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Fucking Weeaboo
Somebody did want a Lv 3 run if I remember right.  And Macross IS hard as hell.  As long as it didn't warp into the middle of things and did everything, I'd watch it.
Retired
StarFox >>> StarFox 64 in difficulty.  But that's mostly due to the poor collision detection.

And yes...Macross is hard as hell.
Edit history:
SuperCoolAl: 2006-03-04 11:18:47 am
I love YaBB 1G - SP1!
Oh wow, after 3 and a half hours of angst and frustration, I've finally got a run. And it's about 42 minutes. Total. Man, I had my best Venom ever and... oh I'll just set about getting this up there for you guys to see  Grin
--------------------------------------------------------------------
Oh. My. God.

It deleted it. The goddam DVD recorder deleted my run!

I deleted one of the clips that went wrong. It looked fine. Then when I finalised the disk it deleted my run and brought the useless clip back.

Whatever god of speedrunning there is is forsaking me right now    

I can't do more tonight. I just can't.

----------------------------------------------------------------------

Well I'm glad I stayed up.

I just recorded another run... it's about 20 seconds slower than the last one, but definitely more entertaining to watch, without a doubt. More wow moments  Seeing as how this is not really an ultra-serious run, I don't think 20 or so seconds matters... The time was about 42:40 and the other one was about 42:20. If the 17% rule applies then this is about 35:30 NTSC-wise.

You'll see why I like this one 

I had a little bit of trouble with the Zoness boss, and with Andross.

Now I've just gotta hope the DVD recorder doesn't bork up on me... 
I love YaBB 1G - SP1!
It's about halfway through uploading on Filefront now... an hour to go.

By the way... do any of you think that this game would be good for individual level runs?

Oh also would someone with the privileges delete the posts I made but have now merged into the first post  Grin
Fucking Weeaboo
You should be able to delete your own posts.

And individual levels really won't work in this.  Unlike other games, you can't start off in the level, and it has dependancies on prior levels, since as wingmen, lasers, route (for Sector Z and Solar), etc.
I love YaBB 1G - SP1!
Good point.

And I just spotted 'remove.'  Roll Eyes

http://files.filefront.com/sf64_finalavi/;4837176;;/fileinfo.html
Sleeping Terror
That looks good, but there's no way that would be 35 minutes on an NTSC console. The only part where you gained significant time over my run was the Sector Y boss.

I haven't done any detailed comparisons yet, but there are two things I noticed. First, you seemed to kill a couple bosses sooner than I could. I'm going to guess that you can fire lasers faster relative to the game speed, since PAL doesn't interfere with how fast you can press buttons. Second, there didn't seem to be nearly as much slowdown. This may be because you mostly didn't use charge shots, but in a previous N64 comparison (Blast Corps), I found that the PAL version had a lot less slowdown.

Anyway, nice job.
Sorry about the guest account... for some reason my ISP over here won't let me onto speeddemosarchive so I'm having to use a proxy, so I can't login.

It's possible the console finds it easier to sustain 50fps than 60fps... but I do try to keep explosions off screen or get far away form them... that's why I loop at the end of the Zoness boss and at the beginning of Andross.

I must say though my run is the glitchiest I've ever done:

1. Teleporting wingmen at the end of Corneria

2. Crashing into something at Zoness but NOT losing wings, just lasers!

3. Looping before the brain seems to carry through.
Sleeping Terror
Quote:
2. Crashing into something at Zoness but NOT losing wings, just lasers!

I figured that was because you were picking up a laser upgrade at that moment... when you got hit, it repaired your wings instantly.
No the Quail is not riding the Q
Quote:
I figured that was because you were picking up a laser upgrade at that moment... when you got hit, it repaired your wings instantly.

The Lazer upgrade actually transforms into a wing repair thing.
(If you break a wing it while the laser upgrade is visible..you will see it change to a wing repair thing.)
I love YaBB 1G - SP1!
Ah that would explain it. Guess I never noticed I was picking it up!
King of hearts
Pretty smooth flyin' SCA.  You're right, I liked how you kicked Andross' ass with no wings. 

