Final Fantasy V - Complete and posted!

2005-11-04 11:15:41 am

Glowy eyes of DOOM!

Hm, it looks like I won't have time to record this anytime soon. Maybe over winter break at the soonest. But thanks again to everyone for their suggestions. Genji, Mkt2015, or anyone else, if you want to take over I wouldn't be offended. I think that a good route for world 1 has already been outlined in this thread, and for world 2 you basically just follow my original route except no shield dragon, no carbunkle, and use L2 old when appropriate; this leaves almost no sidetracking whatsoever. World 3 and the preparation for it still needs to be figured out a little, but not a huge problem. I would help discuss ideas for world 3, but like I said, no recording for a while.

Anyways, have fun y'all.

Aresake

2005-12-08 03:38:04 am

Glowy eyes of DOOM!

I'm back!

For those of you that remember about a month ago when I started this thread, I was quoting a time of 4:14:00 or so for this game. A number of you gave me some very good suggestions (Genji in particular, but thanks to all of you), and I came up with a couple more optimizations of my own, so I tested the run again and now the time is looking more like 3:40:00, which is quite a vast improvement.

So mostly, I'm just letting folks know that the run isn't dead, it's just proceeding very slowly due to my other responsibilities. At this point I personally think it's good enough and tricksy enough that it would be a shame not to record it, so really am planning to do that over winter break, i.e. before the end of the year.

I'll just give you an update on the changes that saved me the most time:

Siren + Galura: Goblinpunch owns them extremely quickly, and not only that, it's easier to pull off than my previous strategy was.

Cannons: Thunder scrolls are indeed the best way to go here. This saved a lot of time from those battles [i]and[\i] eliminated the need to gain a couple levels.

L2 old: A huge timesaver against numerous bosses. I can charm + wall a magic dragon in Exdeath's castle in order to learn it without too much trouble. The followup L5 doom requires precise timing, but now I can pull it off pretty consistently.

Carbunkle esper: No longer need to get it. Its main purpose was to amplify my fire3 damage, but now I no longer do this. I ended my longstanding prejudice against physical classes, realized that fire3 Magic Sword and direct sword damage work very well against Apanda and Halicarnassos, respectively, when used in combination with dblgrip, kiss of blessing, and sampson power.

Golem esper: Believe it or not, this can be skipped too! With the new strategry, there very few points in the game where I absolutely need extra protection from physical attacks, so I use the knight lockout (i.e. critical health + cover + guard) instead.

Neo Exdeath: I still think skipping him is pretty lame, but I'm not quite as adamant about it as I may have been before. What I think I'll probably do is submit two versions of the final segment; one that uses the kiss of blessing glitch and one that doesn't. This would be almost exactly analogous to the two versions of the Super Metroid any% run posted on this site (murder beam or not), so I hope Radix would be okay with it. The only issue is that I now use giltoss against neo, so if I skip him I'll have been unnecessarily collecting the required money in previous segments. This just amounts to opening a couple extra chests along the way and going into a village in world 3 to sell some stuff, but it may add up to almost a minute altogether. Perhaps I could do two versions of the last 3-4 segments, not just the last one.

Speaking of which, I sincerely hope that my run could get accepted sometime in the next couple months. I'm aware that Radix is currently restricting submissions to games that he's played before. Like the other people on this site, I'm very sympathetic to his rationale for doing so. I just have no way of knowing whether he's played FFV or not. . .

So, that's the update for now.

I'm back!

For those of you that remember about a month ago when I started this thread, I was quoting a time of 4:14:00 or so for this game.  A number of you gave me some very good suggestions (Genji in particular, but thanks to all of you), and I came up with a couple more optimizations of my own, so I tested the run again and now the time is looking more like 3:40:00, which is quite a vast improvement.

So mostly, I'm just letting folks know that the run isn't dead, it's just proceeding very slowly due to my other responsibilities.  At this point I personally think it's good enough and tricksy enough that it would be a shame not to record it, so really am planning to do that over winter break, i.e. before the end of the year.

