Dishonored

2013-01-16 11:41:27 am

MATHEMATICS

So the thread isn't dead after alll!

Sneakymode, the reason there is a yellow glow, is because the crosshair is in a position to try and open the door, I think. Regardless, you should not only lean, but also turn a little bit so you get the camera as close as possible to the door. I think I replied to you on YouTube (username is threelettersyndrom). Regardless, practice is going to make perfect.

ExplodingCabbage

2013-01-16 02:00:13 pm

So amzblk - are you planning to do another run? What kind of time do you reckon you're now aiming for?

sneakymode

2013-01-16 02:16:54 pm

Excellent job guys on that new route. I might just sit down today and practice this wall breaching glitch because without that my runs are near pointless if I want to approach the 45 minute mark. Do you think Field of View plays a part in the trick or does it not actually matter?

amzblk

2013-01-16 02:32:58 pm

Quote from ExplodingCabbage:

So amzblk - are you planning to do another run? What kind of time do you reckon you're now aiming for?

I am planning to get sub 42 with the new routes.

Quote from sneakymode:

Excellent job guys on that new route. I might just sit down today and practice this wall breaching glitch because without that my runs are near pointless if I want to approach the 45 minute mark. Do you think Field of View plays a part in the trick or does it not actually matter?

I think field of view does not matter.

161803398874989

2013-01-17 05:44:57 am

MATHEMATICS

I was wondering... in the Flooded District mission, is it possible to clip through the wall to the side of the Wall of Light Checkpoint? Not sure it'd even save time.

amzblk

2013-01-17 12:13:14 pm

Quote from 161803398874989:

I was wondering... in the Flooded District mission, is it possible to clip through the wall to the side of the Wall of Light Checkpoint? Not sure it'd even save time.

It is possible but there is no point doing so. You would waste mana and time.

161803398874989

2013-01-17 12:27:00 pm

MATHEMATICS

Yeah, that's what I thought.

161803398874989

2013-01-18 12:21:57 pm

MATHEMATICS

I've been doing some non-lethal running (only the first three levels), and it's pretty interesting...
Mission 01 (Coldridge Prison)
* You have to stay undetected for the first part of the mission because otherwise you can't nick the key off the guard.
* Proceeding through the Yard Walkway is kind of annoying, since you have to allow the guard to open the door, but you can't just bail straight past him because he will be blocking the entrance. So you lure him out, and the second guard comes running, blocking the path. I haven't tested this exhaustively, you can probably do it with a distraction.
* You have to either get lucky or lose a second or two to pull the guards away with the door explosion. First time I tried it, one of the guards was killed in the explosion.
* You still need to grab a sword for the wheel with the corpse on it. Also for the distraction.

Mission 02 (Overseer Campbell)
* You need to free Martin, because otherwise you can't get Campbell to the Interrogation Room
* Maybe you can clip through the door once the scene has started? Just an idea I had, didn't test it yet. You have a ton of time to dick around during the scene.
* Sleep bolts still get the slow-mo. Sad

* You can still interact with the interrogation chair during open conflict.
* It's faster to go back through the front door and then to the yard than to stay inside.

Mission 03 (House of Pleasure)
* If you are in open conflict, the guys in front of the distillery won't talk to you. Not sure if it was a cutscene, but if it was, that's a good trick.
* You can grab the audiograph easily, so it's just a quick trip through Galvani's office.
* There is a problem at Galvani's. The fastest way would be to get in and out at the top door. However, that requires the Galvani Building Key, which I couldn't find. I looked it up, and apparently only the maid has it.
* You can still interact with Bunting while in open conflict. This is great, because there will be guards. You have to wait while Bunting does his confessions, so that's when you will be blocking. Maybe there's a way to make him shut up?
* Bunting's part is tricky if the guards start shooting. Probably should spare some health potions for this, because it takes only a couple of shots before you're dead.

On an unrelated note, the 'no sword'-glitch works fine on Xbox. It's really, really easy.

I've been doing some non-lethal running (only the first three levels), and it's pretty interesting... 
Mission 01 (Coldridge Prison)
* You have to stay undetected for the first part of the mission because otherwise you can't nick the key off the guard.
* Proceeding through the Yard Walkway is kind of annoying, since you have to allow the guard to open the door, but you can't just bail straight past him because he will be blocking the entrance. So you lure him out, and the second guard comes running, blocking the path. I haven't tested this exhaustively, you can probably do it with a distraction.
* You have to either get lucky or lose a second or two to pull the guards away with the door explosion. First time I tried it, one of the guards was killed in the explosion.
* You still need to grab a sword for the wheel with the corpse on it. Also for the distraction.

