Dragon Warrior 4 (At the moment, planning)

puwexil

2012-06-28 06:33:03 am

Professional Second Banana

Isn't Hotarubi working on DQIII RTAs now? Thought I heard that somewhere.

chessjerk

Edit history:

chessjerk: 2012-06-29 08:53:38 am

chessjerk: 2012-06-29 08:29:53 am

2012-06-28 08:09:52 am

Wow, my run does not feel nearly as impressive any more. I wonder how much time is saved in the Japanese version just with text speed alone?

EDIT:

Quote from logging_in_is_hard:

http://www.nicovideo.jp/mylist/32138491

Faster FC DQIV RTA, timing measured from power-on to The End was 4:57:49; runner was 全部２ｃｈのせい.

Apparently, the current fastest time is 4:22:01, same timing conventions. I swear that this run was floating around on nicovideo some time ago, but I can't find it anymore.

Is there any way to watch the 4:57:49 RTA? I can't get it to play and Google translate is not helping. Sad

EDIT 2:

Watching the 5:35:31 video, apparently on the Japanese version, using Fairy Water kills Metal Slimes? Or am I not seeing that correctly?

chessjerk

2012-07-04 09:25:30 pm

Well, I guess I waited too long to finish. The ustream links don't work for me anymore.

On this page:

http://www.nicozon.net/watch/sm17908630

Is there a way to watch the video? Or is this just a summary page of some kind with a screenshot?

Hsanrb

2012-07-05 12:06:37 am

Quote from chessjerk:

Well, I guess I waited too long to finish. The ustream links don't work for me anymore.

On this page:

http://www.nicozon.net/watch/sm17908630

Is there a way to watch the video? Or is this just a summary page of some kind with a screenshot?

That page has a link toward the bottom, or log into nico before going to mylist/32138491

niko user

2012-07-05 10:01:46 pm

4:57:49 RTA was conducted by Japanese runner named "mei" on niko.
However, he used emulator on this run. Some of niko users therefore doubted that it was tool-assisted.
Then, they questioned to him at BBS of his community, and revealed that many lies included in his answer.
Finally he closed the community and deleted his record movie from niko (uploaded by himself).

全部２ｃｈのせい is one of niko users who doubted mei. He re-uploaded his run to check detail of it.

So today's niko record of FC DQⅣ is 5:14:48 and by swallow.

niko user

2012-07-05 10:27:13 pm

Dear chessjerk

>Watching the 5:35:31 video, apparently on the Japanese version, using Fairy Water kills Metal Slimes? Or am I not seeing that correctly?

Using Japanese first version ROM of DQ Ⅳ, we can kill metal slime in one turn using Fairy Water (more than 10 damages).
It was some kind of bug, and modified from second version ROM.
In niko, this bug is allowed to use in RTA.
So the time required for level up is much shorter.

chessjerk

2012-07-06 12:10:00 am

Quote from Hsanrb:

That page has a link toward the bottom, or log into nico before going to mylist/32138491

None of the links I clicked on lead to a video, and I can't decipher the page enough to create an account, let alone log in.

And thanks niko user for the info. So the current best RTA time is 5:14:48? Is there a video somewhere I can watch (hopefully in a way this non-Japanese person can see it? Smiley

)

niko user

2012-07-06 12:49:14 am

Dear chessjerk

Top three record is
5:14:48- swallow 5:15:37-waiwai 5:15:45- super rinpei
at now.
However, anyone uploaded their play on niko.
Maybe due to top player "swallow" doesn't satisfied with his record.

If you want only to see the playing plan, I recommend you to use mai's play.
Although he used tool assisted movie, the way to play was similar to other player. (merely too much lucky play)
I'm sorry that I have no idea for the movie site available for non-Japanese person.
I'll ask it in Japanese forum.

