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najzere
2010-06-26 05:10:21 pm
Quote from TheQuietMan:
Just checking, but do you know that you can melee at any point during the hover and then jump? You can get up to a ton of ledges even if you lose elevation.


I seem to fall whenever I stop tapping the d-pad or press any other buttons, but I'll experiment with it. If there is a way to gain elevation, or even just maintain it, that would open up tons of skips. There have been plenty of times when I haven't even bothered trying to hover because the distant ledge is at the same height as mine or above it.
TheQuietMan
2010-06-26 05:53:33 pm
Complete. Global. Saturation.
You can maintain your elevation by tapping the crap out of the up button on the D-pad. Also, when you melee at the end of your air walk, it gives you a free jump after the melee is completed, and it can boost you to some very high places if you're in the right position and distance from the ledge. This video shows what you could do with it in multiplayer (melee and jump included) until they patched it.
And this video will give you an idea of what you can do with the glitch, as well as other possibilites. You can climb walls if you find the right slope. When a propane tank is added to the mix, things can get even more interesting.
najzere
2010-06-26 06:12:07 pm
The melee to jump alone is going to be extremely useful. I'll have to try and find a place to use the propane tank trick, although there aren't many angled slopes around propane tanks usually. I'm interested in that left-right-aim trick he used to clip into the wall. I think that might have the most potential if you can do it anywhere. Thanks for the info on all these great tricks!
xRikux89
2010-07-04 05:33:54 pm
I don't know if this is useful at any point, but here goes: Surely you know that if you shoot a gun while on a balancing beam, you can run normally instead of balancing across slowly. You can then also freely run off the beam sideways. If you then press jump, you'll jump off thin air, around a meter away from the beam maybe, adding that much distance to your jump.
arkarian
arkarian
Edit history:
arkarian: 2010-10-03 05:28:31 am
2010-10-03 05:27:51 am
gamelogs.org
does anyone know if the hover glitch has been patched in single player? i can't seem to be able to do it.
TheQuietMan
2010-10-03 09:21:03 am
Complete. Global. Saturation.
Quote from arkarian:
does anyone know if the hover glitch has been patched in single player? i can't seem to be able to do it.

When they fixed it in multiplayer over the summer, it was fixed in single player too. Unpatched versions will still have it though.
And on a sidenote, you can actually still do the airwalk in some places. If you press yourself into the right wall which has a slight ledge to it, you can still airwalk on it until the ledge ends.
najzere
2010-10-03 11:52:16 am
Bumping this thread reminded me: I tried out the other glitches TheQuietMan was talking about before and I couldn't ever get the wall clip trick to work and same for meleeing while hovering. I was able to get a mid-air jump sometimes (by just pressing the jump button), but not reliably. Admittedly, I'm pretty poor when it comes to tapping d-pad up very quickly, so maybe someone else will have better luck. If it turns out some of these are doable, maybe whoever verifies them can post an explicit how-to? Cheesy

Also, with the glitches and best strategies I could devise, I have some individual chapter times for the first seven chapters. If someone's planning on running this or whatever, we can compare and talk routes if the times are very far off.
arkarian
arkarian
Edit history:
arkarian: 2010-10-03 06:42:08 pm
2010-10-03 06:41:47 pm
gamelogs.org
there's still a possibility i'll be running it for the marathon (and i'm also thinking about doing a submittable run) which is why i'm asking. what are you times for the first 7 chapters so i know what to shoot for?

i'm going to start work on some chapter timing of my own soon, hopefully this week.
najzere
2010-10-04 12:33:32 am
These are from selecting the chapter in the menu, not playing straight through and I timed from gaining control to losing it. Also, these were timed with a stopwatch, not recorded and counted by frame.