Mission 02 (Overseer Campbell)
* You need to free Martin, because otherwise you can't get Campbell to the Interrogation Room
* Maybe you can clip through the door once the scene has started? Just an idea I had, didn't test it yet. You have a ton of time to dick around during the scene.
* Sleep bolts still get the slow-mo. :(
* You can still interact with the interrogation chair during open conflict.
* It's faster to go back through the front door and then to the yard than to stay inside.

Mission 03 (House of Pleasure)
* If you are in open conflict, the guys in front of the distillery won't talk to you. Not sure if it was a cutscene, but if it was, that's a good trick.
* You can grab the audiograph easily, so it's just a quick trip through Galvani's office.
* There is a problem at Galvani's. The fastest way would be to get in and out at the top door. However, that requires the Galvani Building Key, which I couldn't find. I looked it up, and apparently only the maid has it.
* You can still interact with Bunting while in open conflict. This is great, because there will be guards. You have to wait while Bunting does his confessions, so that's when you will be blocking. Maybe there's a way to make him shut up?
* Bunting's part is tricky if the guards start shooting. Probably should spare some health potions for this, because it takes only a couple of shots before you're dead.

On an unrelated note, the 'no sword'-glitch works fine on Xbox. It's really, really easy.

ExplodingCabbage

Edit history:

ExplodingCabbage: 2013-01-18 01:04:51 pm

2013-01-18 01:04:29 pm

Regarding non-lethal running: if the objective is just to have zero kills, can't you just manipulate the targets into being shot by their allies instead of actually using the intended non-lethal methods? Or do dead targets count as your kills regardless of how they ended up dead?

Paraxade

Edit history:

Paraxade: 2013-01-18 01:42:41 pm

2013-01-18 01:42:23 pm

Cool stuff amzblk. I'm kinda curious how much time the wall clipping glitch saves now across the entire game, lol. Anyone have a ballpark estimate?

Quote:

On an unrelated note, the 'no sword'-glitch works fine on Xbox. It's really, really easy.

No sword glitch?

161803398874989

2013-01-18 02:34:41 pm

MATHEMATICS

Quote:

Regarding non-lethal running: if the objective is just to have zero kills, can't you just manipulate the targets into being shot by their allies instead of actually using the intended non-lethal methods? Or do dead targets count as your kills regardless of how they ended up dead?

If I recall correctly, they end up as kills regardless, like the guards near the door in Mission 01. In the official list I only could find it for unconscious NPC's though. Needs testing.
Until you get possession, you'd have to rely on luck, though.

Quote:

No sword glitch?

I didn't know what to call it. Basically you put your sword away but can still blink.

Quote:

I'm kinda curious how much time the wall clipping glitch saves now across the entire game, lol. Anyone have a ballpark estimate?

Well, there's the Overseer skip which skips an entire scene of a minute, so you have 45 seconds saved (I checked). Next is on Kaldwin's bridge where it saves like 10 seconds. Dunwall tower, 15 seconds. Then the skip in the Flooded District where it saves a ton of time, 20 seconds (really proud of finding that one). That's the final use of the glitch, so it comes down one and a half minute saved by clipping.

[quote]Regarding non-lethal running: if the objective is just to have zero kills, can't you just manipulate the targets into being shot by their allies instead of actually using the intended non-lethal methods? Or do dead targets count as your kills regardless of how they ended up dead?[/quote]
If I recall correctly, they end up as kills regardless, like the guards near the door in Mission 01. In the official list I only could find it for unconscious NPC's though. Needs testing.
Until you get possession, you'd have to rely on luck, though.

[quote]No sword glitch?[/quote]
I didn't know what to call it. Basically you put your sword away but can still blink.

[quote]I'm kinda curious how much time the wall clipping glitch saves now across the entire game, lol. Anyone have a ballpark estimate?[/quote]
Well, there's the Overseer skip which skips an entire scene of a minute, so you have 45 seconds saved (I checked). Next is on Kaldwin's bridge where it saves like 10 seconds. Dunwall tower, 15 seconds. Then the skip in the Flooded District where it saves a ton of time, 20 seconds (really proud of finding that one). That's the final use of the glitch, so it comes down one and a half minute saved by clipping.

