite looking like two rooms)
- No magic warps in Madra Catacombs as previously mentioned

- Doing Alhafra twice would:
-- (via Airs Rock-Garoh warp) Add about 3 minutes in travel+slightly longer fight
-- (via Airs Rock-Alhafra warp) Add around 2 minutes in travel+fight time
-- (via Tundaria > Briggs > Backtrack) Add a similar time to the Airs Rock-Alhafra version, unless the bridge between Madra-Alhafra gets repaired?
-- (via Mud > Alhafra > Apoji Islands) Might be the quickest way to do things. Would also collect Moloch after Tundaria, need to go to Madra and warp there anyway!
-- First three options can make use of Avoid in my setup
-- I think I'm going to go with Garoh as Ether is an incredibly useful Djinn - and if I need to obtain it I'd rather obtain it early and have it used throughout the game rather than at the end after a Teleport.

EDIT 3: Well, my trial all djinn/summon run came in at 15~ hours combine (gs1+gs2 time with in game time 5:34 and 10:09 respectively) with a lot of mistakes and things unoptimised. I think there is about an 45mins to be saved in the gs1 portion (some route adjustments to account for things in GS2 - turns out there is not a single *extra* djinn that you can obtain quicker in GS1 than you can in GS2. So for that reason I'm going to be skipping Bane/Kite/Tonic/unsure - probably Torch. Also, Golden Boots are imba) and there is probably around 2 hours of optimisation to be done in GS2 (made some serious blunders like forgetting Meld in islet cave lol and various bits of my route not really working out as intended).

I think my route is looking at coming in at around 12 hours total - lol. And while I intend for it to be RTA, I think it makes a lot of sense to break it into two segments as to not penalise for the second menu screens and data transfer between GS1 and GS2 - plus with such a long run with no real point for a break, having a bathroom break/snack is probably best for the health of anyone who runs it lol.

Arkhanno

2013-02-04 01:44:53 am

I'm really liking these broken chests. Kinda makes me want to play through The Lost Age again just to refresh myself on that game. Just curious: was that 15 hour combined run using the Save Retreat glitch?

As for the last Djinn to skip I'd suggest Torch. I'd also like to suggest you Sap. Torch isn't too far out of the way but makes Fusion Dragon a pain if you use the Flash/Granite combo with a single element tier 4 summon.

I'd love to see a finalized run of this eventually, Plexa! I think it's be a fun watch.

Plexa

Edit history:

Plexa: 2013-02-04 02:49:25 am

Plexa: 2013-02-04 02:44:42 am

Plexa: 2013-02-04 02:27:40 am

2013-02-04 02:24:30 am

Yes it was 15hours with save+retreat. There's only two places I used it in TLA though:
- Air's Rock to skip the whirlwind puzzles on the first floor
- Gondowan skip (which isn't *really* essential as I will probably do Briggs after Air's Rock in future, so it's just a time saver)

Of course there are a ton of save warps scattered around the early part of the game to fully abuse the madra warp, later at Loho (to grab petra/haures quicker) and some dungeon ends to get to the relevant town quicker (e.g. Jutpier lighthouse and Contigo).

And while we're on the subject of save+retreat the only places I really found uses for it in GS1 were Sol Sanctum, Goma Cave and Kalay Tunnels (only because I felt that getting the spirit gloves there didn't cost much time for added safety - I'm toying with the idea of skipping the water jacket because that cutscene is very long and while it's reallllly useful vs the fusion dragon, there might be some safe strats which avoid it). I currently get sap, I need minimum 6 djinn to finish TLA, and bane being in cross bone isle makes him very unattractive to get. So I plan on just popping up to Vault to activate the golden boots and grab sap and then back down to Kalay. This trial run I just did got the golden ring (I thought it might be useful vs Poseidon or something) and it's definitely not worth the added cutscenes lol. Incidentally, golden shirt isn't worth it either.

Back on the subject of warping, it looks as if the devs used less and less garbage doors in their dungeons as the game progresses. Towards the end of the game the only garbage doors link to exits from the main room which significantly limits the use of the glitch as most main dungeons have an "entrance" screen with only a door from the world map and a door into the dungeon itself. Then again, I could be proven wrong! The fact that there are a lot of entrance rooms also explains why the save+retreat is generally less useful in general in this game.

