Banjo-Kazooie: Nuts & Bolts

2008-11-20 10:43:46 am

gamelogs.org

Anyone else get past the fact that it's not Banjo-Threeie and realize its speed running/Sequence Breaking potential?
Started playing yesterday and messed around for hour with various SBs or at least pseudo-SBs in Showdown Town. Difficult to tell how much of it was intended by Rare, but I've certainly been able to reach loads of Mumbo crates and musical notes that I'm almost certain were not intended to be gotten so early.

So far I've found many Metroid Prime-esque glitches like pressing into slopes to gradually slide up them, allowing you to jump to a previously just-out-of-reach platform. Stuff like that is literally everywhere in Showdown Town— I've gotten just 7 Jiggies and already have two propellers, 3 medium engines, the medium fuel tank, and the heavy body blockset. Again, not sure which of these I'm 'supposed' to have by now, but I'm sure there's a map somewhere of each Mumbo crate that lists their contents (surely in Prima's guide). I'm also assuming the crates' contents aren't random. If they are, that would certainly screw up most route planning.

I'm definitely interesting in doing a run, but the route planning is going to take quite a while (and of course I'll need to actually beat the game at least once first). It's so open-ended in terms of the order you do things— I've unlocked three worlds already, so skipping all the more time-consuming level goals should be a cinch.

Questions for anyone who has the game: do you think getting Boggy's speed upgrades and Humba's blueprints is worth it? Would mean collecting more notes, but by being creative it shouldn't take too long to a few hundred of them in Showdown Town alone. Building vehicles can take a while, so I think it might be better just to buy and use the blueprints as much as possible, since there's no actual build time required.
Also, am I right that you only need 75 Jiggies to beat the game?

Finally: any runs would have to be single-segment due to the autosave system, but that's not really a big deal. The poor controls at the beginning of the game will take some practice getting used to, but thankfully the early goals are pitifully easy.

Thread title:

Anyone else get past the fact that it's not Banjo-Threeie and realize its speed running/Sequence Breaking potential?
Started playing yesterday and messed around for hour with various SBs or at least pseudo-SBs in Showdown Town. Difficult to tell how much of it was intended by Rare, but I've certainly been able to reach loads of Mumbo crates and musical notes that I'm almost certain were not intended to be gotten so early.

So far I've found many Metroid Prime-esque glitches like pressing into slopes to gradually slide up them, allowing you to jump to a previously just-out-of-reach platform. Stuff like that is literally everywhere in Showdown Town— I've gotten just 7 Jiggies and already have two propellers, 3 medium engines, the medium fuel tank, and the heavy body blockset. Again, not sure which of these I'm 'supposed' to have by now, but I'm sure there's a map somewhere of each Mumbo crate that lists their contents (surely in Prima's guide). I'm also assuming the crates' contents aren't random. If they are, that would certainly screw up most route planning.

I'm definitely interesting in doing a run, but the route planning is going to take quite a while (and of course I'll need to actually beat the game at least once first). It's so open-ended in terms of the order you do things— I've unlocked three worlds already, so skipping all the more time-consuming level goals should be a cinch.

Questions for anyone who has the game: do you think getting Boggy's speed upgrades and Humba's blueprints is worth it? Would mean collecting more notes, but by being creative it shouldn't take too long to a few hundred of them in Showdown Town alone. Building vehicles can take a while, so I think it might be better just to buy and use the blueprints as much as possible, since there's no actual build time required.
Also, am I right that you only need 75 Jiggies to beat the game?

Finally: any runs would have to be single-segment due to the autosave system, but that's not really a big deal. The poor controls at the beginning of the game will take some practice getting used to, but thankfully the early goals are pitifully easy.

Paraxade

2008-11-20 11:41:21 am

There's definitely a lot of potential for speedrunning this game. There's leaderboards for every challenge and you can download the top replays, so that could be helpful, though a lot of them involve using parts you don't get until later, or modifying the vehicle in LOG's choice ones, which would take too long for a run unless you did it really quickly. Seems it'd require a lot of balancing how long it takes to make a vehicle compared to how much time it'd save, although basic vehicles can be created fairly quickly.

Getting anywhere in Showdown Town isn't an issue, as there's a glitch that allows you to fly on the trolley. And yes, you need 75 jiggies to open up Spiral Mountain for the endgame, though there's 131 total.

The jiggies in Showdown Town are all pretty quick and most should be considered for a run; Jolly Dodger's jiggies for sure, and a couple of the tamper switches too, depending on how far out of the way they are. Buying Humba's blueprints could be useful if you already have the notes (which you probably would, seeing how you get 10 notes per completed challenge as well as all the ones laying around), and the speed upgrade depends on how often you'll be out of the vehicle; it probably wouldn't cost too much time to get it anyway, as long as you're already right there (right before going to Jiggosseum might be a good time). Jinjos are utterly useless for speed purposes and should be avoided.

I can't think of much more to say now, might post more later. It'd definitely be an interesting/complicated run though, so good luck to anyone who decides to attempt this.

There's definitely a lot of potential for speedrunning this game. There's leaderboards for every challenge and you can download the top replays, so that could be helpful, though a lot of them involve using parts you don't get until later, or modifying the vehicle in LOG's choice ones, which would take too long for a run unless you did it really quickly. Seems it'd require a lot of balancing how long it takes to make a vehicle compared to how much time it'd save, although basic vehicles can be created fairly quickly.

Getting anywhere in Showdown Town isn't an issue, as there's a [url=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ofCw4rLV1l0]glitch[/url] that allows you to fly on the trolley. And yes, you need 75 jiggies to open up Spiral Mountain for the endgame, though there's 131 total.