CrimsonPheonix

2013-01-18 09:54:48 pm

At the beginning of stage 7, right after you break out of prison, there is a long jump from the place you start to another building. Can anyone show me how to do it? Just sprinting with no sword and double jump + blink wont get me there no matter how many times i try. Is there any trick im missing?

Sloth

2013-01-19 01:52:39 am

What do you guys think about doing a 100% run? It could be quite interesting, routing all of the runes and charms. Also, sneakymode, i find it's all about the angle for clipping through the door, helps to really look carefully at the video.

ExplodingCabbage

2013-01-19 03:28:45 am

Quote from Sloth:

What do you guys think about doing a 100% run? It could be quite interesting, routing all of the runes and charms. Also, sneakymode, i find it's all about the angle for clipping through the door, helps to really look carefully at the video.

100% would presumably be all runes, all charms, all paintings, and all gold? Seeing as those are the things counted on the end of level stats screens? The "all gold" bit of that is going to be the hard part.

Quote from CrimsonPheonix:

At the beginning of stage 7, right after you break out of prison, there is a long jump from the place you start to another building. Can anyone show me how to do it? Just sprinting with no sword and double jump + blink wont get me there no matter how many times i try. Is there any trick im missing?

The objective isn't to get from the balcony to the top of the roof in one go - I don't think that's even possible. There's a little ledge just below the base of the roof in the middle of the building which amzblk lands on, and from there you can climb up to the roof. The ledge doesn't extend out to the sides of the building, so if you don't aim for the centre you'll fail every time.

(That wasn't the greatest explanation in the world, but watch the video again closely if you don't udnerstand and you'll see clearly that amzblk lands on something and then climbs up onto the roof. You want to land on that same something.)

Even knowing this, though, I still find that jump seriously hard; after spending 20+ minutes just reloading a quicksave there and reattempting it, I was getting it maybe 1 time in 10. I don't know if there's some trick amzblk has to nail it consistently; it feels like I'm still missing something.

[quote="Sloth"]What do you guys think about  doing a 100% run? It could be quite interesting, routing all of the runes and charms. Also, sneakymode, i find it's all about the angle for clipping through the door, helps to really look carefully at the video.[/quote]

100% would presumably be all runes, all charms, all paintings, and all gold? Seeing as those are the things counted on the end of level stats screens? The "all gold" bit of that is going to be the hard part.

[quote="CrimsonPheonix"]At the beginning of stage 7, right after you break out of prison, there is a long jump from the place you start to another building. Can anyone show me how to do it? Just sprinting with no sword and double jump + blink wont get me there no matter how many times i try. Is there any trick im missing?
[/quote]

The objective isn't to get from the balcony to the top of the roof in one go - I don't think that's even possible. There's a little ledge just below the base of the roof in the middle of the building which amzblk lands on, and from there you can climb up to the roof. The ledge doesn't extend out to the sides of the building, so if you don't aim for the centre you'll fail every time.

(That wasn't the greatest explanation in the world, but watch the video again closely if you don't udnerstand and you'll see clearly that amzblk lands on something and then climbs up onto the roof. You want to land on that same something.)

Even knowing this, though, I still find that jump seriously hard; after spending 20+ minutes just reloading a quicksave there and reattempting it, I was getting it maybe 1 time in 10. I don't know if there's some trick amzblk has to nail it consistently; it feels like I'm still missing something.

amzblk

2013-01-19 03:42:40 am

Quote from CrimsonPheonix:

At the beginning of stage 7, right after you break out of prison, there is a long jump from the place you start to another building. Can anyone show me how to do it? Just sprinting with no sword and double jump + blink wont get me there no matter how many times i try. Is there any trick im missing?

It is the hardest trick in the game. Firstly you need to jump off the balcony railing just at the last moment. Secondly you need to be moving straight towards the middle pillar of the house. Thirdly there are 2 very small places you can land on. You need to be either to the right of the pillar or to the left. You can not land in the middle of it. The house roof is clipped in a really weird way making this jump very hard.
So to summarize: Perfect timing and angle when jumping off the balcony railing, perfect blink to land on a small area on the pillar.

161803398874989

2013-01-19 04:04:45 am

MATHEMATICS

Yeah, I skipped that jump when running through for non-lethal routing purposes.