With regard to the chest glitch, I'm sure it will work in GS1 as well. But then again I have found absolutely nothing useful in GS2 with the glitch. Except, another ? in Mars lighthouse lol. I did get rather lazy after testing almost the entire eastern sea and finding nothing, and only testing sporadically in the western sea so there is a chance there is something useful. While I was searching to see if anyone had the memory address for the overworld RNG (to aid in manipulating the fountain, which failed horribly) I found that there are three ? items coded into the game which serve no purpose - I guess they were items intended to be found at the start of various areas and can be obtained via the retreat glitch.

Incidentally, the Japanese run linked at the start of the thread which had the 7:06 was using a 4:24 clear time from GS1 in his run. That gives his Any% run an 11:30 time total. I doubt I could push the GS1 route lower than 4:45 and there's probably 2 hours of extra content in TLA in getting summons and the 'post game' dungeons/djinn. But judging from the split times of the jap run it doesn't look like he cleared Air's rock in an optimal way (his time is around 1:30, I had a 1:20~ after I got trolled by x6 defend King Scorpion ._.) which makes me think that the 7:06 can be pushed a lot lower. That makes me guess that TLA can be done in around 8 hours, which gives me hope for 12~ hours total.

Hopefully I'll start doing complete runs of this in 2 weeks or so - I need to optimise Izumo (post Gaia rock) onwards which hopefully will be done this week.

P.S. to add to Manocheese's retreat list; unfortunately Yampi Desert Cave all warps to whatever entrance you came in, there's nothing out of bounds in Islet Cave and no skips in Treasure Isle. Nothing useful in Madra Catacombs (you can get out of bounds in Madra from the Catacombs, but there's nothing useful there) or any of the caves housing summons.

EDIT: just as I say there are no useful chests I find one which is plausibly useful. There is a chest in Jupiter Lighthouse which contains 32767 coins:
You'll also note that there is some garbage text: "Can be given" and "Still Recovering" come up when talking to the chest after obtaining the item. Verrrrry curious.

Yes it was 15hours with save+retreat. There's only two places I used it in TLA though: 
- Air's Rock to skip the whirlwind puzzles on the first floor
- Gondowan skip (which isn't *really* essential as I will probably do Briggs after Air's Rock in future, so it's just a time saver)

Of course there are a ton of save warps scattered around the early part of the game to fully abuse the madra warp, later at Loho (to grab petra/haures quicker) and some dungeon ends to get to the relevant town quicker (e.g. Jutpier lighthouse and Contigo).

And while we're on the subject of save+retreat the only places I really found uses for it in GS1 were Sol Sanctum, Goma Cave and Kalay Tunnels (only because I felt that getting the spirit gloves there didn't cost much time for added safety - I'm toying with the idea of skipping the water jacket because that cutscene is very long and while it's reallllly useful vs the fusion dragon, there might be some safe strats which avoid it). I currently get sap, I need minimum 6 djinn to finish TLA, and bane being in cross bone isle makes him very unattractive to get. So I plan on just popping up to Vault to activate the golden boots and grab sap and then back down to Kalay. This trial run I just did got the golden ring (I thought it might be useful vs Poseidon or something) and it's definitely not worth the added cutscenes lol. Incidentally, golden shirt isn't worth it either.

Back on the subject of warping, it looks as if the devs used less and less garbage doors in their dungeons as the game progresses. Towards the end of the game the only garbage doors link to exits from the main room which significantly limits the use of the glitch as most main dungeons have an "entrance" screen with only a door from the world map and a door into the dungeon itself. Then again, I could be proven wrong! The fact that there are a lot of entrance rooms also explains why the save+retreat is generally less useful in general in this game.

With regard to the chest glitch, I'm sure it will work in GS1 as well. But then again I have found absolutely nothing useful in GS2 with the glitch. Except, another ? in Mars lighthouse lol. I did get rather lazy after testing almost the entire eastern sea and finding nothing, and only testing sporadically in the western sea so there is a chance there is something useful. While I was searching to see if anyone had the memory address for the overworld RNG (to aid in manipulating the fountain, which failed horribly) I found that there are three ? items coded into the game which serve no purpose - I guess they were items intended to be found at the start of various areas and can be obtained via the retreat glitch.

