Castlevania: Symphony Of The Night

Lucid Faia

Edit history:

Lucid Faia: 2005-12-26 12:22:08 am

2005-12-19 01:34:09 am

Yeah, I said it.

Okay, making a topic here so we don't have to talk about this in the EarthBound thread anymore.

Story so far: I've been working on a SOTN run for a few weeks now: a full-game (both castles) fastest completion run with Alucard. I currently have a 50:20 on tape, which beats the current video by over five minutes, but I'm going to improve that time before sending a tape in.

A little aside to Enhasa before we get started here: I ran some tests, and skipping the Leap Stone until later is definitely faster than getting it before the Soul Of Mist. I don't know what I was thinking. Tongue

Route improvements over the current video:
1. I skip the Spike Breaker armor. Contrary to popular belief, it isn't required to get the Silver Ring, thanks to a programmer oversight (not a glitch) that involves drinking a potion before hitting spikes.

2. Gold/Silver Rings. I tested all sorts of combinations involving the Gold and Silver Rings, the Long Library, and the Clock Room. The optimal path seems to be Long Library -> Silver Ring (through Clock Tower, Castle Keep) -> Long Library (via Library Card) -> Gold Ring (through Marble Gallery) -> Clock Room. This is about a minute faster than the route I used in my 50:20, which was faster than the route used by the current video.

3. Sequence Breaker... the Leap Stone isn't required to get to the Soul of Mist. When coming out of Wolf form in mid-air, Alucard can do a downwards kick, as if he had the Leap Stone equipped. Using this technique, it is possible to bounce off of a torch or enemy and get to the Souls of Wolf and Bat without having the Leap Stone, allowing you to skip a great deal of the castle. I didn't use this in my 50:20.

Boss strats:

Slogra and Gaibon: Knives and Fists
Doppelganger, Minotaur, Werewolf, Lesser Demon: Stopwatch and Fists
Hippogryph: Holy Rod
Succubus: Jewel Knuckles
Darkwing Bat: Claymore, and possibly a Soul Steal
The Creature: Luminus
Death: Holy Rod
Medusa: Alucard Sword to pierce defense, and then Jewel Knuckles up close
Akmodan II: Holy Water. Over as soon as it begins.
Shaft: Alucard Sword.
Dracula: Jewel Knuckles, Alucard Sword, Soul Steal

Anyone have questions/comments?

Thread title:

Okay, making a topic here so we don't have to talk about this in the EarthBound thread anymore.
 
Story so far: I've been working on a SOTN run for a few weeks now: a full-game (both castles) fastest completion run with Alucard. I currently have a 50:20 on tape, which beats the current video by over five minutes, but I'm going to improve that time before sending a tape in.
 
A little aside to Enhasa before we get started here: I ran some tests, and skipping the Leap Stone until later is definitely faster than getting it before the Soul Of Mist. I don't know what I was thinking. :P
 
Route improvements over the current video:
1. I skip the Spike Breaker armor. Contrary to popular belief, it isn't required to get the Silver Ring, thanks to a programmer oversight (not a glitch) that involves drinking a potion before hitting spikes.
 
2. Gold/Silver Rings. I tested all sorts of combinations involving the Gold and Silver Rings, the Long Library, and the Clock Room. The optimal path seems to be Long Library -> Silver Ring (through Clock Tower, Castle Keep) -> Long Library (via Library Card) -> Gold Ring (through Marble Gallery) -> Clock Room. This is about a minute faster than the route I used in my 50:20, which was faster than the route used by the current video.
 
3. Sequence Breaker... the Leap Stone isn't required to get to the Soul of Mist. When coming out of Wolf form in mid-air, Alucard can do a downwards kick, as if he had the Leap Stone equipped. Using this technique, it is possible to bounce off of a torch or enemy and get to the Souls of Wolf and Bat without having the Leap Stone, allowing you to skip a great deal of the castle. I didn't use this in my 50:20.
 
