Fan Made Games

Edit history:

TSA: 2005-08-30 08:09:39 pm

2005-08-30 07:49:46 pm

Retired

Without getting into too much detail, you can find the discussion about this here:

http://www.zeldauniverse.net/forums/showthread.php?goto=newpost&t=30315

Basically this guy a few years ago began a 2D project of Ocarina of Time. He got into magazines by showing off mockups and had a really bad demo that showed off nothing any 12 year old couldn't make.

Then he began promising all this stuff, and it never happened. He also stole a lot of stuff from other sites in order to do his "work', and basically was run out of his own community.

He's back now, and says he's coding this game from scratch. Quite frankly, my opinion is that Ocarina of Time is a 3D game, it's meant to be in 3D, and you can't translate Ocarina of Time into 2D. I told him he should use his talents for an original Zelda game, or perhaps his own franchise. The guy is 27 and has a kid, so I really don't like ragging on him, but I can't tell if he's doing this for the love of the game, or for popularity. Even if it is for the love of the game, I really don't get why he's remaking OoT 2D - he said his reason is to "bridge the gap between OoT and ALttP fans from the rift created by the jump from 2D to 3D". That doesn't make sense...there was no rift formed from that.

Anyway, there is no denying he appears to be doing a lot of work, but it's like he has to go out of his way to make it a big deal. He starts a thread on one of the biggest Zelda sites when one existed, and asked the mods to lock up the other just cuz he said so. He brags about being featured in magazines, and he is still in denial that Yahoo! was pressured to remove his site by Nintendo during their raid on fan games.

I'm just wondering what you all think about fan made games. I personally like them as long as they are not remakes of existing games. I abhorred CT Ressurection because it was a straight remake, even though it looked brilliant. Same with OoT 2D. I prefer original stuff.

Now, something like the Zelda OoT Mod for Halo is something different. That's turning Halo into Zelda, which is supremely impressive and it's a different take. I ultimately hope it turns into something more, with expanded areas made to give fans more than OoT had.

Maybe it's the fact Ocarina of Time is just so overdone...it's annoying to see it remade. Plus, he has this mock-up box art for GBA he thinks would be cool.

Ugh, guess I'm ranting.

Thread title:

Without getting into too much detail, you can find the discussion about this here:

http://www.zeldauniverse.net/forums/showthread.php?goto=newpost&t=30315

Basically this guy a few years ago began a 2D project of Ocarina of Time.  He got into magazines by showing off mockups and had a really bad demo that showed off nothing any 12 year old couldn't make.

Then he began promising all this stuff, and it never happened.  He also stole a lot of stuff from other sites in order to do his "work', and basically was run out of his own community.

He's back now, and says he's coding this game from scratch.  Quite frankly, my opinion is that Ocarina of Time is a 3D game, it's meant to be in 3D, and you can't translate Ocarina of Time into 2D.  I told him he should use his talents for an original Zelda game, or perhaps his own franchise.  The guy is 27 and has a kid, so I really don't like ragging on him, but I can't tell if he's doing this for the love of the game, or for popularity.  Even if it is for the love of the game, I really don't get why he's remaking OoT 2D - he said his reason is to "bridge the gap between OoT and ALttP fans from the rift created by the jump from 2D to 3D".  That doesn't make sense...there was no rift formed from that.

Anyway, there is no denying he appears to be doing a lot of work, but it's like he has to go out of his way to make it a big deal.  He starts a thread on one of the biggest Zelda sites when one existed, and asked the mods to lock up the other just cuz he said so.  He brags about being featured in magazines, and he is still in denial that Yahoo! was pressured to remove his site by Nintendo during their raid on fan games.

I'm just wondering what you all think about fan made games.  I personally like them as long as they are not remakes of existing games.  I abhorred CT Ressurection because it was a straight remake, even though it looked brilliant.  Same with OoT 2D.  I prefer original stuff.

Now, something like the Zelda OoT Mod for Halo is something different.  That's turning Halo into Zelda, which is supremely impressive and it's a different take.  I ultimately hope it turns into something more, with expanded areas made to give fans more than OoT had.

Maybe it's the fact Ocarina of Time is just so overdone...it's annoying to see it remade.  Plus, he has this mock-up box art for GBA he thinks would be cool.

Ugh, guess I'm ranting.

Emptyeye

2005-08-30 08:02:10 pm

Talk to the Hand

Regarding this one in particular, I'm of the opinion that "OoT 2D" already exists, and it's called "The Legend of Zelda: A Link to the Past".

Yeah, naturally all the Zelda games will have some similarities to one another, but ALttP and OoT are more similar than any others--start in "light world", collect 3 of a given item to get the Master Sword, move to "dark world" and collect some more of a given item (In temples that, if I understand what you wrote in another thread correctly, have the same names in both games in the Japanese versions), go to Ganon's Tower and finish him off.

But that's really another discussion entirely.

