Binding of Isaac

2011-11-21 11:33:25 am

Wiggle wiggle

I played a round with BrimChoco after the nerf. It's still good, just doesn't completely rape Mom1 and Satan anymore. But if you're going for the Shovel, Mom1 doesn't matter, and it still does respectable damage against Satan, just not the huge damage it did before. Basically, it's just that now you have two alternatives to search for when luck manipulating, rather than just the Dr. Fetus one. Rather than argue "which one's better", try and beat both if one comes up, rather than throwing it away because it's not Dr. Fetus.

André

Edit history:

André: 2011-11-25 12:42:42 pm

André: 2011-11-25 10:49:21 am

André: 2011-11-25 10:48:59 am

2011-11-25 10:01:23 am

Main Work!!!

Hey Marsh, just saw your speedrun. I find sad that when someone doesn't know the game(random stuff) it look pretty casual but when we know all of it, your run was incredibly sick. Good job and continue on this.

I didn't have a lot of time to play it since I bought it recently, so I have a couple of questions there's:
1-The reason you have dice when you start, is it because you finish the game a couple of times?
2-IIRC, Dr. Fetus can only be found after a certain number of playthrough(4 I think)?
3-Does it change anything else than the dice when you finish a certain number of time(I.E. damage, range, etc.)
4-Will this count toward a NG+.

EDIT: And BTW here's an attempt fail I did for new game.

My beginning was very nice(got kamikaze and Judgement) but I move up too soon. I was pretty satisfied until I died Tongue

.

marshmallow

Edit history:

marshmallow: 2011-11-25 10:52:08 am

marshmallow: 2011-11-25 10:51:58 am

2011-11-25 10:50:58 am

Jack of all Trades

12m59s no shovel Fetus run. Still plenty of derp moments and a bad turn or two but it's a new non-shovel PR. Still trying for sub-10:00.

Andre: 1. I think you get it for beating the game with "???" (the blue fetus guy). I got it before the Halloween patch so I dunno if you have to go all the way to Satan or just Mom's Heart. 2. That's right. 3. The game adds more bosses as you unlock them. 4. I guess so.

Everyone else: Brimstone would be tough because that + a shovel from a devil room would be 2 hearts, but yeah I've been on the lookout. I've also tried a couple knife runs but nothing that got very far.

Another tip is to pretty much never use pills unless you're about to die or there's nothing to lose because telepills can really ruin your day. I've also been using the Dead Sea Scrolls when I see them early on before using the dice because they can giver permanent upgrades right? It'd be funny to get a Fetus or Mega off it.

[url=http://marsh.speedrunwiki.com/Binding%20of%20Isaac/BoI_marsh_LongFetus_12m59s.mp4]12m59s no shovel Fetus run.[/url] Still plenty of derp moments and a bad turn or two but it's a new non-shovel PR. Still trying for sub-10:00.

Andre: 1. I think you get it for beating the game with [i]"???"[/i] (the blue fetus guy). I got it before the Halloween patch so I dunno if you have to go all the way to Satan or just Mom's Heart. 2. That's right. 3. The game adds more bosses as you unlock them. 4. I guess so.

Everyone else: Brimstone would be tough because that + a shovel from a devil room would be 2 hearts, but yeah I've been on the lookout. I've also tried a couple knife runs but nothing that got very far.

Another tip is to pretty much never use pills unless you're about to die or there's nothing to lose because telepills can really ruin your day. I've also been using the Dead Sea Scrolls when I see them early on before using the dice because they can giver permanent upgrades right? It'd be funny to get a Fetus or Mega off it.

BlueGlass

Edit history:

BlueGlass: 2011-11-25 06:58:13 pm

2011-11-25 05:59:42 pm

Yep yep yep!

Yeah, the D6 is Mom's Heart with "???"

Actually, Brimstone costs two hearts now, not one like it did originally.

About the Dead Sea Scrolls, I've used them a bunch, but I haven't seen a single permanent upgrade since before the post-Halloween update, so I'm wondering if they removed that in addition to the Brimstone nerfing.

A few random comments on things I've noticed. First, the stats displayed on the pause screen are not entirely accurate. For example, Judas's base damage is 4, and he takes 2 shots to kill an attack fly. Cain or Isaac with 4 damage will only need one shot. Also, at least some of the stats can exceed the displayed maximum; damage and speed clearly keep going, the other two are harder to tell. As for other observations, the Oujia Board and Small Rock both give a small boost to tears, something (either parasite or inner eye, probably the latter) gives a huge boost to Brimstone's damage, and (useless in a speedrun but oh well) max regular hearts, unlike soul hearts, cannot continue offscreen.