Boss strats:
 
Slogra and Gaibon: Knives and Fists
Doppelganger, Minotaur, Werewolf, Lesser Demon: Stopwatch and Fists
Hippogryph: Holy Rod
Succubus: Jewel Knuckles
Darkwing Bat: Claymore, and possibly a Soul Steal
The Creature: Luminus
Death: Holy Rod
Medusa: Alucard Sword to pierce defense, and then Jewel Knuckles up close
Akmodan II: Holy Water. Over as soon as it begins.
Shaft: Alucard Sword.
Dracula: Jewel Knuckles, Alucard Sword, Soul Steal
 
Anyone have questions/comments?

DAMURDOC

2005-12-19 01:36:13 am

The BaldurManiac

I gotta wait for yours to get posted so I can beat it Grin

Lucid Faia

2005-12-19 01:43:12 am

Yeah, I said it.

Bring it.

Enhasa

2005-12-19 05:39:28 am

everybody wanna tell you the meaning of music

Re Leap Stone: Duh! Wink

Keep it up, Lucid. My SOTN knowledge is becoming hazy, but can't you avoid Leap Stone altogether? I don't know if nothing or Gravity Boots is better. You can try the Boots which help out in the Inverted Castle IIRC. Also, do you really mean Clock Tower when you said it? You don't list Karasuman in your boss list, and I don't think you'd want to fight both Hippogryph and Karasuman. And what's wrong with Colosseum to Royal Chapel for the Silver Ring?

Without any testing or much thought really, I always figured the path would be Soul of Wolf, Jewel of Open, wolf stomp to Form of Mist, Silver Ring, library card to wolf stomp to Soul of Bat, library card to Gold Ring, Holy Glasses, etc. The etc could be library card through Clock Tower to Richter (my choice) or the Hippogryph path. I see you do Darkwing Bat to The Creature to Death to warp to Medusa to Akmodan to Shaft. I typically do Darkwing Bat to Medusa to Akmodan (activate this warp and not the first one) to Death to warp to The Creature to warp to Shaft.

Re Leap Stone: Duh! ;)

Keep it up, Lucid. My SOTN knowledge is becoming hazy, but can't you avoid Leap Stone altogether? I don't know if nothing or Gravity Boots is better. You can try the Boots which help out in the Inverted Castle IIRC. Also, do you really mean Clock Tower when you said it? You don't list Karasuman in your boss list, and I don't think you'd want to fight both Hippogryph and Karasuman. And what's wrong with Colosseum to Royal Chapel for the Silver Ring?

Without any testing or much thought really, I always figured the path would be Soul of Wolf, Jewel of Open, wolf stomp to Form of Mist, Silver Ring, library card to wolf stomp to Soul of Bat, library card to Gold Ring, Holy Glasses, etc. The etc could be library card through Clock Tower to Richter (my choice) or the Hippogryph path. I see you do Darkwing Bat to The Creature to Death to warp to Medusa to Akmodan to Shaft. I typically do Darkwing Bat to Medusa to Akmodan (activate this warp and not the first one) to Death to warp to The Creature to warp to Shaft.

Lucid Faia

Edit history:

Lucid Faia: 2005-12-19 08:11:40 am

2005-12-19 08:10:25 am

Yeah, I said it.

It's funny how a great deal of the route planning revolves around the rings.

I don't know if nothing or Gravity Boots is better.

The Gravity Boots definitely save more time than they cost.

Also, do you really mean Clock Tower when you said it? You don't list Karasuman in your boss list, and I don't think you'd want to fight both Hippogryph and Karasuman.

I forgot about him. =\

I use the Holy Rod for Karasuman. He lasts about ten seconds.

Because I'm putting off the Leap Stone until later, the Lion teleporter room is unavailable to me. The fastest way to get to the Gold Ring from the Long Library is definitely through the Clock Tower. I have the Soul Of Bat at that time, so it doesn't take very long to get to the Castle Keep.

And what's wrong with Colosseum to Royal Chapel for the Silver Ring?

