Saints Row 4 (PC)

your_name_here

2013-09-06 03:12:57 pm

What's funny is that low% bad ending would actually be distinct from any% bad ending in this case (unlike in Die Hard).

Frozty

2013-09-07 01:31:58 am

One Chill Dude

I just finished my first complete run from beginning to end, Primarily using the shotgun with full damage upgrade and knock-back. I find that i did spend a lot of time having to run closer to enemies in order to use my ammo efficiently. It 1-shots pretty much everything apart from vehicles up close, but obviously the range is terrible. I used the SMG's for distance, but didn't have any upgrades on them so they felt pretty terrible. Gonna have to look into that much more.

A question i have is how are we going about timing these? Is using the in-game time the norm here, or RTA? (i'm a bit of a noob, considering i dont even know what RTA stands for, only that it refers to the timer haha). I crashed once and had a few other mistakes in there because wsplit hotkeys dont like to cooperate with the game, causing my RTA to be quite different than in-game time.

Lighnat0r

2013-09-07 04:42:48 am

I would advocate the use of RTA (real time attack) in this case.
Though I admittedly haven't studied exactly what counts for the in-game timer, I do believe there are more advantages than disadvantages.

Advantages:
Considering crashing is fairly common, this would mean you'd have to reload and your run would count as segmented. This is kind of unfair and RTA would give a valid way of comparing runs despite crashes.
I am fairly certain time spent in the menu doesn't count toward the in-game time. This would mean you can just take your time in picking upgrades and looking at the map etc, not really speedrun-like. (needs confirming that the in-game timer does indeed pause)
An extension of the previous point, using in-game timer would make warping between the portals overpowered because you spent most of the time doing that in a menu type thing. For anyone watching it looks really slow (on places where it isn't viable in RTA as well), though it saves time when going by the in-game timer. It makes the speedrun less interesting to watch, imo.
Added precision from using RTA, times aren't rounded to the minute. (Not really that important now, but it will be if/when the game in grinded out a bit)

Disadvantages:
Loading times are probably not taken into account for in-game time, making it more fair for people with different systems. (Again haven't tested this, but it's usually the case)

Based on the above, RTA seems like a good option. Using RTA and substracting load times might be good, though I don't know how much load times vary from system to system, and it would make warping between portals quite overpowered as well.

I would advocate the use of RTA (real time attack) in this case. 
Though I admittedly haven't studied exactly what counts for the in-game timer, I do believe there are more advantages than disadvantages.

Advantages:
Considering crashing is fairly common, this would mean you'd have to reload and your run would count as segmented. This is kind of unfair and RTA would give a valid way of comparing runs despite crashes.
I am fairly certain time spent in the menu doesn't count toward the in-game time. This would mean you can just take your time in picking upgrades and looking at the map etc, not really speedrun-like. (needs confirming that the in-game timer does indeed pause)
An extension of the previous point, using in-game timer would make warping between the portals overpowered because you spent most of the time doing that in a menu type thing. For anyone watching it looks really slow (on places where it isn't viable in RTA as well), though it saves time when going by the in-game timer. It makes the speedrun less interesting to watch, imo.
Added precision from using RTA, times aren't rounded to the minute. (Not really that important now, but it will be if/when the game in grinded out a bit)

Disadvantages:
Loading times are probably not taken into account for in-game time, making it more fair for people with different systems. (Again haven't tested this, but it's usually the case)

Based on the above, RTA seems like a good option. Using RTA and substracting load times might be good, though I don't know how much load times vary from system to system, and it would make warping between portals quite overpowered as well.

Traysandor

Edit history:

Traysandor: 2013-09-07 08:12:49 am

2013-09-07 08:09:21 am

The original, since 2003.

@LightnatOr: SR4 never really crashed for me except for maybe once when something weird happened. If you have a really strong graphics card (or multiple cards with crossfire support) with up-to-date drivers then you shouldn't have any notable problems attempting single segment runs. Personally I have an EVGA Nvidia GTX 660 TI in my computer and everything ran smoothly in 1080p fullscreen.