Yeah, the D6 is Mom's Heart with "???"

Actually, Brimstone costs two hearts now, not one like it did originally.

About the Dead Sea Scrolls, I've used them a bunch, but I haven't seen a single permanent upgrade since before the post-Halloween update, so I'm wondering if they removed that in addition to the Brimstone nerfing.

A few random comments on things I've noticed.  First, the stats displayed on the pause screen are not entirely accurate.  For example, Judas's base damage is 4, and he takes 2 shots to kill an attack fly.  Cain or Isaac with 4 damage will only need one shot.  Also, at least some of the stats can exceed the displayed maximum; damage and speed clearly keep going, the other two are harder to tell.  As for other observations, the Oujia Board and Small Rock both give a small boost to tears, something (either parasite or inner eye, probably the latter) gives a huge boost to Brimstone's damage, and (useless in a speedrun but oh well) max regular hearts, unlike soul hearts, cannot continue offscreen.

Fragmaster01

Edit history:

Fragmaster01: 2011-11-26 12:36:10 am

Fragmaster01: 2011-11-25 08:16:23 pm

2011-11-25 08:16:03 pm

Wiggle wiggle

Quote from AndréLucLévesque:

I was pretty satisfied until I died.

I think that sums up everyone's thoughts about learning the game. Tongue

An addition to BlueGlass' comments: Speed does have a max(having gotten massive hordes of Speed Up pills in my last Cain playthrough), but it is higher than 8 points, and honestly at that level of speed you start having control issues anyway. Also, some items ignore the usual stat basis: The Sad Onion, for one, doubles your rate of fire regardless of your current tears stat, but shows up as adding points to the stat anyway. (This particular example is irrelevant to our interests, as it only works with Tearshot style attacks, but it was what I could think of off the top of my brainmeat).

marshmallow

Edit history:

marshmallow: 2011-11-26 06:51:35 pm

marshmallow: 2011-11-26 06:49:47 pm

marshmallow: 2011-11-26 06:45:57 pm

marshmallow: 2011-11-26 06:36:35 pm

marshmallow: 2011-11-26 06:33:50 pm

marshmallow: 2011-11-26 06:33:35 pm

marshmallow: 2011-11-26 06:32:45 pm

2011-11-26 06:30:56 pm

Jack of all Trades

I sat down and told myself I wasn't going to stop playing until I had one run where I had both fetus and a shovel before caves 2. Five hours later this run happened.

I'm usually pretty composed in the face of repeated video game failures but after this session I wanted to throw something.

I felt like the game was trolling me with all those rooms full of zombies. I could've fought Mom's Heart and gotten to Sheol in about the same time, maybe like 10 secs earlier depending if bosses come out or not. But I figured I'd keep clearing rooms in hopes of getting hearts or an emperor card. Ugh, the leeches. And I barely hit the last frame of that vagina enemy laser. And I didn't check that one potential secret room area, what if there was a raw liver or a 1-up or a slot machine full of hearts there?

Of course, even if I didn't die maybe I would've gone the wrong way everytime in Sheol. That's a good rationalization. I didn't like having Ouija board bombs either.

Basement 2 = 0:38 (earliest shovel ever)
Caves 1 = 1:45
Caves 2 = 1:54
Depths 1 = 3:18
Depths 2 = 5:20
Womb 1 = 5:47
Womb 2 = 7:09
Sheol = 8:28 (my PR is 8:17)
DIE = 8:36

I think if everything goes absolutely perfectly then below 9:00 could be possible. Arrive in Sheol around 8:00, emperor card, kill Satan in 35ish secs with mega bombs.

I sat down and told myself I wasn't going to stop playing until I had one run where I had both fetus and a shovel before caves 2. Five hours later [url=http://marsh.speedrunwiki.com/Binding%20of%20Isaac/BoI_marsh_Five%20Hour%20Fail.mp4]this run happened.[/url]

I'm usually pretty composed in the face of repeated video game failures but after this session I wanted to throw something.