The jiggies in Showdown Town are all pretty quick and most should be considered for a run; Jolly Dodger's jiggies for sure, and a couple of the tamper switches too, depending on how far out of the way they are. Buying Humba's blueprints could be useful if you already have the notes (which you probably would, seeing how you get 10 notes per completed challenge as well as all the ones laying around), and the speed upgrade depends on how often you'll be out of the vehicle; it probably wouldn't cost too much time to get it anyway, as long as you're already right there (right before going to Jiggosseum might be a good time). Jinjos are utterly useless for speed purposes and should be avoided.

I can't think of much more to say now, might post more later. It'd definitely be an interesting/complicated run though, so good luck to anyone who decides to attempt this.

kowbrainz

2008-11-24 06:49:19 am

There was quite a bit found in the game's demo which allowed people to glitch outside barriers, get jiggies unintentionally etc. I may try to dig something up soon if you like...

Edit: No, crate contents aren't random.

ToiletPro

Edit history:

ToiletPro: 2009-01-01 03:54:28 pm

2008-12-31 01:51:32 am

[insert clever]

Some thoughts:

Sakura Yule's N&B guide on GameFAQs will likely be a valuable reference. It's got a list of pretty much everything ever.
http://www.gamefaqs.com/console/xbox360/file/935846/54843

There's also a Note Guide on the Rare Witch Project, which might also be useful.
http://www.rarewitchproject.com/?id=1746

We should figure out what increases the game timer and what doesn't. I'd guess most stuff does, but it could be that something, like vehicle building, doesn't increase the timer.

I think it would be fine getting Boggy's speed upgrades and some of Humba's blueprints. We'll get notes from every challenge that happens, so I don't think notes will be a problem. I think it's just a question of when we get them.

I don't think we should go out of our way to pick up notes around Showdown Town or any level because we'll have enough from the challenges, but it probably doesn't hurt to run over them if they're on the way.

I think the very beginning of the run (after entering Showdown Town) should begin by flying up to the top (with the glitch) of LOG's tower and spinning the Jiggy tamper switch. After that, we can drop down and continue normally.

EDIT: There's also this video guide which shows how to get TT Trophies for everything. We can probably use this to see which challenges are the fastest.
http://www.rarewitchproject.com/forums/showthread.php?t=24250

Some thoughts:

Sakura Yule's N&B guide on GameFAQs will likely be a valuable reference. It's got a list of pretty much everything ever.
http://www.gamefaqs.com/console/xbox360/file/935846/54843

There's also a Note Guide on the Rare Witch Project, which might also be useful.
http://www.rarewitchproject.com/?id=1746

We should figure out what increases the game timer and what doesn't. I'd guess most stuff does, but it could be that something, like vehicle building, doesn't increase the timer.

I think it would be fine getting Boggy's speed upgrades and some of Humba's blueprints. We'll get notes from every challenge that happens, so I don't think notes will be a problem. I think it's just a question of [i]when[/i] we get them.

I don't think we should go out of our way to pick up notes around Showdown Town or any level because we'll have enough from the challenges, but it probably doesn't hurt to run over them if they're on the way.

I think the very beginning of the run (after entering Showdown Town) should begin by flying up to the top (with the glitch) of LOG's tower and spinning the Jiggy tamper switch. After that, we can drop down and continue normally.

EDIT: There's also this video guide which shows how to get TT Trophies for everything. We can probably use this to see which challenges are the fastest.
http://www.rarewitchproject.com/forums/showthread.php?t=24250

arkarian

2009-01-02 10:57:41 pm

gamelogs.org

Only reason to spin the tamper switch would be for a 100% run though, right?

ToiletPro

2009-01-03 12:11:55 am

[insert clever]

No, tamper switches are essentially free Jiggies. They'd be useful anywhere.

I think the main job is figuring out what the fastest 75 Jiggies are. The 10 from tamper switches and Jolly Dodger should definitely get picked up. In order to determine which challenges are fastest, we have to keep in mind that we'll spend very little time building vehicles or picking up crates. We have to find the fastest challenges using blueprints and the fewest parts.

As far as notes go, we'll be spending 375 on Jolly Dodger, and 240 (I think) on Boggy's speed upgrades if we choose to get them. I don't know how many we'll spend on Humba blueprints; we'll have to figure that out.

kowbrainz

2009-01-03 08:12:38 am

Quote from ToiletPro:

I think the very beginning of the run (after entering Showdown Town) should begin by flying up to the top (with the glitch) of LOG's tower and spinning the Jiggy tamper switch. After that, we can drop down and continue normally.

You can't do this jiggy first. LOG makes a complaint about how you're trying to break his game. Tongue

In terms of vehicle building, you can save blueprints to your gamertag and use them in the game as long as you have enough parts, so that's sorted. I believe the timer only increases during the main game and challenges, not while in the menus or vehicle builder. You would want to keep the time spent in these places to a minimum regardless, though.

ToiletPro

2009-01-03 01:39:22 pm

[insert clever]

Quote from kowbrainz:

You can't do this jiggy first. LOG makes a complaint about how you're trying to break his game. Tongue

Dang. My genius is ruined.

Quote from kowbrainz:

In terms of vehicle building, you can save blueprints to your gamertag and use them in the game as long as you have enough parts, so that's sorted.

Would that be acceptable in a run, or should it be completely from scratch?

kowbrainz

2009-01-04 03:56:21 am

As I said, I don't believe the timer counts the time when you're in Mumbo's Motors or other menus so it would just be easier for the viewer.

For challenges, it's generally a good idea to avoid as many LOG challenges as you can. Each of these basically give you a crappy vehicle to use, and the only way to get a good time is to edit the vehicle while you're doing the challenge, which I believe adds to the game's clock (this needs to be tested though).

