Banjo-Kazooie 100% (PAL)

2008-07-09 12:29:02 pm

I love YaBB 1G - SP1!

I'm pretty sure the TAS did this, but not in marsh's run: When you enter FP for those 2 minutes to learn beak bomb before going to GB, fly up to the sled after bottles' move and use it to get the first Boggy jiggy. Good timesaver there!

Ver Greeneyes

2008-07-09 05:01:36 pm

This may be a silly question, but are you guys talking about the TAS Sami is working on, or a previous TAS that was never published?

Cyberwrath

2008-07-09 05:07:02 pm

I love YaBB 1G - SP1!

The current TAS being worked on by Sami, it's already completed up to MMM I believe.

Ver Greeneyes

2008-07-09 05:56:28 pm

Thanks. Yeah, I've watched all his WIPs so far Smiley

kowbrainz

2008-07-09 07:24:33 pm

Quote from Cyberwrath:

I'm pretty sure the TAS did this, but not in marsh's run: When you enter FP for those 2 minutes to learn beak bomb before going to GB, fly up to the sled after bottles' move and use it to get the first Boggy jiggy. Good timesaver there!

Heh, I was thinking about this today as well; but not only that, but beak bombing the snowman's pipe for an extra jiggy.

Is anyone able to confirm anything about the presents? I mean, if you pick one up and exit the level, will it be there again when you return to the level later or will it be kept in the game's memory?

I'm just thinking it might be a good idea to go see Bottles, fly up to the top, beak bomb the pipe for the jiggy, grab the blue present on the snowman's nose then ride the sled down to Boggy and exit with the second jiggy.

And yeah, I've been watching the TAS, but I haven't been able to see MMM yet. Pyro was uploading them to youtube but he recently switched computers and he can't record anymore, so it looks like I'll have to go fiddle around with mupen again. But yeah, some of the routes we've used have been influenced a bit by the findings in the run so far, although some of the tricks are a bit hard to pull off consistantly, especially in a single segment run. I still need to chase him up on his Clanker's Cavern route, though. :/

[quote="Cyberwrath"]
I'm pretty sure the TAS did this, but not in marsh's run: When you enter FP for those 2 minutes to learn beak bomb before going to GB, fly up to the sled after bottles' move and use it to get the first Boggy jiggy. Good timesaver there!
[/quote]

Heh, I was thinking about this today as well; but not only that, but beak bombing the snowman's pipe for an extra jiggy.

Is anyone able to confirm anything about the presents? I mean, if you pick one up and exit the level, will it be there again when you return to the level later or will it be kept in the game's memory?

I'm just thinking it might be a good idea to go see Bottles, fly up to the top, beak bomb the pipe for the jiggy, grab the blue present on the snowman's nose then ride the sled down to Boggy and exit with the second jiggy.

And yeah, I've been watching the TAS, but I haven't been able to see MMM yet. Pyro was uploading them to youtube but he recently switched computers and he can't record anymore, so it looks like I'll have to go fiddle around with mupen again. But yeah, some of the routes we've used have been influenced a bit by the findings in the run so far, although some of the tricks are a bit hard to pull off consistantly, especially in a single segment run. I still need to chase him up on his Clanker's Cavern route, though. :/

Cyberwrath

2008-07-10 01:10:30 am

I love YaBB 1G - SP1!

Here's most (if not all) of the TAS run in a format playable through Windows Media Player Classic, it seems.

http://72.233.35.202/index.php?dir=tas/bk

I believe MMM is the final segment uploaded right now (8) and it's done in under 10 minutes! 9:22 I think.

In other news, I've been speeding through the game for fun. I was casually playing it the other day and got 3:55... which is pretty bad, but it had bunches of mistakes. Right now on this file, I'm at 2:26 at the start of CCW. So we'll see how this one ends up. Hopefully I'll only have to go through Furnace Fun once. Last time I died on the 3rd to last tile of the game... damn skull question on grunty!

kowbrainz

Edit history:

kowbrainz: 2008-07-10 01:55:19 am

2008-07-10 01:46:08 am

Ah, thanks for that... I'm downloading part 8, hopefully it's what I'm looking for, lol.

My last times I got were achieved back at the start of June, and are below...

Spiral Mountain - 2.22
Mumbo's Mountain - 6.59
Treasure Trove Cove - 10.30
Clanker's Cavern - 12.24
Bubblegloop Swamp - 18.29
Freezeezy Peak - 17.41
Gobi's Valley - 17.04
Mad Monster Mansion - 15.44
Rusty Bucket Bay - 21.54
Click Clock Wood - 27.04
Gruntilda's Lair - 37.47
Overall - 3.07.55

Pretty average, all in all. BGS saw me lose to Vile twice, and RBB saw me die in the Engine Room. Not at the hard part, though! I actually died while talon trotting to the entrance of the place, slipping off the last rotating thingo... whatsit. But yeah, there was that and another couple of bad mistakes, so that level wasn't too good. I reckon I could've gotten 3.04 or something if it wasn't for that. Oh well.

Anyway, I'm not going to do another full run until I've got some routes to go for methinks. Pyro's sick of Mr Vile ruining his runs, so it isn't likely that he'll be doing anything big, although he's agreed to help test some routes. But I think the main thing is that, since the TAS isn't completed, we can't kick anything off completely yet since the routes we use for later levels will be pretty obsolete once Sami's done. If we can hold the proper run off until Sami's completed CCW and just get some routes for the earlier levels set in stone first, then that'd be cool.

Um... dunno what else to say. I was talking to Pyro about the jiggies in FP and whether or not some of them disappear once you exit the level. I'm pretty sure the sir slush one does; but I don't know about the others, although I assume they'd be the same. The only one that'd be worth testing IMO is the twinklies' jiggy; whether, once you've finished flying through the star of the tree, the glass for the jiggy in the tree remains smashed or not.

Edit: Hrmm... at this stage the links you sent me are only audio files, I think. :/

Ah, thanks for that... I'm downloading part 8, hopefully it's what I'm looking for, lol.