I felt like the game was trolling me with all those rooms full of zombies. I could've fought Mom's Heart and gotten to Sheol in about the same time, maybe like 10 secs earlier depending if bosses come out or not. But I figured I'd keep clearing rooms in hopes of getting hearts or an emperor card. Ugh, the leeches. And I barely hit the last frame of that vagina enemy laser. And I didn't check that one potential secret room area, what if there was a raw liver or a 1-up or a slot machine full of hearts there?

Of course, even if I didn't die maybe I would've gone the wrong way everytime in Sheol. That's a good rationalization. I didn't like having Ouija board bombs either.

Basement 2 = 0:38 (earliest shovel ever)
Caves 1 = 1:45
Caves 2 = 1:54
Depths 1 = 3:18
Depths 2 = 5:20
Womb 1 = 5:47
Womb 2 = 7:09
Sheol = 8:28 (my PR is 8:17)
DIE = 8:36

I think if everything goes absolutely perfectly then below 9:00 could be possible. Arrive in Sheol around 8:00, emperor card, kill Satan in 35ish secs with mega bombs.

marshmallow

2011-11-28 01:14:07 pm

Jack of all Trades

I probably should have tested this 4 or 5 pages ago but better late than never I guess. With Dr. Fetus if you go up to the north, west, or south wall and shoot a bomb it will stay against the wall. Against the east wall it will bounce off for some arcane reason. So if you're trying to blast open a door or find a secret room on the right hand side wall don't go right up against it (unless you have mega, maybe).

marshmallow

Edit history:

marshmallow: 2011-12-03 02:43:30 pm

marshmallow: 2011-12-03 02:32:41 pm

marshmallow: 2011-12-03 02:31:23 pm

marshmallow: 2011-12-03 02:30:58 pm

2011-12-03 02:30:36 pm

Jack of all Trades

An 11:47 shovel run (new WR).

Basement 2 = 1:13
Caves 1 = 2:19
Caves 2 = 2:54
Depths 1 = 3:48
Depths 2 = 5:20
Womb 1 = 7:19
Womb 2 = 8:39
Sheol = 9:58
Satan = 11:03
DONE = 11:47

This run felt really good. I was confident I had ~10:00 but nope. Sad

New world record though.

A lot of stupidity in basement 1-2. Didn't get the blue rock from the worm boss or use the dice on the hanger after I got the shovel in the devil room. And leaving/coming back to the secret room with the one armed bandit, or trying to get into the boss room in basement 1 from the secret room (IMPOSSIBLE HURRR).

My Caves 1 arrival is like a minute slower than my best times, I think that was mostly just bad layouts + luck. Depths 1, 25 secs wasted looking for a secret room then clearing rocks for the blue rock + worthless gold chest. Worth it, sure, especially since I had low hp, but still. That's a lot of time to not be filling the shovel meter.

Ditto in Depths 2, 39 secs 'wasted' getting hearts from the arcade, collecting the mega, and then running back through all the empty rooms to get to the next enemy room. Unlucky map layout I guess.

I was really happy with the Womb stages.

Considering I didn't have an emperor card or a maphack (sun/compass) I got to Satan pretty fast but still, a whole minute. The fight itself was really smooth though.

[url=http://marsh.speedrunwiki.com/Binding%20of%20Isaac/BoI_marsh_shovel_11m47s.mp4]An 11:47 shovel run (new WR).[/url]

Basement 2 = 1:13
Caves 1 = 2:19
Caves 2 = 2:54
Depths 1 = 3:48
Depths 2 = 5:20
Womb 1 = 7:19
Womb 2 = 8:39
Sheol = 9:58
Satan = 11:03 
DONE = 11:47

This run felt really good. I was confident I had ~10:00 but nope. :( New world record though.

A lot of stupidity in basement 1-2. Didn't get the blue rock from the worm boss or use the dice on the hanger after I got the shovel in the devil room. And leaving/coming back to the secret room with the one armed bandit, or trying to get into the boss room in basement 1 from the secret room (IMPOSSIBLE HURRR).

My Caves 1 arrival is like a minute slower than my best times, I think that was mostly just bad layouts + luck. Depths 1, 25 secs wasted looking for a secret room then clearing rocks for the blue rock + worthless gold chest. Worth it, sure, especially since I had low hp, but still. That's a lot of time to not be filling the shovel meter.

Ditto in Depths 2, 39 secs 'wasted' getting hearts from the arcade, collecting the mega, and then running back through all the empty rooms to get to the next enemy room. Unlucky map layout I guess.

I was really happy with the Womb stages.

