Audio Commentary / Subtitles

2008-12-22 05:14:38 pm

everybody wanna tell you the meaning of music

CannibalK9: Whoops, sorry. :-[ Thanks a ton for telling me though.

Alucard: Me too, but it's not for ease of watching reasons, it's for organizational reasons. I think I mentioned this to Nate once or twice (in a "hey it would be nice if" context, not a "could you please do this" context), but anyway, I'd much rather every audio commentary be muxed (ps: muxed != mixed) into all mp4 versions. That way, people wouldn't need any external info (like this thread) to find out which versions have commentary, because they just all would. That's why I asked him to start putting commentary in the LQ versions, because I had half a dozen people say "I downloaded the LQ, where is the commentary?"

I think I just want the xml format to be as clean as possible, lol. Anyway, if he doesn't mind, I'm going to ask him about doing this. I don't think we get enough retro commentaries that it's a big deal, and all new commentaries come in all versions already, so hopefully it won't be too much effort to begin rendering this thread obsolete.

CannibalK9: Whoops, sorry. :-[ Thanks a ton for telling me though.

Alucard: Me too, but it's not for ease of watching reasons, it's for organizational reasons. I think I mentioned this to Nate once or twice (in a "hey it would be nice if" context, not a "could you please do this" context), but anyway, I'd much rather every audio commentary be muxed (ps: muxed != mixed) into all mp4 versions. That way, people wouldn't need any external info (like this thread) to find out which versions have commentary, because they just all would. That's why I asked him to start putting commentary in the LQ versions, because I had half a dozen people say "I downloaded the LQ, where is the commentary?"

I think I just want the xml format to be as clean as possible, lol. Anyway, if he doesn't mind, I'm going to ask him about doing this. I don't think we get enough retro commentaries that it's a big deal, and all new commentaries come in all versions already, so hopefully it won't be too much effort to begin rendering this thread obsolete.

xXIkuto

Edit history:

xXIkuto: 2008-12-22 05:51:38 pm

2008-12-22 05:45:58 pm

yeah i appreciate it, i also sent nate an HQ muxed avi of it awhile ago cause i know he ends up having to do all that stuff. i just figured i'd save him some pain in the ass encoding since he's gotta handle all the runs already and it's just a for fun commentary Tongue

i dunno how pain in the ass it is to replace the current files with a new avi (yeah, avi cause mp4 would kill his avp runs quality even more, and i don't want that Smiley

) that i muxed, but i think it'd be easier for everyone to watch.

i know he's been busy afk for xmas vacation so i just mentioned it so that later on he won't forget about his beautiful run commentary when he's back from magfest and all Wink

also i personally wouldn't mind muxing game audio & commentary into one track and adjust the levels for people. if anyone with commentaries wants me to do that for them, feel free to post here or something. i dunno how pain in the ass that would be for you guys to replace things though, and i don't want to be a pain in the ass over something not necessary like commentary (i appreciate nate hosting it at all.) i know for some reason people really just want the voice and silence, but personally i enjoy at least a little bit of the game music in the background. i could always post samples if someone wanted me to.

maybe if i could learn some magical way to get 3 + audio tracks in an mp4, the voice and silence could happen also. i know that would just make nate go Undecided

though cause it's extra unnecessary space for a preference track. hey though i was looking around and there's a program called handbrake that seems worth messing with for something like that. could lead to archive only commentaries with 3 audio tracks one day Cheesy

p.s- i don't think it's a bad thing to get rid of this thread, but in that case i'd appreciate it if some sort of list or flags were put on the run page to let people know a run has commentary. i'd appreciate it if something like that could be kept.

yeah i appreciate it, i also sent nate an HQ muxed avi of it awhile ago cause i know he ends up having to do all that stuff.  i just figured i'd save him some pain in the ass encoding since he's gotta handle all the runs already and it's just a for fun commentary  :P

i dunno how pain in the ass it is to replace the current files with a new avi (yeah, avi cause mp4 would kill his avp runs quality even more, and i don't want that :) ) that i muxed, but i think it'd be easier for everyone to watch.

i know he's been busy afk for xmas vacation so i just mentioned it so that later on he won't forget about his beautiful run commentary when he's back from magfest and all  ;)

also i personally wouldn't mind muxing game audio & commentary into one track and adjust the levels for people.   if anyone with commentaries wants me to do that for them, feel free to post here or something.   i dunno how pain in the ass that would be for you guys to replace things though, and i don't want to be a pain in the ass over something not necessary like commentary (i appreciate nate hosting it at all.) i  know for some reason people really just want the voice and silence, but personally i enjoy at least a little bit of the game music in the background.  i could always post samples if someone wanted me to.