ChapterTime
1
4:56.5
2
12:33.6
3
5:44.8
4
4:15.8
5
5:38.4
6
11:03.8
7
2:46.6
arkarian
arkarian
Edit history:
arkarian: 2011-01-07 09:11:03 pm
arkarian: 2011-01-07 09:03:32 pm
arkarian: 2011-01-07 08:50:43 pm
arkarian: 2011-01-07 08:34:18 pm
arkarian: 2011-01-07 08:26:33 pm
arkarian: 2011-01-07 08:26:10 pm
arkarian: 2011-01-04 04:12:52 pm
arkarian: 2011-01-04 04:12:22 pm
arkarian: 2011-01-04 03:33:28 pm
arkarian: 2011-01-03 03:36:38 pm
arkarian: 2011-01-03 12:59:23 pm
arkarian: 2011-01-03 12:24:06 pm
arkarian: 2010-12-31 08:33:37 pm
arkarian: 2010-12-24 06:10:19 pm
arkarian: 2010-12-24 04:33:36 pm
arkarian: 2010-12-24 01:49:31 pm
arkarian: 2010-12-24 01:42:35 pm
arkarian: 2010-12-13 07:51:09 pm
arkarian: 2010-12-13 07:40:24 pm
arkarian: 2010-12-13 07:34:49 pm
arkarian: 2010-12-12 06:36:14 pm
arkarian: 2010-12-12 06:25:46 pm
arkarian: 2010-12-12 06:07:31 pm
arkarian: 2010-12-12 06:01:57 pm
arkarian: 2010-12-12 05:44:04 pm
arkarian: 2010-12-11 04:46:22 pm
arkarian: 2010-12-11 04:37:59 pm
arkarian: 2010-12-11 04:33:52 pm
arkarian: 2010-12-11 04:33:34 pm
arkarian: 2010-12-11 04:21:07 pm
arkarian: 2010-12-09 12:15:55 am
arkarian: 2010-12-09 12:08:36 am
arkarian: 2010-12-08 11:51:35 pm
arkarian: 2010-12-08 11:51:29 pm
arkarian: 2010-12-08 11:51:17 pm
arkarian: 2010-12-08 11:40:58 pm
arkarian: 2010-12-08 11:40:37 pm
arkarian: 2010-12-08 11:23:12 pm
arkarian: 2010-12-07 08:30:33 pm
arkarian: 2010-12-07 08:17:44 pm
arkarian: 2010-12-07 08:17:16 pm
arkarian: 2010-12-07 08:06:45 pm
arkarian: 2010-12-07 07:57:18 pm
arkarian: 2010-12-07 07:52:26 pm
arkarian: 2010-12-07 07:52:09 pm
arkarian: 2010-12-07 07:45:28 pm
arkarian: 2010-12-07 07:42:00 pm
arkarian: 2010-12-06 10:49:09 pm
arkarian: 2010-12-06 10:43:25 pm
arkarian: 2010-12-06 10:43:18 pm
arkarian: 2010-12-06 10:12:31 pm
arkarian: 2010-12-05 06:47:38 pm
arkarian: 2010-12-05 06:42:22 pm
arkarian: 2010-12-05 06:13:19 pm
arkarian: 2010-12-05 06:13:06 pm
arkarian: 2010-12-05 12:35:57 am
arkarian: 2010-12-05 12:29:47 am
arkarian: 2010-11-22 08:21:30 pm
arkarian: 2010-11-22 07:53:51 pm
arkarian: 2010-11-22 07:52:33 pm
arkarian: 2010-11-20 10:50:37 pm
arkarian: 2010-11-20 10:40:37 pm
arkarian: 2010-11-20 10:39:59 pm
arkarian: 2010-11-20 10:33:38 pm
arkarian: 2010-11-19 01:03:39 pm
arkarian: 2010-11-19 01:03:15 pm
arkarian: 2010-11-18 10:03:35 pm
arkarian: 2010-11-18 09:07:30 pm
arkarian: 2010-11-18 09:05:56 pm
arkarian: 2010-11-18 09:05:40 pm
arkarian: 2010-11-17 06:43:41 pm
arkarian: 2010-11-17 06:29:20 pm
arkarian: 2010-11-17 06:27:52 pm
arkarian: 2010-11-17 05:35:56 pm
arkarian: 2010-11-17 05:27:30 pm
arkarian: 2010-11-17 05:24:28 pm
arkarian: 2010-11-15 11:36:22 pm
arkarian: 2010-11-15 11:36:10 pm
arkarian: 2010-11-15 11:36:02 pm
arkarian: 2010-11-15 11:34:17 pm
2010-11-15 11:33:16 pm
gamelogs.org
now i'm definitely running this for the marathon so i've finally started doing some chapter runthroughs. i'm going to be generous and allow myself extra time (up to 60 seconds per chapter depending on length) since single segment can be a pain in the ass.