Considering I didn't have an emperor card or a maphack (sun/compass) I got to Satan pretty fast but still, a whole minute. The fight itself was really smooth though.

André

2011-12-03 02:44:47 pm

Main Work!!!

I'm downloading this now. Hope it's gonna be good or else... that's it.

Finally, for my run I decided to do a Low% speedrun since I think an any% would be very vague.
My definition of low% is grabbing no key Item, Tarot card or Pills. So the only thing I can count on is my tears at minimum damage, bombs, heart and soul hearth.

So I'll comment on your run as soon as I'm done watching it(which mean in 11minutes 47 seconds.

André

2011-12-03 03:02:59 pm

Main Work!!!

Nice job,

Sad that there is a couple of time waster that could have been avoid but we can't predict all(sadly). I have a question there: In depths 2, you were probably near of the boss when you got your full shovel, don't you think it would have been faster to complete the level(including the boss, that probably wouldn't be that hard with all your upgrade) and as soon as you enter the Womb 1, use the shovel?

Aside from this, very good and I can't wait for the day you'll have the almost absolute luck because now I think Sub-10 is achievable.

Imperfect

2011-12-03 09:38:59 pm

I have watched all your runs so far Marshmallow. They have been awesome, some of the item luck is amazing and you are rather efficient in most rooms! I have noticed that you really have improved your room to room killing with Dr. Fetus over the months. There is only one thing that I suggest, after you get Dr. Fetus and the Shovel I think you should ignore all Secret rooms and Satan item rooms. The only exception is as a shortcut to Satan while in Sheol. Other than that they are a waste of time, the only benefit to them outside of the exception is a small possibility of finding health if you are a lucky enough to get a lottery machine and one that drops health. The 1-up may seem enticing but if you die during Satan the first time your run will be killed because redoing him will take too long. I think you can save half a minute or so on average on runs if you don't look/enter secret rooms and Satan item rooms after you have Dr. Fetus and the Shovel.

Onin

2011-12-04 07:03:42 am

I assumed he visits the other secret rooms and Satan rooms to find another Shovel, which would have a reset cooldown and save quite a bit of time - IF you get it.

BlueGlass

2011-12-04 09:24:05 am

Yep yep yep!

Nice to see another completed run.

A couple things. First, it would've made more sense to save "the world" for a floor where you hadn't already found the boss room. Second, while it turned out okay this time, using up your shovel when there was a trapdoor on the next screen just doesn't make sense; you got incredibly lucky with the boss room being so close in caves 1. Other than that, you did a great job clearing rooms. There's a clear improvement in your bomb skills, especially looking at the later levels.

Congratulations on the success.

Onin

2011-12-04 10:39:14 am

Now I'm wondering whether reverting the game to pre-Brimstone nerf and aiming for ChocoBrim+Shovel can run faster than Fetus+Shovel...

marshmallow

Edit history:

marshmallow: 2011-12-04 12:41:14 pm

marshmallow: 2011-12-04 12:38:47 pm

marshmallow: 2011-12-04 12:35:01 pm

marshmallow: 2011-12-04 12:31:31 pm

marshmallow: 2011-12-04 12:26:51 pm

2011-12-04 12:25:12 pm

Jack of all Trades

Quote from AndréLucLévesque:

Finally, for my run I decided to do a Low% speedrun since I think an any% would be very vague.
My definition of low% is grabbing no key Item, Tarot card or Pills. So the only thing I can count on is my tears at minimum damage, bombs, heart and soul hearth.

I dunno, I wouldn't think tarots or pills would count as collectable items that add to your overall percent because they're random, one time use, and not kept track of by the game. But I can see why you'd want to avoid having to get an emperor/sun card for sheol.

Quote:

I have a question there: In depths 2, you were probably near of the boss when you got your full shovel, don't you think it would have been faster to complete the level(including the boss, that probably wouldn't be that hard with all your upgrade) and as soon as you enter the Womb 1, use the shovel?

This is a good point, although the boss could've also been in the lower right part of the map. I probably should've checked at least the next room out. If it's full of enemies with no boss room, use the shovel.

Quote:

Aside from this, very good and I can't wait for the day you'll have the almost absolute luck because now I think Sub-10 is achievable.

I could've had sub-10 awhile back if I wasn't unlucky/bad. My PR (personal record) for arriving in Sheol is 8:17.