I'll just give you an update on the changes that saved me the most time:

Siren + Galura: Goblinpunch owns them extremely quickly, and not only that, it's [i]easier[/i] to pull off than my previous strategy was.

Cannons: Thunder scrolls are indeed the best way to go here.  This saved a lot of time from those battles [i]and[\i] eliminated the need to gain a couple levels.

L2 old: A huge timesaver against numerous bosses.  I can charm + wall a magic dragon in Exdeath's castle in order to learn it without too much trouble.  The followup L5 doom requires precise timing, but now I can pull it off pretty consistently.

Carbunkle esper: No longer need to get it.  Its main purpose was to amplify my fire3 damage, but now I no longer do this.  I ended my longstanding prejudice against physical classes, realized that fire3 Magic Sword and direct sword damage work very well against Apanda and Halicarnassos, respectively, when used in combination with dblgrip, kiss of blessing, and sampson power.

Golem esper: Believe it or not, this can be skipped too!  With the new strategry, there very few points in the game where I absolutely need extra protection from physical attacks, so I use the knight lockout (i.e. critical health + cover + guard) instead.

Neo Exdeath: I still think skipping him is pretty lame, but I'm not quite as adamant about it as I may have been before.  What I think I'll probably do is submit two versions of the final segment; one that uses the kiss of blessing glitch and one that doesn't.  This would be almost exactly analogous to the two versions of the Super Metroid any% run posted on this site (murder beam or not), so I hope Radix would be okay with it.  The only issue is that I now use giltoss against neo, so if I skip him I'll have been unnecessarily collecting the required money in previous segments.  This just amounts to opening a couple extra chests along the way and going into a village in world 3 to sell some stuff, but it may add up to almost a minute altogether.  Perhaps I could do two versions of the last 3-4 segments, not just the last one.

Speaking of which, I sincerely hope that my run could get accepted sometime in the next couple months.  I'm aware that Radix is currently restricting submissions to games that he's played before.  Like the other people on this site, I'm very sympathetic to his rationale for doing so.  I just have no way of knowing whether he's played FFV or not. . .

So, that's the update for now.

Mkt2015

2005-12-08 07:07:14 am

MGS for PS1 forever.

If I have to I will do all of the html work for FF V.

Aresake

2005-12-08 11:36:24 am

Glowy eyes of DOOM!

Thanks, that's a very nice offer. But, somebody would need to verify it too.

Lag.Com

2005-12-08 01:07:04 pm

sda loyalist

I've played this game pretty fanatically in the past, I'd do it. Got some interesting strategies there, I'm looking forward to this run. Smiley

Genji

2005-12-08 04:44:30 pm

Blue Mages will rule this world =)

Good to know that you haven't abandonned your run.

Just ~delay~ -)

Aresake

2005-12-08 06:15:27 pm

Glowy eyes of DOOM!

Hey, wow, thanks again! Who would have thought a n00b like me would get so many kind offers from you folks.
I feel so. . . loved Roll Eyes

Nikuvilin

2005-12-08 07:18:29 pm

DMC3,ZOE2 and Xenosaga 2.  Am I crazy?

These boards are quite noob friendly. Good luck on your run! So far looks pretty good!

Bp_

2005-12-08 07:20:14 pm

Quote:

These boards are quite noob friendly. Good luck on your run! So far looks pretty good!

as much as they do something Cheesy

yeah go for it, final fantasy is one of the best series ever !

Aresake

2005-12-29 02:23:03 am

Glowy eyes of DOOM!

I finally got my Playstation and FF anthology in the mail today! It took awhile because of some issues with PayPal. . . that's a long story that need not be recounted here. Anyway, everything is working properly and I've already recorded the first three segments! There will probably be around 25 in all.

A couple differences from the emulator version I did my testing on: first, it takes a couple seconds longer to get into and out of battles, which will add some minutes overall. On the other hand, it is now possible to dash at 2x speed without the dash ability, and with you go 4x! This is sort of a mixed blessing because I was planning to run an RPG, not a racing game! It's quite hard to control our heroes with precision at this ridiculous velocity, and I don't have quite the skill of some of the 2D gamers on this site. As a result the run will probably be full of minor movement mistakes which won't add up to very much time, but will still look somewhat embarrassing. Maybe it will motivate people to challenge my time!

