Timeshift

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2016-01-17 11:40:19 am

I found a way to get oob on level 11, but I have to walk a huge detour which does not make it worth it atm.
(Also it looks really boring).

The train clips through the door (which doesn't even open), I thought it would crush me there, but it does only a few meters after the door when the train is disappearing from oob into a void, so I get off before that happens.
This route is 23 seconds slower in the video, it could be done faster by using vsync to sink down faster and then re-enable it again.
The change-level clip is weird here, it continues down a few meters under the tunnel, but it is not infinite. When I walk the entire path with vsync I am too low at that point to hit the trigger.

Edit history:

Ekelbatzen: 2016-01-17 02:38:38 pm

2016-01-17 02:29:15 pm

So apparently it is also possible to use normal grenades besides both karbine grenades to jumpboost while not dying...
This opens up a whole new world for shortcuts in this game and the video also demonstrates that I can now jump over the fence on level 3 right at the beginning, which is probably even faster than the new oob route.

Edit: Yeah, directly jumping over the fence is 12 seconds faster than the oob route and 29 seconds faster than the 2015 route.

2016-01-17 11:27:55 pm

Amazing find! Woah!

2016-01-18 12:23:26 pm

Forgot to mention it here:
You can already get a crossbow from level 2 by staying outside for that machinegun battle and killing a crossbowman, which takes some additional seconds. But I didn't find any use to exploit the game more in the following levels until level 10 where you get the crossbow normally.

2016-01-18 01:41:52 pm

I found a usage of the triple nade jump in level 13, saving ~36 seconds. I waste all my karbine grenades, but can replenish them with the enemies after the part in the video before the level ends.

2016-01-18 03:02:54 pm

This jump is also applicable on level 14 instead of using the chair, saving ~5 seconds. Though this is also really hard, just doing the jump higher than a double grenade jump is not enough to jump over the invisible clip wall, you have to do it a hundred times to do it perfectly.

2016-01-18 03:23:16 pm

A 3~4 second save is also possible on level 4 by using another normal 2-nade jump, this is also way easier than doing the normal jump before and fighting through the guys...

2016-01-19 02:29:30 pm

On level 14 you also don't have to wait at the giant fan to fill up your time powers for it to be activated. Time reverse can be used between the round door and the fan area, if you start using the powers there you can continue to use the fan immediately.
The problem is that this removes the failsafe that you have enough powers to reach the top, so we would have to be pretty sure that we have enough time powers AND have enough time left since the last usage of any time power, since you can't reverse past that point. What helps is that you can apparently walk through the round door without using powers with the right approach, maybe creating a new segment is useful there. If done right this could save ~8 seconds.

2016-01-20 08:57:21 am

Hey,
I did a quick check to see which levels would benefit from using a triple grenade jump, so far I could only think of one:

Finally we can make that jump! I've been wanting to do that since 2007! The triple nade jumps are a little hard for me to pull off right now and needless to say they should be made with little to no enemies around.

2016-01-20 11:57:03 am

Cool, but I think you jumped too early, you boosted the grenade with the first karbine grenade flying to the left of you before it detonated on its timer. The jump is also quite managable with a normal 2 nade jump. Smiley

Besides that, the problem is that with the current route you only end up in level 15 with 1 karbine grenade, so that jump is not possible with this route one way or the other. That's why I walked all the way to the ammo cache on the ground floor on the 2015 run.

Another find that I did not find use for yet, here is how to get to the top steel beams:

Unless we find a way to get oob from there I think this is only interesting for testing purposes.

2016-01-20 12:16:11 pm

Yup, literally moments later after posting I managed to do it with no grenade Roll Eyes

Roll Eyes

My memory is way too rusty to remember ammo status from previous levels but I'll check level 14 later. I remember going to the beams a while ago but it yielded no results, you know how hard it is to go out of bounds when it's not on the open air.
Our best bet might be getting on top of the consoles room?

2016-01-20 12:19:24 pm

I have been there once, the ceilings are solid and I didn't see anything at first glance. Besides, the doors to the exit are still closed (and solid), so if we go up there we would need to go oob, otherwise it would just be a detour.

2016-01-20 01:56:24 pm

If you don't want to watch the video every time to look at ammo, maybe the save files help which I used for the 2015 run.

For level 15 there are currently 2 different ammo situations:
a) You start level 14 with max karbine grenades, use 1 for chair reverse magic, use 2 to jump down, enter level 15 with 1 karbine grenade
b) You start level 14 with max karbine grenades, use 2 for triple nade jump, use 2 to jump down, enter level 15 with 0 karbine grenades.

Unless we don't use the jump down on level 14 or manage to do it with only
1 normal grenade + crossbow (plan b) /
1 normal grenade + 1 karbine grenade(plan a, both untested yet),
we don't end up with enough karbine grenades in level 15.