Incidentally, the Japanese run linked at the start of the thread which had the 7:06 was using a 4:24 clear time from GS1 in his run. That gives his Any% run an 11:30 time total. I doubt I could push the GS1 route lower than 4:45 and there's probably 2 hours of extra content in TLA in getting summons and the 'post game' dungeons/djinn. But judging from the split times of the jap run it doesn't look like he cleared Air's rock in an optimal way (his time is around 1:30, I had a 1:20~ after I got trolled by x6 defend King Scorpion ._.) which makes me think that the 7:06 can be pushed a lot lower. That makes me guess that TLA can be done in around 8 hours, which gives me hope for 12~ hours total.

Hopefully I'll start doing complete runs of this in 2 weeks or so - I need to optimise Izumo (post Gaia rock) onwards which hopefully will be done this week.

P.S. to add to Manocheese's retreat list; unfortunately Yampi Desert Cave all warps to whatever entrance you came in, there's nothing out of bounds in Islet Cave and no skips in Treasure Isle. Nothing useful in Madra Catacombs (you can get out of bounds in Madra from the Catacombs, but there's nothing useful there) or any of the caves housing summons.

EDIT: just as I say there are no useful chests I find one which is plausibly useful. There is a chest in Jupiter Lighthouse which contains 32767 coins: http://youtu.be/Uogsvll0g84
You'll also note that there is some garbage text: "Can be given" and "Still Recovering" come up when talking to the chest after obtaining the item. Verrrrry curious.

Plexa

Edit history:

Plexa: 2013-02-04 03:06:21 am

2013-02-04 02:48:52 am

LOLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLL

This will save me at least 30 minutes and I'm sure there are Any%'ers that would find this quite interesting.

TheOthin

Edit history:

TheOthin: 2013-02-04 01:32:31 pm

TheOthin: 2013-02-04 01:31:52 pm

2013-02-04 01:31:30 pm

That's beautiful. Just beautiful.

So close to GS2-only 100%... we just need Shine and Charon to get that, right?

Plexa

Edit history:

Plexa: 2013-02-04 08:21:15 pm

Plexa: 2013-02-04 08:21:06 pm

Plexa: 2013-02-04 08:20:54 pm

Plexa: 2013-02-04 08:18:36 pm

Plexa: 2013-02-04 08:18:35 pm

Plexa: 2013-02-04 07:53:05 pm

Plexa: 2013-02-04 07:52:10 pm

Plexa: 2013-02-04 07:43:17 pm

Plexa: 2013-02-04 07:41:27 pm

Plexa: 2013-02-04 07:40:59 pm

Plexa: 2013-02-04 07:38:04 pm

Plexa: 2013-02-04 07:36:53 pm

Plexa: 2013-02-04 01:52:00 pm

2013-02-04 01:51:28 pm

As far as I'm aware of, you only get 5 djinn per character without a password meaning you'll be 5 Djinn short (4+shine) - voiding a 100% by any reasonable definition. But I guess that glitch would change a Max% run.

EDIT: Okay, with early Iris and some less bad playing I got my 10:08 down to an 8:57. Theres at least 15minutes to be saved in not being bad in the Western Sea and potentially more if I can not get trolled by Star Magician. There was some stuff I wanted to look at at Magma rock interior as well. The Islet Cave corridor is a huge pain to go through - it took over 20 minutes to get to the end... I wonder if that is a candidate for the save+reset abuse? I'll have to check the RNG on how many steps I can get before a fight.

With regard to early iris, the best time to get her is either Contigo 1 (when you grab Salt + the sanctum warp point for jupiter later on) or Contigo 2 immediately after Jupiter lighthouse. If you have the mana for Contigo 1 I would go for it, else Contigo 2 is *probably* best done by draining mana on Karst/Agatio then throwing the fight - that seems quicker than 14~ or so avoids but I might be wrong about this. Of course Alex is a dick and heals you before the fight so you can't tank PP before that and it should be noted that you get a full heal after the meeting with Isaac, so Iris needs to be obtained after the sanctum warp and before Isaac.

Also, Valukar can sure tank a hit lol. Star Magician should be 2 turns, Sentinel should be one or two and Valukar needs 2 with a switch in for a fresh Azul. I also need to account for that extra Azul in future runs by getting more agil boost for (probably) Mia. No big deal, that'll add 20 seconds at most and will make sure he doesn't steal the Azul and completely screw me over.

EDIT 2: I can do Islet cave in 5-7 minutes with save+reset - I'll probably do that in future. I can one turn everything in Yampi/Treasure Isle so I won't save+reset that for the time being.