As for fan made games in general, I don't mind them particularly. I do find that the energy strictly may be better served in producing an entirely original game, but then you don't have that instant audience of a familiar series. Of course, if you choose to make a fan game, you should be aware of all the trademark law that goes with it, and not complain if Big Company Whose Characters You "Borrowed" goes trying to shut you down, regardless of what you think about said law.

Did I actually say anything of consequence there?

Regarding this one in particular, I'm of the opinion that "OoT 2D" already exists, and it's called "The Legend of Zelda: A Link to the Past".

Yeah, naturally all the Zelda games will have some similarities to one another, but ALttP and OoT are more similar than any others--start in "light world", collect 3 of a given item to get the Master Sword, move to "dark world" and collect some more of a given item (In temples that, if I understand what you wrote in another thread correctly, have the same names in both games in the Japanese versions), go to Ganon's Tower and finish him off.

But that's really another discussion entirely.

As for fan made games in general, I don't mind them particularly. I do find that the energy strictly may be better served in producing an entirely original game, but then you don't have that instant audience of a familiar series. Of course, if you choose to make a fan game, you should be aware of all the trademark law that goes with it, and not complain if Big Company Whose Characters You "Borrowed" goes trying to shut you down, regardless of what you think about said law.

Did I actually say anything of consequence there?

Psychochild

2005-08-30 08:28:22 pm

I have no problem with games that go and make a game based on a franchise that they enjoy, which features similar gameplay and sorts, as long as there's a bit of originality in them. I wouldn't mind a 2-D Mario game with level themes inspired by Super Mario 64, in fact, that could be pretty cool. But when you're just doing what this guy is doing, taking a great game like this, and just... making a 2-D copy of it... meh. I can't get excited about it.

And that Link there is awesome. Like the sig.

marshmallow

2005-08-30 08:29:11 pm

Jack of all Trades

I think it would be interesting to see what he would have to sacrifice to make it workable. I think the toughest area to make a faithful copy would be the Water Temple...other than that, it seems very doable.

Now he just needs to make it, y'know, fun.

Kibbo

2005-08-30 08:34:48 pm

TIOLET!

I've seen this happening before, a 3D game re-made in a 2D package (for those interested we are talking about the HL-mod counter-strike). And what came out of it definetely didn't look good or was fun to play. When done with the right games in the right way it might just as well end up as a good project, but so far I have seen none.

StrangenessDSS

2005-08-30 09:01:18 pm

Sleeping Terror

Is it possible to remake a 3D game in 2D, and end up with a good game? Yes.

Does this guy have anywhere near enough talent to complete such a task? No.

KennyMan666

2005-08-30 10:09:42 pm

Precursor

Fan games:

Some suck, some are playable, some rock.

soteos

2005-08-30 10:46:49 pm

Eh, some flash games by fans are fun. The ones that don't try to be more than minigames.

Hitaro

2005-08-31 01:52:39 am

Most of the fan games I just don't really care about. There's alwats those crappy games, there's alwayts those good games, and there's some you want to play just for the heck of it (Lampshade of no Real Significance, anyone? :P).

tmont

2005-08-31 04:05:02 am

Not going to school today

I'd kind of like to see OoT made into a 2D game, mainly because I hate 3D video games. However, I think the "integrity" or whatever of the original game programmers should be preserved, in that I don't think jackasses like us should be fiddling around with professional programmers' games to make them "better." I think games should be left alone. Unless, of course, they suck. I think it would be cool if someone made another 2D Zelda game, but not identical to another one (like OoT, for example). That's like making a lame sequel. In my opinion.

spineshark

2005-08-31 04:33:12 am

新世紀進歩的羽扇子音楽

Quote:

I'd kind of like to see OoT made into a 2D game, mainly because I hate 3D video games. However, I think the "integrity" or whatever of the original game programmers should be preserved, in that I don't think jackasses like us should be fiddling around with professional programmers' games to make them "better." I think games should be left alone. Unless, of course, they suck. I think it would be cool if someone made another 2D Zelda game, but not identical to another one (like OoT, for example). That's like making a lame sequel. In my opinion.

Upgrading or downgrading dimensions in video games for fan games is pretty crummy in my opinion on many levels. Aside from design differences (wall-climbing in OoT, or horizontal vs. vertical platforms in Metroid Prime as compared to Super Metroid) there's still the fact that the fan game is based around a lack of creativity. Sure, transmuting the water temple down to 2D will take some cleverness, but level design and puzzles will likely be nearly identical. That's lame (I may look at it just to see how they messed with Volvagia and Bongo Bongo though...).

Pretentious fan games are almost as bad as pretentious 'official' games.