Oh and you know that how fast you shoot a laser is not how fast you can tap.  When you hold down the laser fire, you shoot 3 consecutive lasers very quickly.  It's a matter of timing, not speed.  If you press and hold the A button and then press and hold it again at the right time, you shoot very fast.  I never knew about this for years until I watched a friend play.  I was thinking how the hell does he shoot so fast when he can't tap anywhere near as fast as me.  It really pissed me off that I was playing wrong for so many years and I would never be able to get medals in certain places.
Speed Running Joy-bringer
I remember learning about that too when I first started playing It was an automatic things once I first learned it. But... maybe with some l33t tapping skills (or maybe even a turbo controller) you can shoot a bit faster. Or... rather I doubt that now that I think of it.
Edit history:
SuperCoolAl: 2006-03-08 11:00:30 am
I love YaBB 1G - SP1!
I think a turbo controller is against the rules. I do have one though if it isn't.

I've always been used to tapping, and I wouldn't trust myself to get the timing right all the time  Wink I don't think it would make such a large difference if you can already tap really fast.

My next project will probably be to beat my 'official' run.
Speed Running Joy-bringer
You know... it is SORTOF possible to do single stages... but it's way the hell too troublesome. In most stages, Double Laser/Wing repair can appear up to 2-3 or more times, but you'd always have 3 A-bombs by default and... yeha not happenin' I see.

When it comes to Starwolf's team, you should wait untill they are near the base instead of shooting them while they come down. I was able to take out Leon's ship right after he finished talking, and damage Starwolf 1/2. And also, I encountered a REALLY bad glich. You see, when you defeat all 4 of the ships, fox will "go it alone" from there, but if your ship is in a certain spot when the sequence begins, you will get stuck in cutscene mode flying a near-perfect circle AROUND the base, instead of going into it. I left it for 5 minutes, he was still going around in circles!  Huh?

I think it's safe to say, get away from the base once they are defeated.
Long live SF64!
I've been a Star Fox 64 fan forever, but I'm just now looking into the speedrun community....I've been spending all these years getting high scores and didn't know much about speedruns until lately.  I noticed there haven't been many posts in while?  Did the topic move?

Anyway...I've  been thinking a lot about a more "epic" kind of 100% speedrun.  Go into Expert mode and play the game as many times as needed to get all medals on every level...I've already been thinking about this, and there is a bit of strategy beyond a 1 play-through speedrun because there will be some levels you will cover twice, and Corneria 3 times...you would need to do a bit of complex route planning as well as medal planning...I would keep going on this, but I want to see if there's some interest first...oh and should I put this in a seperate new topic?

Besides that new idea, I've tried a few speedruns just to get the feel of it, though I was too lazy to time myself very accurately...I think being a high score kinda person I can do bosses pretty efficiently...I know I'm a nube to speedrunning, but not to Star Fox!

I also want to try and verify the full boosts vs. partial boosts.  I know with braking, doing little brakes is more efficient than fuuullllll brake...wait...fuuulll brake....wait, I think the meter penalizes you for using up the whole thing in one boost/brake...we shall see...I may test it in Sector Z from the exit of the Great Fox until I'm forced to U-turn since that'd be a fixed distance and I come out of Great Fox perfectly straight (you can go in the back for a powerup)...

anyway, I read the posts, sounds awesome...look forward to checking out those videos and I love seeing the SF64 nostalgia as everyone dusts off their old skills! 
Sleeping Terror
I tested full vs partial boosts. If there is a difference, it's very slight, and you'll lose time if you're ever not boosting while you could be (more likely if you're letting go of the button for partial boosts).

I haven't been posting because I haven't been playing. This game really is kinda boring to speedrun. The main reason it's on the site is because TSA did an initial run as a joke. Maybe I'll return to it and submit a run one day; maybe I won't.
Fucking Weeaboo


I'm gonna beat you one of these days, I swear I will.

Corneria I goofed up and only had twin lasers.
Andross Part 2 I got caught by Andross, but didn't lose my wings or anything, just lost some time.

I couldn't remember how I calculated time before, so I did it from planet selection to planet selection.  Venom I started when you first see your ships, Andross 1 when you enter the tunnel, Andross 2 when the camera switches for "all-range mode" (meter disappears), escape when the game comes out of the white screen until you lose control.
Edit history:
SuperCoolAl: 2006-06-27 10:05:34 am
I love YaBB 1G - SP1!
Quote:
Anyway...I've  been thinking a lot about a more "epic" kind of 100% speedrun.   Go into Expert mode and play the game as many times as needed to get all medals on every level...I've already been thinking about this, and there is a bit of strategy beyond a 1 play-through speedrun because there will be some levels you will cover twice, and Corneria 3 times...you would need to do a bit of complex route planning as well as medal planning...I would keep going on this, but I want to see if there's some interest first...oh and should I put this in a seperate new topic?