Quote from Imperfect:

There is only one thing that I suggest, after you get Dr. Fetus and the Shovel I think you should ignore all Secret rooms and Satan item rooms. The only exception is as a shortcut to Satan while in Sheol. Other than that they are a waste of time, the only benefit to them outside of the exception is a small possibility of finding health if you are a lucky enough to get a lottery machine and one that drops health.

I don't know how the secret room determines what it spawns but I don't think the one armed bandits are that rare. Most of the time it's either coins or the machine. Plus they can drop tarot cards. But yeah, I try not to look for them too much after I get the shovel. I only looked in the depths because I had 1 heart. If this was like a normal, static game I could play riskier in general but you can play for days and not find the right items.

Quote:

The 1-up may seem enticing but if you die during Satan the first time your run will be killed because redoing him will take too long. I think you can save half a minute or so on average on runs if you don't look/enter secret rooms and Satan item rooms after you have Dr. Fetus and the Shovel.

I agree that the 1-up isn't good for a boss fight. But for a normal room in Sheol it would only waste like 5 seconds to be resurrected, assuming you kill yourself as you enter the room.

Quote from Onin:

I assumed he visits the other secret rooms and Satan rooms to find another Shovel, which would have a reset cooldown and save quite a bit of time - IF you get it.

AFAIK this isn't possible. I've never seen an item, once collected, appear twice in a run -- even with dice.

Quote from BlueGlass:

A couple things. First, it would've made more sense to save "the world" for a floor where you hadn't already found the boss room.

I'm torn because I find like 10 fetus jars for every shovel and I've found almost all my shovels before caves 1. So I feel like I needed to get that secret room ASAP. Basement 2 can be large and have multiple potential secret room locations. This time it didn't, but it could've. Maybe I should've just gone to the boss room, killed him, then used the map on caves 1 and see if I can get a secret/boss shovel there but it's a gamble either way. For all I knew the caves 1 boss could've been 12 rooms away instead of 1. Every cleared room without a shovel is wasted time.

Quote:

Second, while it turned out okay this time, using up your shovel when there was a trapdoor on the next screen just doesn't make sense; you got incredibly lucky with the boss room being so close in caves 1.

The funny thing is I didn't even notice I did that after I rendered the video and watched it or else I definitely would've made fun of myself in the summary. But yeah, that is obviously pretty retarded of me. Looks like that cost about 35 seconds. I need to keep the reward center of my brain in check when I finally find that dumb implement instead of going "ZOMG FINALLY USE IT NAOOOOOO!!1"

Quote:

Other than that, you did a great job clearing rooms. There's a clear improvement in your bomb skills, especially looking at the later levels.

The only areas where I feel like I've improved are surviving leech rooms (get out of the perimeter and into the inner rings of the room) and knowing that the east wall bounces bombs back at you if you're point blank. The other stuff is just luck. Especially when you shoot a bomb at an enemy and it decides to just go through them for no reason. And the mega always makes things a lot easier. It wasn't in the video, but they one shot those floating horse head enemies instead of taking iirc 2 regular bombs.

And if I ever get in that one room full of zombies where there are holes everywhere I'm gonna get boned again.

The Devil Baby familiar item would complement Fetus pretty well since it takes care of annoying enemies that get too close. Probably should still roll it for a mega, but it'd make things a bit smoother (especially for flies).

Quote from Onin:

Now I'm wondering whether reverting the game to pre-Brimstone nerf and aiming for ChocoBrim+Shovel can run faster than Fetus+Shovel...

Go for it if you want. Would using past versions be a separate category?

[quote="AndréLucLévesque"]
Finally, for my run I decided to do a Low% speedrun since I think an any% would be very vague.
My definition of low% is grabbing no key Item, Tarot card or Pills. So the only thing I can count on is my tears at minimum damage, bombs, heart and soul hearth.[/quote]

I dunno, I wouldn't think tarots or pills would count as collectable items that add to your overall percent because they're random, one time use, and not kept track of by the game. But I can see why you'd want to avoid having to get an emperor/sun card for sheol.

[quote]I have a question there: In depths 2, you were probably near of the boss when you got your full shovel, don't you think it would have been faster to complete the level(including the boss, that probably wouldn't be that hard with all your upgrade) and as soon as you enter the Womb 1, use the shovel?[/quote]

This is a good point, although the boss could've also been in the lower right part of the map. I probably should've checked at least the next room out. If it's full of enemies with no boss room, use the shovel.

