My feelings on The Demon Rush
Game Page: http://speeddemosarchive.com/RescueRangers.html
Travis 'Klaige' Nible's run
Verifier Responses
Decision: Accept
Reason: He beat frezy_man.
Travis 'Klaige' Nible's run
Verifier Responses
Quote:
No Cheating, and the audio and video were fine.
I reluctantly accept. While stages D and F were significant improvements over the current run, a lot of that improvement was lost throughout the other levels. Bad luck on stage B eliminated much of the gains there, as did the boss in G. Still, the run comes out ahead in enough of a manner to vote accept.
I reluctantly accept. While stages D and F were significant improvements over the current run, a lot of that improvement was lost throughout the other levels. Bad luck on stage B eliminated much of the gains there, as did the boss in G. Still, the run comes out ahead in enough of a manner to vote accept.
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I have to disagree with the first verifier, this run makes large gains over the old one, and the mistakes in this run are a lot smaller than the last one. The stage B (2) boss fight had a bad pass at the beginning, but that doesn't cost more than a second or two because you can't kill the boss in less than 3 passes, and while the G boss (the slot machine cat) fight was ugly, like the runner said, it didn't cost more than 2 or 3 seconds. The biggest improvement is dodging enemies instead of using boxes to take them out.
There were a couple of things I noticed.
Stage 1: Wouldn't it be faster to take a damage boost somewhere instead of slightly pausing at the power lines. It is the beginning of the run, and it doesn't cost a lot of time if you restart.
Stage 2: IIRC, you can just press left and right really quickly at the edge of the ground faucets, which is a lot quicker than jumping on them.
Regardless, this is a good improvement over the old run, and I'll gladly accept.
There were a couple of things I noticed.
Stage 1: Wouldn't it be faster to take a damage boost somewhere instead of slightly pausing at the power lines. It is the beginning of the run, and it doesn't cost a lot of time if you restart.
Stage 2: IIRC, you can just press left and right really quickly at the edge of the ground faucets, which is a lot quicker than jumping on them.
Regardless, this is a good improvement over the old run, and I'll gladly accept.
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It's a time improvement using new techniques that weren't in the original run. Even if the new techniques aren't all executed flawlessly or in every place they could be used it is still an improvement and the majority of it looks to have fairly good execution. Watched side-by-side, the old run has a few hesitations and general inefficiencies (pickup up crates and killing enemies that can be jumped over, turning on/off the iron balls instead of just skipping them, the toy robot boss in general) that by themselves count as a decent improvement by their removal. I don't think any stage lagged behind its old counterpart by more than a second at worst, so it's pretty much straight improvement.
Things like the stage B spaceship-boss have bad luck, but it's still better than the (honestly) hilariously horrible luck that the old run had, and honestly I'd say that he probably had one of the better patterns. Bosses take five hits anyway, so a pass where you can only make one doesn't actually cost that much time (if at all) when you have two passes where you can get two hits in. Stage A also got better luck in the placement (or rather, existence) of certain bees near the end of the power lines section. Speaking of, I agree that it might be faster to take a damage boost or two at the power lines: just charge straight in and jump, damage boost as you land, and keep going. Although I think you pause a moment on the damage and landing frames anyway, so the improvement over a quick stutter-step may not be that much, especially after all those frames you're either falling straight down or to the left before the boost anyway.
I have one huge complaint, though: Zone H. Specifically, the ending of Zone H. You lack the 1up star floating lazily across the screen while the victory theme plays and gently caressing Chip's head right before the screen fades out. Try again, sir, this is a key point of the old run and deserves to be repeated.
Overall, I suppose I'll still have to accept it, though. A decent improvement, new tricks, and better luck in general. I expect the next revision to correct this major flaw in Zone H, though!
...oh yeah, and the sound and video quality was good and I didn't notice any cheating.
Things like the stage B spaceship-boss have bad luck, but it's still better than the (honestly) hilariously horrible luck that the old run had, and honestly I'd say that he probably had one of the better patterns. Bosses take five hits anyway, so a pass where you can only make one doesn't actually cost that much time (if at all) when you have two passes where you can get two hits in. Stage A also got better luck in the placement (or rather, existence) of certain bees near the end of the power lines section. Speaking of, I agree that it might be faster to take a damage boost or two at the power lines: just charge straight in and jump, damage boost as you land, and keep going. Although I think you pause a moment on the damage and landing frames anyway, so the improvement over a quick stutter-step may not be that much, especially after all those frames you're either falling straight down or to the left before the boost anyway.
