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bangerra: 2012-06-06 07:16:02 am
I've taken interest in running Castle of Illusion for Sega Master System [PAL].
Because I like the game, and SDA needs more SMS games!

I haven't done any route planning yet, though the TAS would be a good place to start:

http://tasvideos.org/1344M.html

Overall it looks rather doable, though there seems to be some zips and clips that might be hard.
at 0:38 fall through floor,
2:22 walk through wall (though I think I've done this before, might just be a secret),
12:52 jump over ghost through ceiling into the next room
and boss strategies (some of them seem very TAS only, though the boss patterns are usually very predictable).

I know Adam was talking about this game on #sda, so any tips might be usefull (or even cooperation for the best run?)
Thread title:  
Both the 'tricks' at 0:38 and 2:22 are just part of the game (I just checked).  I figure that they are just both the quickest way to reach the end of the level. 

The Ghost Bounce does look relatively difficult, but with practice a fairly good set-up might be possible, but from memory the room below isn't too bad, but the ladder on the other side caused me a few problems when playing it a while back.  So even if the trick isn't 100%, a fairly reliable set-up that takes a few attempts would be better than taking the normal route.

I don't know too much about boss strategies, I don't remember the bosses being too hard, but with some work some decent strategies could be found (or so I would expect).
Edit history:
bangerra: 2012-06-07 08:15:07 am
I've been messing around a bit on emulator and every single trick in the TAS can be consistently done, though the ghost jump requires a fairly simple setup with the yellow night.
One trick I missed the first time is at the start of stage 2, where you clip through a falling orange platform. This is kinda glitchy, but it can also be done consistently.

The parts that will probably differ from the TAS are the boss fights. There's a good bit of randomness to some of them and the strats on the Book and the Clock don't seem doable non-TAS.
The part that will make or break the run are the 2 final bosses though. The Dragon is a giant pain to hit consistently with the TAS strat, sometimes it works, sometimes it doesn't.
The Witch can only be quickkilled while holding the flame if you haven't lost a life yet (I'm sure this is a glitch), so in a good run that shouldn't be much of a problem..
Totally rad
Glad to hear someone's picking this game up! I've worked on a (casual) speed run through this game before, and could share some of my routes, but I'm pretty sure they're exactly the same as the one in the TAS (which I'm watching now - so far it's almost the same as what I used - ) or what you would come up with, since there are no real fancy tricks involved. You've already found the huge time savers, which are the secret passages; they're indispensable and allow you to skip some pretty nasty rooms.

I'd be thrilled to compete in making a run, but I've only got the PAL version at my disposal at the moment, whereas I'd prefer running NTSC. Perhaps I will also pick up this game again very soon, though Smiley
I've managed to get in a decent run today (18:04) with room for improvement (at least 10 seconds).
The errors are obvious, I didn't fail anything important though, all tricks and glitches I'll be using are in this run.
Converted to NTSC this would be +/- 15:00.



Edit history:
btrim: 2013-02-03 09:04:18 pm
I've been running this in NTSC since December 2012.

My PB so far is 16:31, I still have some things that aren't clean or consistent yet.

Where do you start the time?  I start when I select normal, because you can have an effect on the text, but I guess that's not really SDA style timing.  I do end when I lose control though.

Here's an older 16:59 run (2 parts).  I'll get my recent PB up soon.

Also, I'm really, really, really sorry for what they did to you PAL region folks Sad 
Hockey enthusiast
Looking forwards to see your progress! Keep at it!

This site needs more SEGA-love!
I forgot where I started the timer.. Probably when I gain control in the first stage (SDA timing). Timer stops when I land the final hit on the witch. You'll need to get a solid sub 15 (closer to 14 probably) for a good time. My time can be improved by probably a minute or more (certainly considering the new skip that was found that skips half the Clock Tower).
Running this on NTSC is really damn hard though. Even on the slower PAL is very hard to precisely time some of the tricks.
Imho the game runs too fast on NTSC, the music runs like a madman in 60Hz. I have a few games with this 'problem' btw. I believe a lot of these games were made with the european community in mind, because the SMS did very poorly in the US.
Quote from bangerra:
I forgot where I started the timer.. Probably when I gain control in the first stage (SDA timing). Timer stops when I land the final hit on the witch. You'll need to get a solid sub 15 (closer to 14 probably) for a good time. My time can be improved by probably a minute or more (certainly considering the new skip that was found that skips half the Clock Tower).


