FF7 Run [locked]

2005-04-29 09:44:20 pm

I'm indifferent towards YaBB 1G - SP1!

Saving/Reloading would minimize game time certainly, but since the speedrun will be measured by actual time, will it still minimize that? As I said, my guess would be "no", because you can usually escape quickly from battles, and from what I remember the loading is rather slow, however, this needs to be tested.

Mr._Haggis

2005-04-29 09:56:52 pm

I love YaBB 1G - SP1!

Well, I'll clarify something. The battles aren't as random as one might think but there are still "random" integers involved in the stepping process before an encounter occurs. A number between say 0-20 (though could be different numbers depending on materia and location etc) will be picked after every battle for battle fields and that is the countdown timer for your steps until the next battle. Some terrains might affect the timer to count down faster.

I have not done a CD trick to avoid the battles. Although I think it is possible I did not do this. Basically it seems the countdown is set each time you enter a field that you can have battles on via "random encounter" it isn't carried onto the next screen. As a result if you step wiseley or not complete some steps during your running/walking, you can avoid encounters a lot more often. I did on one occasion only get 1 battle going down the reactor and if you need some reassurance I have a recording of only getting 2 on the way down to help you feel it is possible.

Well, I'll clarify something. The battles aren't as random as one might think but there are still "random" integers involved in the stepping process before an encounter occurs. A number between say 0-20 (though could be different numbers depending on materia and location etc) will be picked after every battle for battle fields and that is the countdown timer for your steps until the next battle. Some terrains might affect the timer to count down faster.

I have not done a CD trick to avoid the battles. Although I think it is possible I did not do this. Basically it seems the countdown is set each time you enter a field that you can have battles on via "random encounter" it isn't carried onto the next screen. As a result if you step wiseley or not complete some steps during your running/walking, you can avoid encounters a lot more often. I did on one occasion only get 1 battle going down the reactor and if you need some reassurance I have a recording of only getting 2 on the way down to help you feel it is possible.

saxman52

2005-04-29 10:02:03 pm

I was under the impression that the speed runs, if possible, were timed according to the in-game clock. Yes, saving/reloading would minimize the actual game clock time, but the vid would be exceptionally longer.

Since NTG brings up the real-time factor I've just realized that the actual vid time would definitely go beyond the 7 hour limit, unless save/loads are cut out, i.e. the Half-Life 2 run. This means an unecessary amount of segments, though.

This is something to consider before a run is submitted. Perhaps the style of our runs needs to change.

Mr._Haggis

2005-04-29 10:09:08 pm

I love YaBB 1G - SP1!

PS. I'm leaving to go to Portugal for a while now. Anyone wanting proof will have to wait :(. All I'm saying is it isn't impossible. Just dont expect to do it in one go. It's not like all these speedruns were done simply by some guy going "Okay, I'm going to pick up the pad and turn the console on and do this all perfect first time after not playing the game in months."

THanks again and all the best for whoever else is attempting the runs. For the person who allegedly got a similar time to me, I want to know how they got a time of under 2hrs leaving midgar if they didn't use my "try again if you get too many encounters"approach. They obviously know something I dont!

NTG

2005-04-29 10:18:12 pm

I'm indifferent towards YaBB 1G - SP1!

Quote:

I was under the impression that the speed runs, if possible, were timed according to the in-game clock. Yes, saving/reloading would minimize the actual game clock time, but the vid would be exceptionally longer.

Since NTG brings up the real-time factor I've just realized that the actual vid time would definitely go beyond the 7 hour limit, unless save/loads are cut out, i.e. the Half-Life 2 run. This means an unecessary amount of segments, though.

This is something to consider before a run is submitted. Perhaps the style of our runs needs to change.

In-game time is used if it is displayed at the end of the game, otherwise it is all timed I believe (I also thought saves/loads were only cut out on PC versions to prevent the system affecting the time, not too sure about that though).
The real time "issue" means that since my system is PAL, any run recorded by me will be approximately 1.2x longer in real time than an equivalent NTSC run. This would make a PAL run massively over the 7 hour limit, and is why I'm not recording a run right now (that, and I still have GTASA to finish :o).