I'd be VERY interested in watching a run like this! IIRC you can use the N64 reset button and it still saves the medals you have. I think it would be easiest like:

First playthrough- Corneria>Meteo>Fortuna>Sector X>Titania>Bolse>Venom 1

Second Playthrough- Corneria>Meteo>Katina>Solar>Macbeth>Reset

Third Playthrough- Corneria>Sector Y>Aquas>Zoness>Sector Z>Area 6>Venom 2

Basically you only have to cover Meteo twice and Corneria three times then. I don't think I'm skilful enough to do this myself though, there's some medals I'm really bad at getting (Solar and Aquas in particular) and some I'm really bad at getting quickly (like Katina).
Fucking Weeaboo
Quote:
I'd be VERY interested in watching a run like this! IIRC you can use the N64 reset button and it still saves the medals you have. I think it would be easiest like:

First playthrough- Corneria>Meteo>Fortuna>Sector X>Titania>Bolse>Venom 1

Second Playthrough- Corneria>Meteo>Katina>Solar>Macbeth>Reset

Third Playthrough- Corneria>Sector Y>Aquas>Zoness>Sector Z>Area 6>Venom 2

Basically you only have to cover Meteo twice and Corneria three times then. I don't think I'm skilful enough to do this myself though, there's some medals I'm really bad at getting (Solar and Aquas in particular) and some I'm really bad at getting quickly (like Katina).


Just skip Venom 1.  You'll get your medal in Venom 2.  Unless you want to count doing that route as part of the run, but it's not necessary if you're only going after the medals.
Long live SF64!
Took me a while to dig up this topic again, but I never saw the replies to my "all medals" run proposal over the summer.

I just recently finished a low score run that's been discussed over at Gamespot.  That was lots of fun.  I got a low score of 24, which I'd be glad to discuss further (low-% run?)

Anyway, I'm ready to work on that 100% ALL medals run.  Hopefully Some talk can get generated here about further strategies as well...I'll start route planning tonight and thanks for the contributions so far...

I hope this doesn't deviate too far from the "redline run" topic since the idea of this is to create a harder and more complete run of the game.  Since the highest scores achieveable are often 100's in excess of the medal score I think the medals provide a good challenge while not slowing you down too much.  I'll see what I can do.
I'd love to see it done, and I can help too, as I've probably played through this game as much as anyone. 
Edit history:
Psonar: 2006-09-01 09:55:54 pm
Long live SF64!
First, should I start a new topic for an Expert, 15-Medal Star Fox 64 run, or just let discussion continue in here?  If this gets off the ground I want to make sure people know about it.

I've decided to definitely do expert.  This needs to be truly beating the game in it's entirety.

When I tried it last night, expert was a good bit more difficult.  The enemy fire is much more intense, health more precious, items less plentiful, and having turbo lasers and a medal at the boss is more difficult.  No Expert isn't that hard to just mess around in, but boosting and getting medals makes it a challenge.

Route Planning...The 3-step plan prev. posted would be the most intuitive route to be sure.  Some changes might need to be made to make medals easier, which includes thinking about teammate health, bomb usage/availability, and Bill/Katt help.  Not many changes can be made however.  The following is a logical deduction of how the route should go...

Sector X must go to Titania, and Solar must go to MacBeth which implies Zonness must go to Sector Z (Sector X can't go there and Macbeth is taken)
Sector Y must go to Aquas and Meteo must go to Fortuna meaning Meteo or Sector Y may be repeated for Katina.
Fortuna and Katina are interchangable, though Fortuna provides few points = little health which doesn't help wingmates for Solar (constant health drain), also Bill's help on Sector X doesn't apply since the warp won't be used unless warping then changing course is faster...therefore, Katina will go to Solar, and Fortuna to Sector X
After that, Sector Z and MacBeth may go to Area6, but Titania CORRECTION: MacBeth -> Area6 involves a long cutscene making it a bad choice...therefore Sector Z will go to Area 6.  Titania or MacBeth will then go to Bolse.  From Titania means no Star Wolf, MacBeth means Star Wolf ... MacBeth to Bolse might be fastest since StarWolf may give some quicker points.  