Anyways, wish me luck.

I finally got my Playstation and FF anthology in the mail today!  It took awhile because of some issues with PayPal. . . that's a long story that need not be recounted here.  Anyway, everything is working properly and I've already recorded the first three segments!  There will probably be around 25 in all.

A couple differences from the emulator version I did my testing on: first, it takes a couple seconds longer to get into and out of battles, which will add some minutes overall.  On the other hand, it is now possible to dash at 2x speed without the dash ability, and with you go 4x!  This is sort of a mixed blessing because I was planning to run an RPG, not a racing game!  It's quite hard to control our heroes with precision at this ridiculous velocity, and I don't have quite the skill of some of the 2D gamers on this site.  As a result the run will probably be full of minor movement mistakes which won't add up to very much time, but will still look somewhat embarrassing.  Maybe it will motivate people to challenge my time!

Anyways, wish me luck.

darkwasabi

2005-12-29 06:14:27 am

King of hearts

Yay! My favorite of the 2D Final Fantasys (or ies? It's a title so...). Don't think I can give any advice that isn't obvious, so good luck!

Bp_

2005-12-29 03:38:38 pm

I wish you luck Smiley

this is the best ff game and i cant wait to see it
pretty nice to ear that you already got some segment done !!
Grin

Enhasa

2005-12-31 05:17:31 am

everybody wanna tell you the meaning of music

Hey aresake, glad to see you're back on this, since you look like somebody who actually knows what he's doing. Oh, and the ridiculous turbo speeds are actually the best part of the FF PS1 rereleases. Wink

Just wanted to make sure, since Boco never actually completed her TAS, you should find out exactly what she would have done differently since it was only a WIP. You could ask her on bisqwit's. I would tell you myself, but that thread was an awful long time ago, so I don't remember.

Aresake

2006-01-03 12:22:18 pm

Glowy eyes of DOOM!

Quote:

Just wanted to make sure, since Boco never actually completed her TAS, you should find out exactly what she would have done differently

Well, it's a little late to change anything at this point; I'm done recording everything except the last few segments. besides, it appears from the forums that Boco actually had a life and elected not to finish planning her run. I'm glad that I learned of her World 1 run from this forum, because I was able to incorporate the goblinpunch trick that I never would have thought of.

Let's just say. . . I may not be a speedrunning expert, but at this point there probably aren't very many people who have spent more hours poring over the FFV's boss data and calculating ABP in a spreadsheet than I have. I even tried to find sequence breaks using the warp spell a la FFIV, and there turned out to be two places where I don't think the programmers intended the results, but sadly neither of them helped me. If I'm missing any major strategy that could improve the time, then so be it. I've done the best I can do, and I'll leave it to future runners to try and beat me.

By the way, I may actually finish recording tomorrow! But the last segment could be a b****, so don't hold me to that.

[quote]
Just wanted to make sure, since Boco never actually completed her TAS, you should find out exactly what she would have done differently[/quote]

Well, it's a little late to change anything at this point; I'm done recording everything except the last few segments.  besides, it appears from the forums that Boco actually had a life and elected not to finish planning her run.  I'm glad that I learned of her World 1 run from this forum, because I was able to incorporate the goblinpunch trick that I never would have thought of.

Let's just say. . . I may not be a speedrunning expert, but at this point there probably aren't very many people who have spent more hours poring over the FFV's boss data and calculating ABP in a spreadsheet than I have.  I even tried to find sequence breaks using the warp spell a la FFIV, and there turned out to be two places where I don't think the programmers intended the results, but sadly neither of them helped me.  If I'm missing any major strategy that could improve the time, then so be it.  I've done the best I can do, and I'll leave it to future runners to try and beat me.

By the way, I may actually finish recording tomorrow!  But the last segment could be a b****, so don't hold me to that.