My last times I got were achieved back at the start of June, and are below...

Spiral Mountain - 2.22
Mumbo's Mountain - 6.59
Treasure Trove Cove - 10.30
Clanker's Cavern - 12.24
Bubblegloop Swamp - 18.29
Freezeezy Peak - 17.41
Gobi's Valley - 17.04
Mad Monster Mansion - 15.44
Rusty Bucket Bay - 21.54
Click Clock Wood - 27.04
Gruntilda's Lair - 37.47
Overall - 3.07.55

Pretty average, all in all. BGS saw me lose to Vile twice, and RBB saw me die in the Engine Room. Not at the hard part, though! I actually died while talon trotting to the entrance of the place, slipping off the last rotating thingo... whatsit. But yeah, there was that and another couple of bad mistakes, so that level wasn't too good. I reckon I could've gotten 3.04 or something if it wasn't for that. Oh well.

Anyway, I'm not going to do another full run until I've got some routes to go for methinks. Pyro's sick of Mr Vile ruining his runs, so it isn't likely that he'll be doing anything big, although he's agreed to help test some routes. But I think the main thing is that, since the TAS isn't completed, we can't kick anything off completely yet since the routes we use for later levels will be pretty obsolete once Sami's done. If we can hold the proper run off until Sami's completed CCW and just get some routes for the earlier levels set in stone first, then that'd be cool.

Um... dunno what else to say. I was talking to Pyro about the jiggies in FP and whether or not some of them disappear once you exit the level. I'm pretty sure the sir slush one does; but I don't know about the others, although I assume they'd be the same. The only one that'd be worth testing IMO is the twinklies' jiggy; whether, once you've finished flying through the star of the tree, the glass for the jiggy in the tree remains smashed or not.

Edit: Hrmm... at this stage the links you sent me are only audio files, I think. :/

Cyberwrath

2008-07-10 02:14:49 am

I love YaBB 1G - SP1!

Nope, they're video + audio, but I guess you don't have the proper codec to watch them. Not sure exactly what codec it'd be since I have a ton of them, but maybe someone else knows. I've watched all the runs from the site I linked you to, so I know they all work with video.

kowbrainz

Edit history:

kowbrainz: 2008-07-10 05:34:57 am

2008-07-10 05:17:10 am

Don't worry about it then. I've managed to get mupen to work in the end.

It's pretty stunning to see him get a time like that, though. I think the only changes that'd need to be made for a run would be collecting the items in the well area with the pumpkin; but I doubt it would add too much. What would the end time end up being... 11 minutes perhaps?

Edit: Oh, forgot about Motzand. I'm not sure if (from the TAS) his keys are set in order when you enter the room, or they're always the same or what. :/

Cyberwrath

Edit history:

Cyberwrath: 2008-07-10 02:06:53 pm

2008-07-10 12:11:37 pm

I love YaBB 1G - SP1!

During my run yesterday, I did the well stuff in MMM as Banjo. I did the same hop over the hedge, collected the notes, and jumped in the well. I had to come up for air once, as some of the turns are kinda tricky and it was tough to avoid some of the whiplashes. It wasn't too bad, and probably saved a little time, despite it being less-than-fast.

And I'm pretty sure the notes on the piano are not the same everytime, but probably set it stone once you enter the room. I don't think there's much to do with the piano for non-TAS...

EDIT: Just finished my speedrun a few minutes ago. Final time was 3:17:11 100 jiggies, 900 notes, 24 honeycomb.

SM: 2:20
MM: 6:43, not too great
TTC: 11:23. Bad! I had several issues with the shock-jump pillars and fell a few times...argh!
CC: 15:06. TERRIBLE! I had no route in mind, and made several bad mistakes. Almost restarted the run, but decided to keep going.
BGS: 17:22. Not TOO bad, lost to Vile once I think.
FP: 19:58. No route in mind, made one major mistake... going to the top of the snowman without killing 5 snowmen to make the jiggy up there appear. I can't remember, but I might have had to race Boggy twice!
GV: 18:26. Again, no route in mind, but nothing bad happened.
MMM: 17:07. Just kinda played it by ear and tried to be efficient. Got the well jiggy/notes as Banjo, not sure how effective it was.
RBB: 16:28, lol somehow beat marsh's time. Got the Boom Box trick to work, but was still inefficient in the latter half of the level
CCW: 31:09. Winter wasn't too great.
Grunty's Lair: 41:11. I remember trying to do the cool shock-spring jump into Grunty's hat to get the jiggy like 8-9 times. It's just too cool not to do! Furnace Fun luckily only took one attempt. Took it a bit conservative and did one of the timer games (matching game in GV) so I could use jokers on skull Q's.

So yeah, overall 3:17. I'm really happy with this considering most of the levels I didn't have a set route in mind. I just tried to be as efficient as possible, but definitely lost a lot of time not staying on a set path.

I wont be attempting any more runs, at least not speedruns, but I'll be glad to try and help plan routes when necessary. I guess we'll mostly take the TAS, see what's optimal to do on console, and edit it from there!

During my run yesterday, I did the well stuff in MMM as Banjo. I did the same hop over the hedge, collected the notes, and jumped in the well. I had to come up for air once, as some of the turns are kinda tricky and it was tough to avoid some of the whiplashes. It wasn't too bad, and probably saved a little time, despite it being less-than-fast.

And I'm pretty sure the notes on the piano are not the same everytime, but probably set it stone once you enter the room. I don't think there's much to do with the piano for non-TAS...

EDIT: Just finished my speedrun a few minutes ago. Final time was 3:17:11 100 jiggies, 900 notes, 24 honeycomb.