For Boggy's upgrades - I think they're useful in some cases as they allow you to perform jumps with BK to get to normally inaccessable areas. At the same time, you can just use the flying trolley glitch for most of these sb's so it doesn't matter too much. There are some challenges which work better when you're on foot but I wouldn't want to be running for any distance too long...

Ghoti

2009-01-04 11:19:07 pm

Currently occupying the grey area.

Quote from ToiletPro:

Quote from kowbrainz:

In terms of vehicle building, you can save blueprints to your gamertag and use them in the game as long as you have enough parts, so that's sorted.

Would that be acceptable in a run, or should it be completely from scratch?

I think this would be considered NG+, so it wouldn't be allowed.

TheSoundDefense

2009-09-09 12:54:20 am

I'm not sure if this is made obsolete by the flying trolley glitch, but this particular sequence break is INCREDIBLY easy to do. Got me some very convenient parts, like larger engines and a Freezeezy, early on in the game.

Hellfish

2010-01-16 05:21:35 am

I <3 my Xbrick

The climb is much slower than the trolley glitch, sorry. I think the only things that should definitely be gotten are the jet engine from uptown and the medium fuel in the cave under the lighthouse on the seaside, speeds up Nutty Acres a fair bit. The medium fuel is necessary, otherwise you'll run out time and time again.

This should probably be done after Nutty Acres 1 since it's LOGs choice anyway, plus once that's done you can trolley glitch up to the tamper switches while you're there.

HidoiMidoriRyuu

2010-01-17 03:37:00 am

4NT

I really need to finish off this game... Have done most of it, but I am going for at least having all jiggies and jinjos before entering the final level.

An advantage is that the free building system does leave a lot of room for game mechanic abuse. I know I have used neat tricks like the Bearspring (seat with a spring) to do no-effort completion of various speed challenges. Also, the cargo copter is highly useful even in situations where using a cargo copter is not really intended.

Hellfish

Edit history:

Hellfish: 2010-01-17 02:39:55 pm

2010-01-17 09:02:10 am

I <3 my Xbrick

Whoops, my mistake. The medium fuel is not under the lighthouse, it's on the cliff overlooking the second banjoland gazebo. I might try to get some preliminary times down.The route in my head is currently:

(REVISED)
*Tutorial and intro stuff, skip as much as possible (not much :/ )
*Glitch up to LOG using a bench and get the worldball..thing..
*Nutty Acres Act 1 (1 jiggy,1 trophy)
*Bank Jiggy
*Glitch up to Tommy's house, get warp pad.
*Glitch over the lake and up to the cliff
*Roll over to uptown and glitch up to it's jinjo house, glitch into the center, get jet crate, toss it outside and glitch back out
*Glitch up to rooftops, get tamper switch
*Take warp pad to Mumbos and offload crates
*Glitch up to harbour roofs and grab grenade launcher (Theres an easy medium ammo above Humba for this)
*WOOOSH through Nutty Acres Act 2. (3+1 jiggys, 3 trophys)
*BOOM through NA3 (1 jiggy,1 trophy)
*Glitch up to tamper switch on LOGs factory
*Take LOGBox ball to it's socket

Benches and uptown fences seem to be the easiest to glitch with.Yeah, I know it aint much so far but it's mostly for myself if I decide to try and run this somehow.

Editing instead of doubleposting: The part up to and including I think I can do in about 25 minutes based on the test runs I just did (Only three,it's annoying as all hell to sit through the intro and tutorial shtick every time. I'd probably segment right after coming out of NA1) assuming I can avoid stupid mistakes like needing several attempts to glitch into uptown and onto it's rooftops and ramming BOTH Mumbo and Thomas in NA2... *grumbles*

Also, a change: while I'm up and about getting jet and fuel, I'll probably head over to the docks to get a grenade launcher which will help NA3 immensely. 00:02:88 is my current record. Not near WR, I know, but they have access to ALL parts.

Also, is it really worth it to work out at all? I don't have the numbers, but won't it require a couple o hundred notes just to get speed maxed?

Whoops, my mistake. The medium fuel is not under the lighthouse, it's on the cliff overlooking the second banjoland gazebo. I might try to get some preliminary times down.The route in my head is currently:

(REVISED)
*Tutorial and intro stuff, skip as much as possible (not much :/ )
*Glitch up to LOG using a bench and get the worldball..thing..
*Nutty Acres Act 1 (1 jiggy,1 trophy)
*Bank Jiggy
*Glitch up to Tommy's house, get warp pad.
*Glitch over the lake and up to the cliff
*Roll over to uptown and glitch up to it's jinjo house, glitch into the center, get jet crate, toss it outside and glitch back out
*Glitch up to rooftops, get tamper switch
*Take warp pad to Mumbos and offload crates
*Glitch up to harbour roofs and grab grenade launcher (Theres an easy medium ammo above Humba for this)
*WOOOSH through Nutty Acres Act 2. (3+1 jiggys, 3 trophys)
*BOOM through NA3 (1 jiggy,1 trophy)
*Glitch up to tamper switch on LOGs factory
*Take LOGBox ball to it's socket

Benches and uptown fences seem to be the easiest to glitch with.Yeah, I know it aint much so far but it's mostly for myself if I decide to try and run this somehow.

Editing instead of doubleposting: The part up to and including I think I can do in about 25 minutes based on the test runs I just did (Only three,it's annoying as all hell to sit through the intro and tutorial shtick every time. I'd probably segment right after coming out of NA1) assuming I can avoid stupid mistakes like needing several attempts to glitch into uptown and onto it's rooftops and ramming BOTH Mumbo and Thomas in NA2... *grumbles*

Also, a change: while I'm up and about getting jet and fuel, I'll probably head over to the docks to get a grenade launcher which will help NA3 immensely. 00:02:88 is my current record. Not near WR, I know, but they have access to ALL parts.