And yes, I think manual timing might be a good option for now until we can figure out exactly what the in game timer counts for. In SDA, it depends on the game in whether or not loading times are part of the run's time too. Take Final Fantasy 9 for example, which is the same for everyone, where getting into an encounter typically costs you several seconds in loading time before you even see anything on the screen. That's still included in the final time of the game. Not to mention loading screens and disc changing all counts too.

In SR4 though you're probably right on the PC version. Every computer is different so no two people are ever going to have the same loading times. It's pretty fast for me, but then again I'm packing an i7 3770k and a powerful 2 GB graphics card, among other things.

If I remember correctly though, the ruling on segmented runs is that the initial load from a save file doesn't count towards the timer until you gain control of the character, but I could be mistaken on that.

@LightnatOr: SR4 never really crashed for me except for maybe once when something weird happened.  If you have a really strong graphics card (or multiple cards with crossfire support) with up-to-date drivers then you shouldn't have any notable problems attempting single segment runs.  Personally I have an EVGA Nvidia GTX 660 TI in my computer and everything ran smoothly in 1080p fullscreen.

And yes, I think manual timing might be a good option for now until we can figure out exactly what the in game timer counts for.  In SDA, it depends on the game in whether or not loading times are part of the run's time too. Take Final Fantasy 9 for example, which is the same for everyone, where getting into an encounter typically costs you several seconds in loading time before you even see anything on the screen. That's still included in the final time of the game. Not to mention loading screens and disc changing all counts too.

In SR4 though you're probably right on the PC version. Every computer is different so no two people are ever going to have the same loading times. It's pretty fast for me, but then again I'm packing an i7 3770k and a powerful 2 GB graphics card, among other things.

If I remember correctly though, the ruling on segmented runs is that the initial load from a save file doesn't count towards the timer until you gain control of the character, but I could be mistaken on that.

Frozty

2013-09-07 12:05:39 pm

One Chill Dude

I have similar computer specs (7950, i7, all that jazz) so crashes definitely are not hardware related. That's beside the point though. The biggest time waster i had (other than messing up in game) was probably having to alt+tab out of the game (and thus pausing it) in order to hit my splits. Talking with Professor_Broman, he had heard of games that hog all of the inputs and not letting wsplit use hotkeys, but that there is a way around it. Anyone know what software that might be?

Lighnat0r

Edit history:

Lighnat0r: 2013-09-07 12:30:17 pm

2013-09-07 12:27:25 pm

Yeah, there might be some very rare crashes to do with hardware, but nearly all are just the game screwing up.
As for WSplit not working properly, I've had plenty of issues with the way WSplit captures input. I don't know of a way to fix WSplit, but I do know that Llanfair uses a better method to capture input, and in fact works just fine with SR4.
If you're hell bent on using WSplit, turn pause on focus loss off in the game settings and split when you don't need to control your character.

Regarding load times, on my 6 year old pc the load times are not slow either, though I can't say if/how much of a difference there is.

mattBLiTZ

2013-09-07 03:41:46 pm

Pac is Back

Real time seems appropriate here, although I will say that I have a pretty beast computer and I've crashed three times in 35 hours (never crashed in any games that don't have known issues).

yapzilla

2013-09-18 11:59:50 pm

i found that early game the 'merica does tons of damage, you can kill wardens super fast. it is acquired with dlc is that legal?

j4sp3rr

Edit history:

j4sp3rr: 2013-09-19 05:21:14 am

j4sp3rr: 2013-09-19 05:21:08 am

2013-09-19 05:20:54 am

RTA would seem the most appropriate indeed, and imo DLC and such would not count towards speedruns because they are additions to the game, and not the core game itself, it could be a catagory though(like New Game+ giving you OP weapons from the getgo).