SM: 2:20
MM: 6:43, not too great
TTC: 11:23. Bad! I had several issues with the shock-jump pillars and fell a few times...argh!
CC: 15:06. TERRIBLE! I had no route in mind, and made several bad mistakes. Almost restarted the run, but decided to keep going.
BGS: 17:22. Not TOO bad, lost to Vile once I think.
FP: 19:58. No route in mind, made one major mistake... going to the top of the snowman without killing 5 snowmen to make the jiggy up there appear. I can't remember, but I might have had to race Boggy twice!
GV: 18:26. Again, no route in mind, but nothing bad happened.
MMM: 17:07. Just kinda played it by ear and tried to be efficient. Got the well jiggy/notes as Banjo, not sure how effective it was.
RBB: 16:28, lol somehow beat marsh's time. Got the Boom Box trick to work, but was still inefficient in the latter half of the level
CCW: 31:09. Winter wasn't too great.
Grunty's Lair: 41:11. I remember trying to do the cool shock-spring jump into Grunty's hat to get the jiggy like 8-9 times. It's just too cool not to do! Furnace Fun luckily only took one attempt. Took it a bit conservative and did one of the timer games (matching game in GV) so I could use jokers on skull Q's.

So yeah, overall 3:17. I'm really happy with this considering most of the levels I didn't have a set route in mind. I just tried to be as efficient as possible, but definitely lost a lot of time not staying on a set path.

I wont be attempting any more runs, at least not speedruns, but I'll be glad to try and help plan routes when necessary. I guess we'll mostly take the TAS, see what's optimal to do on console, and edit it from there!

kowbrainz

Edit history:

kowbrainz: 2008-07-11 06:30:11 am

2008-07-11 03:37:45 am

Cool. Might be worth testing whether the well is easy enough to do consistantly with Banjo or whether it'd just be easier to come back with the pumpkin after the drainpipe jiggy from the mansion.

I'm going to try and get some routes for Treasure Trove Cove and Clanker's Cavern written up to test; I'm not sure what exactly to aim for, but I'm looking for sub-10 minutes to start with on Treasure Trove Cove, and perhaps 10.50 or less on Clanker's Cavern using a modified version of the TAS route. TTC just needs practice, I think; especially the flying sections. I think the hardest part for me so far has been being able to pick up the three notes above one of the pillars consistantly while flying; I always seem to be a bit late and miss a few on the way up to the alcove jiggy, but oh well. There's that, and getting the lockup jiggy while flying... can never seem to get the timing right on that one.

If you're able to find any routes which are able to beat the old ones easily enough, then feel free to post them; I'd love to test anything out if possible. Thanks.

Edit: Just got 10.12 with a new route for Treasure Trove Cove, although it was still extremely sloppy, so I'm guessing there's probably 30 seconds of improvement to be had there. I can send you the route later if you like, I'll just have to type it up.

Getting the jiggy from inside the lockup while flying is quite tricky. Out of the three runs I did for the level, one of them I quit early because I spent about 2 or 3 minutes trying to get into the thing, before landing and being knocked into the water. For the third run, I may have gotten that part right, but the other flying bits were a bit average. I try to pick up the yellow jinjo on my way up to the lighthouse jiggy if possible, and while I usually get it right, there are times where I miss it, or, even worse, get stuck under the tree's leaves while flying up, sometimes even landing in the process. Not fun.

Hopefully it gets better with practice. Thankfully the level is early on in the game; I don't think I'd bother with this sort of madness in Gobi's Valley or Freezeezy Peak. But we'll wait and see.

Oh, and the route I'm currently using picks up 8 of the 10 Mumbo Tokens (skipping the ones below the lockup jiggy, the one in the lower pool with the shrapnel enemy in it), but some more could be skipped depending on the later routes. I'll have to wait and see which ones are the best to get in later levels before I decide on which ones to miss, though.

Cool. Might be worth testing whether the well is easy enough to do consistantly with Banjo or whether it'd just be easier to come back with the pumpkin after the drainpipe jiggy from the mansion.

I'm going to try and get some routes for Treasure Trove Cove and Clanker's Cavern written up to test; I'm not sure what exactly to aim for, but I'm looking for sub-10 minutes to start with on Treasure Trove Cove, and perhaps 10.50 or less on Clanker's Cavern using a modified version of the TAS route. TTC just needs practice, I think; especially the flying sections. I think the hardest part for me so far has been being able to pick up the three notes above one of the pillars consistantly while flying; I always seem to be a bit late and miss a few on the way up to the alcove jiggy, but oh well. There's that, and getting the lockup jiggy while flying... can never seem to get the timing right on that one.

If you're able to find any routes which are able to beat the old ones easily enough, then feel free to post them; I'd love to test anything out if possible. Thanks.

Edit: Just got 10.12 with a new route for Treasure Trove Cove, although it was still extremely sloppy, so I'm guessing there's probably 30 seconds of improvement to be had there. I can send you the route later if you like, I'll just have to type it up.

Getting the jiggy from inside the lockup while flying is quite tricky. Out of the three runs I did for the level, one of them I quit early because I spent about 2 or 3 minutes trying to get into the thing, before landing and being knocked into the water. For the third run, I may have gotten that part right, but the other flying bits were a bit average. I try to pick up the yellow jinjo on my way up to the lighthouse jiggy if possible, and while I usually get it right, there are times where I miss it, or, even worse, get stuck under the tree's leaves  while flying up, sometimes even landing in the process. Not fun.

Hopefully it gets better with practice. Thankfully the level is early on in the game; I don't think I'd bother with this sort of madness in Gobi's Valley or Freezeezy Peak. But we'll wait and see.

Oh, and the route I'm currently using picks up 8 of the 10 Mumbo Tokens (skipping the ones below the lockup jiggy, the one in the lower pool with the shrapnel enemy in it), but some more could be skipped depending on the later routes. I'll have to wait and see which ones are the best to get in later levels before I decide on which ones to miss, though.

kowbrainz

Edit history:

kowbrainz: 2008-07-12 07:34:10 am

2008-07-11 10:46:28 pm

Oh, I'll need some people to help test something I've read about...

Basically, I've heard from a few sites that there's a gap between the polygons in the Rusty Bucket Bay engine room's window. You know, the window that you're able to look through to see the switch which slows down the fans.