Exo

Edit history:

Exo: 2012-07-06 07:27:26 am

Exo: 2012-07-06 02:59:04 am

Exo: 2012-07-06 02:57:30 am

Exo: 2012-07-06 02:10:56 am

Exo: 2012-07-06 02:10:49 am

Exo: 2012-07-06 02:08:41 am

Exo: 2012-07-06 02:05:52 am

Exo: 2012-07-06 01:59:17 am

Exo: 2012-07-06 01:58:06 am

2012-07-06 01:57:05 am

Sandbagging

@chessjerk:
Just make an account on nicovide and watch it from there.

Tutorial on how to register at nicovideo (google is great isnt it):
http://thenextweb.com/2008/01/15/how-to-register-for-japanese-video-site-nico-nico-douga/

Some minor things might have changed in the nico-layout but most of it should be the same.
If not, google-translate usually does the job for figuring out what youre supposed to fill in the form.

Nicolink to part 1 of the 4:57:49 TAS (search for 版ドラゴンクエスト4RTA to find the rest):
http://www.nicovideo.jp/watch/sm17908630

Links to waiwais 5:24:07 RTA (really choppy video quality and misses the first 2 hours i think.):
http://www.nicovideo.jp/watch/1309437675
http://www.nicovideo.jp/watch/1309438675
http://www.nicovideo.jp/watch/1309442829

niko user

2012-07-06 06:43:47 pm

@chessjerk:
I couldn't got information about the movie site for abroad. sorry・・・
On up-loading a movie on niko, we can choose "yes" or "no" to permit watching outside from niko.
I think many up-loader of RTA movies choose "no". embarassed

Quote from Exo:

@chessjerk:
Just make an account on nicovide and watch it from there.

Tutorial on how to register at nicovideo (google is great isnt it):
http://thenextweb.com/2008/01/15/how-to-register-for-japanese-video-site-nico-nico-douga/

I agree that this tutorial works well on creating an account on nikovideo.

Quote from Exo:

Links to waiwais 5:24:07 RTA (really choppy video quality and misses the first 2 hours i think.):
http://www.nicovideo.jp/watch/1309437675
http://www.nicovideo.jp/watch/1309438675
http://www.nicovideo.jp/watch/1309442829

These videos are uploaded as record video of chapter5 on FC DQ4 RTA.
So first 2hours was not miss, merely need not to upload.

Hsanrb

2012-07-06 07:52:31 pm

I don't know of any recordings but if you can bother to watch live I know Super Rinpei streams on ustream
http://www.ustream.tv/channel/super-rinpei-time

I wonder if theres any English versions of DQ4 with killing metal slimes with holy water. Seems like an odd thing to remove since no one would think to try it.

Also this video might also expire before you get to watch but a Japanese streamer restreamed the DQ Team relay (6 games, 2 teams)
http://www.twitch.tv/ukky1982/b/323171439 the DQ4 portion starts about 15hrs in. Team A had tough luck on Chapter 1 though. Both still finished under 6 hrs

niko user

2012-07-06 08:22:47 pm

Thank you mr. Hsanrb!
Latter video you showed was called "teihen" relay
I missed this event since I went abroad at that time, so it was really helpful for me.
For this relay, top DQ RTA player of nikovideo was gathered.

Runners of DQ4 portion were "waiwai" and "super-rinpei".
I think that video include enough information of recent playing of FC DQ4 on niko.

ShinerCCC

Edit history:

ShinerCCC: 2013-02-23 07:24:01 am

2013-02-23 07:00:07 am

Yes, a worthless avatar riding my posts.