here are my times: agdq is a generous estimate for the marathon, while best is obv my best time for that chapter. i'm timing from the start of the chapter to the end (so not necessarily from start of control since some chapters start with a cutscene) to better reflect how long they'll take in a ss.

chapt      agdq        bestabout
1     
05:0004:52        < 4:50 is easily possible
2     
13:3013:13        probably will be more like 13:00 after my next round of practice
3     
05:2004:58       
4     
06:3005:55        i hate this chapter
5     
05:4005:05        this one sucks too
6     
10:3010:06        < 10:00 is easily possible, probably 9:40
7     
03:1002:58        can't hover so i have to move the cars
8     
04:3504:24        easy chapter is easy
9     
04:3004:11        ^^^
10     
03:0502:51       
11     
02:5502:50       
12     
05:3505:08       
13     
04:5004:12        lots of ways this one can go wrong but should be no big deal
14     
04:3004:03        could probably be done in under 3:50
15     
04:2504:05        can be done several seconds faster
16     
01:2501:21        lol
17     
10:2009:16        this chapter is lame
18     
09:3008:41        almost certainly going to fall off at least one ledge here. hate this chapter
19     
03:1502:45        can probably be done several seconds faster
20     
05:4004:43        this one's not too bad as long as i don't die near the end
21     
02:4002:28       
22     
17:3016:45       
22     
12:4012:10        can skip the bridge falling to save over a minute (thanks tigger!)
24     
05:3005:19       
25     
11:0010:17       
26     
02:2502:18       
total     
2:46:002:34:44       

notes:
- one cool thing about this game is that you rarely have to worry about ammo since many chapters start you off with either a particular gun or no weapons at all, so ammo conservation is basically a non-issue
- i don't do the ch 2 rope swing skip because i'm too inconsistent. hovering isn't actually necessary for this trick, it's just a reeeeally long and precise jump.
- obviously can't do the ch 4 fight skip since hovering's been patched. the fight itself is fairly long and really sucks, but i've got a reasonably consistent strat.
- i'm giving myself so much extra time in ch 5 because of the many ways it can go wrong. fairly confident i can do it in under 5:15 pretty consistently though.
- unlike most parts of the game, you don't have to worry about leaving chloe behind in chapter 10 - you can just run straight through it, meleeing or shotgunning anyone in your way
- if i don't die, ch 17 is easily done in under 9:40. it's very easy to misstep and fall off a ledge in this chapter though hence the extra minute of time.
Master ZED
2010-11-18 09:36:48 pm
Quote from arkarian:
- obviously can't do the ch 4 fight skip since hovering's been patched.
Delete your game data and ignore the update prompt every time you boot up.  Just be sure to back up any local cinema files you want to keep first by putting them into online files, as the game data contains all local cinema files for all accounts on your PS3 (I didn't know this and lost a few good ones... feh).
arkarian
2010-11-18 09:43:25 pm
gamelogs.org
i'm not going to delete my game data just to do that. i'll just be running it without hovering.
Master ZED
2010-11-18 10:03:16 pm
It's not like you're really losing anything other than the cinema files; the save data folder contains all single player progress, and all DLC can be re-downloaded (that and there's no single player DLC anyway).  The only reason I could think of not to do this would be if you play online regularly, which is why I'm not even studying the game for a run unless a well-defined glitchless category pops up.
arkarian
2010-11-18 10:05:10 pm
gamelogs.org
oh i thought it deleted game data too. well since i've already been practicing without hovering i'm just going to keep doing that. if it turns out that the run will be a lot longer than 3 hours though i'll look into doing it with hovering.
LOUiE
2011-01-10 01:26:12 pm
I didn't find this anywhere yet and I was watching the AGDQ Marathon of this game and the runner Arkarian missed this on Chapter 25. After you shoot the resin to move the first set of roots out of the way, instead of jumping on the rope and going around, you can just throw a grenade up through the whole while on the ground and it'll blow the resin and move the roots and you can just right through.  I wish I could do video capture cause I'd load it up to Youtube and show it.  Maybe someone with video capture capability can try this and upload it?
arkarian
2011-01-10 01:38:27 pm
gamelogs.org
wow cool, i'll have to try that next time i run the game. nice find.
LOUiE
2011-01-10 03:32:25 pm
BTW, that was a really cool out of bounds glitch you found.  I'm hoping a huge skip will be found with it.
arkarian
2011-01-10 03:47:18 pm
gamelogs.org
heh yeah we'll see. sort of a shame that the game depends so much on events like elena and tenzin following you to trigger certain scenes but maybe it'll lead to something cool ... assuming it can be reliably reproduced.
Master ZED
2011-01-15 01:39:41 pm
Ran into a couple new bugs:

1. If you hit Draza with the Dragon Sniper too early on Very Easy, you'll kill him outright.  There's no way to continue without a checkpoint restart, as the game has no event prepared for a weapon kill (it's impossible anyway once he starts firing).  This is a concern if only because the Dragon is the optimal long arm choice for the entirety of chapter 14 (you don't need a long arm on VE, and on Normal, it's useful for a handful of enemies on top of Draza).

2. If you drop the Hammer in Chapter 20 just prior to the tank shooting down the bridge, it's possible to go back for the weapon and avoid the replacement event (it takes the Hammer and gives you an M4 instead).  The problem is that the follow-up events are buggy with the Hammer equipped and may freeze up on weapon switches and such.  I didn't look into it very thoroughly as there's no good reason to go to the trouble in a speed run that I know of (maybe it once or still does damage to the tank?).

Also, is there any way to avoid the Chapter 25 VE difficulty freeze without reloading from the title screen?  Not that I'll be doing an SDA run due to the original version requirement on this game, but I am curious as to whether a VE RTA would be allowed if the freeze is unavoidable and therefore makes a single segment impossible on that difficulty.

Finally, I can't figure out how the bridge collapse skip in chapter 22 works.  I've gotten lucky a few times and gotten it, but I haven't seen a pattern other than it usually happens when I mulch everyone in the towers first with the Dragon from the previous tower.  A quick look around the web produced no results.
arkarian
arkarian
Edit history:
arkarian: 2011-01-15 02:04:08 pm
arkarian: 2011-01-15 02:00:11 pm
2011-01-15 01:59:54 pm
gamelogs.org
Quote from Master ZED:
1. If you hit Draza with the Dragon Sniper too early on Very Easy, you'll kill him outright.  There's no way to continue without a checkpoint restart, as the game has no event prepared for a weapon kill (it's impossible anyway once he starts firing).  This is a concern if only because the Dragon is the optimal long arm choice for the entirety of chapter 14 (you don't need a long arm on VE, and on Normal, it's useful for a handful of enemies on top of Draza).

wow, awesome. i didn't even think about that, but it's certainly faster to kill him then just use the checkpoint restart. also didn't think about using the dragon for the entire chapter, but that's probably faster too -- does the game give you enough ammo to beat the chapter with it?

Quote from Master ZED:
2. If you drop the Hammer in Chapter 20 just prior to the tank shooting down the bridge, it's possible to go back for the weapon and avoid the replacement event (it takes the Hammer and gives you an M4 instead).  The problem is that the follow-up events are buggy with the Hammer equipped and may freeze up on weapon switches and such.  I didn't look into it very thoroughly as there's no good reason to go to the trouble in a speed run that I know of (maybe it once or still does damage to the tank?).

this is interesting but probably not very useful since there are so many enemies to kill and the hammer has so little ammo. i can already run through basically that entire chapter without stopping. also, the hammer does not hurt the tank afaik.

Quote from Master ZED:
Also, is there any way to avoid the Chapter 25 VE difficulty freeze without reloading from the title screen?

not sure -- i know i've gotten through the chapter without getting the freeze, but i wouldn't risk it in a run. seems like simply reloading the checkpoint after the big battle would probably be enough, but i haven't tried it.