Unreliable, thanks to the way the left statue in the Clock Room works. Starting from the Gold Ring, using a Library Card and Wing Smashing through the long hallways on the top of the castle is faster than walking it to the Clock Room and through the Colloseum. The difference is around twenty to thirty seconds, according to my notes. >_> Plus, that's assuming you don't have to wait for the statue to move once you reach the Clock Room.

Without any testing or much thought really, I always figured the path would be Soul of Wolf, Jewel of Open, wolf stomp to Form of Mist, Silver Ring, library card to wolf stomp to Soul of Bat, library card to Gold Ring, Holy Glasses, etc. The etc could be library card through Clock Tower to Richter (my choice) or the Hippogryph path.

You're better off ignoring the Jewel Of Open until getting the Soul Of Mist, because you don't need it yet, and you pick up a Library Card right before the Werewolf and Minotaur.

I think you made a mistake on the rings. Getting either ring without the Soul Of Bat is impossible, as far as I know (or at least impractical, in Silver's case). Assuming the Soul Of Bat is required for both, that puts your starting point in the Long Library. I've tested several routes from that point, and LL -> GR -> LL -> SR -> CR appears to be optimal.

I see you do Darkwing Bat to The Creature to Death to warp to Medusa to Akmodan to Shaft. I typically do Darkwing Bat to Medusa to Akmodan (activate this warp and not the first one) to Death to warp to The Creature to warp to Shaft.

Yeah. The Inverted Castle route I use is also the reason I don't skip the Leap Stone entirely. I admit I haven't tested the Inverted Castle as thoroughly as I have the Normal one. I'll give your route a try tonight.

It's funny how a great deal of the route planning revolves around the rings.

[i]I don't know if nothing or Gravity Boots is better.[/i]

The Gravity Boots definitely save more time than they cost.

[i]Also, do you really mean Clock Tower when you said it? You don't list Karasuman in your boss list, and I don't think you'd want to fight both Hippogryph and Karasuman.[/i]

I forgot about him. =\

I use the Holy Rod for Karasuman. He lasts about ten seconds.

Because I'm putting off the Leap Stone until later, the Lion teleporter room is unavailable to me. The fastest way to get to the Gold Ring from the Long Library is definitely through the Clock Tower. I have the Soul Of Bat at that time, so it doesn't take very long to get to the Castle Keep.

[i]And what's wrong with Colosseum to Royal Chapel for the Silver Ring?[/i]

Unreliable, thanks to the way the left statue in the Clock Room works. Starting from the Gold Ring, using a Library Card and Wing Smashing through the long hallways on the top of the castle is faster than walking it to the Clock Room and through the Colloseum. The difference is around twenty to thirty seconds, according to my notes. >_> Plus, that's assuming you don't have to wait for the statue to move once you reach the Clock Room.

[i]Without any testing or much thought really, I always figured the path would be Soul of Wolf, Jewel of Open, wolf stomp to Form of Mist, Silver Ring, library card to wolf stomp to Soul of Bat, library card to Gold Ring, Holy Glasses, etc. The etc could be library card through Clock Tower to Richter (my choice) or the Hippogryph path.[/i]

You're better off ignoring the Jewel Of Open until getting the Soul Of Mist, because you don't need it yet, and you pick up a Library Card right before the Werewolf and Minotaur.

I think you made a mistake on the rings. Getting either ring without the Soul Of Bat is impossible, as far as I know (or at least impractical, in Silver's case). Assuming the Soul Of Bat is required for both, that puts your starting point in the Long Library. I've tested several routes from that point, and LL -> GR -> LL -> SR -> CR appears to be optimal.

[i]I see you do Darkwing Bat to The Creature to Death to warp to Medusa to Akmodan to Shaft. I typically do Darkwing Bat to Medusa to Akmodan (activate this warp and not the first one) to Death to warp to The Creature to warp to Shaft.[/i]

Yeah. The Inverted Castle route I use is also the reason I don't skip the Leap Stone entirely. I admit I haven't tested the Inverted Castle as thoroughly as I have the Normal one. I'll give your route a try tonight.