Oh, also regarding lvl 15 oob: All command center ceilings are solid, even the little rooms where the tanks get lifted from and too are oob proof.

Attachment:

TimeShift 2015 speedrun saves.rar

2016-01-20 04:39:58 pm

I can do the plan a) jump, with a karbine grenade + normal grenade, but I can't manage to do it with the crossbow instead of the karbine grenade.

If we do the old chair trick on level 14 instead of the new triple nade jump before this, we lose 5 seconds of time, but maybe it is worth the jump on level 15.

But then the next problem arises, the part after the control room where we shoot ourselves up the level edge with the chair, 1 karbine grenade is necessary for that. Maybe it is possible to get an angle with a normal grenade, but it would be really hard.
It is also possible to get to that edge without the chair by using the triple nade jump, which saves the time to push the chair, but we don't have the grenades to do that in any previous case...

2016-01-20 05:03:42 pm

With your new jump on level 15 ~12 seconds could be saved if it can be integrated somehow:

2016-01-22 05:00:36 pm

Still trying to find a way, it doesn't help that jumps without rifle grenades are really hard Grin

Grin

I finally found a way to fall inside the console room on Repo Men

As you are well aware if you fall on top of the console room you only get ONE jump, if you fall directly on the spot where i go trough you die instantly but if you fall near it and then jump you can get trough easily. In theory you could reach that spot in a single jump starting from outside the complex (instead of falling on the zep first) provided the angle was just right? I'll leave that to you to find out Grin

Grin

2016-01-22 07:08:11 pm

Oh nice find! I thought jumping through the ceiling was just not possible, I also tried to jump in at several points except where you did it.
Jumping with a single jump from the ground might be possible, this calls for another segment cut.

For the previous level 21, wind tunnel, I got behind the wind turbines on both sides to find out there is no use to get there. There is a solid ground surrounded by solid walls and jumping down there killed me every time. I tried to land on random barrels that were down there to soften my fall, but it didn't work and also probably has no use.

I also could not manage to jump from the ground to the next floor on either sides using triple nade jump (with and without wind), but I managed to get to the beam grid on the ceiling, leading nowhere.
So for level 21 I haven't found anything useful, all the doors except the first above spawn seem to be programmed chronologically accurate to the checkpoint system.

Edit history:

zato: 2016-01-22 08:14:25 pm

2016-01-22 08:10:50 pm

Wind tunnel is pretty tight, your barrel launch on the 2015 run was pretty much as good as it gets because you landed on the console so IDK.
Edit: btw was just re-watching your level 11 clip, using the zoom makes you move slower, use it only when necessary.

2016-01-24 07:08:36 am

Hmm I don't know, using the crossbow zoom doesn't seem to slow me when I put it to comparison:

With other guns you are slower, of course.
I have to hope to be able to replicate that jump on windtunnel, I only managed to do it once yet. Smiley

Edit history:

Ekelbatzen: 2016-01-24 10:42:39 am

2016-01-24 09:55:27 am

I also found a little 1s save on the level 5 prison part:

For anyone not familiar with this route: Before the doors open there are some weird conditions and triggers, which in most cases trigger the gun defense turrets and the doors won't open for quite some seconds, then the guard comes out and you have to go inside and hit the button to open the doors yourself.
In the old route I would kill everyone and kill the last guy from a specific point for this to work (I still don't know why, probably so the guard doesn't see his flying corpse).
With the new route I tried stealthing at first, but noticed the first enemies can still be alerted. As long as the three guys by the door don't shoot and my grenade doesn't make any sound (using time-stop), this still works.
My theory is that the guard on his post just can't be alerted, he doesn't see the soldiers in distress and doesn't hear anything loud, which probably makes him feel safe or something.

Edit: I also had this idea that was blocked by a clip wall:

I also found a little 1s save on the level 5 prison part:
[hidden="Level 5 prison"][url]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uIFQBGRYY6A[/url][/hidden]
For anyone not familiar with this route: Before the doors open there are some weird conditions and triggers, which in most cases trigger the gun defense turrets and the doors won't open for quite some seconds, then the guard comes out and you have to go inside and hit the button to open the doors yourself.
In the old route I would kill everyone and kill the last guy from a specific point for this to work (I still don't know why, probably so the guard doesn't see his flying corpse).
With the new route I tried stealthing at first, but noticed the first enemies can still be alerted. As long as the three guys by the door don't shoot and my grenade doesn't make any sound (using time-stop), this still works.
My theory is that the guard on his post just can't be alerted, he doesn't see the soldiers in distress and doesn't hear anything loud, which probably makes him feel safe or something.