Quote from Master ZED:
Finally, I can't figure out how the bridge collapse skip in chapter 22 works.  I've gotten lucky a few times and gotten it, but I haven't seen a pattern other than it usually happens when I mulch everyone in the towers first with the Dragon from the previous tower.  A quick look around the web produced no results.

it doesn't have anything to do with the towers. there's probably no information about it on the web, as afaik tigger77 and i are the only ones who knew about it until i did my run. it's very easy though:

basically, what triggers the bridge collapse is elena running across the long wooden plank. she only does this once every enemy on the other side has been killed. so all you have to do is kill all the enemies but one (i just snipe them), then jump down and walk a little ways across the bridge while elena is still hiding out on the cliff behind you. then just kill the last enemy and continue across the bridge, way ahead of elena.

the only thing to be careful about is to not go too far across the bridge before you've killed the last enemy: if you do, the game will kill you, since you've tried to leave the area without killing all the enemies.
arkarian
arkarian
Edit history:
arkarian: 2011-01-15 02:07:11 pm
2011-01-15 02:02:55 pm
gamelogs.org
also would like to mention that according to my chapter times, i'd say a good segmented run would be under 2:30. my times don't include the bridge skip or the aforementioned tricks so unless anything substantially new is found, 2:30 is a good goal to shoot for ... now i (or someone else) just need to find time to do a run. ;(
Master ZED
Master ZED
Edit history:
Master ZED: 2011-01-15 04:57:36 pm
2011-01-15 04:33:36 pm
Quote from arkarian:
wow, awesome. i didn't even think about that, but it's certainly faster to kill him then just use the checkpoint restart. also didn't think about using the dragon for the entire chapter, but that's probably faster too -- does the game give you enough ammo to beat the chapter with it?
Well, that would be great if the game saved Draza's damage between reloads (you make it sound like that's the case...?).  Either way, one sniper shot on Very Easy knocks his helmet off, and on any other difficulty including Crushing, the same weapon can still knock his helmet off instantly with a headshot, so as long as you bring the sniper rifle to the fight, you can finish it immediately.

As for ammo, on Normal, I've made it through before with some selective sharpshooting; it has a 10 shot max, so I reserve it for long range targets and Dragan.  The only exception I make is for the GAU, where I conserve ammo by using the free M4 instead.  On Very Easy, I don't even use a long arm in this chapter; I rely solely on the uzi the entire time, including for unbuckling the GAU's logs.  The same can be done in 13, but there's no reason to carry the Sniper over from 12 that I can discern on Very Easy, as you can charge through all long range fire.  Oddly enough, the only weapon you can't carry onto the train from chapter 12 is the FAL, though I can't think of a good reason for it. :\

Quote from arkarian:
this is interesting but probably not very useful since there are so many enemies to kill and the hammer has so little ammo. i can already run through basically that entire chapter without stopping. also, the hammer does not hurt the tank afaik.
No, it doesn't hurt the tank sadly (went back and tried it).  It's not so much the enemy count that makes it useless as the enemy types and groupings; in Chapter 23 for example, I run through the entire thing, from the end of 22 to the start of 24, with the Hammer and 92FS or Desert-5 devouring foes because there are small groups and Dragans everywhere that make explosive weapons very useful.  The only time I drop the Hammer is to rapid fire rockets at the GAU's.

Speaking of which, I don't think the quick load technique is well known (found it months ago after dying pitifully to a kid in TDM because of the Hammer's reload time), and I didn't see it in your marathon run, so:

To "quick load," tap left then right on the d-pad to change from and back to the weapon you're using; that'll cancel whatever loading animation is hindering you and can eliminate lag time between shots as well (the Dragon Sniper has serious lag issues in single player that this resolves, for example).  If you're using it to actually reload a weapon, take note of the clip display; you have to switch weapons when the clip ammo count recovers for this to work.  Most weapons have instantaneous loading when they reach a certain point in the loading animation, but some weapons have animations that exceed the "actual" load time, particularly the RPG and Hammer; I recommend practicing with those weapons first.