EDIT 3: After testing magma rock a bit more, my route was sub-optimal. Should be able to save a bunch of time in the interior compared to the previous run.

As far as I'm aware of, you only get 5 djinn per character without a password meaning you'll be 5 Djinn short (4+shine) - voiding a 100% by any reasonable definition. But I guess that glitch would change a Max% run.

EDIT: Okay, with early Iris and some less bad playing I got my 10:08 down to an 8:57. Theres at least 15minutes to be saved in not being bad in the Western Sea and potentially more if I can not get trolled by Star Magician. There was some stuff I wanted to look at at Magma rock interior as well. The Islet Cave corridor is a huge pain to go through - it took over 20 minutes to get to the end... I wonder if that is a candidate for the save+reset abuse? I'll have to check the RNG on how many steps I can get before a fight.

With regard to early iris, the best time to get her is either Contigo 1 (when you grab Salt + the sanctum warp point for jupiter later on) or Contigo 2 immediately after Jupiter lighthouse. If you have the mana for Contigo 1 I would go for it, else Contigo 2 is *probably* best done by draining mana on Karst/Agatio then throwing the fight - that seems quicker than 14~ or so avoids but I might be wrong about this. Of course Alex is a dick and heals you before the fight so you can't tank PP before that and it should be noted that you get a full heal after the meeting with Isaac, so Iris needs to be obtained after the sanctum warp and before Isaac.

Also, Valukar can sure tank a hit lol. Star Magician should be 2 turns, Sentinel should be one or two and Valukar needs 2 with a switch in for a fresh Azul. I also need to account for that extra Azul in future runs by getting more agil boost for (probably) Mia. No big deal, that'll add 20 seconds at most and will make sure he doesn't steal the Azul and completely screw me over.

EDIT 2: I can do Islet cave in 5-7 minutes with save+reset - I'll probably do that in future. I can one turn everything in Yampi/Treasure Isle so I won't save+reset that for the time being.

EDIT 3: After testing magma rock a bit more, my route was sub-optimal. Should be able to save a bunch of time in the interior compared to the previous run.

EllomenoP

2013-02-04 07:32:00 pm

Hey guys, great job with all the new discoveries Plexa.

Ive kind of dropped out of the speedrunning community for a while. Mainly I'm really busy with school and my personal life and it leaves not much time for other stuff. I feel bad when I look at my last posts and your guys' encouragement and then I just stopped playing lol. Maybe ill get back into this sometime though. Its going to be hard for me to put in 7-8 straight hours for a TLA run.

Currently Ive been gaming more casually but Ill keep an eye on this thread because GS is a wonderful game.

Keep at it guys :).

Plexa

Edit history:

Plexa: 2013-02-08 03:15:17 am

Plexa: 2013-02-08 03:14:35 am

2013-02-08 02:31:07 am

So I sat down and hammered out a near-completed GS2 100% run today. I say near completed because Doom Dragon killed me. My strats were admittedly lazy and bad for him, so I deserved it - I've also fixed that. There were a ton of obvious execution mistakes which I'm aware of (and probably noted during the run). The run can be found here for those who are interested: http://www.twitch.tv/tl_plexa/b/364992640

What I'm more interested in is any input on the general route given how open 100% is, the route is hidden below:

Daila
Kandorean Temple
Dekhan Plateau (Madra Warp)
Iron/Madra (for sanctum warp)
Indra Cavern
Dekhan Plateau 2 (sanctum warp to madra)
Madra
King Scorpion
Mikasalla/Sour/Osenia Cavern (sanctum warp to mikasalla)
Garoh (for sanctum warp)
Airs Rock
Garoh
Briggs (needed to get moloch)
Gondowan Passage (w/ skip)
Naribwe
Kibombo Mountains
Kibombo/Gabomba
Naribwe (I feel that the Kibombo warp to madra takes longer. Briggs dead = I can do either)
Gondowan Passage (getting djinn + healing fungus)
Madra 2 (Moloch, Bandit fight)
Ship
Shrine of the Sea God
SW Gondowan (lucky medal)
Gondowan Catacombs (just for mud)
Apoji Islands/Aqua Rock
E. Tundaria (pretty stone, lucky medal)
Tundaria Tower (madra warp, jupiter djinn before tower)
Alhafra 2 (briggs cutscene)
Izumo/Gaia Rock (Ulysses)
S. Angara (red cloth, lucky medal)
Ankhol Ruins
Champa
N. Osenia (Milk, lucky medal)
Lemuria (get wild coat from fountain, eclipse)
Hesperia Settlement (getting Chill, Core on the way there)
Shaman Village/Trial Road (glitch for x3 wild coats, x3 golden boots)
Contigo (venus djinn, sanctum warp point)
Jupiter Lighthouse
Anemos Inner Sacntum (Iris before Isaac (using early Iris))
Isaac joins
Atteka Cave (Coatlique)
Magma Rock
Loho
Angara Cave (warp to Loho after)
Petra/Shaman Village Cave 2 (warp to Loho)
Kalt Island
Northern Reaches
Mars lighthouse 1 (through to after Agatio/Karst, getting mars Djinn)
Shaman Village (getting Jupiter djinn from trial road, teleport)
Izumo/Treasure Isle (teleport)
Apoji Islands/Islet Cave (teleport, getting Apoji jupiter djinn here)
Garoh/Taopo Swamp (teleport, no yallam tepeport point)
Alhafra/Yampi Desert Cave (teleport)
Contigo/SW Atteka (getting last Djinn, teleport)
Anemos Inner Sanctum (Charon)
Mars Lighthouse 2 (Doom Dragon into GG)

So I sat down and hammered out a near-completed GS2 100% run today. I say near completed because Doom Dragon killed me. My strats were admittedly lazy and bad for him, so I deserved it - I've also fixed that. There were a ton of obvious execution mistakes which I'm aware of (and probably noted during the run). The run can be found here for those who are interested: http://www.twitch.tv/tl_plexa/b/364992640

What I'm more interested in is any input on the general route given how open 100% is, the route is hidden below:
[hidden]Daila
Kandorean Temple
Dekhan Plateau (Madra Warp)
Iron/Madra (for sanctum warp)
Indra Cavern
Dekhan Plateau 2 (sanctum warp to madra)
Madra
King Scorpion
Mikasalla/Sour/Osenia Cavern (sanctum warp to mikasalla)
Garoh (for sanctum warp)
Airs Rock
Garoh
Briggs (needed to get moloch)
Gondowan Passage (w/ skip)
Naribwe
Kibombo Mountains
Kibombo/Gabomba
Naribwe (I feel that the Kibombo warp to madra takes longer. Briggs dead = I can do either)
Gondowan Passage (getting djinn + healing fungus)
Madra 2 (Moloch, Bandit fight)
Ship
Shrine of the Sea God
SW Gondowan (lucky medal)
Gondowan Catacombs (just for mud)
Apoji Islands/Aqua Rock
E. Tundaria (pretty stone, lucky medal)
Tundaria Tower (madra warp, jupiter djinn before tower)
Alhafra 2 (briggs cutscene)
Izumo/Gaia Rock (Ulysses)
S. Angara (red cloth, lucky medal)
Ankhol Ruins
Champa
N. Osenia (Milk, lucky medal)
Lemuria (get wild coat from fountain, eclipse)
Hesperia Settlement (getting Chill, Core on the way there)
Shaman Village/Trial Road (glitch for x3 wild coats, x3 golden boots)
Contigo (venus djinn, sanctum warp point)
Jupiter Lighthouse
Anemos Inner Sacntum (Iris before Isaac (using early Iris))
Isaac joins
Atteka Cave (Coatlique)
Magma Rock
Loho
Angara Cave (warp to Loho after)
Petra/Shaman Village Cave 2 (warp to Loho)
Kalt Island
Northern Reaches
Mars lighthouse 1 (through to after Agatio/Karst, getting mars Djinn)
Shaman Village (getting Jupiter djinn from trial road, teleport)
Izumo/Treasure Isle (teleport)
Apoji Islands/Islet Cave (teleport, getting Apoji jupiter djinn here)
Garoh/Taopo Swamp (teleport, no yallam tepeport point)
Alhafra/Yampi Desert Cave (teleport)
Contigo/SW Atteka (getting last Djinn, teleport)
Anemos Inner Sanctum (Charon)
Mars Lighthouse 2 (Doom Dragon into GG)
[/hidden]

wersterlobe

2013-02-08 05:30:32 am

dang, I'm happy to see this get a ton of love. I've known about a bit of this stuff, but not yet fully explored it (I knew about retreat chesting for example, but didn't know about that early Iris, that looks so sick haha)

I plan to route through this game some time soon, dang I just realised I actually have nothing important to post haha

But def love this game, happy to see you're doing some really cool shit Plexa!!