maybe if i could learn some magical way to get 3 + audio tracks in an mp4, the voice and silence could happen also.  i know that would just make nate go  :-\ though cause it's extra unnecessary space for a preference track.  hey though i was looking around and there's a program called [url=http://handbrake.fr/?article=download]handbrake[/url] that seems worth messing with for something like that.  could lead to archive only commentaries with 3 audio tracks one day  :D

p.s- i don't think it's a bad thing to get rid of this thread, but in that case i'd appreciate it if some sort of list or flags were put on the run page to let people know a run has commentary.  i'd appreciate it if something like that could be kept.

nate

2008-12-22 05:50:36 pm

why not just play both at once and turn down the level on the game audio?

xXIkuto

2008-12-22 05:52:58 pm

a bunch of syncing issues, and most people won't do that Undecided

Motoss

2008-12-22 05:59:49 pm

Basically, runs are way more interesting with commentary, so I would be nice if even if this thread disappears, that runs with commentary were marked in some way next to the title of the game.

P.S. Does anyone know what is up with the commentary on Tiki's MM3? I downloaded the HQ and it doesn't seem to have a second audio track, in WMP, VLC, or any other player I have.

nate

2008-12-22 06:05:38 pm

meant after the commentary track is muxed.

Quote from Motoss:

Does anyone know what is up with the commentary on Tiki's MM3? I downloaded the HQ and it doesn't seem to have a second audio track, in WMP, VLC, or any other player I have.

did you download it from archive.org?

Motoss

2008-12-22 06:07:07 pm

I did.

Enhasa

2008-12-22 06:17:08 pm

everybody wanna tell you the meaning of music

Motoss: LOL, I wondered if this could possibly happen, and it did. I am VERY VERY sorry. Since I was editing the first post already, I jumped the gun and edited the changes in there that apply to the update that is coming in several hours. Tiki's MM3 from before does NOT have commentary. His MM3 in the Dec 23 update does. While I'm at it, Satoryu's MM9 run is technically not obsoleted yet either.

Motoss and Alucard: BTW, sorry, it seems I am doing an utterly shitty job of making myself clear today. I'm not going to lock this thread unless it's totally unnecessary. Including commentary in all versions does NOT make this thread obsolete. It makes the version listings after the colons obsolete. The SDA rewrite (I should have realized winter makes people lazy, whoops, and I am naturally lazy) will make this thread obsolete, along with other common requests like "list runs by runner" etc.

Alucard: 3 tracks would be a hack (I know you know this, just saying). Ideally the correct implementation would be if the end user could mix the volumes from track 1 and track 2 in their player. That way, track 1 could be 100% game audio, track 2 could be 100% voice, and people could have all game audio, all voice, or a mix of the two... whatever they want. This is why in the abstract, it makes more sense not to premix track 2 yourself, although there's not really much point in waiting around for a feature that may never come.

Or you could just do what Nate said, lol. That's what I would do.

Anyway, I don't care either way whether or not game audio is included, but if you premix them, only people who want premixed are happy. People who want only voice are sad, plus the audio only makes it harder to hear the voice. If you keep them separate, voice only people are happy, and mix people only have a slight inconvenience.

Motoss: LOL, I wondered if this could possibly happen, and it did. I am VERY VERY sorry. Since I was editing the first post already, I jumped the gun and edited the changes in there that apply to the update that is coming in several hours. Tiki's MM3 from before does NOT have commentary. His MM3 in the Dec 23 update does. While I'm at it, Satoryu's MM9 run is technically not obsoleted yet either.

Motoss and Alucard: BTW, sorry, it seems I am doing an utterly shitty job of making myself clear today. I'm not going to lock this thread unless it's totally unnecessary. Including commentary in all versions does NOT make this thread obsolete. It makes the version listings after the colons obsolete. The SDA rewrite (I should have realized winter makes people lazy, whoops, and I am naturally lazy) will make this thread obsolete, along with other common requests like "list runs by runner" etc.

Alucard: 3 tracks would be a hack (I know you know this, just saying). Ideally the correct implementation would be if the end user could mix the volumes from track 1 and track 2 in their player. That way, track 1 could be 100% game audio, track 2 could be 100% voice, and people could have all game audio, all voice, or a mix of the two... whatever they want. This is why in the abstract, it makes more sense not to premix track 2 yourself, although there's not really much point in waiting around for a feature that may never come.