This won't quickly reload shotguns because the Moss and SAS reload one to two shells at a time.  However, particularly in the Moss's case, it can be used to rid yourself of the annoying pump action after you fire a round, allowing for a rapid fire shotgun.  It's less effective on the SAS, which is already pretty quick, and because of how all pistols work including the Pistole, it has no use on one-handed weapons.

The same effect can be achieved with Triangle while aiming and by throwing a grenade (grenade throwing also takes priority over loading animations).  I don't recommend using Triangle, however, since it's less available and may compromise your speed if you're in cover.

Quote from arkarian:
not sure -- i know i've gotten through the chapter without getting the freeze, but i wouldn't risk it in a run. seems like simply reloading the checkpoint after the big battle would probably be enough, but i haven't tried it.
I'll try it when I get back there, but I did try reloading at the start of 25 to no avail.  From my study of the glitch, it only happens if you play straight through 25 after 24 on Very Easy; I'd never encountered the glitch until after you mentioned it in the marathon because I'd never played single player on a difficulty less than Normal before. :\

EDIT: Restarting the checkpoint after the battle but before the stairs didn't stop the glitch. Sad

Quote from arkarian:
basically, what triggers the bridge collapse is elena running across the long wooden plank. she only does this once every enemy on the other side has been killed. so all you have to do is kill all the enemies but one (i just snipe them), then jump down and walk a little ways across the bridge while elena is still hiding out on the cliff behind you. then just kill the last enemy and continue across the bridge, way ahead of elena.

the only thing to be careful about is to not go too far across the bridge before you've killed the last enemy: if you do, the game will kill you, since you've tried to leave the area without killing all the enemies.

I never paid any attention to Elena's position, but that does make a lot of sense now that I think about it, as she was never ahead of me when I got the glitch to trigger.  Thanks for the info.

As for run times, I'm just looking for shortcuts and readjusting to the game after slacking for a month.  I'm thinking about doing a UC2 VE RTA or Normal SS for my own channel, but since I refuse to delete my game data to take advantage of airwalking, I won't be submitting to SDA.  I still play MP on occasion and severe tardiness as a result of having to re-download a ton of LiveData updates every time I sign on wouldn't be tolerated. :\
arkarian
2011-01-15 04:57:56 pm
gamelogs.org
you don't actually lose anything by deleting your "game data", it's just the cinema scenes. your save files/treasures/trophies/unlockables/etc will be fine. i didn't use the hover glitch in my marathon run simply because it's too difficult for me to do in ss. who knows, maybe sda would accept runs on both versions.

i did know about the reload trick, sort of ... guess it never really crossed my mind to use it.

didn't even think to use the uzi on the train but you're right that it's probably the fastest. i hate that stupid gun though lol. i like my handgun too much. ;(
Master ZED
2011-01-15 05:44:56 pm
Quote from arkarian:
you don't actually lose anything by deleting your "game data", it's just the cinema scenes. your save files/treasures/trophies/unlockables/etc will be fine. i didn't use the hover glitch in my marathon run simply because it's too difficult for me to do in ss. who knows, maybe sda would accept runs on both versions.
If there's enough of a difference to allow a 1.09 run, that would be great.  My staying on the current version isn't about any potential run or my saves; it's about not pissing off my UC2 friends by taking 30 minutes to sign on, as I still do play online from time to time (the patch and LiveData D/L'ing processes take stupid amounts of time). Sad

I like the uzi a lot actually, unless you want to talk competitive MP, in which case I'd agree with you.  I don't have enough problems with the accuracy against CPU opponents to ever warrant ditching the weapon unless I have to use a long range handgun, in which case I definitely want the 92FS so I can abuse the pistol accuracy bug (if you rapid fire a pistol, after the fourth shot, the accuracy becomes perfect until you cease tapping R1 or pick up more ammo, whichever comes first).  Then again, you don't really need the bug either; the 92FS, .45 Defender and Desert-5 are all stupidly accurate on their own. o_o
arkarian
2011-01-15 05:47:41 pm
gamelogs.org
nah i don't ever play multiplayer. i just like the precision/ammo of the handguns.

can definitely understand not wanting to erase your data because of multiplayer though. would be cool if sda allowed runs on both versions. i'd say it's at least a 7-minute difference.