So in order to turn the current run into a non-lethal run, we'd have to modify routes for missions 01, 02, 03 and 05. The rest can stay as it is, because they're non-lethal already. Tested some things, here's what I found.

Mission 03 (House of Pleasure)
* You can get Crowley's last words before you talk to Slackjaw. That way you don't have to go to the distillery an additional time.
* Unless you're really lucky, you're going to need at least one sleeping dart for the Bunting interrogation. I think you'll always get exactly two guards in the Silver room (on all my attempts that was the number), and only one of those is really annoying in that he keeps shooting you.
* I still haven't tried backing away while Bunting is talking. Doubt it works, since it also doesn't work on Miss White in mission 05.

Mission 05 (Lady Boyle's Last Party)
* The jump on the lamp in the beginning of the level is a PITA on Xbox. I can never get that one.
* I talked to Miss White to find out the identities, but you have to talk to her, then run to the fountain, wait for the objective to update, then run back. You can move from the second sentence onwards. Not sure if it's the fastest way, but I think so.
* Lord Brisby seems to start moving around after you talk to Miss White, so it'd be smart to talk to him first.
* If you cause a ruckus by sleep darting the target, someone, somewhere will die. I don't know who, but the non-lethal box is unchecked at the end of the mission. So you have to wait for her to get to the cellar (which takes ages).
* It's impossible to skip the Pendleton conversation about Lord Shaw. I sleep darted Shaw, and Pendleton mentioned me giving the note, but nothing else.
* As for the escape, I think it's faster to go back through the gardens rather than through the sewers.

Yeah, I skipped that jump when running through for non-lethal routing purposes.

So in order to turn the current run into a non-lethal run, we'd have to modify routes for missions 01, 02, 03 and 05. The rest can stay as it is, because they're non-lethal already. Tested some things, here's what I found.

Mission 03 (House of Pleasure)
* You can get Crowley's last words before you talk to Slackjaw. That way you don't have to go to the distillery an additional time. 
* Unless you're really lucky, you're going to need at least one sleeping dart for the Bunting interrogation. I think you'll always get exactly two guards in the Silver room (on all my attempts that was the number), and only one of those is really annoying in that he keeps shooting you.
* I still haven't tried backing away while Bunting is talking. Doubt it works, since it also doesn't work on Miss White in mission 05.

Mission 05 (Lady Boyle's Last Party)
* The jump on the lamp in the beginning of the level is a PITA on Xbox. I can never get that one.
* I talked to Miss White to find out the identities, but you have to talk to her, then run to the fountain, wait for the objective to update, then run back. You can move from the second sentence onwards. Not sure if it's the fastest way, but I think so.
* Lord Brisby seems to start moving around after you talk to Miss White, so it'd be smart to talk to him first.
* If you cause a ruckus by sleep darting the target, someone, somewhere will die. I don't know who, but the non-lethal box is unchecked at the end of the mission. So you have to wait for her to get to the cellar (which takes ages).
* It's impossible to skip the Pendleton conversation about Lord Shaw. I sleep darted Shaw, and Pendleton mentioned me giving the note, but nothing else.
* As for the escape, I think it's faster to go back through the gardens rather than through the sewers.

ExplodingCabbage

Edit history:

ExplodingCabbage: 2013-01-19 10:07:45 am

ExplodingCabbage: 2013-01-19 10:07:09 am

ExplodingCabbage: 2013-01-19 10:06:19 am

ExplodingCabbage: 2013-01-19 09:59:21 am

ExplodingCabbage: 2013-01-19 09:56:01 am

ExplodingCabbage: 2013-01-19 09:54:35 am

ExplodingCabbage: 2013-01-19 09:44:06 am

ExplodingCabbage: 2013-01-19 09:42:23 am

2013-01-19 09:42:08 am

161803398874989, I'd seriously test out whether getting a guard to shoot a target for you counts as a kill before you go planning mission 3 too seriously. I'd be willing to bet that it doesn't. (Rival factions killing each other don't count as kills, and nor do rats killing non-unconscious people.) I can't test it myself any more (am away from my gaming PC again for the foreseeable future) or I'd already have done so; it's no more than half an hour's work to test this thoroughly and potentially renders all work you've done so far on mission 3 (and perhaps also mission 2, if you can get Curnow to draw a gun while still behind the door?) redundant.