[quote]I'd kind of like to see OoT made into a 2D game, mainly because I hate 3D video games.  However, I think the "integrity" or whatever of the original game programmers should be preserved, in that I don't think jackasses like us should be fiddling around with professional programmers' games to make them "better."  I think games should be left alone.  Unless, of course, they suck.  I think it would be cool if someone made another 2D Zelda game, but not identical to another one (like OoT, for example).  That's like making a lame sequel.  In my opinion.[/quote]
Upgrading or downgrading dimensions in video games for fan games is pretty crummy in my opinion on many levels.  Aside from design differences (wall-climbing in OoT, or horizontal vs. vertical platforms in Metroid Prime as compared to Super Metroid) there's still the fact that the fan game is based around a lack of creativity.  Sure, transmuting the water temple down to 2D will take some cleverness, but level design and puzzles will likely be nearly identical.  That's lame (I may look at it just to see how they messed with Volvagia and Bongo Bongo though...).

Pretentious fan games are almost as bad as pretentious 'official' games.

Blublu

2005-08-31 05:59:15 pm

...

I don't usually like fan games because they're usually just lame copies of the official one. Even if the graphics are identical (ripped), the physics are usually completely wrong and the level design is usually craptastic.

The only exception I know of is called "Mario XP", which is some weird sort of Mario/Castlevania hybrid.

Gorash

Edit history:

Gorash: 2005-08-31 06:15:19 pm

2005-08-31 06:14:36 pm

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Well there are 3 categories:

Fan-made mini games rock. Some of the best games I know are done by a single person and most of them are nothing more than a recreation of an established principle. Examples are the Touhou games, [url=bisqwit.iki.fi/jsgames/peterbox/]Bisqwit's Sokoban clone[/url] and definitely not least the Bricks client which was written by Radix if I'm not wrong.

When some guy alone starts thinking that's not enough and wants to recreate or rewrite a full price game from scratch you can usually file that under megalomania. If there's an example of someone pulling that, I've missed it, and I think that's really unlikely given the publicity such a feat would yield. As one of our profs put it: "The time where a single programmer could lock himself up for a weekend and would come out with an ingeniuos piece of software afterwards are long over. Get used to it."

The third category is the game made by a fan community not because of the name but because of the game. These games are up to par again if not better. Counterstrike comes into mind. I still think the worlds best game will be a MMORPG written and maintained by a community of open source programmers. This sort of game just cries for several hundred people to put work into it.

Well there are 3 categories:

Fan-made mini games rock. Some of the best games I know are done by a single person and most of them are nothing more than a recreation of an established principle. Examples are the Touhou games, [url=bisqwit.iki.fi/jsgames/peterbox/]Bisqwit's Sokoban clone[/url] and definitely not least the Bricks client which was written by Radix if I'm not wrong.

When some guy alone starts thinking that's not enough and wants to recreate or rewrite a full price game from scratch you can usually file that under megalomania. If there's an example of someone pulling that, I've missed it, and I think that's really unlikely given the publicity such a feat would yield. As one of our profs put it: "The time where a single programmer could lock himself up for a weekend and would come out with an ingeniuos piece of software afterwards are long over. Get used to it."

The third category is the game made by a fan community not because of the name but because of the game. These games are up to par again if not better. Counterstrike comes into mind.  I still think the worlds best game will be a MMORPG written and maintained by a community of open source programmers. This sort of game just cries for several hundred people to put work into it.

Kibbo

2005-08-31 06:16:10 pm

TIOLET!

Now when I search through my memory I remember a fan game (or maybe it's more of a mod) that is actually quite good. It's a re-make of Doom 1 in the Doom 3 engine, almost identical levels and weapon behaviour and all secrets are there and so on, just a lot better graphics.

More info at http://cdoom.d3files.com/index.php

VorpalEdge

2005-08-31 08:18:43 pm

welcome to the machine

Nobody's mentioned any roguelikes yet? :/

www.t-o-m-e.net

Go there, download immediately.

Gorash

2005-08-31 10:50:32 pm

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Went there, although graphics are a poor game judge I prefer something with more than 256 sprites Wink

VorpalEdge

2005-08-31 11:26:44 pm

welcome to the machine

What are these 'sprites' you talk about?

I play in ascii. Tongue

KennyMan666

2005-08-31 11:46:36 pm

Precursor

Roguelikes, eh?

Play Nethack, for great justice.

http://www.nethack.org/

Gorash

Edit history:

Gorash: 2005-09-01 02:04:23 am

2005-09-01 01:30:20 am

${$uid.$user}{' usertext'}

Quote:

What are these 'sprites' you talk about?

I play in ascii. Tongue

Ok, my bad... Make that 128. Wink

KennyMan:
I tried Nethack, but... um... lets say I lack dedication. (And I die in every game from hunger or poisoning before I reach level 4)

Try ProgressQuest, that's much more chilling.

EDIT: Your wish is my command, although adding .com at the end shouldn't have been that hard to figure out Wink

KennyMan666

2005-09-01 01:56:55 am

Precursor

A link would have been nice. Roll Eyes