Or you could just do what Nate said, lol. That's what I would do.

Anyway, I don't care either way whether or not game audio is included, but if you premix them, only people who want premixed are happy. People who want only voice are sad, plus the audio only makes it harder to hear the voice. If you keep them separate, voice only people are happy, and mix people only have a slight inconvenience.

xXIkuto

2008-12-22 06:18:23 pm

(@ nate) oh sorry i was a little confused. i thought you meant start up the run and then commentary at around the same time and adjust. i actually didn't really think of playing both tracks at once while watching, you're right that it would be the most pro-space out of them all. i guess it's just for convenience to mix the track as well with a lower game audio in the background.

i have no idea why i thought you meant doing something as ghetto as running 2 vlc's at around the same time Undecided

Enhasa

2008-12-22 06:24:05 pm

everybody wanna tell you the meaning of music

I don't think VLC (or any player I've used for that matter) can mix levels for multiple tracks, so I think he does mean 2 VLC instances simultaneously.

BTW there's nothing wrong with ghetto, man. Whatever works. Tongue

For example, anri-chan is like the ghettoest thing ever created.

Carcinogen

2008-12-22 06:43:37 pm

Ghettoest, but free, and at least a little effective. ;-p

nate

2008-12-22 06:44:36 pm

i didn't mean anything. whether software exists to do it is irrelevant. you just write it.

bet you anything mplayer does it though which means you can put a little "listen with mixed commentary" button in smplayer.

Enhasa

2008-12-22 07:13:52 pm

everybody wanna tell you the meaning of music

From what I can tell, nobody supports it because it's not part of the specs to be able to play multiple tracks at once. (ie listening to English and Spanish simultaneously wouldn't be very useful)

But yeah, it would be great if there was an mplayer parameter already.

nate

2008-12-22 11:36:21 pm

don't dvds do it?

then again i have to think about what i am asking ... dvd subtitles aren't text lol. wouldn't be unbelievable if they actually ghetto the movie audio into the commentary track at a lower volume.

guess someone who knows of a dvd like that offhand can check the commentary track in isolation.

Riods

2009-01-03 04:53:33 pm

Oh, I have a little problem here.
The commentarys that are in external files don't play straight, after some time around 1min and 2 min, the SMPlayer just stops the video, and I need to go to whatever part it stopped and click play again. Does anyone knows a solution? It bugs me to always have to find whatever time it was, it kind of breaks the flow of the video.

Anyway, I'm not English so, just ignore the mistakes I made.

Siyko

2009-01-03 05:37:54 pm

I used to be athiest until I realized I was God.

Quote from nate:

wouldn't be unbelievable if they actually ghetto the movie audio into the commentary track at a lower volume.

i'd assume it would - if it had to play both the movie audio and commentary, then you'd have to read from two audio tracks simultaneously - that would provide legacy issues, and even read speed issues for older dvd players, and i've never heard of a dvd player being unable to play the audio commentary.

djcj

2009-01-04 10:14:55 am

Audio commentary on a DVD is an own track with mixed in movie sound. It's not two audio tracks played simultanously.
Try demuxing the AC3 files from a DVD and you'll see.
You have to stick with mixing the game sound together with the AC.
Or you have to hack a media player so it's able to play two tracks simultanously, wich is a bad idea IMO.

Enhasa

Edit history:

Enhasa: 2009-01-12 10:57:44 pm

2009-01-12 10:50:18 pm

everybody wanna tell you the meaning of music

Quote from Riods:

Oh, I have a little problem here.
The commentarys that are in external files don't play straight, after some time around 1min and 2 min, the SMPlayer just stops the video, and I need to go to whatever part it stopped and click play again. Does anyone knows a solution? It bugs me to always have to find whatever time it was, it kind of breaks the flow of the video.

Anyway, I'm not English so, just ignore the mistakes I made.

Yeah, it was brought up several pages back, but this thread is long so I understand.

It's because of how mplayer does external audio. It interleaves the audio with the video. Of course, this works great for avi (which is interleaved) but it doesn't work for mp4 since it's muxed. Also of course, I tested the external audio with avi's like Sonic 2, so I didn't catch this at first.