I've followed you on twitch etc will check out when I can. Do you have the sweeper script/have you run it through all dungeons for all the save retreat warps? I know it's been done for Golden Sun 1, not sure if it was completely done for 2 (because I did 1 and not 2 lol)

Plexa

Edit history:

Plexa: 2013-02-09 12:36:26 am

Plexa: 2013-02-09 12:35:07 am

Plexa: 2013-02-09 12:34:55 am

Plexa: 2013-02-09 12:24:00 am

2013-02-08 09:12:34 pm

I don't have the sweeper script, but I do have the coordinate script (kirkq's iirc) and have trawled all of the dungeons for OoB doors manually except magma rock interior. There's a chance I missed stuff, but if there were anything accessible I think I would have found it. There may be some more applications of the save+retreat glitch (similar to skipping the whirlwind puzzles in airs rock) that I haven't thought of/tested though. I didn't test Western Sea thoroughly for retreat on doors after my testing in the Eastern Sea converged with Manocheese's list, so I just used his list.

I think as far as GS2 any% goes it's mostly mapped out, then again all the information I could find on GS1 missed the Hydros skip so I could be wrong haha.

EDIT: I've thought about Valukar a bit more and while he's generally pretty nice, I'm going to RNG for a ninja hood in GS1 to give to Piers which will bring him into range of Valukar's 206 agil after swapping the wild coat for the Elven Shirt. I'm also not going to bother getting an extra set of agil+ items in trial road for Mia. I also want Leda's bracelet from the lemuria fountain for Catasrophe vs DD, but if I don't get that then I don't mind - it's just a nice-to-have item unlike the wild coat.

I don't have the sweeper script, but I do have the coordinate script (kirkq's iirc) and have trawled all of the dungeons for OoB doors manually except magma rock interior. There's a chance I missed stuff, but if there were anything accessible I think I would have found it. There may be some more applications of the save+retreat glitch (similar to skipping the whirlwind puzzles in airs rock) that I haven't thought of/tested though. I didn't test Western Sea thoroughly for retreat on doors after my testing in the Eastern Sea converged with Manocheese's list, so I just used his list.

I think as far as GS2 any% goes it's mostly mapped out, then again all the information I could find on GS1 missed the Hydros skip so I could be wrong haha.

EDIT: I've thought about Valukar a bit more and while he's generally pretty nice, I'm going to RNG for a ninja hood in GS1 to give to Piers which will bring him into range of Valukar's 206 agil after swapping the wild coat for the Elven Shirt. I'm also not going to bother getting an extra set of agil+ items in trial road for Mia. I also want Leda's bracelet from the lemuria fountain for Catasrophe vs DD, but if I don't get that then I don't mind - it's just a nice-to-have item unlike the wild coat.

TheOthin

2013-02-09 10:40:52 am

GS2 has a lot of vague points, from what I understand. I tried plotting a route a while ago and found myself with a lot of uncertainty between options.

One of the big ones I'm curious about is Gaia Rock. It's possible to skip straight to the Serpent, but it seems to require going rather out of your way for stuff in preparation for the ridiculous boss fight. I'm not sure exactly what would be best to get, if the timing even turns out to be worth it. Of course, this is only consequential in segmented; any RTA would never want to bother.

Plexa

2013-02-09 03:35:47 pm

I think for Serpent you're either going to go for no lights, 2 lights or all lights. No lights obviously because its fastest if you can do it, 2 lights because the first two are right next to each other and I'm reasonably sure that a 2 light fight is quicker than a 1 light fight and all lights because I *think* that the last light speeds up the fight more than the time lost getting the light. Currently I do all lights because
- It's RTA
- I have to get the dancing idol for 100% (to get the djinn)
- I can't RNG for the spirit ring
I did take a long hard read of all your work on the serpent thought Smiley

it was rather interesting.