What does all that boil down to?
Turn Game ON...
RUN 1: CO / ME /  FO / SX / TI / RESET
RUN 2: CO / ME or SY?/ KA / SO / TI / BO / RESET or VE1?
RUN 3: CO / SY / AQ / ZO / SZ / A6 / VE2
Credits -> Turn Game OFF

RUN 1, 2, and 3 are interchangeable, but climaxing to VE2 is the most logical to me.  Gives a good show.

Note than RUN 3 is the redline route that this topic is about...just on expert and with medals...and after at least an hour of solid gameplay.

Question: Should a medal be gotten on Venom 1 (from Bolse - pretty hard without boosting) and Venom 2 (from Area 6) or just Venom 2?
Question: once the score is displayed after Bolse, the StarFox team goes straight to Venom with no "Lylat System" screen in between (no awarding of the medal)...if there's a reset there, should I just do it after the score goes away?

I did some initial practice last night.  I played through some levels, mostly on the blue line run and just held boost the whole time while attempting to get a medal.  Some levels worked, others didn't...here are my feelings:

Corneria was fine except I need to get more used to boosting and what tricks I can't do without losing a wing...turbo lasers are a must for bosses.  My scores were between 180 and 200, so I should calm down a little on the enemies and focus on flying.

Meteo was fine except for the gold-ring-giving butterflies (hit+3)...they shoot you from behind after you pass them and there isn't time to kill them while boosting...used bombs to clear them.  200 is very feasible without the warp, but If I choose ME -> KA then I'll get the medal on that path and the ME-> FO will be pure speed.  Boosting through the warp gates was a problem...need to work out some partial boosting or something

Fortuna was fine for the medal, had 70-80 easy.  Just need to work on blasting StarWolf out of the sky...I've seen the other videos and they agree that it needs to be improved, so I'll work how to get quick kills there.

Sector X was fine on score, but not on Peppy.  He's ambushed twice, and Expert mode isn't near as friendly about it.  I just need to save him really fast the first time and the second time I boost on ahead of him, so I'll need a well placed bomb.  Other than that, score was over 200.

Titania was a disaster...I died so many times!  Boosting constantly AND trying to get a medal is a deathwish on that level...I need to step back and perfect just running the level, then medaling then try and put the two together.  Expert is much more brutal on the Titanian speedtank!

Bolse was alright with no Star Wolf...take out the towers, kill some ships and turrets, then have at the core...points get close, pure speed wouldn't necessarily get the medal, but as I get used to it I should know how many random fighters I'll need to kill.  If things get bad (no bombs, no lasers) a suicide would help here...you get a free laser on the 15th kill of any all-range mode fight and 3 free bombs.

Suicide would be a "bail" after lost points or items, but the only place it could possibly save time might be Katina...if you die after the arrival of the Mothership, you start facing the mothership as the hatches open! (I think).  However this would only help in a pure speedrun (a possible improvement on TSA?) because you'd need to kill about 100 fighters after the Mothership arrives, so there's not really any time saved and you're giving up hyper lasers that will save even more time.

I also took a crack at boosting through Solar and got just over 100 on the first try.  If I clean it up (re-learning bomb placements...) it'll be very doable with full boosting.

That's it for now, sorry about the long post, but I really am doing this.  Please feel free to comment, suggest, or question!  The more people we can get in on this the better!  I encourage others to try your had at this run, too, and we'll get some competition going like they did with the redline run!

Do a barrel roll!
Visit my profile to see my runs!
Wow; I'm quite impressed with your strategies and research.  Keep up the good work!  I only have a couple of comments to contribute: 

Yes, this run, since you seem adequately serious, should have its own thread.  Considering the original intentions of this thread, any further discussion here should only perpetuate a minimalist red-line run on either difficulty.  (I'll start a thread for you. Wink )

Secondly, for Sector X, you can usually save Peppy pretty easily with a bomb directed toward the lower left of the screen just a few moments after the robot arm bursts through the giant wall.  The enemies do not even need to have appeared by this point, and the bomb will probably be more effective if it anticipates them. 

Yeah, good luck with Titania; never could stand the place. 
Fucking Weeaboo
In response to the statement about Venom 1:

Even though there are two different routes, there's only 1 medal for Venom, which is quite easily attainable on Venom 2.  Therefore, Venom 1 can be skipped.