[quote]Aside from this, very good and I can't wait for the day you'll have the almost absolute luck because now I think Sub-10 is achievable.[/quote]

I could've had sub-10 awhile back if I wasn't unlucky/bad. My PR (personal record) for arriving in Sheol is 8:17.

[quote="Imperfect"]There is only one thing that I suggest, after you get Dr. Fetus and the Shovel I think you should ignore all Secret rooms and Satan item rooms.  The only exception is as a shortcut to Satan while in Sheol.  Other than that they are a waste of time, the only benefit to them outside of the exception is a small possibility of finding health if you are a lucky enough to get a lottery machine and one that drops health.[/quote]

I don't know how the secret room determines what it spawns but I don't think the one armed bandits are that rare. Most of the time it's either coins or the machine. Plus they can drop tarot cards. But yeah, I try not to look for them too much after I get the shovel. I only looked in the depths because I had 1 heart. If this was like a normal, static game I could play riskier in general but you can play for days and not find the right items.

[quote]The 1-up may seem enticing but if you die during Satan the first time your run will be killed because redoing him will take too long.  I think you can save half a minute or so on average on runs if you don't look/enter secret rooms and Satan item rooms after you have Dr. Fetus and the Shovel.  [/quote]

I agree that the 1-up isn't good for a boss fight. But for a normal room in Sheol it would only waste like 5 seconds to be resurrected, assuming you kill yourself as you enter the room.

[quote="Onin"]I assumed he visits the other secret rooms and Satan rooms to find another Shovel, which would have a reset cooldown and save quite a bit of time - IF you get it.[/quote]

AFAIK this isn't possible. I've never seen an item, once collected, appear twice in a run -- even with dice.

[quote="BlueGlass"]
A couple things.  First, it would've made more sense to save "the world" for a floor where you [i]hadn't[/i] already found the boss room.[/quote]

I'm torn because I find like 10 fetus jars for every shovel and I've found almost all my shovels before caves 1. So I feel like I needed to get that secret room ASAP. Basement 2 can be large and have multiple potential secret room locations. This time it didn't, but it could've. Maybe I should've just gone to the boss room, killed him, then used the map on caves 1 and see if I can get a secret/boss shovel there but it's a gamble either way. For all I knew the caves 1 boss could've been 12 rooms away instead of 1. Every cleared room without a shovel is wasted time.

[quote]Second, while it turned out okay this time, using up your shovel when there was a trapdoor on the next screen just doesn't make sense; you got incredibly lucky with the boss room being so close in caves 1.[/quote]

The funny thing is I didn't even notice I did that after I rendered the video and watched it or else I definitely would've made fun of myself in the summary. But yeah, that is obviously pretty retarded of me. Looks like that cost about 35 seconds. I need to keep the reward center of my brain in check when I finally find that dumb implement instead of going "ZOMG FINALLY USE IT NAOOOOOO!!1"

[quote]Other than that, you did a great job clearing rooms.  There's a clear improvement in your bomb skills, especially looking at the later levels.[/quote]

The only areas where I feel like I've improved are surviving leech rooms (get out of the perimeter and into the inner rings of the room) and knowing that the east wall bounces bombs back at you if you're point blank. The other stuff is just luck. Especially when you shoot a bomb at an enemy and it decides to just go through them for no reason. And the mega always makes things a lot easier. It wasn't in the video, but they one shot those floating horse head enemies instead of taking iirc 2 regular bombs.

And if I ever get in that one room full of zombies where there are holes everywhere I'm gonna get boned again.

The Devil Baby familiar item would complement Fetus pretty well since it takes care of annoying enemies that get too close. Probably should still roll it for a mega, but it'd make things a bit smoother (especially for flies).

[quote="Onin"]Now I'm wondering whether reverting the game to pre-Brimstone nerf and aiming for ChocoBrim+Shovel can run faster than Fetus+Shovel...[/quote]

Go for it if you want. Would using past versions be a separate category?

zoonel

2011-12-04 04:08:40 pm

Go play spacechem !

hi,
maybe this has been discussed before but why don’t you visit the vendor room when you are close to them with enough money ? I think there is a possibility to buy the shovel and the battery can reduce the room to visit to recharge the shovel (or the dice).

Onin

Edit history:

Onin: 2011-12-04 06:41:55 pm

2011-12-04 06:40:29 pm

The only really good item from the vendor room is the Compass, which costs a looot of coins.

Quote:

Go for it if you want. Would using past versions be a separate category?