Gorash

2005-12-19 09:13:51 am

${$uid.$user}{' usertext'}

This will be still single segment I presume?

Persona

2005-12-19 10:46:17 am

Castlevania?

I also want to know if it's single seg or not.

Lucid Faia

2005-12-19 07:14:45 pm

Yeah, I said it.

Yeah, it will be single-segment. I forgot to mention that.

Enhasa

2005-12-19 10:32:15 pm

everybody wanna tell you the meaning of music

Thanks for clearing that up, Lucid. I forgot that you needed Soul of Bat to get the Silver Ring at that point and I also forgot about the library card in the Colosseum.

And guys, it wouldn't very well replace the old run if it weren't SS, would it?

Gorash

2005-12-19 11:15:34 pm

${$uid.$user}{' usertext'}

just checking. Wink

There is a nice number of runs in the queue. We will have a lot to watch after christmas.

Lucid Faia

Edit history:

Lucid Faia: 2005-12-21 05:12:59 am

2005-12-21 05:11:47 am

Yeah, I said it.

I tried several more runs last night, but it was not meant to be. Coming off of the most ridiculous sequence of run failures I've ever seen (from a power outage to the cat stepping on the VCR remote), I had some very nice runs, one of which actually ended on Lord Dracula. >_<

It's looking like sub-45 minutes is a definite possibility with this route. In my best run, I was in the Inverted Castle in just over 27 minutes. Smiley

EDIT: By the way, skipping the Leap Stone entirely is a no-go. Without it, "stacking" Gravity Boot jumps are not possible; the game will only allow one at a time. Also, it won't allow for the move to be performed in mid-air, making it nearly useless. Therefore, the Leap Stone and Gravity Boots should both be collected.

Enhasa

2005-12-21 06:27:17 pm

everybody wanna tell you the meaning of music

This is going to be good.

I didn't know not picking up the Leap Stone nuked the Gravity Boots like that. Of course then I agree 100%. Oh, have you tried other Inverted Castle routes?

Lucid Faia

Edit history:

Lucid Faia: 2005-12-26 12:33:20 am

2005-12-26 12:21:42 am

Yeah, I said it.

I just finished this run! ^_^

Yes, I did a run on Christmas day. >_>

I timed this using Twin Galaxies general timing rules, which means I started timing from the time I selected the file, not from the time I gained control of Richter at the beginning, and then stopped timing after skipping the final cutscene to view the ending. The time I got was 44:11. Under SDA timing, it will likely be just under 44 minutes, maybe around 43:47 or so. The run went great. Few mistakes were made, and the biggest mistake probably cost me all of 5 seconds. I can objectively say that it will be a tough one to beat.

I'll be making a copy of the run. The next day the post office is open, I'll send the original to SDA and the copy to TG.

DAMURDOC

2005-12-26 02:57:29 am

The BaldurManiac

Quote:

I just finished this run! ^_^

Yes, I did a run on Christmas day. >_>

I timed this using Twin Galaxies general timing rules, which means I started timing from the time I selected the file, not from the time I gained control of Richter at the beginning, and then stopped timing after skipping the final cutscene to view the ending. The time I got was 44:11. Under SDA timing, it will likely be just under 44 minutes, maybe around 43:47 or so. The run went great. Few mistakes were made, and the biggest mistake probably cost me all of 5 seconds. I can objectively say that it will be a tough one to beat.

I'll be making a copy of the run. The next day the post office is open, I'll send the original to SDA and the copy to TG.

Good job

VorpalEdge

2005-12-26 03:16:52 am

welcome to the machine

Congrats, Lucid.

Enhasa

2005-12-27 06:21:31 am

everybody wanna tell you the meaning of music

I don't know how you don't have more congratulations, really. Congrats from me!

Glad to see wolf stomping worked out for you. Wink

I want some unknowing viewer to be like, wha?

getter77

2005-12-27 01:45:26 pm

100% runs=great to watch

Congrats from me as well. Always nice to see people work hard on refining a classic they like so much.