Edit: I also had this idea that was blocked by a clip wall:
[hidden="Level 5 clip door"][url]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SwQv-MnB7u0[/url][/hidden]

2016-01-24 02:12:55 pm

I was reading Judgy's FPS guide when I remembered that I abused that save glitch where I survive a fall due to an autosave. With this I could get down the fan area in wind tunnels, but it has no use, as I have guessed.

But I found out that doing a barrel jump on level 11 can save another ~16s by just switching walking with flying:

It's a shame I can't time reverse very far after that, the train could have clipped me through the gate where the end of the level is I think.

Edit history:

Ekelbatzen: 2016-02-01 04:53:06 pm

2016-02-01 04:51:53 pm

So my plan for level 14/15 is this:
- Use the chair jump on lvl 14 instead of the triple jump | -5s possible save wasted +save grenades
- Don't jump down using 2 karbine grenades, but use your (HeRMe) route | -7s wasted
(- Jumping down with crossbow + grenade requires most enemies to be dead, killing them isn't probably a good idea)
- Jumping off the ladder still makes it possible to save mid-air, so new segment before falling to death
- Jump the pipes with vsync on because it is frustrating without
- Manage to reach the wind shaft without using powers so we can use them immediately: 8s saved
- Do your jump on level 15 with the gained grenades | 12s saved

Summed up we lose 12s and gain 12s and gain the 8s with the wind shaft either way... but this route seems easier to run I think. Has anyone a better plan than this?

In other non-planning related news:
I started running single-segment for fun and for general practice and started streaming it on Twitch.
I have gotten under 1h last time and learn more about barrel behaviour, as with these playthroughs there is more randomness than playing fixed segments for a couple hundred times.
Of course I can't do the hardest tricks yet because I would fail too often. But there are still many tricks from our routes that are replicatable quite well when practicing single-segment, even when I have to reload a few times.

So my plan for level 14/15 is this:
- Use the chair jump on lvl 14 instead of the triple jump | -5s possible save wasted +save grenades
- Don't jump down using 2 karbine grenades, but use your (HeRMe) route | -7s wasted
(- Jumping down with crossbow + grenade requires most enemies to be dead, killing them isn't probably a good idea)
- Jumping off the ladder still makes it possible to save mid-air, so new segment before falling to death
- Jump the pipes with vsync on because it is frustrating without
- Manage to reach the wind shaft without using powers so we can use them immediately: 8s saved
- Do your jump on level 15 with the gained grenades | 12s saved

Summed up we lose 12s and gain 12s and gain the 8s with the wind shaft either way... but this route seems easier to run I think. Has anyone a better plan than this?
[hidden="Level 14 jump down"][url]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sKSY86Mpz4Y[/url][/hidden]

In other non-planning related news:
I started running single-segment for fun and for general practice and started streaming it on [url="http://www.twitch.tv/ekelbatzen"]Twitch[/url].
I have gotten under 1h last time and learn more about barrel behaviour, as with these playthroughs there is more randomness than playing fixed segments for a couple hundred times.
Of course I can't do the hardest tricks yet because I would fail too often. But there are still many tricks from our routes that are replicatable quite well when practicing single-segment, even when I have to reload a few times.

Edit history:

zato: 2016-02-04 01:26:22 am

2016-02-03 05:21:16 pm

Unfortunately if you kill all of the enemies below as well as the ones in your way, once you go trough the door new ones spawn again (lvl14) It really seems to be up to you to decide which routes you want to take, I have not been able to find anything new one those levels.

I found a potential skip for En Route, I made a quick video but I'm having trouble uploading to YouTube for some reason.

You can do it way way smoother than in the video, and you also don't need to jump on the ladder if you can survive the fall damage. I think the turret moves randomly, but you can't get on top of it if it's pointing to the right. To jump over it the optimal position is in the middle of the turret, sometimes you jump and you get to the middle, sometimes you don't, but I think you always need to shoot the bolt in the middle regardless to more consistently make the jump.

2016-02-04 03:49:57 am

Oooh so jumping from there IS possible! Nice find! That saves ~23 seconds.

I found the turret guy frustrating at first, he would mostly sit still a bit too far to the left.
But then I jumped on top of him and saved. After a reload he will ~80% swing left immediately and ~20% swing right immediately, so this opens a chance window for that.
If you are fast enough triggerwise the enemies down below won't have spawned yet, so we don't have to worry too much about hp when we jump off.

I will try on level 8 if falling off the zep somehow hits magic triggers instead of just falling to my death,
I'll just have to smuggle the crossbow from level 2 all the way there real quick.

2016-02-04 04:25:07 am

Quote from Rob1n:

I will try on level 8 if falling off the zep somehow hits magic triggers instead of just falling to my death

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