I have one huge complaint, though: Zone H. Specifically, the ending of Zone H. You lack the 1up star floating lazily across the screen while the victory theme plays and gently caressing Chip's head right before the screen fades out. Try again, sir, this is a key point of the old run and deserves to be repeated.
Overall, I suppose I'll still have to accept it, though. A decent improvement, new tricks, and better luck in general. I expect the next revision to correct this major flaw in Zone H, though!
...oh yeah, and the sound and video quality was good and I didn't notice any cheating.
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This run is a definite improvement over the previous one. The execution is tight and the boss fights have good luck. But the biggest improvement is a more rigorously optimized route. There are still a number of minor improvements that can be made to the route, but the runner managed to hit the big stuff (spawning the platforms in the vertical shaft; damage boosting through the jack-in-the-box at the start of D-3; etc).
Specific suggestions to the runner (or whoever wants to work on this game in the future):
(0:42) Instead of stopping for the dog and the spark, you should drop down to the lower level (a few seconds earlier, immediately after the apple), jump over the mouse and the two boxes, and then make your way back up to the top level when you hit the next utility pole.
(1:55) For the two lower faucets, you don't need to jump. It's faster to walk up to the edge of them and press right/left repeatedly.
(2:05) Not luck. All the flies in the game can be manipulated. For this fly, the trick is to jump when you're at the right edge of the wooden box, and to do a pretty short jump so you just barely reach the cooker-knob. If done right, the first fly will charge over your head and the second fly will never spawn. This fly is probably the hardest one to manipulate; the rest are easier.
(2:12) The trick for this fly is to land on the left edge of the second knob and then immediately jump again. Basically if you are able to begin that jump (from the second to the third knob) *before* Chip passes the center of the second cooker-knob, then you are guaranteed that the fly will not charge you (and the second fly will not spawn).
(2:27) Jumping over the last shapeshifter and then dropping down right before the door is not the fastest way. You're losing time because you're so close to the door that you're forced to stop your forward motion when you drop. (Normally you can continue to hold to the right while you're dropping so that your forward motion continues.) It's best to do the stutter-step at the moment the bear shoots his green balls (exactly where you do it in the video), then run to the right just far enough that the second-to-last shapeshifter changes direction and runs back under you to the left, and then drop down two levels (in between the second-to-last and the last shapeshifter).
(2:31) When the boss is off the screen, sometimes you can actually jump and throw the ball against the side of the screen and hit him. If you're relatively close to the side of the screen, you actually have enough time to throw the ball and get it back again before the boss comes back on the screen (so there's no lost time even if you don't hit him). Just a tip. Although, the boss fight in your current run went very well as it is.
(3:05) While your strat here is a big improvement over the previous run's, there is actually an even faster way. Stay on the upper level. Kill the first jack-in-the-box by throwing that one box at it. Then jump up onto the first jack-in-the-box's platform, run to the right edge of it, jump to the right (full height), but then at the peak of your jump (at which time you'll be off-screen, so you've got to kinda know this cue from practice) you turn back to the left so that you fall on top of the second jack-in-the-box (he'll be springing leftward at this point) and get boosted to the right. Your invulnerability will last just long enough to pass the second and third jack-in-the-boxes. It seems hard at first, but this is actually no tougher than many of the other tricks you're doing in this run.
(3:12) To get past the first gyro-guy, you can stay on the upper level and damage boost over the top of him (and then drop down right after). As you know, making that short jump underneath the gyro-guy is really tough, so the fewer times you have to do it the better. The one modification that is needed in order to damage boost here (and at the jack-in-the-boxes that I mentioned above) is that you'll need to pick up an acorn later to get some health back (so you can do the jack-in-the-box damage boost at the start of the 3rd section). Fortunately you can get an acorn right at the end of the cannon-ball section, 3:36, (since you have to wait for that last cannon-ball anyway). To grab that acorn without adding any additional time to the route, you should throw the first box upward as you're riding the switch down (just to get rid of the box) and then use the second box (the one with the acorn) to flip the switch. If you can do this tightly enough, the limiting factor is still waiting for that last cannon-ball to drop, so the acorn grab is free.
(4:02) Robot boss: You've got the right idea with delaying your first shot in order to get two hits. But for hits 3-5, instead of staying far away and doing a single and a double-hit, it's slightly faster to just run up to him and do the 3rd, 4th, and 5th hits from point-blank. A little less safe this way, though.
(4:47) First thing you should do is jump and grab that box that is directly overhead. You want this box to be out of the way so you can get onto the moving platform below it sooner (otherwise you've got to wait for it to reach 2 units long instead of just 1 unit). Then continue with the rest of your path (jumping up on the box on the right hand side in order to scroll the screen further, and then coming back to the left to reach the aforementioned moving platform).