Zen

2005-12-28 12:37:56 am

Forward standard-by-ten .

Outstanding. I can't wait. I just hope you kept a copy for yourself, just in case.

spineshark

2005-12-30 06:33:37 am

新世紀進歩的羽扇子音楽

I found this game and bought it (as I had doubts that I would really see it again) TODAY, but thanks to my lack of a PlayStation of any sort...

well I emulated it, except somewhere in the copying madness I lost the file that emulates the save card, so my progress (to after the Scylla (?) fight) was all lost. Game is really easy in light of all the time I spent playing Circle...but I totally can't wait to see this run.

Enhasa

2005-12-31 05:10:51 am

everybody wanna tell you the meaning of music

This game is not rare at all. It's on Greatest Hits.

You could always re-download the PS1 save BIOS. It's not hard to find.

Oh and SotN was honestly pretty easy back in the day too.

spineshark

2005-12-31 06:32:00 am

新世紀進歩的羽扇子音楽

Yeah, when I saw it was "Greatest Hits" I was thinking like "DOH!" but whatever, I knew I'd shell out for a PS1 (all 20 bucks...OH NOES!) eventually when I became an RPG Zombie, I just thought it would be when I was off to college, instead it's like as soon as I can...

I've got the save issue fixed, though I'd say it's irrelevant as the promise of playing the game NOT at half speed in the very near future is too tantalizing to put up with crap.

Adam Grise

2006-01-17 07:36:04 pm

Adam, I gotta commend you, brotha! I loved the run!

I have to say right now that you made a LOT more progress on the run than I did. Nobody had beaten the "record" I'd had for about 8 months, so I started to hammer at it again.

I'd discovered how to skip Spike Breaker (which nullified my efforts in the spike room, and getting through it without the echo of bat... I was sad to find that my efforts were wasted. ;-D), but I definitely didn't know about skipping the leap stone. That's wonderful!

I'd smoothed out some of my boss fights (like the few that utilized the watch), but you still owned with the sword/fist combo. I simply never reached the "speed-runner's" state of mind that's really required to kick this game's ass the way you did. I love it!

Keep up the work, bro! Extremely well done. =D

~Adam

spineshark

Edit history:

spineshark: 2006-01-18 05:31:42 am

2006-01-18 05:31:07 am

新世紀進歩的羽扇子音楽

Sweet! I didn't have to find this again!

The night I got this I just watched the parts I wanted to see: the major improvements and the fight with Death (because I suck).

I don't know what to say, this run floored me. The first one I watched long ago, since I doubted I'd ever get to play the game, and I couldn't understand a bit of it...I watched it again after I'd gotten really close to the ending of the game (and found my own Crissaegrem hehehehe) because I couldn't wait...this run is a heck of a lot of fun to watch.

I'm still trying to figure out that Wolf/Mist jump in Long Library though...O_o It looked so damn easy!

Apolo

2006-01-18 07:39:03 am

I love YaBB 1G - SP1!

First off, great job on the run. I watched it at least 3 times now. I'm so happy that someone finally utilized and showed to the public the game's glitches that were actually discovered 2 years ago. Not to sound like an arrogant prick, but just telling the truth.

Now for some comments-

On your way back after getting the Leap Stone, instead of just jumping from platform to platform, try to doublejump then downwards kick from platform to platform. I think I was actually able to outrun the Flea Riders using that method back when I was doing a Minimum Kill run (since Flea Riders could kill you FAST when you're at such a low level). You could also use that doublejump/stomp trick at times whenever Alucard isn't backdashing or wingsmashing.

Now that I think about it, a SoTN minimum kill run would be an entirely different category, right? Maybe I could submit my run sometime.

KennyMan666

2006-01-18 03:53:08 pm

Precursor

I don't know about minimum kill, though low level would be included in a low% game which would be it's own category. So, no killings except for bosses, and no picking up any items other than those that are required to actually finish the game.