Also, is it really worth it to work out at all? I don't have the numbers, but won't it require a  couple o hundred notes just to get speed maxed?

Hellfish

2010-01-23 07:34:21 am

I <3 my Xbrick

Well shit. What do you do with an out-of-warranty x-box that won't read discs?

Anyway, I got some last stuff before it gave up on me.
It costs 240 notes to max speed at the gym. Would that be worth it or would it be better to spend those on Jolly's jiggys rather than collect another 2-300 notes for him?
If one could find a reliable way to tip over mumbo crates in the trolley, that seems to make em easier to glitch with.
Are the tamper switches really worth it, besides of course top of LOGs factory and Uptown since they're on the path, as they take quite a bit of time to get to? Under LOG's factory is a longass underwater drive(plus, can't do it without the laser), same with the one under the arcade and the one in the cave under the lighthouse is really out of the way.

MAS8705

Edit history:

MAS8705: 2012-06-26 09:12:16 pm

MAS8705: 2012-06-26 04:23:36 pm

2012-06-26 12:52:40 am

SDA Apprentice -- (3-1)

*casts revive*

what is it about me and casting revive on topics that are more than two-three years old?

Anyway, for some strange reason, I've had the urge to play nuts and bolts again, and strangely enough, I've found myself interested in doing a speed run for this game.

So far, I've experimented with the beginning route that was laid out by Hellfish, and here is what I can gather so far...

1) While I don't see a need for the freezeezy, I can see that getting the jet engine and grenade early on can help out greatly.
2) Hellfish's route plan was pretty well thought out for the start of the run, outside of what he wrote, I saw the following:
Nutty acres
Act 1
Act 2
Act 3
Logbox
Act 1
Act 2
Act 3
Banjoland
Act 1
Act 2
Logbox
Act 4
Banjoland
Act 3
Act 4
Jiggosseum
Act 1- minus one tt
Act2
Act 3
Act 4
Logbox
Act 5
Act 6
Nut arce
Act 4
Act 5
Act 6
Finish all the acts possible, then go to the jiggy dispenser and (after parking the trolley in front of it) get them all in one take. The only time I haven't seen the need for that is for Logbox 3, which seems pointless to go get for just one jiggy. Other than that, for the trips to TT, the first was after the first two banjoland acts, while the 2nd was either after the next two banjolands or somewhere during the latter part. As for what to do for the last 15 jiggies, I need to figure that out, but hey trying to generate interest for any and all who might want to join in the fun...

I'm also planning on bringing in premade schematics, so it will be a NG (with Preloaded Vehicle designs).

Edit: alright so after my first playthrough, I got a time of about 7 hrs 24 minutes: some of this was obviously experimenting with builds and failing miserably on some... Other than that, I also have made 28 vehicles, although I do want to see if I can cut that amount down if possible. In fact in the 2nd test run, I've already collected 50/75 jiggies in about 2 hrs 15 minutes, so I'm guessing the run could easily fall under 4 hours.

Other than that, I'm also considering taking an extra two three minutes to get an extra torpedo and laser due to the annoyance of the last fight... Especially during the stealth where the auto missiles failed miserably...

*casts revive*

what is it about me and casting revive on topics that are more than two-three years old?

Anyway, for some strange reason, I've had the urge to play nuts and bolts again, and strangely enough, I've found myself interested in doing a speed run for this game.

So far, I've experimented with the beginning route that was laid out by Hellfish, and here is what I can gather so far...

1) While I don't see a need for the freezeezy, I can see that getting the jet engine and grenade early on can help out greatly.
2) Hellfish's route plan was pretty well thought out for the start of the run, outside of what he wrote, I saw the following:
Nutty acres
Act 1
Act 2
Act 3
Logbox
Act 1
Act 2
Act 3
Banjoland
Act 1
Act 2
Logbox
Act 4
Banjoland
Act 3
Act 4
Jiggosseum
Act 1- minus one tt
Act2
Act 3
Act 4
Logbox
Act 5
Act 6
Nut arce
Act 4
Act 5
Act 6
Finish all the acts possible, then go to the jiggy dispenser and (after parking the trolley in front of it) get them all in one take.  The only time I haven't seen the need for that is for Logbox 3, which seems pointless to go get for just one jiggy.  Other than that, for the trips to TT, the first was after the first two banjoland acts, while the 2nd was either after the next two banjolands or somewhere during the latter part.  As for what to do for the last 15 jiggies, I need to figure that out, but hey trying to generate interest for any and all who might want to join in the fun...

I'm also planning on bringing in premade schematics, so it will be a NG (with Preloaded Vehicle designs).

Edit: alright so after my first playthrough, I got a time of about 7 hrs 24 minutes: some of this was obviously experimenting with builds and failing miserably on some...  Other than that, I also have made 28 vehicles, although I do want to see if I can cut that amount down if possible.  In fact in the 2nd test run, I've already collected 50/75 jiggies in about 2 hrs 15 minutes, so I'm guessing the run could easily fall under 4 hours.

Other than that, I'm also considering taking an extra two three minutes to get an extra torpedo and laser due to the annoyance of the last fight... Especially during the stealth where the auto missiles failed miserably...

InsipidMuckyWater

2012-06-26 02:29:48 am

Visit my profile to see my runs!