Kind of a necrobump, but I tried an RTA of this game last night. I forgot most of the fine details about running this game so I was trying to read this topic and maps on GameFAQs on my phone as I went.
Chapter 1 was just fine, took about 45 minutes.
Chapter 2 was a train wreck, after I had a Chameleon boss fight I died over and over and over again trying to cut corners and get greedy. Lost many hours. Tournament only took two tries, Alena was level 12, I fed her both Lifeforce Nuts instead of selling them. Need to find a good route here; not sure about the worth of Venomous Dagger on Brey. It's good but it renders his huge pool of MP useless, I didn't learn Snowstorm until the chapter was entirely over. This made even walking to Endor take four tries, just ridiculous. I think rushing Chain Mail for Alena is still smart but the next big item should probably be either a Morning Star or good armor for Cristo to help with sustain issues. These three characters have very low HP, making any use of Heal really inefficient without good defense.
Chapter 3 could have been faster, had a rocky start trying to do my strat of "run to Bonmalmo, sell clothes+lunch+herb, buy Wing, free Tom, talk to Reed, death warp". Spent too much time grinding in the cave even after I opened the shop. Ended with Iron Safe + 7 Broad Swords for Taloon's inventory, Iron Safe might even be skippable for RTA because Strom and Laurent make the cave pretty safe. Wasted some time in the casino and got up to 5700 coins pretty easily.
Chapter 4 was okay, could have been faster as well. Just disorganized in general, had a few deaths. Somehow managed to get all the towns on my Return list at level 2.
Cave of Betrayal was easy, first try, I did my "leave behind the Iron Spear and Morning Star in the silver cave" strat for an awesome power start for Chapter 5.
I barely beat Lighthouse Bengal, Mara got all the experience, need to practice that fight to find the ideal strat *_*
I ragequit at around 9h30m, finally got the Padequia seed. I forgot to get the Small Medals in Konenber, and since I haven't played in years I couldn't remember the route for all the Small Medals after that. I think this game could be RTA'd in less than 11 hours.

edit: well this is embarrassing. hadn't read SDA in years and didn't know about the last page of this topic. I don't have a nico account, not sure if I'll ever get around to watching those vids but I'm very curious.
My biggest concern is Balzack II because there won't be easy access to Metal Babble Shields for Fendspell. I think Hero/Ragnar/Panon/Cristo with 2x Sword of Miracles and 2x Sword of Lethargy would be the way to go here. Esturk should still be manageable, Necrosaro will still be very very scary.

Kind of a necrobump, but I tried an RTA of this game last night. I forgot most of the fine details about running this game so I was trying to read this topic and maps on GameFAQs on my phone as I went.
Chapter 1 was just fine, took about 45 minutes.
Chapter 2 was a train wreck, after I had a Chameleon boss fight I died over and over and over again trying to cut corners and get greedy. Lost many hours. Tournament only took two tries, Alena was level 12, I fed her both Lifeforce Nuts instead of selling them. Need to find a good route here; not sure about the worth of Venomous Dagger on Brey. It's good but it renders his huge pool of MP useless, I didn't learn Snowstorm until the chapter was entirely over. This made even walking to Endor take four tries, just ridiculous. I think rushing Chain Mail for Alena is still smart but the next big item should probably be either a Morning Star or good armor for Cristo to help with sustain issues. These three characters have very low HP, making any use of Heal really inefficient without good defense.
Chapter 3 could have been faster, had a rocky start trying to do my strat of "run to Bonmalmo, sell clothes+lunch+herb, buy Wing, free Tom, talk to Reed, death warp". Spent too much time grinding in the cave even after I opened the shop. Ended with Iron Safe + 7 Broad Swords for Taloon's inventory, Iron Safe might even be skippable for RTA because Strom and Laurent make the cave pretty safe. Wasted some time in the casino and got up to 5700 coins pretty easily.
Chapter 4 was okay, could have been faster as well. Just disorganized in general, had a few deaths. Somehow managed to get all the towns on my Return list at level 2.
Cave of Betrayal was easy, first try, I did my "leave behind the Iron Spear and Morning Star in the silver cave" strat for an awesome power start for Chapter 5.
I barely beat Lighthouse Bengal, Mara got all the experience, need to practice that fight to find the ideal strat *_*
I ragequit at around 9h30m, finally got the Padequia seed. I forgot to get the Small Medals in Konenber, and since I haven't played in years I couldn't remember the route for all the Small Medals after that. I think this game could be RTA'd in less than 11 hours.

edit: well this is embarrassing. hadn't read SDA in years and didn't know about the last page of this topic. I don't have a nico account, not sure if I'll ever get around to watching those vids but I'm very curious.
My biggest concern is Balzack II because there won't be easy access to Metal Babble Shields for Fendspell. I think Hero/Ragnar/Panon/Cristo with 2x Sword of Miracles and 2x Sword of Lethargy would be the way to go here. Esturk should still be manageable, Necrosaro will still be very very scary.