(5:23) No need to stop the screen from scrolling as you pass under the 2nd lizard. Instead, stay along the bottom, jump onto the 4-box formation, then short-jump onto the stool immediately after it, and then short-jump onto the white platform.
(5:30 onward) You chose to take the upper path, which results in you having to stop briefly at the first set of poker chips (or whatever those are supposed to be). Instead you could have taken the lower path and not stopped at all. The only hitch in the lower path is the spot directly underneath the first set of poker chips where the lizard jumps off the 2-box formation. It seems like you'd have to stop when you hit the boxes, wait for the lizard to jump over you, and then jump up onto the boxes and continue. But if you do a really short jump when you get very very close to the boxes you can actually jump up onto the boxes and still go under the lizard, without stopping forward motion. Not as hard as it sounds.
(6:07) This fly is the easiest of all to manipulate. After you jump over the preceding rhino, you do a short jump (just as the fly is spawning) which will cause him to charge and go over the top of you.
(6:19) Casino boss: There is a hesitation between when you first pick up the ball and when you throw it. I'm unsure if this is just a mistake, or if it's because you are trying to determine whether or not you are standing in the sweet spot *before* you throw the ball. If the latter, I recommend the following: Throw the ball immediately when you pick it up. Then you can adjust your position while the ball is in the air. This actually makes the sweetspot even bigger, because the horizontal position of the ball will be unchanged if you continue to grab it and re-throw it in mid-air (even if chip has shifted to the left since the ball was initially thrown). You can actually walk half a character-width to the left and still be able to grab the ball (which puts you well out of range of the boss's projectiles). If this is what you were trying to do, then I apologize; please disregard.
(7:10) This crab isn't too hard to jump over. Probably not worth killing.
(7:18) For the upper-left-corner squirrel, you should do a really short jump immediately after picking up the box, which will cause the squirrel to spawn earlier. Then you take a few steps to the left and throw the box upward to kill him with minimal interruption.
(7:20) Killing the crab is totally unnecessary. Just jump over him.
(8:08) Since you don't need the health, why not go over the top of the box-pyramid formation and then damage boost over the first pelican.
(8:18) No need to stop. Do a fan-augmented jump right over those thumbtacks.
(9:04) There is actually an even faster way. You don't hit the boss right away, but instead wait for him to walk left and cross the center point, then if you are really quick, you can get 3 hits in before he reaches the left wall and then walks back to the center to explode. This is really hard though, so I'm not sure I'd recommend it to you. I just thought it was worth pointing out.
But here is a more practical tip: When you're waiting for the boss to re-assemble, you should stand slightly to the right (just like you already do) and throw the ball a little bit ahead of time so that it will already be on its way back down to you when the boss becomes vulnerable. This only really matters on the last cycle, since the other cycles are a fixed length.
(9:33-9:47) There's a couple split-second inefficiencies scattered throughout this section, but I figure you're trying to play it safe here, so I won't attempt to point these out.
(9:49-9:54) I recommend taking the upper path here. You can actually get through all this without stopping and without damage boosting. The tricky part about the upper path is jumping over the third weasel (and the only reason this is tricky is because some major slowdown kicks in right at the very moment you're trying to execute the jump, which is distracting to say the least).
(9:59) When you're in between axes it makes sense to do the stutter-right thing, but once the axe to your left moves up, you may as well just walk all the way leftward to the axe's base. Then you'll be further left when it comes time to jump over.
(10:25) You're right that you need to take a hit here. I understand why you throw the apparently useless box at the weasel (you can sometimes get lucky and kill weasels in 1 hit). However, by far the best thing to do here is don't throw the box, face left when the plunger hits you, and get boosted to the right (over the box that's sitting on the conveyor belt). Then you can throw the box you're holding to kill the next lizard.
(10:32-10:38) There's 3+ seconds of stoppage here, in a part that needs just 1 second (the time it takes to grab and throw two boxes). Suggested route: Take the bottom-most path. Jump over the first 2-box formation, and at the second 2-box formation grab the first box and throw it rightward (to kill the lizard) and grab the second box to take with you. Jump over the third 2-box formation. Continue rightward along the bottom until the weasel's plunger is about to hit you, at which point you jump up to the next level, take a few steps, and then throw the box you're holding rightward to kill the last lizard.
A/V:
Looks and sounds fine.
Authenticity:
No signs of foul play. There are however signs of fowl play in the form of throwing boxes at pelicans.
Verdict: ACCEPT
Significant time improvement. Good route optimization. Skillful execution. Enough said.