Good GOD would I love to see a proper run of this game, even in a preliminary stage. I really wish you luck on this! Obviously the player-submitted replays will be helpful in finishing individual challenges, and your route looks good from a cursory overview, though I haven't played the game in years, myself. (Might pick it back up though so I can do that DLC I never bothered playing after I purchased it).

Eager to see your progress in this matter comrade.

MAS8705

2012-06-27 12:19:04 am

SDA Apprentice -- (3-1)

alright, a quick update.

While I can't say for sure the best way of approaching the run as a whole, I was able to cut down the time to under four hours while using only 19 vehicles. I admit I'm still concerned about the final fight, but if I go ahead to approach the run with segments, it should help out greatly.

Basically, I'm going to collect the five tampered jiggies, and buy the other five from Jolly dodger. Meanwhile I will be collecting notes in order to buy the nessessary things to help get through the stages fast, meanwhile, I only plan to farm for crates at the start to get the jet crate and granade launcher and near the end after you get the laser to get a 2nd one and torpedo.

Other than that, I'll see if I can post my progress to get feedback and see if it can be improved on.

As for the replays, I can't really trust them sadly due to the fact of either a) some go back once they have better stuff to work with or B) they must have hacked. There are some times that you barely start to move and they finish.

again, we will see what will happen, but I can see the segments going as such.

1) Intro/tutorial/Nutty Acres 1+ cash in
2) Go visit Tommy for warp pad, Collect Jet Crate, get the Tampered Jiggy in Uptown, return that crate, Medium equipment Crate and return, get grenade and return, and go to theater to get the sticky ball and return. (this segment will help to get the extra stuff I need so that I don't have to worry about getting the stuff later.
3) Complete both Act 2 and 3 of Nutty Acres and cash in
4) Fly to the top of the tower to get 2nd tampered jiggy, then Complete and cash in Logbox720 Act 1+2
5) Complete Logbox720 Act 3
6) Complete Banjoland Act 1+2 and cash in those with the TT Jiggies
7) Complete and cash in Logbox Act 4
8+9) Complete the Jiggosseum Acts 1-4 I know that there is a point where I can't proceed any further so once I cash in the first set, that will be the split segment
10) Complete and cash in Logbox720 Acts 5+6
11) Complete Jiggosseum Act 5
12) By this point, I can start the 2nd half of farming, which includes getting the crate from uptown and behind the banjoland boathouse, meanwhile also being able to collect the other three tampered Jiggies under the arcade, under the lighthouse, and under the tower, meanwhile by this point, I can also hit up Jolly to get the Jiggies from him too and TT.
13) Nut Acres Acts 4-6 and cash in+one final visit to TT to get the last set of Jiggies. I'm not too sure if I should do it all together or to split the acts into segments
14) finish buying the last things I need and then proceed to spiral mountain to do that last two missions.

If all works well, the run should be under 4 hours. Don't really know how much lower from there though, but we will see... when I get the free time this week, I'll get started.

alright, a quick update.

While I can't say for sure the best way of approaching the run as a whole, I was able to cut down the time to under four hours while using only 19 vehicles.  I admit I'm still concerned about the final fight, but if I go ahead to approach the run with segments, it should help out greatly.

Basically, I'm going to collect the five tampered jiggies, and buy the other five from Jolly dodger.  Meanwhile I will be collecting notes in order to buy the nessessary things to help get through the stages fast, meanwhile, I only plan to farm for crates at the start to get the jet crate and granade launcher and near the end after you get the laser to get a 2nd one and torpedo.

Other than that, I'll see if I can post my progress to get feedback and see if it can be improved on.

As for the replays, I can't really trust them sadly due to the fact of either a) some go back once they have better stuff to work with or B) they must have hacked.  There are some times that you barely start to move and they finish.

again, we will see what will happen, but I can see the segments going as such.

1) Intro/tutorial/Nutty Acres 1+ cash in
2) Go visit Tommy for warp pad, Collect Jet Crate, get the Tampered Jiggy in Uptown, return that crate, Medium equipment Crate and return, get grenade and return, and go to theater to get the sticky ball and return. (this segment will help to get the extra stuff I need so that I don't have to worry about getting the stuff later. 
3) Complete both Act 2 and 3 of Nutty Acres and cash in
4) Fly to the top of the tower to get 2nd tampered jiggy, then Complete and cash in Logbox720 Act 1+2
5) Complete Logbox720 Act 3
6) Complete Banjoland Act 1+2 and cash in those with the TT Jiggies
7) Complete and cash in Logbox Act 4
8+9) Complete the Jiggosseum Acts 1-4  I know that there is a point where I can't proceed any further so once I cash in the first set, that will be the split segment
10) Complete and cash in Logbox720 Acts 5+6
11) Complete Jiggosseum Act 5
12) By this point, I can start the 2nd half of farming, which includes getting the crate from uptown and behind the banjoland  boathouse, meanwhile also being able to collect the other three tampered Jiggies under the arcade, under the lighthouse, and under the tower, meanwhile by this point, I can also hit up Jolly to get the Jiggies from him too and TT.
13) Nut Acres Acts 4-6 and cash in+one final visit to TT to get the last set of Jiggies.  I'm not too sure if I should do it all together or to split the acts into segments
14) finish buying the last things I need and then proceed to spiral mountain to do that last two missions.

If all works well, the run should be under 4 hours.  Don't really know how much lower from there though, but we will see...  when I get the free time this week, I'll get started.

InsipidMuckyWater

2012-06-27 02:52:13 am

Visit my profile to see my runs!

Quote from MAS8705:

As for the replays, I can't really trust them sadly due to the fact of either a) some go back once they have better stuff to work with or B) they must have hacked. There are some times that you barely start to move and they finish.