Darkwing Duck

2013-02-23 03:31:32 pm

Highly Evolved

Shiner, use this link.

http://www.mmcafe.com/nico.html

Enter a nico video and you can watch it.

A link like this: http://www.mmcafe.com/nico.html#http://www.nicovideo.jp/watch/1309442829

ShinerCCC

2013-02-25 03:26:26 am

Yes, a worthless avatar riding my posts.

Did a better half-run last night, just up to halfway through Chapter 3 (bought the shop).
I rushed armor for Brey and Cristo, which meant I didn't wipe until I went to head for Endor, but battles took a pretty long time. I'll try rushing Morning Star next time.

For chapter 3, I grabbed just the Chain Sickle, died, went to Bonmalmo, did errands, died, did fox village. Walked too far, turned around to sell Full Plate, then it was dark when I got to Endor oops.

I think I'll leave Iron Spear in the cave and sell the Broad Sword. Chapter 5 is easy enough with the Iron Spear on the hero, and it's more important to me to get through Chapter 3 quicker since it's just a pile of menu manipulation that needs to be sped through as fast as possible.

Lhexa

2018-05-21 01:43:41 pm

This run has since been demolished by the human TAS community, who as usual withhold their secrets. Sad

LotBlind

2018-05-22 08:01:01 am

"withhold their secrets": What do you mean? There's no special secrecy around TASes, there's always at least some kind of explanation of the tricks used if not a full-on dump of various memory locations etc. Submission page for the latest one. That and asking adelikat directly should work.

Lhexa

2018-05-30 05:24:34 pm

Hi, LotBlind. I apologize to the runners, I was being irrational. As, unfortunately, I often am. Tongue

Lhexa

2018-06-09 08:39:34 pm

Also, sir, the "human TAS" community is not even a subset of the TAS community. It's people who perform TAS-like feats by hand. For context, my Dragon Warrior run is unbeaten in its category (no RNG manipulation), and is 4:47 hours. However, the current world record is 24:41 minutes.

The "human TAS" community is indeed secretive, given that they have not responded to my overtures to learn what they have learned. Sad

LotBlind

2018-06-10 01:07:09 pm

I was wondering what you meant by "human TAS", didn't realize it was actually a thing.

Yeah some people have no sense of responsibility, like with documenting what they've found. Some communities happen to be like that.

Lhexa

Edit history:

Lhexa: 2018-06-10 03:31:01 pm

Lhexa: 2018-06-10 03:29:02 pm

Lhexa: 2018-06-10 03:27:17 pm

Lhexa: 2018-06-10 03:25:46 pm

2018-06-10 03:24:31 pm

I don't think it's a matter of responsibility. I think it's just that they (well, the couple members I know passably well) have too much faith in the permanence of Twitch and the continuity of an oral tradition. The attitude seems to be, if I want to learn I should watch their channels. Tongue

Thankfully, there is GDQ footage. I learned more about DW1 during AGDQ 2018 during that thirty minutes than in the whole four years preceding it. In addition, DW3 is coming up this SGDQ.

LotBlind

2018-06-11 06:17:40 am

Yeah, I don't know of a better way to store information than a wiki. That's what they're for. We have a wiki right here. Don't hesitate to make full use of it yourself! Wink

Lhexa

2018-06-12 08:25:42 pm

For a field as contentious as speedrunning, where keeping track of origination is very important, wikis are absolutely terrible. Even forum threads are better than wikis. Thus my presence. -_-