OK, then my current PB is probably closer to 16

Quote from bangerra:
Running this on NTSC is really damn hard though. Even on the slower PAL is very hard to precisely time some of the tricks.
Imho the game runs too fast on NTSC, the music runs like a madman in 60Hz. I have a few games with this 'problem' btw. I believe a lot of these games were made with the european community in mind, because the SMS did very poorly in the US.


I agree about it being hard, but I have to disagree on it being "too fast."  This game is way too slow on PAL.  Mickey already runs too slowly.  I think we'll have to agree to disagree though, as we each clearly grew up playing games at different speeds.  The only section I'd consider too fast on NTSC is the second set of three ghosts in the castle autoscroller. 

While translating times from PAL to NTSC is a good gauge of quality (which I agree is important for a showcase like SDA) I don't think it's any indicator of skill with the game, and it seems like we agree on that.

(BTW, I idle sometimes in #speedrunslive  on IRC if you ever want to chat.  I'm usually on in the weekend afternoons EST (GMT-5) )

Yeah sure, I'm on IRC all the time. I've only had the SMS for a good 3 years I think, so it's not really the childhood memories. It's more the music that gets me.. it just sounds too fast. Anyway, converting times is easy on SMS as it should be an exact number. I guess I could time it on one of the sidescrollers.
Edit history:
polarity: 2013-02-06 03:33:49 am
polarity: 2013-02-06 03:31:54 am
polarity: 2013-02-06 03:29:33 am
polarity: 2013-02-06 03:28:03 am
polarity: 2013-02-06 03:26:29 am
polarity: 2013-02-06 01:49:41 am
here's what happens if you jump while standing still on a slope and holding an item:



useful?
Does it follow you if you go to the next screen?
If it doesn't then I don't see much use for it. It looks pretty cool though thumbsup
Quote from bangerra:
Does it follow you if you go to the next screen?
If it doesn't then I don't see much use for it. It looks pretty cool though thumbsup


The item you're currently "holding" will follow you, but any you have stocked up won't. So you can at least do your jump attack while also carrying an item around, still not sure if it's useful though.

Any tips for dealing with the dragon?
Just copy what I do in my video?
Wait in the corner untill he shoots, and run under the fireballs. This will give you enough time to get your hit in.
The TAS doesn't wait, but fuck the TAS, this dragon is too OP.
Any way to manipulate the stage 1 boss? Randomness there sucks...
If you stand close to him (like 1.5 bosslengths away) and face him, he seems more likely to only do 1 sweep. But I could be wrong.
Edit history:
polarity: 2013-02-16 01:54:12 pm
polarity: 2013-02-16 01:54:11 pm
polarity: 2013-02-16 01:54:05 pm
polarity: 2013-02-16 01:53:24 pm
polarity: 2013-02-16 09:57:04 am
i got a 15:14 (on emu)
Nice run with all the tricks.  New NTSC WR, actually.  Beats my 15:39 on console.

What emulator do you use?


Wonderprincess
He uses Kega Fusion (iirc). Awesome run, I hope you'll still run it and beat your own record Smiley
Edit history:
polarity: 2013-02-20 04:23:57 pm
14:43
Nice run! There's a lot of funky jumps you can do over the blue weights in the final level though. So there's still a lot of time to be saved. Also: you can try hitting the clock boss in midair as long as you have some hp left, every hit saves like 8 seconds!
14:19 still with some slop http://www.twitch.tv/polarityy/c/1981958
new boss strat. can anyone find anything practical that is faster?
Well, you can hit him without taking damage, but it's pretty damn hard. he basicly has to be at his lowest point, and micky at his highest point facing away from the clock.