Anyway, a few people have claimed that you can flap flip against the left side of the window on the seam between the glass and the wall and pass through it from the engine room into the room with the fan switch. I've tested this out a few times on a PAL console but with no luck so far; if anyone else is able to do it (and consistantly), a video or better description would be good. Hopefully, if it does work, it isn't a NTSC only glitch; although I'd assume it wouldn't be since the PAL version of BK only came out a few weeks after the NTSC version, so there wasn't enough time for further testing in the game anyway.

Here's the original post (from David Wonn's site)

Quote:

If anyone's having trouble collecting the Jiggy behind the ship's propeller in the allotted time, this glitch could help! When you're inside the Rusty Bucket ship, in the area with all the gears where the two propellor switches are, you can see a window on the left side. When you look through the window, you can see another room of the ship. While facing the window, move over to the left side of it, where the polygon line of the window frame meets the wall. Hold down Z and press A to do the wing-assisted flip jump, and press into that polygon line as you're jumping. If you did it right, Banjo will go right through the window! You'll end up in that other room, and when you leave, you'll be much closer to where the Jiggy behind the propeller is. It may take several attempts to do this, so keep trying, but it's not that hard. Incidentally, this glitch seems similar to my BK Snowman glitch...I wonder if there are other places in the game where Banjo can go through a polygon line where he normally could not go?

Edit: I just had a re-run of Treasure Trove Cove and Clanker's Cavern, and now my PBs for both levels are 10.02 and 11.27 respectively. Both had their fair share of mistakes, or areas where I could have gone a little faster, so we'll see how things turn out later on.

The route for Mumbo's Mountain is unlikely to change. That said, I've almosted perfected climbing Ticker's Tower with Banjo after a few tests today, getting it in roughly 25-40 seconds each time, but I'm not entirely sure whether I'll actually be incorporating this into the run, as I can't plan the route exactly the way Sami takes it, and I haven't been able to grab the witch switch jiggy with Banjo just yet. However, if we're able to put together a route later that is able to incorporate these and still get a 6 minute time for the level (as well as an easy way to do the WS jiggy on a console), that'd be great. I think it'd be awesome to see the termite transformation skipped, and it would lead to some easier route planning later since we can skip 4-5 mumbo tokens from other areas.

Edit again: Holy crap! Just performed the RBB glitch on an NTSC rom; it's really easy to do as well! You don't even need to flip; just run towards the wall and press different directions on the control stick. Here's hoping it works on the PAL console...

(10 minutes later) It works on PAL. Joy. Cheesy

Oh, I'll need some people to help test something I've read about...

Basically, I've heard from a few sites that there's a gap between the polygons in the Rusty Bucket Bay engine room's window. You know, the window that you're able to look through to see the switch which slows down the fans.

Anyway, a few people have claimed that you can flap flip against the left side of the window on the seam between the glass and the wall and pass through it from the engine room into the room with the fan switch. I've tested this out a few times on a PAL console but with no luck so far; if anyone else is able to do it (and consistantly), a video or better description would be good. Hopefully, if it does work, it isn't a NTSC only glitch; although I'd assume it wouldn't be since the PAL version of BK only came out a few weeks after the NTSC version, so there wasn't enough time for further testing in the game anyway.

Here's the original post (from David Wonn's site)
[quote]If anyone's having trouble collecting the Jiggy behind the ship's propeller in the allotted time, this glitch could help! When you're inside the Rusty Bucket ship, in the area with all the gears where the two propellor switches are, you can see a window on the left side. When you look through the window, you can see another room of the ship. While facing the window, move over to the left side of it, where the polygon line of the window frame meets the wall. Hold down Z and press A to do the wing-assisted flip jump, and press into that polygon line as you're jumping. If you did it right, Banjo will go right through the window! You'll end up in that other room, and when you leave, you'll be much closer to where the Jiggy behind the propeller is. It may take several attempts to do this, so keep trying, but it's not that hard. Incidentally, this glitch seems similar to my BK Snowman glitch...I wonder if there are other places in the game where Banjo can go through a polygon line where he normally could not go? [/quote]

Edit: I just had a re-run of Treasure Trove Cove and Clanker's Cavern, and now my PBs for both levels are 10.02 and 11.27 respectively. Both had their fair share of mistakes, or areas where I could have gone a little faster, so we'll see how things turn out later on.

The route for Mumbo's Mountain is unlikely to change. That said, I've almosted perfected climbing Ticker's Tower with Banjo after a few tests today, getting it in roughly 25-40 seconds each time, but I'm not entirely sure whether I'll actually be incorporating this into the run, as I can't plan the route exactly the way Sami takes it, and I haven't been able to grab the witch switch jiggy with Banjo just yet. However, if we're able to put together a route later that is able to incorporate these and still get a 6 minute time for the level (as well as an easy way to do the WS jiggy on a console), that'd be great. I think it'd be awesome to see the termite transformation skipped, and it would lead to some easier route planning later since we can skip 4-5 mumbo tokens from other areas.

Edit again: Holy crap! Just performed the RBB glitch on an NTSC rom; it's really easy to do as well! You don't even need to flip; just run towards the wall and press different directions on the control stick. Here's hoping it works on the PAL console...

(10 minutes later) It works on PAL. Joy. :D

Gibbatizer

2008-07-12 07:46:38 am

Quote:

Edit: If Gibbatizer is able to give some level times and/or routes for those times which surpass the ones above, that'd be great. If we can get as much leeway on the ideal times as possible so that beating 2.47 isn't such an impossible feat, then that'd be excellent.

These are my personal best times for each world. None include death or save abuse and are all during a full length run. However I doubt I will have many or any on tape, these are just personal bests which I have kept record of.

Spiral: 2.17
Mumbo: 6.04
Treasure Trove: 9.58
Clanker's: 11.38
Freezeezy: 15.47
Bubblegloop: 15.28
Gobi's Valley: 13.53
Mad Monster Mansion: 13.45
Rusty Bucket Bay: 14.20
Click Clock Wood's: 25.32 (lots of improvement possible, 2 - 3 minutes easy)
Gruntilda's Lair: 35.28

You mentioned something about skipping a Bubblegloop Swamp Witch Switch, I assume your refferring to using the kazooie bouncing green circle thing to jump onto the gruntilda statues hat?! If not, thats a good trick aswell. And if doing full length running, before bugglegloop if you jump in the swamp toward freezeezy puzzle picture you can jump along the sides in the tunnel and not get hurt, but thats kinda easy.

Just watching your Mumbo Mountain then, when firing the egg at the ape, you can fire the second egg before he throws the first orange aswell as in the middle of the last 2. Saves a couple of seconds.

Anyway, what particular worlds would you like the routes for. I think my Gobi's was pretty good, mad monster was pretty good, and click clock, if it is ever nailed is decent aswell. The camera work in Click Clock is insanity...

[quote]Edit: If Gibbatizer is able to give some level times and/or routes for those times which surpass the ones above, that'd be great. If we can get as much leeway on the ideal times as possible so that beating 2.47 isn't such an impossible feat, then that'd be excellent.
[/quote]

These are my personal best times for each world. None include death or save abuse and are all during a full length run. However I doubt I will have many or any on tape, these are just personal bests which I have kept record of.

Spiral: 2.17
Mumbo: 6.04
Treasure Trove: 9.58
Clanker's: 11.38
Freezeezy: 15.47
Bubblegloop: 15.28
Gobi's Valley: 13.53
Mad Monster Mansion: 13.45
Rusty Bucket Bay: 14.20
Click Clock Wood's: 25.32 (lots of improvement possible, 2 - 3 minutes easy)
Gruntilda's Lair: 35.28

You mentioned something about skipping a Bubblegloop Swamp Witch Switch, I assume your refferring to using the kazooie bouncing green circle thing to jump onto the gruntilda statues hat?! If not, thats a good trick aswell. And if doing full length running, before bugglegloop if you jump in the swamp toward freezeezy puzzle picture you can jump along the sides in the tunnel and not get hurt, but thats kinda easy.

Just watching your Mumbo Mountain then, when firing the egg at the ape, you can fire the second egg before he throws the first orange aswell as in the middle of the last 2. Saves a couple of seconds.

Anyway, what particular worlds would you like the routes for. I think my Gobi's was pretty good, mad monster was pretty good, and click clock, if it is ever nailed is decent aswell. The camera work in Click Clock is insanity...

kowbrainz

Edit history:

kowbrainz: 2008-07-12 09:04:14 am

2008-07-12 08:04:21 am

Yeah, I'd really like to see the routes and tricks you use for BGS, Freezeezy, Gobi's and Click Clock Wood if possible. MMM I'm sure can be improved by using a simplified version of the TAS route; TTC is just flying work IMO.

I don't mind if the videos you have on hand make a few mess ups; if I can see what the basic outline of the route is from the vid, then it'll be fine, really.

I'm a little baffled as to how you managed to shave off so much time in BGS; was it just from skipping the wading boots or what? Think I'll just have to wait for the vid, lol.

Thanks a lot, though; the RBB vid has been a real help. Hopefully it doesn't get shattered too badly when Sami gets up to there in his TAS, lol.

Oh, and taking those times into account, the current aim for the run is 2.43.12 overall; although I think I can get this down quite a bit further with some new hybrid routes based off the TAS. We shall see.

kowbrainz

2008-07-12 11:25:59 pm

Alright, I've tested some stuff in Freezeezy Peak today for route planning later, and it seems that I could have just asked Sami about it all first; he'd probably know all of this already. Anyway...

1. You can do the twinklies game in your first trip into the level and the switch will be activated when you return, however you can't fly through the star in the first trip, as the glass on the jiggy inside the tree will return on subsequent trips. Darn.

2. Furthermore, you can't beak bomb the snowman's buttons in the first trip since the jiggy will disappear when you exit the level. Same goes for the sir slushes.

3. You can't collect the present on the snowman's nose in the first trip either; the presents will return unless you hand all of them into the polar bear kids.

4. The beak bomb trick used to get the jiggy in the snowman's pipe seems to be unperformable on a console (that or extremely difficult, I couldn't pull it off). In the run I think it'll be better to simply fly up and land inside, then feathery flap down to the sled for Boggy's jiggy and mumbo token

Thankfully that's over; now I can plan the rest of the levels up until Mad Monster Mansion.

In other news; I'm getting progressively better at Treasure Trove Cove. Flying into the lockup for a jiggy is becoming second nature now, and I'm having fewer and fewer mistakes in the flying segments. My best time is now 9.57, but even then there's still a lot of time to be saved.

I'm still rubbish at Clanker's Cavern, though; can't get near that 11 minute barrier at the moment. Tried tweaking my routes, but it might have something to do with some of the trickier parts of the segment like the Anvil. I'm certain I can save a chunk of time there.

I had my first Bubblegloop Swamp try in quite some time today, and basically went the way of the TAS, barely ever using the wading boots. I had a few hiccups along the way and managed to get 15.52 in the end; although I'm still a while off your best, Gibbatizer. You said somewhere that MM was the only level that had the same route as Marsh; if this is the case then I'd like to see the BGS segment and how you manage to shave so much time with a different route. You sure there's no death abuse involved? Tongue

Alright, I've tested some stuff in Freezeezy Peak today for route planning later, and it seems that I could have just asked Sami about it all first; he'd probably know all of this already. Anyway...

1. You can do the twinklies game in your first trip into the level and the switch will be activated when you return, however you can't fly through the star in the first trip, as the glass on the jiggy inside the tree will return on subsequent trips. Darn.

2. Furthermore, you can't beak bomb the snowman's buttons in the first trip since the jiggy will disappear when you exit the level. Same goes for the sir slushes.

3. You can't collect the present on the snowman's nose in the first trip either; the presents will return unless you hand all of them into the polar bear kids.

4. The beak bomb trick used to get the jiggy in the snowman's pipe seems to be unperformable on a console (that or extremely difficult, I couldn't pull it off). In the run I think it'll be better to simply fly up and land inside, then feathery flap down to the sled for Boggy's jiggy and mumbo token

Thankfully that's over; now I can plan the rest of the levels up until Mad Monster Mansion.

In other news; I'm getting progressively better at Treasure Trove Cove. Flying into the lockup for a jiggy is becoming second nature now, and I'm having fewer and fewer mistakes in the flying segments. My best time is now 9.57, but even then there's still a lot of time to be saved.

I'm still rubbish at Clanker's Cavern, though; can't get near that 11 minute barrier at the moment. Tried tweaking my routes, but it might have something to do with some of the trickier parts of the segment like the Anvil. I'm certain I can save a chunk of time there.

I had my first Bubblegloop Swamp try in quite some time today, and basically went the way of the TAS, barely ever using the wading boots. I had a few hiccups along the way and managed to get 15.52 in the end; although I'm still a while off your best, Gibbatizer. You said somewhere that MM was the only level that had the same route as Marsh; if this is the case then I'd like to see the BGS segment and how you manage to shave so much time with a different route. You sure there's no death abuse involved? :P

Gibbatizer

2008-07-13 07:17:11 am

yeh! Keep in mind that was my best ever time, my others float around a similar mark to your recently acquired time. Umm, the croc runs faster if you use his chomp attack! This is very useful to ensure you beat Vile. The route is easy because you have to follow those egg eating crocs around. Something I cant remember if I used or not, but when you are smashing the huts and climbing high to get the jiggy and witch switch, theres a few huts you can stand on and talon trot jump upto the next platform. Some are pretty risky though, I think the first 2 are easy to achieve. Try some of that stuff, it may be a little while before I can post any more video's, as I can't do it myself...

kowbrainz

Edit history:

kowbrainz: 2008-07-13 08:24:39 am

2008-07-13 07:56:55 am

Ah, cool.

Yeah, the TAS uses the talon trot jump for most of the mud huts; I tried it out a few weeks ago but couldn't manage to pull it off. I'll give it another shot when I can, though. And yeah, I doubted the route would be much different because of the crocs.

I've written up some basic routes that I'll try and use for a test run later; but I still need some help on Freezeezy Peak and Click Clock Wood at the moment - mainly Click Clock Wood I think. Also wondering how much time could be shaved off your RBB time; I know there's at least 30 seconds I can take off from the engine room trick, but otherwise not sure just yet. Sami's TAS won't even be up to RBB for a month or two I think, so no help there. Undecided

Edit: Oh, perhaps another ~15-20 seconds or so during the boom box battle using the egg trick. I'd probably use a gold feather as well just to make sure the guy doesnt get in the way while picking up the jiggy.

kowbrainz

2008-07-17 06:05:20 am

Alright, I think I'm in need of some help with Gobi's Valley. My route at the moment is pretty much the same as Sami's in the TAS, but it doesn't work too well at all. At the moment I'm trying to get the notes near Grabba without using the wading boots; at first this meant simply jumping in with the running shoes, but this took too long and too much energy on console, so instead I decided to get a few after exitting Rubee's pyramid, then talking to Bottles for an energy refill and coming back for the rest later.
Even then, my best time hasn't achieved anything lower than 15.20 yet... so something's definitely going wrong. Other sources of error include the pyramid matching game; I haven't quite memorised the tiles yet, lol; plus a few minor errors here and there which I won't go into too much detail with.

Mad Monster Mansion... is going alright. I've pulled off the hedge-jump twice with Banjo now, but it still needs some practice. Diving down into the well with Banjo is fairly easy tbh; if you get it right you won't need to resurface for air. Another thing - I'm almost certain that Motzand's keys are in a set order. The first part he plays definitely is, but I'll have to write down the notes he plays and check later. Honestly, though; for the past three or four runs through MMM I've predicted the first few notes he plays and remembered the rest after he plays them as if he's done the same thing before. Hopefully it isn't too hard to memorise.

Rusty Bucket Bay is still slow for me; my best time is in the low-15 minute range at the moment, even after using the two major tricks. It should come faster soon after I've practiced the route a little more, I guess.

I'm yet to actually try a full run of Freezeezy; I have a basic route planned, but I'm unsure whether or not it will score a good time or what. Something under 16 minutes would be lovely, but we'll see.

Click Clock Wood will wait for later. Last thing; Clanker's Cavern is still being mean to me; the lowest I've gotten so far is 15.24, and even then, that was after subtracting a minute since I missed the pipe jump at the start and had to re-enter the level, lol. Hopefully I get better soon.

I'm thinking about doing a full game run on Monday or Tuesday and aiming for something under 3 hours. From there I'll see where I'm at and where I can save time, if anything. I'm sure I'll have enough mistakes to write a novel and a half, don't worry. Tongue

Alright, I think I'm in need of some help with Gobi's Valley. My route at the moment is pretty much the same as Sami's in the TAS, but it doesn't work too well at all. At the moment I'm trying to get the notes near Grabba without using the wading boots; at first this meant simply jumping in with the running shoes, but this took too long and too much energy on console, so instead I decided to get a few after exitting Rubee's pyramid, then talking to Bottles for an energy refill and coming back for the rest later.
Even then, my best time hasn't achieved anything lower than 15.20 yet... so something's definitely going wrong. Other sources of error include the pyramid matching game; I haven't quite memorised the tiles yet, lol; plus a few minor errors here and there which I won't go into too much detail with.

Mad Monster Mansion... is going alright. I've pulled off the hedge-jump twice with Banjo now, but it still needs some practice. Diving down into the well with Banjo is fairly easy tbh; if you get it right you won't need to resurface for air. Another thing - I'm almost certain that Motzand's keys are in a set order. The first part he plays definitely is, but I'll have to write down the notes he plays and check later. Honestly, though; for the past three or four runs through MMM I've predicted the first few notes he plays and remembered the rest after he plays them as if he's done the same thing before. Hopefully it isn't too hard to memorise.

Rusty Bucket Bay is still slow for me; my best time is in the low-15 minute range at the moment, even after using the two major tricks. It should come faster soon after I've practiced the route a little more, I guess.

I'm yet to actually try a full run of Freezeezy; I have a basic route planned, but I'm unsure whether or not it will score a good time or what. Something under 16 minutes would be lovely, but we'll see.

Click Clock Wood will wait for later. Last thing; Clanker's Cavern is still being mean to me; the lowest I've gotten so far is 15.24, and even then, that was after subtracting a minute since I missed the pipe jump at the start and had to re-enter the level, lol. Hopefully I get better soon.

I'm thinking about doing a full game run on Monday or Tuesday and aiming for something under 3 hours. From there I'll see where I'm at and where I can save time, if anything. I'm sure I'll have enough mistakes to write a novel and a half, don't worry. :P

kowbrainz

2008-07-18 06:50:45 am

Hehe... I can confirm that Motzand's organ playing in Mad Monster Mansion is not random in the slightest; after analysing three different people playing through the game, myself, Marsh, and some random youtuber, both the PAL and NTSC versions follow a set list of notes, which can be found below:

The star is the last note you play, so yeah, there's 15 notes to memorise in all. I'll probably keep a cheat sheet with me for the first few practice runs before I have it completely memorised... although that may take a while - I'm still yet to memorise the matching tiles in Gobi's Valley. >_>;

Um... yeah, still need some help with Gobi's Valley overall, and Freezeezy Peak as well. My route there is horrible at the moment; it might help to wait for the new WIP from Sami in the TAS, but I'm not sure how long that's going to be, and I'm assuming it'll include quite a few tricks with flying, beak bombing and what have you.

From what I recall, my last time for RBB was 14.02. Which is good, I guess; but there's still room for heaps of improvement, considering that with the route I'm currently taking (slightly modified Gibb route) I'm actually leaving the level just as the propellors for the ship turn back on, lol.

Hehe... I can confirm that Motzand's organ playing in Mad Monster Mansion is not random in the slightest; after analysing three different people playing through the game, myself, Marsh, and some random youtuber, both the PAL and NTSC versions follow a set list of notes, which can be found below:

[img]http://i163.photobucket.com/albums/t297/kowbrainz/motzand.jpg[/img]

The star is the last note you play, so yeah, there's 15 notes to memorise in all. I'll probably keep a cheat sheet with me for the first few practice runs before I have it completely memorised... although that may take a while - I'm still yet to memorise the matching tiles in Gobi's Valley. >_>;

Um... yeah, still need some help with Gobi's Valley overall, and Freezeezy Peak as well. My route there is horrible at the moment; it might help to wait for the new WIP from Sami in the TAS, but I'm not sure how long that's going to be, and I'm assuming it'll include quite a few tricks with flying, beak bombing and what have you.

From what I recall, my last time for RBB was 14.02. Which is good, I guess; but there's still room for heaps of improvement, considering that with the route I'm currently taking (slightly modified Gibb route) I'm actually leaving the level just as the propellors for the ship turn back on, lol.

Gibbatizer

2008-07-20 08:04:31 am

thats a very well illustrated keyboard note guide thing. But do you still have to wait for him to go through and press them all or can you rush ahead? Btw, if you can offer me possible ways of hooking a vcr up and recording off their and creating clips somehow, I can hopefully start helping you a bit more. What are some standard recording methods going from video onto computer?

kowbrainz

2008-07-21 03:34:36 am

Yeah, as soon as he's finished talking and when he's about to go for the first note, you can start playing, then you can rush ahead and do the rest of the first part, skip the second text then do the second part. Make sure the keys go green after you hit them, though; if you do it too early they won't change in colour and you'll get hurt when you rush ahead later, which happened to me when I first went through.

Um; the way I record isn't particularly simple; I use an old video camera and hook it up to the TV's output, then plug the video camera into a laptop with a video card and import what's on the screen straight into Windows Movie Maker before it gets saved. But there are a lot more better ways of recording; I just haven't really looked for any yet since I don't need one (at least, not for games which play in 50hz; 60hz titles don't work for me for whatever reason).

There's your obvious TV tuners and stuff like that; I think this was one I looked at a while ago, but I'm not exactly sure how they work etc; maybe look into it a bit further first just so you know exactly what you want or need.

Yeah, as soon as he's finished talking and when he's about to go for the first note, you can start playing, then you can rush ahead and do the rest of the first part, skip the second text then do the second part. Make sure the keys go green after you hit them, though; if you do it too early they won't change in colour and you'll get hurt when you rush ahead later, which happened to me when I first went through.

Um; the way I record isn't particularly simple; I use an old video camera and hook it up to the TV's output, then plug the video camera into a laptop with a video card and import what's on the screen straight into Windows Movie Maker before it gets saved. But there are a lot more better ways of recording; I just haven't really looked for any yet since I don't need one (at least, not for games which play in 50hz; 60hz titles don't work for me for whatever reason).

There's your obvious TV tuners and stuff like that; I think [url=http://cgi.ebay.com.au/Leadtek-DTV-Dongle-GOLD-USB-2-0-Digital-HDTV-TV-Tuner_W0QQitemZ220259864981QQihZ012QQcategoryZ111509QQssPageNameZWDVWQQrdZ1QQcmdZViewItem]this[/url] was one I looked at a while ago, but I'm not exactly sure how they work etc; maybe look into it a bit further first just so you know exactly what you want or need.

kowbrainz

2008-07-25 07:55:20 am

I thought there'd be more interest in Banjo-Kazooie. Oh well. :/

Okay, I've played through the game from start to finish again to check on my weak areas and practice. Below are the results, copied over from a post on another site

Quote:

Kowbrainz: 2.57.14
100 jiggies, 900 notes, all honeycombs and Grunty defeated.