Mkt2015

2006-01-03 12:57:24 pm

MGS for PS1 forever.

Like I said before, her TAS should be used only as a guide and not the law since a speedrunner doesn't have the luxury of save states.

Aresake

2006-01-05 12:21:18 pm

Glowy eyes of DOOM!

Oh sweet victory! I finished my first speedrun! Smiley

Pretty well blew my old time out of the water, too. By my estimation, the total time is 3:26. You can see the timer in the menu screen change to 3:22 moments before I enter the final battle, which lasts about four minutes by my count.

And by some bizarre coincidence, my final save time is 3:13 -- Exactly the same time that Genji reported when he did his run. (Although mine was the Apocalypse save and he had Necrofobia). That's right, the very same time I openly scoffed at in this forum. My apologies once again for that Genji. Ah, you gotta love the irony of it Wink

Anyways, I'm very happy about the final time and the run itself. Since it's a segmented run I didn't keep any major mistakes or mishaps, although there are very many minor ones -- mostly party steering and little menu bloopers. As for strategic improvements, I can already think of three or four things I'd do a little differently if I were to record it again. Still, adding together all the improvements I can think of, I'd be lucky to shave off even five minutes.

Thanks again for everybody's support! I wouldn't have done it with out you and it would have been much worse anyway.

Lag.Com -- if you're still interested in verifying, send me an email and we'll get to business. (My email is on my profile)

Oh sweet victory!  I finished my first speedrun!   :) :D ;D

Pretty well blew my old time out of the water, too.  By my estimation, the total time is 3:26.  You can see the timer in the menu screen change to 3:22 moments before I enter the final battle, which lasts about four minutes by my count.

And by some bizarre coincidence, my final save time is 3:13 -- Exactly the same time that Genji reported when he did his run.  (Although mine was the Apocalypse save and he had Necrofobia).  That's right, the very same time I openly scoffed at in this forum.  My apologies once again for that Genji.  Ah, you gotta love the irony of it ;)

Anyways, I'm very happy about the final time and the run itself.  Since it's a segmented run I didn't keep any major mistakes or mishaps, although there are very many minor ones -- mostly party steering and little menu bloopers.  As for strategic improvements, I can already think of three or four things I'd do a little differently if I were to record it again.  Still, adding together all the improvements I can think of, I'd be lucky to shave off even five minutes.

Thanks again for everybody's support!  I wouldn't have done it with out you and it would have been much worse anyway.

Lag.Com -- if you're still interested in verifying, send me an email and we'll get to business.  (My email is on my profile)

getter77

2006-01-05 02:02:18 pm

100% runs=great to watch

Awesome congrats on the run of the BEST old school FF game! That's right I said it....:flees into the sunset:

Mkt2015

2006-01-05 02:30:38 pm

MGS for PS1 forever.

Looking forward to watching it. And yes, it is the best old school FF game.

Bp_

2006-01-05 04:42:15 pm

Quote:

Looking forward to watching it. And yes, it is the best old school FF game.

nothing to add all there Grin

wassupnext

2006-01-05 05:41:01 pm

SDA fan

YAY. Another Pop-Corn/Beer cinema time !

darkwasabi

2006-01-05 09:58:56 pm

King of hearts

Kita!

Aresake

2006-01-05 10:09:00 pm

Glowy eyes of DOOM!

Quote:

Kita!

Wha?

Enhasa

2006-01-05 10:57:07 pm

everybody wanna tell you the meaning of music

This is too awesome! Me (FF4) and Peter (FF6) welcome you to the club! Smiley

We can exchange war stories of how aggravating it was to redo all those segments and all that time spent looking at numbers.

Oh, Dragondarch (MQ) too. I guess. Wink

Pweisger

2006-01-06 07:00:27 am

PwNzRd!

And darkwasabi can join you after re-doing his FF8 run. Man, a lot of these have been coming out as of late. Great job!

Genji

2006-01-06 07:22:02 am

Blue Mages will rule this world =)

Congrats