DonkeyKong1254

2013-10-27 08:11:01 pm

Hey guys! I've been looking to get into SR4 speedrunning. Any tips/tricks i might need to know?

j4sp3rr

2013-10-29 03:20:10 pm

Quote from DonkeyKong1254:

Hey guys! I've been looking to get into SR4 speedrunning. Any tips/tricks i might need to know?

go fast

monarch78

2013-11-15 08:11:54 pm

After a 100% blind play through (about 20 hours). I'm excited to see what can be done any% wise.
Once a route gets established we can start knocking down the times with finer tweaks.
The key seems to be finding the right weapon/power combination and finding the most efficient way to collect cache/clusters to fund that early.
I personally found the maxed out pistols extremely versatile. I also completed almost all of the simulation objectives before even picking up the missions. I'm wondering how much that will benefit any%.
I'll do a run or two this weekend. Take plenty of notes and see what I come up with.

GrassVortex

2014-01-17 04:18:11 pm

Anyone still working on running this game?
I did a somewhat OK unpracticed SS run (5:05 according to the game timer) considering that I haven't played the game since the week after release and had to retry one of the later mission a few times due to clumsiness.
I have started to collect information about mission waypoints, collectible locations (clusters) and other tips and tricks I find while playing so I can create a better route.

I'm also planning to apply to the ESA marathon this summer with a run of this if I manage to find a good route before the submissions end.

Krispearman

2014-01-21 09:09:34 am

So yeah wondering also if anyone else is looking into this? I had like a 5hour run on casual without save warping or anything, and going out the way to get infinite sprint (wasnt aware its quicker without) just wondering what the out of bounds/glide glitch is people talk about and what sort of weapon/skill loadouts people are thinking would work best?

Ditto

2014-02-26 01:26:46 am

I started to learn this game, haven't done many runs so far (5h +/- 20m) but here are my thoughts.

Pistols are still very good. Especially alien pistols for the ammo. Shotguns can destroy everything in 1-3 shots, very useful against murderbots, rolling ball bots and objects which need to be destoryed. But there's no alien version of it so you will run out of ammo really fast and you have to hack a friendly fire to get some.

Upgrades like glide, wall running and jump height make the end game easier when you need to get on platforms. For that you need about 50 clusters therefore I'm not sure the savewarps at the early missions are worth it. During those travels you can collect clusters, it slows down early game but you will benefit from them late game. Later on you will mostly travel to the Broken Shillelagh so you can't collect too many.

I got a hint that you can access a Void early game (as soon as you can climb a tower?). Might worth getting it due towers give you a lot of clusters and a flying vehicle (with guns) would be very useful. Not sure how many times can you deliver it to you via vehicle delivery from you phone.

I started to learn this game, haven't done many runs so far (5h +/- 20m) but here are my thoughts.

Pistols are still very good. Especially alien pistols for the ammo. Shotguns can destroy everything in 1-3 shots, very useful against murderbots, rolling ball bots and objects which need to be destoryed. But there's no alien version of it so you will run out of ammo really fast and you have to hack a friendly fire to get some.

Upgrades like glide, wall running and jump height make the end game easier when you need to get on platforms. For that you need about 50 clusters therefore I'm not sure the savewarps at the early missions are worth it. During those travels you can collect clusters, it slows down early game but you will benefit from them late game. Later on you will mostly travel to the Broken Shillelagh so you can't collect too many.

I got a hint that you can access a Void early game (as soon as you can climb a tower?). Might worth getting it due towers give you a lot of clusters and a flying vehicle (with guns) would be very useful. Not sure how many times can you deliver it to you via vehicle delivery from you phone.

sellz90

Edit history:

sellz90: 2014-02-26 04:39:38 am

2014-02-26 03:51:23 am

Quote from Ditto:

I got a hint that you can access a Void early game (as soon as you can climb a tower?). Might worth getting it due towers give you a lot of clusters and a flying vehicle (with guns) would be very useful. Not sure how many times can you deliver it to you via vehicle delivery from you phone.