Spiral Mountain: 2.18
Gruntilda's Lair: 37.43
Mumbo;s Mountain: 6.39
Treasure Trove Cove: 11.42
Clanker's Cavern: 11.38
Bubblegloop Swamp: 15.25
Freezeezy Peak: 18.28
Gobi's Valley: 14.35
Mad Monster Mansion: 14.59
Rusty Bucket Bay: 14.12
Click Clock Wood: 29.35

1. Mumbo's Mountain was good, but definitely not excellent. Could have been improved by twenty seconds or more due to some mistakes here and there (Conga hitting me off the platform a few times lol etc)

2. Treasure Trove Cove was terrible. 2 minutes behind by personal best, so I wasn't too happy. I kept going anyway.
This was mainly due to bad flying segments; landing when I wasn't meant to and missing item in flight.

3. Clanker's Cavern was good, but it can be improved by up to a minute through route optimization I think. Hopefully Pyro's able to help out soon; this is his level.

4. Bubblegloop Swamp was the best run I've had before, and even then it still had mistakes here and there (skipping Vile's speech, missing turtles in tanktup)

5. Gobi's Valley came next in the run. Best time for me, although it can still be improved by a lot.

6. Mad Monster Mansion... was okay. I'm still practicing the route I use for the level, and there were some big mistakes here and there, but it was okay all in all

7. Freezeezy Peak was terrible. Big mistakes and horrible route planning all round. Yay... >.>

8. Rusty Bucket Bay was smooth; the route I use beats Marshmallow's time by two minutes at least, but I can still do better.

9. Click Clock Wood was terrible; namely Autumn. I fell off the tree and almost left without opening the flower and getting its jiggy, or entering gnawty's house.

10. Grunty's lair was good; final fight and furnace fun went really well. Talked to many Brentilda's just for furnace fun.

Major weak areas.... Freezeezy Peak, mainly. Click Clock Wood was mostly due to not doing that level for a while.
Gobi's Valley can also get improvement, same with Mad Monster Mansion. If you have videos for them it would be good, Gibbatizer; otherwise some rough written routes of the steps you take in the level might be good enough if you have the time.

:( I thought there'd be more interest in Banjo-Kazooie. Oh well. :/

Okay, I've played through the game from start to finish again to check on my weak areas and practice. Below are the results, copied over from a post on another site

[quote]
Kowbrainz: 2.57.14
100 jiggies, 900 notes, all honeycombs and Grunty defeated.

Spiral Mountain: 2.18 
Gruntilda's Lair: 37.43 
Mumbo;s Mountain: 6.39 
Treasure Trove Cove: 11.42 
Clanker's Cavern: 11.38 
Bubblegloop Swamp: 15.25
Freezeezy Peak: 18.28 
Gobi's Valley: 14.35 
Mad Monster Mansion: 14.59
Rusty Bucket Bay: 14.12 
Click Clock Wood: 29.35

1. Mumbo's Mountain was good, but definitely not excellent. Could have been improved by twenty seconds or more due to some mistakes here and there (Conga hitting me off the platform a few times lol etc)

2. Treasure Trove Cove was terrible. 2 minutes behind by personal best, so I wasn't too happy. I kept going anyway.
This was mainly due to bad flying segments; landing when I wasn't meant to and missing item in flight.

3. Clanker's Cavern was good, but it can be improved by up to a minute through route optimization I think. Hopefully Pyro's able to help out soon; this is his level.

4. Bubblegloop Swamp was the best run I've had before, and even then it still had mistakes here and there (skipping Vile's speech, missing turtles in tanktup)

5. Gobi's Valley came next in the run. Best time for me, although it can still be improved by a lot.

6. Mad Monster Mansion... was okay. I'm still practicing the route I use for the level, and there were some big mistakes here and there, but it was okay all in all

7. Freezeezy Peak was terrible. Big mistakes and horrible route planning all round. Yay... >.>

8. Rusty Bucket Bay was smooth; the route I use beats Marshmallow's time by two minutes at least, but I can still do better.

9. Click Clock Wood was terrible; namely Autumn. I fell off the tree and almost left without opening the flower and getting its jiggy, or entering gnawty's house.

10. Grunty's lair was good; final fight and furnace fun went really well. Talked to many Brentilda's just for furnace fun.
[/quote]

Major weak areas.... Freezeezy Peak, mainly. Click Clock Wood was mostly due to not doing that level for a while.
Gobi's Valley can also get improvement, same with Mad Monster Mansion. If you have videos for them it would be good, Gibbatizer; otherwise some rough written routes of the steps you take in the level might be good enough if you have the time.

Essentia

2008-07-25 10:35:09 am

Everything's better with Magitek

I just want you to let you know that I'm interested in this run; I just don't really have anything to contribute. I'm sure there are a lot of other people who are in the same situation, so don't get discouraged. Smiley

Cyberwrath

2008-07-25 08:22:25 pm

I love YaBB 1G - SP1!

Nice, looks like a great practice run!

How did the Mozhand organ part go? Did you fly through it? Also, did you use pumpkin or bear form to collect the well stuff in MMM?

kowbrainz

2008-07-26 03:54:37 am

Thanks for that, Essentia. Good to know at least.

Organ was done using the cheat sheet. Well was done with Banjo, but I messed up a bit. I've had a perfect run with it before, collecting all notes, jiggy and the mumbo token in one dive; I just have to find out which notes to go for first and how to avoid wasting time getting hit by the whiplashes at the bottom.

I'm still unsure how Gibbatizer's getting upwards of a minute faster than me on that level, though; I'm using the TAS route for goodness sake. Tongue

I think the time to aim for would be around about 2.40, if possible, now that I know roughly what can be done. Then again, I'm probably still overlooking some big skips and alternate routes here and there, so I'm worried about finishing the run then having someone achieve 2.35 or something similar a few months later, lol.