[quote]I was under the impression that the speed runs, if possible, were timed according to the in-game clock. Yes, saving/reloading would minimize the actual game clock time, but the vid would be exceptionally longer.

Since NTG brings up the real-time factor I've just realized that the [i]actual vid time[/i] would definitely go beyond the 7 hour limit, unless save/loads are cut out, i.e. the Half-Life 2 run. This means an unecessary amount of segments, though.

This is something to consider before a run is submitted. Perhaps the style of our runs needs to change.[/quote]

In-game time is used if it is displayed at the end of the game, otherwise it is all timed I believe (I also thought saves/loads were only cut out on PC versions to prevent the system affecting the time, not too sure about that though). 
The real time "issue" means that since my system is PAL, any run recorded by me will be approximately 1.2x longer in real time than an equivalent NTSC run. This would make a PAL run massively over the 7 hour limit, and is why I'm not recording a run right now (that, and I still have GTASA to finish  :o).

saxman52

2005-04-29 11:12:32 pm

Good point about the PC save/load cuts. I think you're right about those.

I don't see how the real time of a vid would change based on whether the game is PAL or NTSC. I understand how the game clock would be affected. The NTSC and PAL versions both run at the same speed, only the in-game clock is different. You could play the exact same FF7 game on PAL and NTSC and the real time would still be the same.

NTG

2005-04-29 11:21:55 pm

I'm indifferent towards YaBB 1G - SP1!

Quote:

Good point about the PC save/load cuts. I think you're right about those.

I don't see how the real time of a vid would change based on whether the game is PAL or NTSC. I understand how the game clock would be affected. The NTSC and PAL versions both run at the same speed, only the in-game clock is different. You could play the exact same FF7 game on PAL and NTSC and the real time would still be the same.

What happens with FF7 is that the in-game clock isn't affected, because the clock and the game both run slower on PAL. I'm getting this info from the Speed FAQ:

Quote:

Because of the frequenze differences, the PAL
version is 1,2 times slower than the NTSC version. At first we didn't think
this was such a big deal. Alright, so the PAL version is 1,2 times slower. It
only means that PAL gamers spend more time playing than NTSC gamers, but there
is no way you can tell from looking at the clock in the game.

saxman52

2005-04-29 11:50:50 pm

Ahhhh, I see. The PAL version must be most strange to play, going slower and all.

Kodek

2005-05-08 08:41:18 am

I was thinking of doing a PC run so I fired up my old FF7 discs. It's been a really long time since I last played so I was inevitably welcomed by loads of patching and troubleshooting on different forums about issues with using a non-nvidia card and most of all, WinXP.

However against all odds I got FF7 to finally work and started playing. After the Shinra HQ I noticed a bug that isn't only annoying but would *gasp* also affect the speedrun results. The motorcycle mini-game runs at approx. 5-6 times faster than it should. It's probably not manually slowed down (i.e. fps capped) so it runs as fast as it can on any given system. Anyone whose tried to play really old games on a new system is familiar with this issue, although it's somewhat rare.

I was wondering if anyone familiar with this has come up with a solution.

DLH112

2005-05-08 12:55:58 pm

I think thats why everyone is using the playstation version.

saxman52

2005-05-08 05:03:08 pm

Also, on the PC version the clock is slower or something. Either way, no matter what the times on the PC version are going to be faster than the Playstation ones. The guy talks more about this in the Speed FAQ. There is a whole other set of times for the PC version that you can compare yours to.

Also, the guy who got those times for the PC might have his e-mail on the FAQ, so you might be able to discuss the motorcycle glitch.

NTG

2005-05-08 07:17:46 pm

I'm indifferent towards YaBB 1G - SP1!

Yeh, I believe the FAQ implies that times differ between every single PC, so this game would probably be untrackable:

Quote:

Lolo told me that 10 minutes on his game clock was actually 10:13. He's using
an Athlon 2200 (1,8 GHz, he thinks) and he's got 512 DDR RAM. I have a P4 2,66
GHz with 512 DDR RAM as well, and 10 minutes on my clock was 10:12,0 exactly.

Zen

2005-05-08 08:43:58 pm

Forward standard-by-ten .

I remember the motorcycle bit being too fast as a general rule. I used software rendering.