In a 100% there are a lot of options like when do you get Ether? Healing PP is so amazingly useful throughout the run and having access to Thor for many fights is super useful. However, it costs roughly 2 minutes to get from garoh to Madra even with avoid. Should I do gaia rock > aqua rock so I can get the djinn at Apoji rather than getting it after teleport? Should I get Ulysses in Izumo after gaia rock? Or when I teleport there for Star Magician? Unless I see some good ideas for improvements on my route above I'll probably just try to hammer out one completed GS2 run, and then start tweaking. It is a very safe route so there should be a lot more time to be saved with risky strats.

I think for Serpent you're either going to go for no lights, 2 lights or all lights. No lights obviously because its fastest if you can do it, 2 lights because the first two are right next to each other and I'm reasonably sure that a 2 light fight is quicker than a 1 light fight and all lights because I *think* that the last light speeds up the fight more than the time lost getting the light. Currently I do all lights because
- It's RTA
- I have to get the dancing idol for 100% (to get the djinn)
- I can't RNG for the spirit ring
I did take a long hard read of all your work on the serpent thought :) it was rather interesting.

In a 100% there are a lot of options like when do you get Ether? Healing PP is so amazingly useful throughout the run and having access to Thor for many fights is super useful. However, it costs roughly 2 minutes to get from garoh to Madra even with avoid. Should I do gaia rock > aqua rock so I can get the djinn at Apoji rather than getting it after teleport? Should I get Ulysses in Izumo after gaia rock? Or when I teleport there for Star Magician? Unless I see some good ideas for improvements on my route above I'll probably just try to hammer out one completed GS2 run, and then start tweaking. It is a very safe route so there should be a lot more time to be saved with risky strats.

FionordeQuester

Edit history:

FionordeQuester: 2013-02-14 05:17:33 pm

2013-02-13 05:42:39 pm

So, do you actually use a password for your G1 + G2 run? If so, which one?

EDIT: This question has already been answered in the second half of his "goal sub 9:20-something" run, where he was chasing a Djinn in Antarctica and when fixing Brigg's ship.

Plexa

Edit history:

Plexa: 2013-02-15 02:43:52 am

2013-02-15 02:31:57 am

So to answer that question, in case anyone else has the same one, I use a gold password via 'link cable' (i.e. VBA link lo). Looking it up, it looks like to get a 100% file you need to transfer using at least a Gold password so that you can obtain the Force Orb to get Shine in Contigo. A cable transfer is slightly better than gold as it will transfer over the menu stats - in my case the purple background and text going at max speed from the start. The max speed is nice to get through the first cutscene quicker.

My run today came in at 9:24:18 (in game 8:24). Still a lot of obvious mistakes but enough to make it a challenge to beat for another person! I won't be able to make attempts for a while, so this will do .... for now! That means my combined time is 4:37:54 + 9:24:18 which by my count is 14:02:12 combined (4:16+8:24 = 12:40 in game).

I'm looking forward to seeing more people run this amazing game! Maybe someone will find this category interesting and run it as well Smiley

feel free to contact me via pm here or on teamliquid if you want to talk about it. Of course I'll have my eye on this thread as well. Always happy to talk!

So to answer that question, in case anyone else has the same one, I use a gold password via 'link cable' (i.e. VBA link lo). Looking it up, it looks like to get a 100% file you need to transfer using at least a Gold password so that you can obtain the Force Orb to get Shine in Contigo. A cable transfer is slightly better than gold as it will transfer over the menu stats - in my case the purple background and text going at max speed from the start. The max speed is nice to get through the first cutscene quicker.

My run today came in at 9:24:18 (in game 8:24). Still a lot of obvious mistakes but enough to make it a challenge to beat for another person! I won't be able to make attempts for a while, so this will do .... for now! That means my combined time is 4:37:54 + 9:24:18 which by my count is 14:02:12 combined (4:16+8:24 = 12:40 in game).

I'm looking forward to seeing more people run this amazing game! Maybe someone will find this category interesting and run it as well :) feel free to contact me via pm here or on teamliquid if you want to talk about it. Of course I'll have my eye on this thread as well. Always happy to talk!

FionordeQuester

Edit history:

FionordeQuester: 2013-02-15 12:28:35 pm

FionordeQuester: 2013-02-15 12:27:20 pm

2013-02-15 12:27:04 pm

Actually, according to the Forums Faq on Gamefaqs, only the Bronze password is needed, though I'm going on a glitchless run with the route you recommended anyways, so we'll see who's right soon! If I'm right, than it means only the Bronze Password is needed, as Isaac's party is obsolete no matter what password you use.