Oh yeah, the hackers. Yeah, I remember those now. There's usually a good 10-20 people who figure out some way to get an infinitely high score or who screw with the start time. Kind of forgot about that. And you're right - a lot of people are going to be using upgrades. But still, you can drop below the hacked stuff and then use the upgraded demonstrations for at least ideal routes and strategies if nothing else. But you obviously have a better idea of what you're doing than I do at this point, so I'll just stop saying obvious things. Haha

Paraxade

2012-06-27 03:22:33 am

I don't have anything constructive to add but I'm interested in this. Good luck.

Tranquilite

2012-06-27 04:08:31 am

Ooh, I love this game. I may even have something useful to say (probably not).

As far as weapons go, I find that the two most useful weapons are the egg gun and the torpedile. The egg gun's high rate of fire, fast projectile speed, and decent auto-aim, and low ammo consumption, makes them surprisingly powerful, especially if you use multiple of them. Personally, I've always had a hard time using grenades, which is why I find it interesting that you go out of your way to collect/use them.

The other thing I have to say is that the sticky ball is probably my favorite part in this game, as it allows for some interesting out-of-the-box solutions. For example, one of the jiggies in nutty acres requires you to use some kind of flying machine to bring nuts back to the farm, but I found out that you can use the sticky ball to grab the nut-collecting device and just bring that to all of the nuts instead, making short work of the challenge. There is also a similar challenge in Banjoland where you are supposed to put trash in a trashcan, where instead you can just use the sticky ball to drag the trashcan to the trash. It is also increidbly useful in Jinjo hurling, as you can use a stickyball-attached-to-a-bunch-of-springs contraption to launch jinjos to ridiculous heights easily (though I seriously doubt you will be getting any Jinjo tokens in a speedrun). The stick ball also makes most missions which involve transporting objects really easy.

Well regardless of whether or not any of what I've said is useful, I really look forward to any kind of progress on a speedrun for this game. And I will be sure to keep my eye on this thread, and hopefully be able to provide feedback.

Ooh, I love this game. I may even have something useful to say (probably not).

As far as weapons go, I find that the two most useful weapons are the egg gun and the torpedile. The egg gun's high rate of fire, fast projectile speed, and decent auto-aim, and low ammo consumption, makes them surprisingly powerful, especially if you use multiple of them. Personally, I've always had a hard time using grenades, which is why I find it interesting that you go out of your way to collect/use them.

The other thing I have to say is that the sticky ball is probably my favorite part in this game, as it allows for some interesting out-of-the-box solutions. For example, one of the jiggies in nutty acres requires you to use some kind of flying machine to bring nuts back to the farm, but I found out that you can use the sticky ball to grab the nut-collecting device and just bring that to all of the nuts instead, making short work of the challenge. There is also a similar challenge in Banjoland where you are supposed to put trash in a trashcan, where instead you can just use the sticky ball to drag the trashcan to the trash. It is also increidbly useful in Jinjo hurling, as you can use a stickyball-attached-to-a-bunch-of-springs contraption to launch jinjos to ridiculous heights easily (though I seriously doubt you will be getting any Jinjo tokens in a speedrun). The stick ball also makes most missions which involve transporting objects really easy.

Well regardless of whether or not any of what I've said is useful, I really look forward to any kind of progress on a speedrun for this game. And I will be sure to keep my eye on this thread, and hopefully be able to provide feedback.

InsipidMuckyWater

Edit history:

InsipidMuckyWater: 2012-06-27 03:07:50 pm

2012-06-27 03:06:36 pm

Visit my profile to see my runs!

^ Nice ideas. There should be a Youtube channel dedicated to crazy BKNB ideas. Or we should start posting more in the megavideo thread.

One of my favorites I came up with ... remember that achievement for bringing the floating beach ball down into the tunnel at the bottom of the test track? You're SUPPOSED to use that there sticky ball you mentioned to drag it down, meaning you [conventionally] have to wait awhile before you can acquire the achievement. However, I built a rudimentary flying vehicle and stuck a GIANT CAGE on the front of it with only one entrance / exit. It looked preposterous. The vehicle looked like a wind-up toy plane pushing around a giant metal net on the front of it which was bigger than the vehicle itself. Anyway, I caught the ball in the cage and flew it down into the tunnel, keeping the cage opening pointed away from the ceiling so the ball wouldn't float back out. I think I felt more satisfaction than most people once I got that achievement, especially since I had only been playing for a few hours. haha.

^  Nice ideas.  There should be a Youtube channel dedicated to crazy BKNB ideas.  Or we should start posting more in the megavideo thread.

One of my favorites I came up with ... remember that achievement for bringing the floating beach ball down into the tunnel at the bottom of the test track?  You're SUPPOSED to use that there sticky ball you mentioned to drag it down, meaning you [conventionally] have to wait awhile before you can acquire the achievement.  However, I built a rudimentary flying vehicle and stuck a GIANT CAGE on the front of it with only one entrance / exit.  It looked preposterous.  The vehicle looked like a wind-up toy plane pushing around a giant metal net on the front of it which was bigger than the vehicle itself.  Anyway, I caught the ball in the cage and flew it down into the tunnel, keeping the cage opening pointed away from the ceiling so the ball wouldn't float back out.  I think I felt more satisfaction than most people once I got that achievement, especially since I had only been playing for a few hours. haha.