Also look into other potentially 'non-lethal' approaches, like possessing the target and walking them off a cliff or into a swarm of rats or weepers. Try dropping (not throwing) whale oil tanks on people as well to check whether that counts as a kill - it's moderately likely that the logic that's used to determine whether or not to delete a whale oil tank when you enter dialogue (which catches tanks you've just thrown, but misses one's you've dropped) is the same or similar to the logic used to determine whether you are 'responsible' for a whale oil tank exploding, and that simply dropping whale oil tanks onto people from height won't be blamed on you.

Quote from 161803398874989:

* I talked to Miss White to find out the identities, but you have to talk to her, then run to the fountain, wait for the objective to update, then run back. You can move from the second sentence onwards. Not sure if it's the fastest way, but I think so.

Interesting. It hadn't occurred to me until reading this that having to talk to Brisby regardless might tip the balance in favour of talking to Miss White for a non-lethal run. I'm not sure which would be faster off the top of my head.

Hmm... actually, can you just luckily guess? A 1 in 3 chance isn't terrible and would save a significant chunk of time. I'm fairly sure you can't just guess for the lethal method (the objective won't count as complete until you've either identified the target or killed all three Boyles), but it might be handled differently for the non-lethal approach. Heck, what happens if you bring Brisby the wrong girl? Could be funny.

Quote:

* If you cause a ruckus by sleep darting the target, someone, somewhere will die. I don't know who, but the non-lethal box is unchecked at the end of the mission. So you have to wait for her to get to the cellar (which takes ages).

Curious. Do you have 1 civilian killed or 1 hostile killed when doing this?

Quote:

* It's impossible to skip the Pendleton conversation about Lord Shaw. I sleep darted Shaw, and Pendleton mentioned me giving the note, but nothing else.

Can't you just do it the same way as I pointed out to amzblk: talk to him, give him the note, and then don't interact with him in any further way? I'm fairly sure Pendleton's dialogue isn't affected in any way by whether you handle Boyle lethally or not?

Quote:

* As for the escape, I think it's faster to go back through the gardens rather than through the sewers.

My gut says you're probably right (but you should record and time both to test it, of course).

161803398874989, I'd seriously test out whether getting a guard to shoot a target for you counts as a kill before you go planning mission 3 too seriously. I'd be willing to bet that it doesn't. (Rival factions killing each other don't count as kills, and nor do rats killing non-unconscious people.) I can't test it myself any more (am away from my gaming PC again for the foreseeable future) or I'd already have done so; it's no more than half an hour's work to test this thoroughly and potentially renders all work you've done so far on mission 3 (and perhaps also mission 2, if you can get Curnow to draw a gun while still behind the door?) redundant.

Also look into other potentially 'non-lethal' approaches, like possessing the target and walking them off a cliff or into a swarm of rats or weepers. Try dropping (not throwing) whale oil tanks on people as well to check whether that counts as a kill - it's moderately likely that the logic that's used to determine whether or not to delete a whale oil tank when you enter dialogue (which catches tanks you've just thrown, but misses one's you've dropped) is the same or similar to the logic used to determine whether you are 'responsible' for a whale oil tank exploding, and that simply dropping whale oil tanks onto people from height won't be blamed on you.

[quote="161803398874989"]* I talked to Miss White to find out the identities, but you have to talk to her, then run to the fountain, wait for the objective to update, then run back. You can move from the second sentence onwards. Not sure if it's the fastest way, but I think so.[/quote]
Interesting. It hadn't occurred to me until reading this that having to talk to Brisby regardless might tip the balance in favour of talking to Miss White for a non-lethal run. I'm not sure which would be faster off the top of my head.

Hmm... actually, can you just luckily guess? A 1 in 3 chance isn't terrible and would save a significant chunk of time. I'm fairly sure you can't just guess for the lethal method (the objective won't count as complete until you've either identified the target or killed all three Boyles), but it might be handled differently for the non-lethal approach. Heck, what happens if you bring Brisby the wrong girl? Could be funny.

[quote]* If you cause a ruckus by sleep darting the target, someone, somewhere will die. I don't know who, but the non-lethal box is unchecked at the end of the mission. So you have to wait for her to get to the cellar (which takes ages).[/quote]
Curious. Do you have 1 civilian killed or 1 hostile killed when doing this?

[quote]* It's impossible to skip the Pendleton conversation about Lord Shaw. I sleep darted Shaw, and Pendleton mentioned me giving the note, but nothing else.[/quote]
Can't you just do it the same way as I pointed out to amzblk: talk to him, give him the note, and then don't interact with him in any further way? I'm fairly sure Pendleton's dialogue isn't affected in any way by whether you handle Boyle lethally or not?