I have been starting to route this game, I’ve done up to Emergency Situation, I have done runs up to the point I have routed and I am typically 3mins sometimes 4mins quicker than the WR. What I have found about travel is that over a distance of 2000 meters it is equally as quick to use the void as to use a fully upgraded player (abilities and superpowers) with infinite sprint and any distance under the 2000 meter mark it is quicker to use the void. As you rarely ever have to travel more than 1500 meters it is best to get the void and use any clusters you do get throughout the run on powers that will help you speed up the missions in Punch the Shark.

To get the void I have found the quickest place to get the void is during the mission where you first go to the door to escape the simulation you run over to the tower before going to the door this is the earliest point to get it efficiently while maximizing use of it. The best way to get it is to use the tornado heli which is a fixed spawn only meters away on a roof and fly up to the void near the top of the tower. Add it to the garage and call it infinitely throughout the run when needed.

Another tip whenever you call for the void jump in the air so you are in midair when it is called in, this will skip most of the entering animation saving 4 or 5 secs every time it is called in.

[quote="Ditto"]
I got a hint that you can access a Void early game (as soon as you can climb a tower?). Might worth getting it due towers give you a lot of clusters and a flying vehicle (with guns) would be very useful. Not sure how many times can you deliver it to you via vehicle delivery from you phone.
[/quote]

I have been starting to route this game, I’ve done up to Emergency Situation, I have done runs up to the point I have routed and I am typically 3mins sometimes 4mins quicker than the WR. What I have found about travel is that over a distance of 2000 meters it is equally as quick to use the void as to use a fully upgraded player (abilities and superpowers) with infinite sprint and any distance under the 2000 meter mark it is quicker to use the void. As you rarely ever have to travel more than 1500 meters it is best to get the void and use any clusters you do get throughout the run on powers that will help you speed up the missions in Punch the Shark.

To get the void I have found the quickest place to get the void is during the mission where you first go to the door to escape the simulation you run over to the tower before going to the door this is the earliest point to get it efficiently while maximizing use of it. The best way to get it is to use the tornado heli which is a fixed spawn only meters away on a roof and fly up to the void near the top of the tower. Add it to the garage and call it infinitely throughout the run when needed.

Another tip whenever you call for the void jump in the air so you are in midair when it is called in, this will skip most of the entering animation saving 4 or 5 secs every time it is called in.

BystanderTim

2014-05-07 06:16:00 pm

Are there any active runners of this game still around? If so, leave a post here, and maybe i can make a skype group or something.

Nanoscripter

2014-05-10 04:14:35 am

You're pretty good...

I wouldnt mind learning to run the game bystander. i just cant use skype so we would have to talk on sda.

BystanderTim

2014-05-10 08:08:51 am

Quote from Nanoscripter:

I wouldnt mind learning to run the game bystander. i just cant use skype so we would have to talk on sda.

Ok then. Umm. I wanted to post a route when i get the vehicle strats down, but do you have any sort of other, because i can't do routes just yet.

Nanoscripter

2014-05-10 10:51:47 pm

You're pretty good...

not really, just looking for glitches in my spare time.

Ditto

2014-05-13 05:34:47 am

I still plan to run this game too aside of the third just don't really have time for fulls runs.
But i'd love to discuss or brainstorm about it. It is good for motivation too Smiley

BystanderTim

2014-05-13 08:17:08 pm

Nice guys.

Nanoscripter

2014-05-14 10:42:24 am

You're pretty good...

i know of a few useful glitches, when firing a gun you can still use you're super powers besides super stomp and you can keep firing you're gun. you can get the golden c.i.d stuck if water by spamming the use key when you tackle him and i think you can clip into the world by using a car to ram you into things and picking it up at the same time. i think that last one might be false but its only happend to me once.

BystanderTim

2014-05-14 04:05:59 pm

I've gotten that super powers glitch, The one time the C.I.D is involved, if you go at him from a certain angle, you can get him stuck either way.

Nanoscripter

2014-05-17 08:33:59 am

You're pretty good...

When you are trying to capture the circle orb dome things (dont remember the name) you can use your powers while smashing the board thing to take control of it.