Scykoh

2013-06-08 04:04:32 am

Not sure if anyone is still trying to do anything with this game, but I've been taking it quite seriously. Smiley

I've done a single segment run and got 3:04, and it was an incredibly sloppy run, at least 20-30 minutes of mistakes, unoptimized, and using a route that I'm looking to outdo here pretty soon. I think that sub 2:30 shouldn't be too difficult at all with this game. You can see the run here (starts at ~20:10) http://www.twitch.tv/psychoticgaming/b/413071005 and see just how bad of a run can get nearly sub 3h. Tongue

The route I use in that run is:

<ROUTE>
<Nutty Acres Level Globe>
Nutty Acres 1
<Bank Nutty Acres Jiggies>
<Gathering Phase> [Lakeside Warp Pad, Uptown Tamper, Crate 43/38, Uptown Warp Pad, stash Crate 43/38, warp Uptown, Crate 40, Arcade Tamper, Crate 18, Arcade Warp Pad, stash Crate 40/18, warp Arcade, Lighthouse Tamper, Crate 35/36, stash Crate 35/36] (must get Jogger pass code and collect Crate 31 at some point)
Nutty Acres 2
Nutty Acres 3
<Get High Grip Wheels at this point>
<Logbox 720 Level Globe + L.O.G. tower tamper>
Logbox 1
Logbox 2
<Bank Logbox Jiggies>
Nutty Acres 4
<Get Crate 44 at this point>
<Bank Nutty Acres Jiggies>
<Banjoland Level Globe>
<Bank Trophy Jiggies>
Logbox 3
<Get Floaters at this point>
Logbox 4
<Bank Logbox Jiggies>
Banjoland 1
Banjoland 3
Banjoland 4
<Get Spring at this point>
<Get Crate 45 and 23 at this point>
<Bank Banjoland Jiggies>
Nutty Acres 5
<Bank Nutty Acres Jiggies>
<Buy Large Tray at shop>
<Jolly Dodger> (costs 375 notes)
Logbox 5
Logbox 6
<Bank Logbox Jiggies>
<Bank Trophy Jiggies>
<Buy Large Fuel at shop. Buy Air Cushion [4] before Nutty Acres 6 if can afford, afterwards if not>
Nutty Acres 6
<Bank Nutty Acres Jiggies>
Banjoland 5
Banjoland 6
<Bank Banjoland Jiggies>
<Bank Trophy Jiggies>
<Buy Torpedile>
Spiral Mountain

As you'll notice, I get crates that would normally require me to do the Jiggoseum act 5 Grunty battle to get the laser. I found an exploit that allows me to get the crates at any point. Nuts & Bolts has a mechanic where if a crate is in your trolley when you enter a stage, upon exiting that stage the crate will still be in your trolley. So, the exploit is you flip your trolley on its side, press it right against a laser fence, then use your RT grab ability to pull the crate as close to your trolley as possible. Then, enter a stage and exit it. If done correctly, you will now have the crate in your trolley outside the laser fence, due to it being close enough to your trolley to be considered inside it.

The route here is what I used, but I think it is less than ideal. I have a lot of ideas for a better route, and I will update when I have that figured out.

Not sure if anyone is still trying to do anything with this game, but I've been taking it quite seriously. :) I've done a single segment run and got 3:04, and it was an incredibly sloppy run, at least 20-30 minutes of mistakes, unoptimized, and using a route that I'm looking to outdo here pretty soon. I think that sub 2:30 shouldn't be too difficult at all with this game. You can see the run here (starts at ~20:10) http://www.twitch.tv/psychoticgaming/b/413071005 and see just how bad of a run can get nearly sub 3h. :P

The route I use in that run is:

<ROUTE>
<Nutty Acres Level Globe>
    Nutty Acres 1
<Bank Nutty Acres Jiggies>
    <Gathering Phase> [Lakeside Warp Pad, Uptown Tamper, Crate 43/38, Uptown Warp Pad, stash Crate 43/38, warp Uptown, Crate 40, Arcade Tamper, Crate 18, Arcade Warp Pad, stash Crate 40/18, warp Arcade, Lighthouse Tamper, Crate 35/36, stash Crate 35/36] (must get Jogger pass code and collect Crate 31 at some point)
    Nutty Acres 2
    Nutty Acres 3
<Get High Grip Wheels at this point>
<Logbox 720 Level Globe + L.O.G. tower tamper>
    Logbox 1
    Logbox 2
<Bank Logbox Jiggies>
    Nutty Acres 4
<Get Crate 44 at this point>
<Bank Nutty Acres Jiggies>
<Banjoland Level Globe>
    <Bank Trophy Jiggies>
    Logbox 3
<Get Floaters at this point>
    Logbox 4
<Bank Logbox Jiggies>
    Banjoland 1
    Banjoland 3
    Banjoland 4
<Get Spring at this point>
<Get Crate 45 and 23 at this point>
<Bank Banjoland Jiggies>
    Nutty Acres 5
<Bank Nutty Acres Jiggies>
<Buy Large Tray at shop>
    <Jolly Dodger> (costs 375 notes)
    Logbox 5
    Logbox 6
<Bank Logbox Jiggies>
<Bank Trophy Jiggies>
<Buy Large Fuel at shop. Buy Air Cushion [4] before Nutty Acres 6 if can afford, afterwards if not>
    Nutty Acres 6
<Bank Nutty Acres Jiggies>
    Banjoland 5
    Banjoland 6
<Bank Banjoland Jiggies>
    <Bank Trophy Jiggies>
<Buy Torpedile>
    Spiral Mountain

As you'll notice, I get crates that would normally require me to do the Jiggoseum act 5 Grunty battle to get the laser. I found an exploit that allows me to get the crates at any point. Nuts & Bolts has a mechanic where if a crate is in your trolley when you enter a stage, upon exiting that stage the crate will still be in your trolley. So, the exploit is you flip your trolley on its side, press it right against a laser fence, then use your RT grab ability to pull the crate as close to your trolley as possible. Then, enter a stage and exit it. If done correctly, you will now have the crate in your trolley outside the laser fence, due to it being close enough to your trolley to be considered inside it.