I don't think so. SDA rules state that the fastest patch should be run no matter what (although I find those rules rather outdated).

André

Edit history:

André: 2011-12-04 07:56:10 pm

2011-12-04 07:53:32 pm

Main Work!!!

Quote from marshmallow:

Quote from AndréLucLévesque:

Finally, for my run I decided to do a Low% speedrun since I think an any% would be very vague.
My definition of low% is grabbing no key Item, Tarot card or Pills. So the only thing I can count on is my tears at minimum damage, bombs, heart and soul hearth.

I dunno, I wouldn't think tarots or pills would count as collectable items that add to your overall percent because they're random, one time use, and not kept track of by the game. But I can see why you'd want to avoid having to get an emperor/sun card for sheol.

the reason why I don't think tarot card could be allowed is because there an effect that can be permanent(The Hanged Man) and pills can also give permanent effects(I.E. HP up, stats up/down in general and pretty fly)Maybe theres other effect than those I said there but they're the only one I can think of for the moment.

P.S.: To be considered a new game low%, am I supposed to restart a new game from the beginning like I do for a while now(I.E. just doing through the first run(through mom))

[quote="marshmallow"][quote="AndréLucLévesque"]
Finally, for my run I decided to do a Low% speedrun since I think an any% would be very vague.
My definition of low% is grabbing no key Item, Tarot card or Pills. So the only thing I can count on is my tears at minimum damage, bombs, heart and soul hearth.[/quote]

I dunno, I wouldn't think tarots or pills would count as collectable items that add to your overall percent because they're random, one time use, and not kept track of by the game. But I can see why you'd want to avoid having to get an emperor/sun card for sheol.[/quote]
the reason why I don't think tarot card could be allowed is because there an effect that can be permanent(The Hanged Man) and pills can also give permanent effects(I.E. HP up, stats up/down in general and pretty fly)Maybe theres other effect than those I said there but they're the only one I can think of for the moment.

P.S.: To be considered a new game low%, am I supposed to restart a new game from the beginning like I do for a while now(I.E. just doing through the first run(through mom))

Fragmaster01

2011-12-04 07:58:34 pm

Wiggle wiggle

Quote from AndréLucLévesque:

P.S.: To be considered a new game low%, am I supposed to restart a new game from the beginning like I do for a while now(I.E. just doing through the first run(through mom))

I'd think so, but obviously back up your save beforehand. As for tarot cards, I'd say that low% would involve no "permanent" powerups. Pills would be out just because it's so easy to accidentally get a permanent powerup, but Tarot Cards you can easily see whether you can use them safely or not upon picking them up.

André

2011-12-04 08:02:22 pm

Main Work!!!

Yeah, I agree with this. I though more that I didn't want to use them by security but yeah you're right, I would complete all the places the fastest I could and if by luck I drop a tarot, I'll check if it's emperor and if it'S the case, I'll keep it for depths 2.

BlueGlass

2011-12-04 11:28:35 pm

Yep yep yep!

Quote from Onin:

The only really good item from the vendor room is the Compass, which costs a looot of coins.

Don't forget the battery and 9-volt. The latter not only shortens the recharge meter by two ticks, but also gives you an instant refill.

Hanged Man's effect is not permanent, it only lasts one room. I think you're confusing it with the noose.

Also, as for different versions, how would you even get a past version anyway?

zoonel

2011-12-05 02:54:56 am

Go play spacechem !

Quote:

Also, as for different versions, how would you even get a past version anyway?

the humble bundle version

Quote:

The only really good item from the vendor room is the Compass, which costs a looot of coins.

there is the 9-volt, tarot cards, the shovel and they can be sold half the price. worth a check imho.

André

2011-12-05 06:44:29 am

Main Work!!!

Yeah in my opinion when you have 8 coins or 15, in the best scenario, you should go check. There's a lot of secret room you enter where there's 6 coins, so instead of going back, you could grab the coin in them and go to a shop when you drop by and buy the 9-volt or compass(worth 15 coins each or 8 when half and they're the only ones that could be very useful on a speedrun). So Marsh, if you have time for this, you should give a couple of attempts on this and give us news.

Fragmaster01

2011-12-05 08:51:12 am

Wiggle wiggle

And even if you don't find a battery/compass, you could find a Soul Heart or some other thing to help you along.

marshmallow

2011-12-05 01:56:52 pm

Jack of all Trades

One time I got a quarter from the treasure room and then bought a fetus from the shop.