Ideally all the commentary would be included as a second track, and we = Nate could go back and mux in commentaries for each run, but since it's not like that yet, for now you can just open 2 instances (one with video, one with commentary). Sad

I know it's a hack but it works. Including all the commentaries in the runs is already a good idea otherwise for the convenience factor like Alucard points out.

I edited the first post to stave off any more confusion.

[quote="Riods"]
Oh, I have a little problem here.
The commentarys that are in external files don't play straight, after some time around 1min and 2 min, the SMPlayer just stops the video, and I need to go to whatever part it stopped and click play again. Does anyone knows a solution? It bugs me to always have to find whatever time it was, it kind of breaks the flow of the video.

Anyway, I'm not English so, just ignore the mistakes I made.
[/quote]
Yeah, it was brought up several pages back, but this thread is long so I understand.

It's because of how mplayer does external audio. It interleaves the audio with the video. Of course, this works great for avi (which is interleaved) but it doesn't work for mp4 since it's muxed. Also of course, I tested the external audio with avi's like Sonic 2, so I didn't catch this at first.

Ideally all the commentary would be included as a second track, and we = Nate could go back and mux in commentaries for each run, but since it's not like that yet, for now you can just open 2 instances (one with video, one with commentary). :( I know it's a hack but it works. Including all the commentaries in the runs is already a good idea otherwise for the convenience factor like Alucard points out.

I edited the first post to stave off any more confusion.

mikwuyma

Enhasa

Edit history:

Enhasa: 2009-01-16 09:58:10 am

2009-01-14 08:09:37 pm

My feelings on The Demon Rush

So we did a couple of audio commentaries at MAGFest.

Download the mp4, then after you download go to Audio -> Track 2 -> then sit back and relax...that is, if you can relax after listening. Wink

http://dl.speeddemosarchive.com/demo.pl?DarkCastle_easy_119 - My debut! Cheesy

It's also Essentia-safe with absolutely no cursing!

http://dl.speeddemosarchive.com/demo.pl?Contra_1017 - Group commentary featuring Frezy_Man's sexy Swedish accent, and me screaming all over. Also, definitely not Essentia-safe, though I would say it's tiki-approved Tongue

For those of you too lazy to go to audio and click track 2.

http://files.filefront.com/darkcastlewav/;12893597;/fileinfo.html

http://files.filefront.com/Groupcontrafuckingawesomewav/;12893740;/fileinfo.html

purb36

2009-01-14 09:01:11 pm

I love YaBB 1G - SP1!

simple solution for voice-only recording: play the video with headphones on, so there's no sound from the video included, and comment.

three.5 cheers for commentary!
-A

Satoryu

2009-01-14 09:06:26 pm

Visually Appealing

Quote from mikwuyma:

http://dl.speeddemosarchive.com/demo.pl?Contra_1017 - Group commentary featuring Frezy_Man's sexy Swedish accent, and me screaming all over. Also, definitely not Essentia-safe, though I would say it's tiki-approved Tongue

it sounded like total madness. it was fucking crazy. fucking hilarious. it felt like Freddy wanted to talk more about the run, but everyone else kept on interrupting him.

mikwuyma

2009-01-14 10:16:19 pm

My feelings on The Demon Rush

purb36: I wasn't going for voice-only recording. In fact, I think the in-game sound enhances the Dark Castle commentary.

Satoryu: Glad you liked it. Smiley

And yes, Freddy was the only one being serious (or trying to be, at least).

Carcinogen

2009-01-15 04:46:51 pm

My new lack of self-perception aside, I am incredibly lame while I'm drunk 0_0;;

Emptyeye

2009-01-15 08:08:36 pm

Talk to the Hand

Quote from mikwuyma:

purb36: I wasn't going for voice-only recording. In fact, I think the in-game sound enhances the Dark Castle commentary.

Satoryu: Glad you liked it. Smiley

And yes, Freddy was the only one being serious (or trying to be, at least).

The best part of his seriousness is that every single time he's like "And this boss fight sucked." *Destroys boss inconceivably quickly*

Needed more "COOOONTRA! BY FREDDY ANNNNNDERSOOOOON!" Wink

purb36

2009-01-16 02:40:51 am

I love YaBB 1G - SP1!

Quote from mikwuyma:

purb36: I wasn't going for voice-only recording. In fact, I think the in-game sound enhances the Dark Castle commentary.

wasn't necessarily directed at you...more for the "how do i record without the video sound being too loud" crowd. personally, i like having the music in with the commentary, as long as you can hear the commentary clearly. but that's just me. and lots of other people too... Wink

-A