The route here is what I used, but I think it is less than ideal. I have a lot of ideas for a better route, and I will update when I have that figured out.

Madtaz64

2014-01-14 02:05:57 pm

Hey, someone pointed me this topic out while I was at AGDQ, and I figured I should post in it and tell you guys that I've been working on the game for a bit, and also post some updates on the route/tricks/etc. I started learning it back in September and did a few runs over the following months and got a 3:16 after 5-6 runs and a LOT of rerouting, but put it down temporarily. But I'm going back to the game now and plan on bringing the game's time down a good amount. The world record at the moment is 2:21 by Scykoh, but we both have theroized that low two hours is realistic, maybe even sub 2. Yes, we do use premade blueprints so I guess it IS new game plus in a way, although you have access to the blueprints right when you start the game up so theroretically someone could literally pick up the game for the first time and have blueprints downloaded already if a friend sent them it with a set file name. And honestly, having to build the necessary vehicles together every time would be a major pain in the ass anyways.

Here’s a video of the record: http://www.twitch.tv/psychoticgaming/c/2975062
And here’s the work in progress of his most recent route: http://pastebin.com/LZDX1WYy

This is the route I use, which is a modified version of Scykoh's route: http://www.pastebin.com/rPMh5yvE
I modified the route to accommodate a discovery we made, listed below. This route is not perfect and the vehicles used in it are definitely not perfect in any way, someone told me that they made a new route and a new set of vehicles, but this was a while ago and he hasn't sent me anything yet. If it comes down to it I will improve the vehicles myself but I'm hoping it wasn't all a ruse, rerouting and making good vehicles in this game was a chore in itself the first time around. =/

There are a few glitches used in the route too, most of them featured here:
You should watch the whole video, it's really entertaining! But if you just wanna skip through to the glitches I'll list the timestamps below:

0:56: Trolley hover, used in a lot of areas, especially in the beginning.
2:35: Laser Crate Grab, used to get large jets, large engines, and even a laser. Around 4:15 the video says you have to walk all the way to a level entrance in order to get the vehicle, but after he made the video one of the comments told him you could actually hold up on the dpad in showdown town to warp to Mumbo’s Motors and warp back and get the parts back, which prompted me to reroute the game with the changes.

There is one glitch I encountered a while back I never was able to figure out how or why it happened, but if someone was able to figure out what causes it and how to do it consistently it could potentially save time over the run: http://www.twitch.tv/madtaz64/c/2933783
If anyone wants to help out with the route or is even interested in running the game lemme know here, shoot me a twitch pm, or you could contact me on the srl irc, I usually idle on the #banjo channel there so feel free to ask me any questions if you have any! I guess also talking to me when I’m live could work too.

Hey, someone pointed me this topic out while I was at AGDQ, and I figured I should post in it and tell you guys that I've been working on the game for a bit, and also post some updates on the route/tricks/etc. I started learning it back in September and did a few runs over the following months and got a 3:16 after 5-6 runs and a LOT of rerouting, but put it down temporarily. But I'm going back to the game now and plan on bringing the game's time down a good amount. The world record at the moment is 2:21 by Scykoh, but we both have theroized that low two hours is realistic, maybe even sub 2. Yes, we do use premade blueprints so I guess it IS new game plus in a way, although you have access to the blueprints right when you start the game up so theroretically someone could literally pick up the game for the first time and have blueprints downloaded already if a friend sent them it with a set file name. And honestly, having to build the necessary vehicles together every time would be a major pain in the ass anyways.

Here’s a video of the record: http://www.twitch.tv/psychoticgaming/c/2975062
And here’s the work in progress of his most recent route: http://pastebin.com/LZDX1WYy

This is the route I use, which is a modified version of Scykoh's route: http://www.pastebin.com/rPMh5yvE
I modified the route to accommodate a discovery we made, listed below. This route is not perfect and the vehicles used in it are definitely not perfect in any way, someone told me that they made a new route and a new set of vehicles, but this was a while ago and he hasn't sent me anything yet. If it comes down to it I will improve the vehicles myself but I'm hoping it wasn't all a ruse, rerouting and making good vehicles in this game was a chore in itself the first time around. =/

There are a few glitches used in the route too, most of them featured here: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZJDsbD5axsg
You should watch the whole video, it's really entertaining! But if you just wanna skip through to the glitches I'll list the timestamps below:

0:56: Trolley hover, used in a lot of areas, especially in the beginning.
2:35: Laser Crate Grab, used to get large jets, large engines, and even a laser. Around 4:15 the video says you have to walk all the way to a level entrance in order to get the vehicle, but after he made the video one of the comments told him you could actually hold up on the dpad in showdown town to warp to Mumbo’s Motors and warp back and get the parts back, which prompted me to reroute the game with the changes.

There is one glitch I encountered a while back I never was able to figure out how or why it happened, but if someone was able to figure out what causes it and how to do it consistently it could potentially save time over the run: http://www.twitch.tv/madtaz64/c/2933783
If anyone wants to help out with the route or is even interested in running the game lemme know here, shoot me a twitch pm, or you could contact me on the srl irc, I usually idle on the #banjo channel there so feel free to ask me any questions if you have any! I guess also talking to me when I’m live could work too.

the1stpkmnfan

2014-01-14 02:58:18 pm

Snowboard Assassin

I remember watching that video a while back. Definitely interesting to see glitches from this game, but it somehow didn't seem very surprising. Tongue

Considering how broken the game play can be manipulated, this does have speed running potential. If only I had a 360.