Specific suggestions to the runner (or whoever wants to work on this game in the future):
(0:42) Instead of stopping for the dog and the spark, you should drop down to the lower level (a few seconds earlier, immediately after the apple), jump over the mouse and the two boxes, and then make your way back up to the top level when you hit the next utility pole.
(1:55) For the two lower faucets, you don't need to jump. It's faster to walk up to the edge of them and press right/left repeatedly.
(2:05) Not luck. All the flies in the game can be manipulated. For this fly, the trick is to jump when you're at the right edge of the wooden box, and to do a pretty short jump so you just barely reach the cooker-knob. If done right, the first fly will charge over your head and the second fly will never spawn. This fly is probably the hardest one to manipulate; the rest are easier.
(2:12) The trick for this fly is to land on the left edge of the second knob and then immediately jump again. Basically if you are able to begin that jump (from the second to the third knob) *before* Chip passes the center of the second cooker-knob, then you are guaranteed that the fly will not charge you (and the second fly will not spawn).
(2:27) Jumping over the last shapeshifter and then dropping down right before the door is not the fastest way. You're losing time because you're so close to the door that you're forced to stop your forward motion when you drop. (Normally you can continue to hold to the right while you're dropping so that your forward motion continues.) It's best to do the stutter-step at the moment the bear shoots his green balls (exactly where you do it in the video), then run to the right just far enough that the second-to-last shapeshifter changes direction and runs back under you to the left, and then drop down two levels (in between the second-to-last and the last shapeshifter).
(2:31) When the boss is off the screen, sometimes you can actually jump and throw the ball against the side of the screen and hit him. If you're relatively close to the side of the screen, you actually have enough time to throw the ball and get it back again before the boss comes back on the screen (so there's no lost time even if you don't hit him). Just a tip. Although, the boss fight in your current run went very well as it is.
(3:05) While your strat here is a big improvement over the previous run's, there is actually an even faster way. Stay on the upper level. Kill the first jack-in-the-box by throwing that one box at it. Then jump up onto the first jack-in-the-box's platform, run to the right edge of it, jump to the right (full height), but then at the peak of your jump (at which time you'll be off-screen, so you've got to kinda know this cue from practice) you turn back to the left so that you fall on top of the second jack-in-the-box (he'll be springing leftward at this point) and get boosted to the right. Your invulnerability will last just long enough to pass the second and third jack-in-the-boxes. It seems hard at first, but this is actually no tougher than many of the other tricks you're doing in this run.
(3:12) To get past the first gyro-guy, you can stay on the upper level and damage boost over the top of him (and then drop down right after). As you know, making that short jump underneath the gyro-guy is really tough, so the fewer times you have to do it the better. The one modification that is needed in order to damage boost here (and at the jack-in-the-boxes that I mentioned above) is that you'll need to pick up an acorn later to get some health back (so you can do the jack-in-the-box damage boost at the start of the 3rd section). Fortunately you can get an acorn right at the end of the cannon-ball section, 3:36, (since you have to wait for that last cannon-ball anyway). To grab that acorn without adding any additional time to the route, you should throw the first box upward as you're riding the switch down (just to get rid of the box) and then use the second box (the one with the acorn) to flip the switch. If you can do this tightly enough, the limiting factor is still waiting for that last cannon-ball to drop, so the acorn grab is free.
(4:02) Robot boss: You've got the right idea with delaying your first shot in order to get two hits. But for hits 3-5, instead of staying far away and doing a single and a double-hit, it's slightly faster to just run up to him and do the 3rd, 4th, and 5th hits from point-blank. A little less safe this way, though.
(4:47) First thing you should do is jump and grab that box that is directly overhead. You want this box to be out of the way so you can get onto the moving platform below it sooner (otherwise you've got to wait for it to reach 2 units long instead of just 1 unit). Then continue with the rest of your path (jumping up on the box on the right hand side in order to scroll the screen further, and then coming back to the left to reach the aforementioned moving platform).
(5:23) No need to stop the screen from scrolling as you pass under the 2nd lizard. Instead, stay along the bottom, jump onto the 4-box formation, then short-jump onto the stool immediately after it, and then short-jump onto the white platform.
(5:30 onward) You chose to take the upper path, which results in you having to stop briefly at the first set of poker chips (or whatever those are supposed to be). Instead you could have taken the lower path and not stopped at all. The only hitch in the lower path is the spot directly underneath the first set of poker chips where the lizard jumps off the 2-box formation. It seems like you'd have to stop when you hit the boxes, wait for the lizard to jump over you, and then jump up onto the boxes and continue. But if you do a really short jump when you get very very close to the boxes you can actually jump up onto the boxes and still go under the lizard, without stopping forward motion. Not as hard as it sounds.