[quote]* As for the escape, I think it's faster to go back through the gardens rather than through the sewers.[/quote]
My gut says you're probably right (but you should record and time both to test it, of course).

amzblk

Edit history:

amzblk: 2013-01-19 12:07:44 pm

amzblk: 2013-01-19 12:04:48 pm

amzblk: 2013-01-19 12:01:41 pm

2013-01-19 11:23:47 am

Quote from 161803398874989:

Mission 01 (Coldridge Prison)
* You still need to grab a sword for the wheel with the corpse on it. Also for the distraction.

You can grab the bottle and throw the corpse with it and it will make the wheel turnable. No sword needed.

Quote from 161803398874989:

Mission 01 (Coldridge Prison)
* You have to stay undetected for the first part of the mission because otherwise you can't nick the key off the guard.

Found this while trying various stuff:

There is a trigger before you open the door to that pathway which triggers the guards and closes the gate. Skipping that trigger leaves the gate open and the key hanging invisibly in the air. Dont know if it would be optimal for any% because the gun is very useful taking out the guard at the gate, but definetly useful for a non-lethal run.

sneakymode

2013-01-19 12:35:38 pm

I think ultimately it would be a detrmiment to any% because there are no other weapon racks after this point, are there? You need at least a sword to open the gate and to remove the body from the gate in the sewers later on after the prison.

Also I was goofing around seeing if it was at all possible to skip Emily's dialog at the start. I found two places you can climb up to but it seems the developers did a good job of blocking off that area with invisible walls. You can definitely survive the fall required but actually getting over the wall before triggering Emily is tough if not impossible.

amzblk

2013-01-19 01:28:05 pm

Quote from sneakymode:

I think ultimately it would be a detrmiment to any% because there are no other weapon racks after this point, are there? You need at least a sword to open the gate and to remove the body from the gate in the sewers later on after the prison.

You can grab the sword from the table as soon as you break out of your prison cell if you really need it.
But for the blocking corpse I already said:

Quote from amzblk:

You can grab the bottle and throw the corpse with it and it will make the wheel turnable. No sword needed.

Sloth

2013-01-19 02:08:47 pm

Quote:

100% would presumably be all runes, all charms, all paintings, and all gold? Seeing as those are the things counted on the end of level stats screens? The "all gold" bit of that is going to be the hard part.

Ya, the gold part would be annoying but I was just thinking of doing all Runes, Charms, Paintings, and Shrines. So I guess it can't really be called a 100% run, more like an every item run.

MAS8705

2013-01-19 02:20:13 pm

SDA Apprentice -- (3-1)

not to jump in mid conversation, but I wanted to throw in my two cents in regards of the 100% run. You are correct in regards of the "All Runes, Charms, & painting," but gold is the game's currency and thus you wouldn't need to worry about collecting all the gold in the game. However, you might have forgotten about the game's blueprints, & additional missions, and I'm sure you would then need to gold in order to buy all the upgrades. Still, nice to see that this thread is alive again. Although I wonder why we still don't have a submittion yet considering how we already have a few runs posted onto youtube already, unless if even more improvements can be made.

amzblk

2013-01-19 02:51:07 pm

Quote from MAS8705:

not to jump in mid conversation, but I wanted to throw in my two cents in regards of the 100% run. You are correct in regards of the "All Runes, Charms, & painting," but gold is the game's currency and thus you wouldn't need to worry about collecting all the gold in the game. However, you might have forgotten about the game's blueprints, & additional missions, and I'm sure you would then need to gold in order to buy all the upgrades. Still, nice to see that this thread is alive again. Although I wonder why we still don't have a submittion yet considering how we already have a few runs posted onto youtube already, unless if even more improvements can be made.

More improvements can be made to the 42:59 run.

Paraxade

2013-01-19 03:03:40 pm

For the record, if you get through the entire prison without ever picking up a sword, then the game gives you one later when you pick up the crossbow.

sneakymode

Edit history:

sneakymode: 2013-01-19 03:29:38 pm

2013-01-19 03:26:46 pm

It's ridiculous but there's about 30-40 keys, too, that you could collect in the 100% run if you were nuts but it's obviously not actually necessary.
Edit: Not including duplicates. I meant unique keys.