(6:07) This fly is the easiest of all to manipulate. After you jump over the preceding rhino, you do a short jump (just as the fly is spawning) which will cause him to charge and go over the top of you.
(6:19) Casino boss: There is a hesitation between when you first pick up the ball and when you throw it. I'm unsure if this is just a mistake, or if it's because you are trying to determine whether or not you are standing in the sweet spot *before* you throw the ball. If the latter, I recommend the following: Throw the ball immediately when you pick it up. Then you can adjust your position while the ball is in the air. This actually makes the sweetspot even bigger, because the horizontal position of the ball will be unchanged if you continue to grab it and re-throw it in mid-air (even if chip has shifted to the left since the ball was initially thrown). You can actually walk half a character-width to the left and still be able to grab the ball (which puts you well out of range of the boss's projectiles). If this is what you were trying to do, then I apologize; please disregard.
(7:10) This crab isn't too hard to jump over. Probably not worth killing.
(7:18) For the upper-left-corner squirrel, you should do a really short jump immediately after picking up the box, which will cause the squirrel to spawn earlier. Then you take a few steps to the left and throw the box upward to kill him with minimal interruption.
(7:20) Killing the crab is totally unnecessary. Just jump over him.
(8:08) Since you don't need the health, why not go over the top of the box-pyramid formation and then damage boost over the first pelican.
(8:18) No need to stop. Do a fan-augmented jump right over those thumbtacks.
(9:04) There is actually an even faster way. You don't hit the boss right away, but instead wait for him to walk left and cross the center point, then if you are really quick, you can get 3 hits in before he reaches the left wall and then walks back to the center to explode. This is really hard though, so I'm not sure I'd recommend it to you. I just thought it was worth pointing out.
But here is a more practical tip: When you're waiting for the boss to re-assemble, you should stand slightly to the right (just like you already do) and throw the ball a little bit ahead of time so that it will already be on its way back down to you when the boss becomes vulnerable. This only really matters on the last cycle, since the other cycles are a fixed length.
(9:33-9:47) There's a couple split-second inefficiencies scattered throughout this section, but I figure you're trying to play it safe here, so I won't attempt to point these out.
(9:49-9:54) I recommend taking the upper path here. You can actually get through all this without stopping and without damage boosting. The tricky part about the upper path is jumping over the third weasel (and the only reason this is tricky is because some major slowdown kicks in right at the very moment you're trying to execute the jump, which is distracting to say the least).
(9:59) When you're in between axes it makes sense to do the stutter-right thing, but once the axe to your left moves up, you may as well just walk all the way leftward to the axe's base. Then you'll be further left when it comes time to jump over.
(10:25) You're right that you need to take a hit here. I understand why you throw the apparently useless box at the weasel (you can sometimes get lucky and kill weasels in 1 hit). However, by far the best thing to do here is don't throw the box, face left when the plunger hits you, and get boosted to the right (over the box that's sitting on the conveyor belt). Then you can throw the box you're holding to kill the next lizard.
(10:32-10:38) There's 3+ seconds of stoppage here, in a part that needs just 1 second (the time it takes to grab and throw two boxes). Suggested route: Take the bottom-most path. Jump over the first 2-box formation, and at the second 2-box formation grab the first box and throw it rightward (to kill the lizard) and grab the second box to take with you. Jump over the third 2-box formation. Continue rightward along the bottom until the weasel's plunger is about to hit you, at which point you jump up to the next level, take a few steps, and then throw the box you're holding rightward to kill the last lizard.
A/V:
Looks and sounds fine.
Authenticity:
No signs of foul play. There are however signs of fowl play in the form of throwing boxes at pelicans.
Verdict: ACCEPT
Significant time improvement. Good route optimization. Skillful execution. Enough said.
Quote:
I didn't find any forms of cheating and I had no problems with A/V
I definitely accept this run, it is a definite improvement over the old run. Does that mean this is a perfect run, no. The most obvious improvement would be the casino boss and a bunch of different spots with just a little difference that could make up a few more seconds. I think this is a pretty good job for a first speedrun, Congrats on your first run! Hope to see more runs from you in the future.
I definitely accept this run, it is a definite improvement over the old run. Does that mean this is a perfect run, no. The most obvious improvement would be the casino boss and a bunch of different spots with just a little difference that could make up a few more seconds. I think this is a pretty good job for a first speedrun, Congrats on your first run! Hope to see more runs from you in the future.
Decision: Accept
Reason: He beat frezy_man.
Thread title: