Lufia

Edit history:

zell99: 2006-02-22 10:17:57 pm

2006-02-22 10:17:14 pm

Do'h! Homer'D!

I did a bit of testing myself:

Maxim's attacks without Dread; 231 - 257 - 241 - 206 - 199 - 222 - 257 - 241 - 192 ==> 227 average

Maxim's attacks with Dread (-67 DFP on average); 247 - 248 - 229 - 250 - 263 ==> 247 average

These are small samples but I think it's obvious there's a difference. Trick seems to give a better increase in damage output but since it only affects one member, it's probably not the best option.

Enhasa

2006-02-23 03:38:21 am

everybody wanna tell you the meaning of music

Quote:

I have to say, the amount of dedication and, most of all, intelligence towards Lufia between you two (DTaeKim and Enhasa) simply astounds me.
I just hope people like you help me with my RPG runs! Keep up the amazing work!

Ha, you should look at the Valkyrie Profile thread. Wink

You gotta be running a game I know and like! My "help" with StarTropics runs will be limited to "watch the TAS." Tongue

Quote:

However, I wonder how effective Dread really is. When I used 1 Dread in the first battle, my physical damage actually decreased. The second time, using 2 Dreads increased the damage drastically. I'm rather confused by this, and I probably will never know why unless I find the exact damage formula (highly unlikely).

That can happen when the sample sizes are small.

BTW, relnqshd at gamefaqs knows basically every line of code in Lufia 2. (For example, he released a small patch which fixes the bugs in US version.) He might be able to tell you more than you ever wanted to know about Lufia 1 if you asked.

Quote:

These are small samples but I think it's obvious there's a difference. Trick seems to give a better increase in damage output but since it only affects one member, it's probably not the best option.

Since Artea's attacking now, 1-2 Dreads are about the same. If the sinistrals had more HP (i.e. the battles were longer), it'd be more advantageous to buff more with things like Trick of course.

Actually while typing this, I just tried 2 Dreads and got 11 minutes. It's like an arms race. =/ I'm not entirely sure if it's faster (because my random encounters part was on the unlucky side with 1 Dread and lucky with 2), but at least it's not any slower.

Another thing is, for healing, the fastest thing you can do is go to the menu in between battles and use Maxim's Valor. Even if not everyone needs healing, Valor is on top for cursor purposes and you don't have to select who to heal. Also, for turning on fast message speed, the optimal way to do that is hit B, up, A, up, up, left. The first up is faster than down right and the second set of ups is faster than going down. I always hit left for stereo here too while I'm at it, and it's even "on the way." Wink

[quote]I have to say, the amount of dedication and, most of all, intelligence towards Lufia between you two (DTaeKim and Enhasa) simply astounds me.
I just hope people like you help me with [i]my[/i] RPG runs! Keep up the amazing work![/quote]
Ha, you should look at the [url=http://speeddemosarchive.com/yabb/YaBB.pl?board=consoles_newer;action=display;num=1120629616;start=85#85]Valkyrie Profile thread[/url]. ;)

You gotta be running a game I know and like! My "help" with StarTropics runs will be limited to "watch the TAS." :P

[quote]However, I wonder how effective Dread really is.  When I used 1 Dread in the first battle, my physical damage actually decreased.  The second time, using 2 Dreads increased the damage drastically.  I'm rather confused by this, and I probably will never know why unless I find the exact damage formula (highly unlikely).
[/quote]
That can happen when the sample sizes are small.

BTW, relnqshd at gamefaqs knows basically every line of code in Lufia 2. (For example, he released a small patch which fixes the bugs in US version.) He might be able to tell you more than you ever wanted to know about Lufia 1 if you asked.

[quote]These are small samples but I think it's obvious there's a difference. Trick seems to give a better increase in damage output but since it only affects one member, it's probably not the best option.
[/quote]
Since Artea's attacking now, 1-2 Dreads are about the same. If the sinistrals had more HP (i.e. the battles were longer), it'd be more advantageous to buff more with things like Trick of course.

Actually while typing this, I just tried 2 Dreads and got 11 minutes. It's like an arms race. =/ I'm not entirely sure if it's faster (because my random encounters part was on the unlucky side with 1 Dread and lucky with 2), but at least it's not any slower.

Another thing is, for healing, the fastest thing you can do is go to the menu in between battles and use Maxim's Valor. Even if not everyone needs healing, Valor is on top for cursor purposes and you don't have to select who to heal. Also, for turning on fast message speed, the optimal way to do that is hit B, up, A, up, up, left. The first up is faster than down right and the second set of ups is faster than going down. I always hit left for stereo here too while I'm at it, and it's even "on the way." ;)

DTaeKim

2006-02-24 07:20:19 pm

I asked relnqshd about Lufia 1. He replied that though he would like to hack the ROM for the information, he doesn't have much free time to do so. I am encouraged, though.

Okay, I think this is the item list I will grab from each area, which also details my route.

Segment 1: Introduction to Sheran (3rd visit)

Fortress of Doom - None (Any surprise?)
Defeat Sinistrals

Alekia - Potion (located in Weapon/Item shop), Power Potion, Cloth Helm
Purchase Dagger from Weapon Shop

Alekia Castle - Escape, Swing Wing
Talk to the Princess for 100 GOLD.

Skip Chantam

Sheran
Talk to first fallen townsperson
Swing Wing to Alekia?

Alekia (2nd visit) - Dress
Talk to Lufia

Cave to Sheran
Talk to Danil (NPC)

Sheran (2nd visit) - Potion x4, Sweet Water, Foul Water, Antidote, Awaken, Revive, 100 GOLD, Arrow x2, Mid Arrow, Great Potion
Release King and two servants
Commit suicide against Gades (saves 1-2 actions)

Alekia (3rd visit)
Talk to Roman

Chantam - Mind Potion, Power Potion (unlisted in FAQ)
Return Lilah to Danil

Sheran (3rd visit)
Rest at Inn
Save

2nd Segment: Sheran (3rd visit) to Treck (2nd visit)

Treck - Dress, Hair Band, Power Gourd
Talk to old man at the dock.
Purchase Robe, Cloth Armor

Cave East of Treck - Cloth Shoes, Swing Wing

Guy's House - Great Potion, Short Sword
Talk to Guy
Enjoy music (for a brief time)

Treck (2nd visit)
Rest at Inn
Save

3rd Segment: Treck (2nd visit) to Grenoble (2nd visit)

Treck (2nd visit)
Defeat Demon Lords mini-boss
Talk to Maberia's first mate on dock? (trigger Maberia's apperance on western island)

Cave North of Treck - Potion, Daze ring
Use 1st Foul Water here at HP and MP shrine and level to 8.
Defeat Goblins

Lorbenia - Mid Arrow, Mind Potion (unlisted in FAQ)
Enter big shop and purchase 20 Sweet Waters
Trigger Lou cutscene
Talk to innkeeper

Grenoble (1st visit) - Speed Potion, Spell Potion
Talk to old man in Old Cave shop lobby.

Old Cave
Loot 2nd level of Old Cave

Grenoble (2nd visit)
Give Fairy Kiss to Old Man

Kirof (1st visit)
Enter and leave.

Medan (1st visit)
Purchase Spear x2, Chain Mail x2, Wood Shield x2, Wood Helm x1, Glass Cap, Swing Wing x5
Save

Segment 4: Medan (1st visit) to Medan (3rd visit)

Grenoble (3rd visit)
Get Level 3 Task

Old Cave
Loot Level 3

Grenoble (4th visit)
Return Silver Wick for 1000 GOLD

Northwest Tower - Sonic Ring, 2 Mid Arrows, Power Potion, Spell Potion (get Mind Potion/Great Potion?)
Fight Apprentice
Warp to Kirof

Kirof - Hi Potion
Trigger cutscene

Medan
Trigger cutscenes in castle
Save

I asked relnqshd about Lufia 1.  He replied that though he would like to hack the ROM for the information, he doesn't have much free time to do so.  I am encouraged, though.

Okay, I think this is the item list I will grab from each area, which also details my route.

Segment 1: Introduction to Sheran (3rd visit)

Fortress of Doom - None (Any surprise?)
Defeat Sinistrals

Alekia - Potion (located in Weapon/Item shop), Power Potion, Cloth Helm
Purchase Dagger from Weapon Shop

Alekia Castle -  Escape, Swing Wing
Talk to the Princess for 100 GOLD.

Skip Chantam

Sheran
Talk to first fallen townsperson
Swing Wing to Alekia?

Alekia (2nd visit) - Dress
Talk to Lufia

Cave to Sheran
Talk to Danil (NPC)

Sheran (2nd visit) - Potion x4, Sweet Water, Foul Water, Antidote, Awaken, Revive, 100 GOLD, Arrow x2, Mid Arrow, Great Potion
Release King and two servants
Commit suicide against Gades (saves 1-2 actions)

Alekia (3rd visit)
Talk to Roman

Chantam - Mind Potion, Power Potion (unlisted in FAQ)
Return Lilah to Danil

Sheran (3rd visit)
Rest at Inn
Save

2nd Segment: Sheran (3rd visit) to Treck (2nd visit)

Treck - Dress, Hair Band, Power Gourd
Talk to old man at the dock.
Purchase Robe, Cloth Armor

Cave East of Treck - Cloth Shoes, Swing Wing

Guy's House - Great Potion, Short Sword
Talk to Guy
Enjoy music (for a brief time)

Treck (2nd visit)
Rest at Inn
Save

3rd Segment: Treck (2nd visit) to Grenoble (2nd visit)

Treck (2nd visit)
Defeat Demon Lords mini-boss
Talk to Maberia's first mate on dock? (trigger Maberia's apperance on western island)

Cave North of Treck - Potion, Daze ring
Use 1st Foul Water here at HP and MP shrine and level to 8.
Defeat Goblins

Lorbenia - Mid Arrow, Mind Potion (unlisted in FAQ)
Enter big shop and purchase 20 Sweet Waters
Trigger Lou cutscene
Talk to innkeeper

Grenoble (1st visit) - Speed Potion, Spell Potion
Talk to old man in Old Cave shop lobby.

Old Cave
Loot 2nd level of Old Cave

Grenoble (2nd visit)
Give Fairy Kiss to Old Man

Kirof (1st visit)
Enter and leave.

Medan (1st visit)
Purchase Spear x2, Chain Mail x2, Wood Shield x2, Wood Helm x1, Glass Cap, Swing Wing x5
Save

Segment 4: Medan (1st visit) to Medan (3rd visit)

Grenoble (3rd visit)
Get Level 3 Task

Old Cave
Loot Level 3

Grenoble (4th visit)
Return Silver Wick for 1000 GOLD

Northwest Tower - Sonic Ring, 2 Mid Arrows, Power Potion, Spell Potion (get Mind Potion/Great Potion?)
Fight Apprentice
Warp to Kirof

Kirof - Hi Potion
Trigger cutscene

Medan
Trigger cutscenes in castle
Save

DTaeKim

2006-02-25 09:38:16 pm

New run in progress.

I got a time of 14 mintues after the Sinistrals. 15 after I do my duties in Alekia.

Alekia before Sheran - 0:15

Sheran before Treck - 0:26

Treck before Demon Lords boss - 0:34
Hero: 5, Lufia: 4, Aguro: 5

Medan before Follower and Old Cave Level 3 - 1:05

Medan before Ghost Cave - 1:20
Hero: 10, Lufia: 10, Aguro: 10

Enhasa

2006-02-26 08:46:51 pm

everybody wanna tell you the meaning of music

Do you need to pick up that Potion in Alekia? This is a general comment, but I don't think you should ever pick up a regular item that you could just buy in a store. Even if the chest is right next to you. And especially in a dungeon, the threshold for what you would bother picking up goes even higher since you'll be fighting more enemies and walking slower to boot.

I know I've said this before, but just reminding you that you can segment as much as you want and not accept any bad luck. The biggest benefit of this is being able to plan for good luck, to be honest.

I think you would definitely want to Swing Wing back to Alekia. Isn't there a cave you need to go through?

I like how you found items that aren't in the FAQ, good job. Ha, the thing that sucks the most about running vs normal play is not being able to enjoy the music.

You buy Sweet Waters in Lorbenia when you can start buying them earlier, so I will just say something about optimizing them that you probably already know. If you use too many, you will be at too low levels and need to Foul Water to power level. If you use too few, then you will be meeting too many fights that you want to Smoke Ball away from. Both of these aren't very good so you want to try to hit a happy medium.

If I were to take a guess though, I would say to be careful not to use too few. Since you still meet enemies (just less), are you using them most of the time? It might be faster at times to Sweet Water/Smoke Ball through areas where the XP/time ratio is not very good and then Foul Water at better leveling spots. I assume a TAS for example would Sweet Water through the entire game and Foul Water to fight only cores to survive the sinistrals. Obviously, you wouldn't want to do that, but I really do think you could be more selective in which enemies you fight.

I'm glad you're posting your times now, because I was going to ask. Tongue

Do you know how this compares with your previous test runs? Because this way you could try out different things and see how they compare.

Do you need to pick up that Potion in Alekia? This is a general comment, but I don't think you should ever pick up a regular item that you could just buy in a store. Even if the chest is right next to you. And especially in a dungeon, the threshold for what you would bother picking up goes even higher since you'll be fighting more enemies and walking slower to boot.

I know I've said this before, but just reminding you that you can segment as much as you want and not accept any bad luck. The biggest benefit of this is being able to plan for good luck, to be honest.

I think you would definitely want to Swing Wing back to Alekia. Isn't there a cave you need to go through?

I like how you found items that aren't in the FAQ, good job. Ha, the thing that sucks the most about running vs normal play is not being able to enjoy the music.

You buy Sweet Waters in Lorbenia when you can start buying them earlier, so I will just say something about optimizing them that you probably already know. If you use too many, you will be at too low levels and need to Foul Water to power level. If you use too few, then you will be meeting too many fights that you want to Smoke Ball away from. Both of these aren't very good so you want to try to hit a happy medium.

If I were to take a guess though, I would say to be careful not to use too few. Since you still meet enemies (just less), are you using them most of the time? It might be faster at times to Sweet Water/Smoke Ball through areas where the XP/time ratio is not very good and then Foul Water at better leveling spots. I assume a TAS for example would Sweet Water through the entire game and Foul Water to fight only cores to survive the sinistrals. Obviously, you wouldn't want to do that, but I really do think you could be more selective in which enemies you fight.

I'm glad you're posting your times now, because I was going to ask. :P Do you know how this compares with your previous test runs? Because this way you could try out different things and see how they compare.

Mr_Nice_Guy

2006-02-26 10:17:12 pm

Battle Is My Forte

would it be allowed to enter the name TAITO?
it lets you do a normal game with 4x exp & gold, just like the Try Again mode.

-Suzaku-

2006-02-26 10:20:03 pm

Eternal Understudy

Quote:

would it be allowed to enter the name TAITO?
it lets you do a normal game with 4x exp & gold, just like the Try Again mode.

That IS the Try Again mode and would fall under its category.

DTaeKim

Edit history:

DTaeKim: 2006-02-26 10:38:48 pm

2006-02-26 10:38:11 pm

The reason I get the Potion is because the odds are VERY low that Hero will survive the trip to Sheran without healing at some point. I could get 2 Potions, but I can get away with 1.

I don't use a single Sweet Water until after the Ghost Cave. This is to ensure that my levels are high enough to confront the Phantasm and allow me minimal leveling to fight the Follower.

I may as well post my progress since then. I think you will be pleasantly surprised. I made some notes on the items I find and purchase.

I raided the Old Cave Level 3 before entering the Ghost Cave. Next time around, I'm going to use the Water Ring; it helps OHKO Flamespooks and Willowisps, saving me time.

Phantasm
Hero: 12, Aguro: 11, Lufia: 12

Belgen
Items to be Found: Mind Gourd, Power Gourd
Purchase Brone Robe, Brone Shield, Brone Armor
Save - 1:45
Hero: 13, Aguro: 12, Lufia: 12

Cave Southwest of Belgen
Items to be Found: Scimitar, Brone Armor, Brone Shield, Brone Helm, Fly Ring, Revive, Hi Potion, Hi Magic

Dais
2nd Run Save - 1:56

3rd Run Save - 1:56
Hero: 13, Aguro: 12, Lufia: 13

2nd Run Follower - Hero: 14, Lufia: 13, Aguro: 13
3rd Run Follower - Hero: 14, Lufia: 13, Aguro: 13

I found the Fly Ring to be immensely helpful. It adds about 10-20 damage to Aguro's ATK, which means that he can help Lufia deal damage. It's about a minute off the beaten path, but the aggrivation it saves is more than enough.

Jenoba

Purchase Long Sword, Buckler, Light Armor, 14 Big Arrows, 10 Hi Potions
Save - 2:11

In between these saves, I raid the Old Cave Level 4.

2nd Run Ruan Save Before Water Ghost- 2:33
Water Ghost - Hero: 15, Lufia: 15, Aguro: 14, Jerin: 17

3rd Run Ruan Before Water Ghost Save - 2:26
Water Ghost - Hero: 15, Lufia: 15, Aguro: 14, Jerin: 17

2nd Run Odel - 3:02
3rd Run Odel - 2:44

As of the last save point, I am 18 minutes ahead of the pace.

The reason I get the Potion is because the odds are VERY low that Hero will survive the trip to Sheran without healing at some point.  I could get 2 Potions, but I can get away with 1.

I don't use a single Sweet Water until after the Ghost Cave.  This is to ensure that my levels are high enough to confront the Phantasm and allow me minimal leveling to fight the Follower.

I may as well post my progress since then.  I think you will be pleasantly surprised.  I made some notes on the items I find and purchase.

[b]I raided the Old Cave Level 3 before entering the Ghost Cave.  Next time around, I'm going to use the Water Ring; it helps OHKO Flamespooks and Willowisps, saving me time.[/b]

Phantasm
Hero: 12, Aguro: 11, Lufia: 12

Belgen
Items to be Found: Mind Gourd, Power Gourd
Purchase Brone Robe, Brone Shield, Brone Armor
Save - 1:45
Hero: 13, Aguro: 12, Lufia: 12

Cave Southwest of Belgen
Items to be Found: Scimitar, Brone Armor, Brone Shield, Brone Helm, Fly Ring, Revive, Hi Potion, Hi Magic

Dais
2nd Run Save - 1:56

3rd Run Save - 1:56
Hero: 13, Aguro: 12, Lufia: 13

2nd Run Follower - Hero: 14, Lufia: 13, Aguro: 13
3rd Run Follower - Hero: 14, Lufia: 13, Aguro: 13

[b]I found the Fly Ring to be immensely helpful.  It adds about 10-20 damage to Aguro's ATK, which means that he can help Lufia deal damage.  It's about a minute off the beaten path, but the aggrivation it saves is more than enough.[/b]

Jenoba

Purchase Long Sword, Buckler, Light Armor, 14 Big Arrows, 10 Hi Potions
Save - 2:11

[b]In between these saves, I raid the Old Cave Level 4.[/b]

2nd Run Ruan Save Before Water Ghost- 2:33
Water Ghost - Hero: 15, Lufia: 15, Aguro: 14, Jerin: 17

3rd Run Ruan Before Water Ghost Save - 2:26
Water Ghost - Hero: 15, Lufia: 15, Aguro: 14, Jerin: 17

2nd Run Odel - 3:02
3rd Run Odel - 2:44

[b]As of the last save point, I am 18 minutes ahead of the pace.[/b]

Enhasa

2006-02-26 11:06:41 pm

everybody wanna tell you the meaning of music

Quote:

The reason I get the Potion is because the odds are VERY low that Hero will survive the trip to Sheran without healing at some point. I could get 2 Potions, but I can get away with 1.

Thanks, that was my hunch. I was talking in general more about all the items you got in Sheran round 2 and so forth.

Sounds good with the improvement. Smiley

Quote:

I found the Fly Ring to be immensely helpful. It adds about 10-20 damage to Aguro's ATK, which means that he can help Lufia deal damage. It's about a minute off the beaten path, but the aggrivation it saves is more than enough.

What does it do, besides "effective against flying creatures"?

This is how you decide whether or not it's worth it. Estimate all the time that you would save vs regular enemies and bosses if you got it, and see if that adds up to a minute or not. The only way I could see this being the case is if it means the difference between killing a regular enemy in one less hit or not, and if you're doing a lot of that before you get the next ring.

My goal is to get you to pick up less chests, not more. Wink

I recommend something when it clearly saves time like the Engage Ring.

Quote:

2nd Run Ruan Save Before Water Ghost- 2:33
Water Ghost - Hero: 15, Lufia: 15, Aguro: 14, Jerin: 17

3rd Run Ruan Before Water Ghost Save - 2:26
Water Ghost - Hero: 15, Lufia: 15, Aguro: 14, Jerin: 17

2nd Run Odel - 3:02
3rd Run Odel - 2:44

What'd you do in between Ruan and Odel? Tongue

I notice you're in the same levels as before? Where do you guess your time saving comes from? Are you using the Engage Ring to be able to save time by fighting different regular enemies and pick up less EQ-type chests (you should be picking up less items anyway)? Is your EQ any different from before? If you have better EQ this time for whatever reason (Old Cave, etc), you should try to see if you can do lower levels.

[quote]The reason I get the Potion is because the odds are VERY low that Hero will survive the trip to Sheran without healing at some point.  I could get 2 Potions, but I can get away with 1.[/quote]
Thanks, that was my hunch. I was talking in general more about all the items you got in Sheran round 2 and so forth.

Sounds good with the improvement. :)

[quote][b]I found the Fly Ring to be immensely helpful.  It adds about 10-20 damage to Aguro's ATK, which means that he can help Lufia deal damage.  It's about a minute off the beaten path, but the aggrivation it saves is more than enough.[/b][/quote]
What does it do, besides "effective against flying creatures"?

This is how you decide whether or not it's worth it. Estimate all the time that you would save vs regular enemies and bosses if you got it, and see if that adds up to a minute or not. The only way I could see this being the case is if it means the difference between killing a regular enemy in one less hit or not, and if you're doing a lot of that before you get the next ring.

My goal is to get you to pick up less chests, not more. ;) I recommend something when it clearly saves time like the Engage Ring.

[quote]2nd Run Ruan Save Before Water Ghost- 2:33
Water Ghost - Hero: 15, Lufia: 15, Aguro: 14, Jerin: 17

3rd Run Ruan Before Water Ghost Save - 2:26
Water Ghost - Hero: 15, Lufia: 15, Aguro: 14, Jerin: 17

2nd Run Odel - 3:02
3rd Run Odel - 2:44[/quote]
What'd you do in between Ruan and Odel? :P

I notice you're in the same levels as before? Where do you guess your time saving comes from? Are you using the Engage Ring to be able to save time by fighting different regular enemies and pick up less EQ-type chests (you should be picking up less items anyway)? Is your EQ any different from before? If you have better EQ this time for whatever reason (Old Cave, etc), you should try to see if you can do lower levels.

DTaeKim

Edit history:

DTaeKim: 2006-02-26 11:21:32 pm

2006-02-26 11:18:56 pm

Quote:

What does it do, besides "effective against flying creatures"?

This is how you decide whether or not it's worth it. Estimate all the time that you would save vs regular enemies and bosses if you got it, and see if that adds up to a minute or not. The only way I could see this being the case is if it means the difference between killing a regular enemy in one less hit or not, and if you're doing a lot of that before you get the next ring.

My goal is to get you to pick up less chests, not more. Wink

I recommend something when it clearly saves time like the Engage Ring.

By effective against flying creatures, it increases damage against said creatures. The Follower qualifies as a flying creature, which means that my attack is increased. I get the Ghost Ring for the same reason; it turns Aguro into a decent damage dealer, although nowhere near the level Lufia is at this point.

As for the chests, I already have streamlined my route in terms of chests that I can get. The only change in items from the last run and this run is the addition of the Fly Ring.

Quote:

What'd you do in between Ruan and Odel? Tongue

Put the Blue, Green, and Red gems and get to Elfrea. Then it's Elfrea to Odel, which isn't long. I skip the town before the tunnel.

Quote:

I notice you're in the same levels as before? Where do you guess your time saving comes from? Are you using the Engage Ring to be able to save time by fighting different regular enemies and pick up less EQ-type chests (you should be picking up less items anyway)? Is your EQ any different from before? If you have better EQ this time for whatever reason (Old Cave, etc), you should try to see if you can do lower levels.

To tell you the truth, it comes from smarter leveling. The levels I established in my previous run are the levels I am aiming for in this run. By knowing where exactly to level to, I can save time by using Sweet Waters until I know I need to level, then level at that spot. It was the case in the Ghost Cave (I entered at Hero: 10, Lufia: 10, Aguro: 10 and left at Hero: 13, Lufia: 12, Aguro: 12). As a result, I also gained time before the Follower, since I was on pace to reach the levels I was at in my previous run, Foul Water not needed. Consequently, after the Follower, I was on pace to reach the levels I was at in my previous run against the Water Ghost.

The levels I leave the Ghost Cave at establish my pace for the next two bosses.

The only way I can reduce my time leveling is to abuse the battles that give the best experience, but since I have no control over what enemies appear in battle, I go with the flow.

The Engage Ring is unavailable here; I don't have a ship yet.

There is no change from my equipment. Smarter spending helps me save money for my splurge in Frederia. Right now, I'm at 24000 GOLD right now.

[quote]
What does it do, besides "effective against flying creatures"?

This is how you decide whether or not it's worth it. Estimate all the time that you would save vs regular enemies and bosses if you got it, and see if that adds up to a minute or not. The only way I could see this being the case is if it means the difference between killing a regular enemy in one less hit or not, and if you're doing a lot of that before you get the next ring.

My goal is to get you to pick up less chests, not more. ;) I recommend something when it clearly saves time like the Engage Ring.[/quote]

By effective against flying creatures, it increases damage against said creatures.  The Follower qualifies as a flying creature, which means that my attack is increased.  I get the Ghost Ring for the same reason; it turns Aguro into a decent damage dealer, although nowhere near the level Lufia is at this point.

As for the chests, I already have streamlined my route in terms of chests that I can get.  The only change in items from the last run and this run is the addition of the Fly Ring.

[quote]What'd you do in between Ruan and Odel? :P[/quote]

Put the Blue, Green, and Red gems and get to Elfrea.  Then it's Elfrea to Odel, which isn't long.  I skip the town before the tunnel.

[quote]I notice you're in the same levels as before? Where do you guess your time saving comes from? Are you using the Engage Ring to be able to save time by fighting different regular enemies and pick up less EQ-type chests (you should be picking up less items anyway)? Is your EQ any different from before? If you have better EQ this time for whatever reason (Old Cave, etc), you should try to see if you can do lower levels.[/quote]

To tell you the truth, it comes from smarter leveling.  The levels I established in my previous run are the levels I am aiming for in this run.  By knowing where exactly to level to, I can save time by using Sweet Waters until I know I need to level, then level at that spot.  It was the case in the Ghost Cave (I entered at Hero: 10, Lufia: 10, Aguro: 10 and left at Hero: 13, Lufia: 12, Aguro: 12).  As a result, I also gained time before the Follower, since I was on pace to reach the levels I was at in my previous run, Foul Water not needed.  Consequently, after the Follower, I was on pace to reach the levels I was at in my previous run against the Water Ghost.

The levels I leave the Ghost Cave at establish my pace for the next two bosses.

The only way I can reduce my time leveling is to abuse the battles that give the best experience, but since I have no control over what enemies appear in battle, I go with the flow.

The Engage Ring is unavailable here; I don't have a ship yet.

There is no change from my equipment.  Smarter spending helps me save money for my splurge in Frederia.  Right now, I'm at 24000 GOLD right now.

Enhasa

2006-02-27 03:52:12 am

everybody wanna tell you the meaning of music

Quote:

By effective against flying creatures, it increases damage against said creatures. The Follower qualifies as a flying creature, which means that my attack is increased. I get the Ghost Ring for the same reason; it turns Aguro into a decent damage dealer, although nowhere near the level Lufia is at this point.

Ya, I know what that means, but I didn't know who it would be useful against. It's not like Follower's name is Flying Ghost Guy or whatever he is. Tongue

Quote:

As for the chests, I already have streamlined my route in terms of chests that I can get. The only change in items from the last run and this run is the addition of the Fly Ring.

How about the stuff like Potions and Antidote in Sheran 2 that you listed? I'll believe you about your EQ, but I still find it hard to belive you would want to just pick up Antidotes and Awakens and such.

Quote:

To tell you the truth, it comes from smarter leveling. The levels I established in my previous run are the levels I am aiming for in this run. By knowing where exactly to level to, I can save time by using Sweet Waters until I know I need to level, then level at that spot.

Sounds good. Smiley

Quote:

The only way I can reduce my time leveling is to abuse the battles that give the best experience, but since I have no control over what enemies appear in battle, I go with the flow.

Is there anything worth abusing with shorter segments, like Mimics/Cores? Or are they too tough to fight/kill?

[quote]By effective against flying creatures, it increases damage against said creatures.  The Follower qualifies as a flying creature, which means that my attack is increased.  I get the Ghost Ring for the same reason; it turns Aguro into a decent damage dealer, although nowhere near the level Lufia is at this point.[/quote]
Ya, I know what that means, but I didn't know who it would be useful against. It's not like Follower's name is Flying Ghost Guy or whatever he is. :P

[quote]As for the chests, I already have streamlined my route in terms of chests that I can get.  The only change in items from the last run and this run is the addition of the Fly Ring.[/quote]
How about the stuff like Potions and Antidote in Sheran 2 that you listed? I'll believe you about your EQ, but I still find it hard to belive you would want to just pick up Antidotes and Awakens and such.

[quote]To tell you the truth, it comes from smarter leveling.  The levels I established in my previous run are the levels I am aiming for in this run.  By knowing where exactly to level to, I can save time by using Sweet Waters until I know I need to level, then level at that spot.[/quote]
Sounds good. :)

[quote]The only way I can reduce my time leveling is to abuse the battles that give the best experience, but since I have no control over what enemies appear in battle, I go with the flow.[/quote]
Is there anything worth abusing with shorter segments, like Mimics/Cores? Or are they too tough to fight/kill?

DTaeKim

Edit history:

DTaeKim: 2006-02-27 04:22:42 am

2006-02-27 04:10:55 am

Quote:

Ya, I know what that means, but I didn't know who it would be useful against. It's not like Follower's name is Flying Ghost Guy or whatever he is.

Well, he has wings, which is why I figured he would qualify. On that note, the Water Ghost qualifies as a Ghost, but for one reason or another, item damage is unaffected by the Ghost Ring. Go figure. It doesn't matter anyhow; my Big Arrow strategy is more than adequate enough to tame that beast.

Quote:

How about the stuff like Potions and Antidote in Sheran 2 that you listed? I'll believe you about your EQ, but I still find it hard to belive you would want to just pick up Antidotes and Awakens and such.

I was going by the FAQ there. I have NO idea where those items are. The new Sheran list:

Items to be Found: Sweet Water, Foul Water, Revive, Arrow x2, Mid Arrow, Revive, 100 GOLD

Basically, all of the items I pick up now are generally equipment and Miracles. I get all of the healing items in the early game because you can't predict when a particularly nasty hit may happen. This generally stops by the point I reach Belgen. Revives are still a priority for the most part. At the very least, I can sell my supply of them. I also stock Ex Potions to save money in the long run. The exception is the Old Cave; I get everything there because all of the chests are in close proximity.

In the early game, I ought to mention I get Escapes and Swing Wings, since Jerin isn't in the team. Oddly enough, Escapes aren't purchasable in shops. I wonder why?

Quote:

Is there anything worth abusing with shorter segments, like Mimics/Cores? Or are they too tough to fight/kill?

*Shudders.

As much as I would LOVE to abuse those things, they appear so infrequently and run so frequently that it's not worth the trouble to do so. On average, I encounter 2 Mimics, Mimicker, and Red Cores with Sweet Water. I only kill one. However, that one killed gives me enough experience to level up or get damn near close enough to a level up. If I get to kill 2 or more, it's a freaking miracle, since it takes me about 5-6 actions to kill ONE. My run is planned without taking into consideration killing one. If I kill one, consider it a bonus.

[quote] Ya, I know what that means, but I didn't know who it would be useful against. It's not like Follower's name is Flying Ghost Guy or whatever he is.[/quote]

Well, he has wings, which is why I figured he would qualify.  On that note, the Water Ghost qualifies as a Ghost, but for one reason or another, item damage is unaffected by the Ghost Ring.  Go figure.  It doesn't matter anyhow; my Big Arrow strategy is more than adequate enough to tame that beast.

[quote]How about the stuff like Potions and Antidote in Sheran 2 that you listed? I'll believe you about your EQ, but I still find it hard to belive you would want to just pick up Antidotes and Awakens and such.[/quote]

I was going by the FAQ there.  I have NO idea where those items are.  The new Sheran list:

Items to be Found: Sweet Water, Foul Water, Revive, Arrow x2, Mid Arrow, Revive, 100 GOLD

Basically, all of the items I pick up now are generally equipment and Miracles.  I get all of the healing items in the early game because you can't predict when a particularly nasty hit may happen.  This generally stops by the point I reach Belgen.  Revives are still a priority for the most part.  At the very least, I can sell my supply of them.  I also stock Ex Potions to save money in the long run.  The exception is the Old Cave; I get everything there because all of the chests are in close proximity.

In the early game, I ought to mention I get Escapes and Swing Wings, since Jerin isn't in the team.  Oddly enough, Escapes aren't purchasable in shops.  I wonder why?

[quote]Is there anything worth abusing with shorter segments, like Mimics/Cores? Or are they too tough to fight/kill?[/quote]

*Shudders.

As much as I would LOVE to abuse those things, they appear so infrequently and run so frequently that it's not worth the trouble to do so.  On average, I encounter 2 Mimics, Mimicker, and Red Cores with Sweet Water.  I only kill one.  However, that one killed gives me enough experience to level up or get damn near close enough to a level up.  If I get to kill 2 or more, it's a freaking miracle, since it takes me about 5-6 actions to kill ONE.  My run is planned without taking into consideration killing one.  If I kill one, consider it a bonus.

Mr_Nice_Guy

2006-02-27 10:00:30 pm

Battle Is My Forte

this is a nice walktrough, with the fastest way to complete towers, caves, getting allumina pieces etc.
http://www.rpgclassics.com/shrines/snes/lufia/walkthrough.shtml

hope it helps

DTaeKim

Edit history:

DTaeKim: 2006-02-28 04:40:04 am

2006-02-27 11:41:26 pm

Unfortunately, I was aware of the site, and it doesn't help too much as it stands.

I appreciate the help though.

Finished 2nd Run. Gained 30 minutes on the post-credits time.

2nd Run details my previous run through this game.

2nd Run Bakku - 3:46 (Before Might Helmet)
3rd Run Bakku - 3:21 (Before Might Helmet)
Hero: 20, Lufia: 19, Aguro: 18, Jerin: 21

2nd Run Carbis - 3:58 (Before Tower of Light)
3rd Run Bakku - 3:42 (Before Tower of Light, after Herat)
Hero: 21, Lufia: 20, Aguro: 19, Jerin: 21

Guardian
Hero: 21, Lufia: 21, Aguro: 19, Jerin: 21

Harder to fight at these levels; took me 21 tries. I was close to Hero: 22,

Lufia: 21, Aguro: 20, and Jerin: 22. About 1500 EXP short. I should aim for

those levels next time around.

2nd Run Linze - 4:10
3rd Run Linze - 3:54
Hero: 22, Lufia: 21, Aguro: 20, Jerin: 22

2nd Run Marse - 4:17 (Before Alumina Quest)
3rd Run Marse - 4:00 (Before Alumina Quest)
Hero: 22, Lufia: 22, Aguro: 20, Jerin: 22

Marse - 4:25

2nd Run Frederia - 4:51 (Before final Alumina)
3rd Run Frederia - 4:40 (Before Pirates)
Hero: 28, Lufia: 27, Aguro: 25, Jerin: 25

Marse - 5:02 (Before Pirates)
2nd Run Pirates - Hero: 29, Lufia: 28, Aguro: 26, Jerin: 26
3rd Run Pirates - Hero: 28, Lufia: 27, Aguro: 25, Jerin: 26

2nd Run Carbis - 5:22 (Before Dual Blade)
3rd Run Carbis - 4:56 (Before Dual Blade)

2nd Run Epro - 5:31 (Before Oil Cave)
3rd Run Epro - 5:06 (Before Oil Cave)

2nd Run Oil Dragon - Hero: 32, Aguro: 29, Lufia: 31, Jerin: 28
3rd Run Oil Dragon - Hero: 33, Aguro: 29, Lufia: 32, Jerin: 28

2nd Run Arubus - 5:52 (Before Glasdar Key)
3rd Run Arubus - 5:27 (Before Glasdar Key)

2nd Run Arubus - 6:02 (Before Glasdar Tower)
3rd Run Arubus - 5:35 (Before Gladar Tower)

Nazeby (1st run) - Hero: 39, Lufia: 38, Aguro: 36, Jerin: 33
Nazeby (2nd run) - Hero: 36, Lufia: 35, Aguro: 33, Jerin: 32
Nazeby (3rd run) - Hero: 36, Lufia: 35, Aguro: 33, Jerin: 32

2nd Run Old Man - 6:20 (Before Doom Island Fortress)
3rd Run Old Man - 5:46 (Before Doom Island Fortress)

2nd Run Gades - Hero: 37, Aguro: 34, Jerin: 33
3rd Run Gades - Hero: 36, Aguro: 33, Jerin: 32

2nd Run Amon - Hero: 38, Aguro: 35, Jerin: 33
2nd Run Amon - Hero: 37, Aguro: 34, Jerin: 33

2nd Run Daos - Hero: 39, Aguro: 36, Jerin: 34
2nd Run Daos - Hero: 38, Aguro: 35, Jerin: 34

2nd Run Guard Daos - Hero: 40, Aguro: 37, Jerin: 35, Lufia: 36
3rd Run Guard Daos - Hero: 39, Aguro: 36, Jerin: 34, Lufia: 35

Final Blow: 6:44
Loss of Player Control: 6:49
Post Credits Time: 6:53
Dead count: 0
Rakke Dead cnt: 4
Lufia Dead cnt: 12
Aguro Dead cnt: 7
Jerin Dead cnt: 7
Rest count: 34
Battle count: 368
Runaway count: 49
Boss lose cnt: 0
Opened Box: 345/655
Got item: 79/136

Post Credits Time: 6:23
Dead count: 0
Rakke Dead cnt: 11
Lufia Dead cnt: 10
Aguro Dead cnt: 10
Jerin Dead cnt: 4
Rest count: 26
Battle count: 388
Runaway count: 73
Boss lose cnt: 0
Opened Box: 294/655
Got item: 69/136

Unfortunately, I was aware of the site, and it doesn't help too much as it stands.

I appreciate the help though.

Finished 2nd Run.  Gained 30 minutes on the post-credits time.

2nd Run details my previous run through this game.

2nd Run Bakku - 3:46 (Before Might Helmet)
3rd Run Bakku - 3:21 (Before Might Helmet)
Hero: 20, Lufia: 19, Aguro: 18, Jerin: 21

2nd Run Carbis - 3:58 (Before Tower of Light)
3rd Run Bakku - 3:42 (Before Tower of Light, after Herat)
Hero: 21, Lufia: 20, Aguro: 19, Jerin: 21

Guardian
Hero: 21, Lufia: 21, Aguro: 19, Jerin: 21

[b]Harder to fight at these levels; took me 21 tries.  I was close to Hero: 22,

Lufia: 21, Aguro: 20, and Jerin: 22.  About 1500 EXP short.  I should aim for

those levels next time around.[/b]

2nd Run Linze - 4:10
3rd Run Linze - 3:54
Hero: 22, Lufia: 21, Aguro: 20, Jerin: 22

2nd Run Marse - 4:17 (Before Alumina Quest)
3rd Run Marse - 4:00 (Before Alumina Quest)
Hero: 22, Lufia: 22, Aguro: 20, Jerin: 22

Marse - 4:25

2nd Run Frederia - 4:51 (Before final Alumina)
3rd Run Frederia - 4:40 (Before Pirates)
Hero: 28, Lufia: 27, Aguro: 25, Jerin: 25

Marse - 5:02 (Before Pirates)
2nd Run Pirates - Hero: 29, Lufia: 28, Aguro: 26, Jerin: 26
3rd Run Pirates - Hero: 28, Lufia: 27, Aguro: 25, Jerin: 26

2nd Run Carbis - 5:22 (Before Dual Blade)
3rd Run Carbis - 4:56 (Before Dual Blade)

2nd Run Epro - 5:31 (Before Oil Cave)
3rd Run Epro - 5:06 (Before Oil Cave)

2nd Run Oil Dragon - Hero: 32, Aguro: 29, Lufia: 31, Jerin: 28
3rd Run Oil Dragon - Hero: 33, Aguro: 29, Lufia: 32, Jerin: 28

2nd Run Arubus - 5:52 (Before Glasdar Key)
3rd Run Arubus - 5:27 (Before Glasdar Key)

2nd Run Arubus - 6:02 (Before Glasdar Tower)
3rd Run Arubus - 5:35 (Before Gladar Tower)

Nazeby (1st run) - Hero: 39, Lufia: 38, Aguro: 36, Jerin: 33
Nazeby (2nd run) - Hero: 36, Lufia: 35, Aguro: 33, Jerin: 32
Nazeby (3rd run) - Hero: 36, Lufia: 35, Aguro: 33, Jerin: 32

2nd Run Old Man - 6:20 (Before Doom Island Fortress)
3rd Run Old Man - 5:46 (Before Doom Island Fortress)

2nd Run Gades - Hero: 37, Aguro: 34, Jerin: 33
3rd Run Gades - Hero: 36, Aguro: 33, Jerin: 32

2nd Run Amon - Hero: 38, Aguro: 35, Jerin: 33
2nd Run Amon - Hero: 37, Aguro: 34, Jerin: 33

2nd Run Daos - Hero: 39, Aguro: 36, Jerin: 34
2nd Run Daos - Hero: 38, Aguro: 35, Jerin: 34

2nd Run Guard Daos - Hero: 40, Aguro: 37, Jerin: 35, Lufia: 36
3rd Run Guard Daos - Hero: 39, Aguro: 36, Jerin: 34, Lufia: 35

Final Blow: 6:44
Loss of Player Control: 6:49
Post Credits Time: 6:53
Dead count: 0
Rakke Dead cnt: 4
Lufia Dead cnt: 12
Aguro Dead cnt: 7
Jerin Dead cnt: 7
Rest count: 34
Battle count: 368
Runaway count: 49
Boss lose cnt: 0
Opened Box: 345/655
Got item: 79/136

Post Credits Time: 6:23
Dead count: 0
Rakke Dead cnt: 11
Lufia Dead cnt: 10
Aguro Dead cnt: 10
Jerin Dead cnt: 4
Rest count: 26
Battle count: 388
Runaway count: 73
Boss lose cnt: 0
Opened Box: 294/655
Got item: 69/136

Brightstar

2006-02-28 04:43:44 pm

You've got my support.

http://homsinis.ytmnd.com/

DTaeKim

Edit history:

DTaeKim: 2006-02-28 09:20:52 pm

2006-02-28 06:42:06 pm

Heh. Interesting take.

The biggest change from the last run and this run was the Alumina route. I went for the Herat Alumina piece along with the Might Helmet. Then I went to the Tower of Light, Linze, then went for the remaining five pieces on the islands. I used two Foul Waters within Elba Island (IIRC, the one with the inn) to level up to the levels listed for Pirates.

Another change was the fact I decided to use the spell Statue against the Guardian. This was so Aguro and Hero could gain experience from that battle instead of sitting it out. As I noted earlier, I had more difficulty this time around, probably because I was one level lower than usual. I don't have this much difficulty since Jerin matches the Guardian's AGL action for action. This time around, however, the Guardian occasionally performed two actions for every action the girls did, which led to my premature demise.

What I did not do this time around was fight my usual two battles in order to gain enough experience to level against Nazeby. Usually, I level Jerin to 30 within the Glasdar Key cave, then warp to Herat and get my wish from the Egg Dragon. In this run, I ran from every subsequent battle. In my previous run, I fought two battles that earned me about 7000-9000 EXP, enough for a level up for Hero and Lufia against Nazeby. It's more of a precaution, and I think I don't need it. Besides, it looks more impressive when the levels of the team are less than 40.

The route is all but set, as I want to test whether or not I should get the Alumina pieces in Elba and Ulupp Islands before entering the Tower of Light. If I were to do this, I would probably have to divert to Frederia early to purchase the Grand Blade for Aguro. I also will powerbuild with the Foul Water found in Medan nearby the inn in Elba Island. At this point, I know that powerbuilding is necessary in order for me to keep pace in levels so Jerin reaches Level 30 RIGHT when I finish the Glasdar Key cave. The Grand Blade is necessary for Aguro to keep pace with Hero's damage, since the Great Axe is drastically weaker than the Carbo Sword Hero is using (53 ATK points lower, which is about 30-50 HP of damage depending on the enemy). The Foul Water found in Loire Island will also be used to powerlevel.

I also have to find out what triggers Brant's appearance on Loire Island. I'm fairly certain it is talking to the Doom Island Researcher, which means that I won't enter Loire Island until after the Tower of Light.

As for items, I probably won't diverge much from my route. As it stands, this was my inventory at the end of my 3rd practice run.

37 Smoke Balls (I probably should just buy 60 Smoke Balls in Bakku)
31 Sweet Water (I probably should buy 60 Sweet Water in Bakku along with the Smoke Balls)
6 Hi Magic
38 Ex Potions (I used 26 against Gades. Eep)
1 Awaken (won in a monster battle)
8 Hi Potions (leftovers from the Water Ghost battle)
4 Ex Magic
4 Revives
18 Miracles (16 used in total against the Sinistrals)
34 Power Gourd (27 used in total against the Sinistrals)
1 Magic Guard
4 Stone Cure (precaution in the area around Odel)
1 Antidote (won in a monster battle)
1 Grilled Newt (won in a monster battle)
1 Foul Water (won in a monster battle)
2 Spell Potions (um...)
1 Mystery Pin (found, precaution against Daos)
1 Purple Ring
1 Engage Ring
1 Green Ring

Heh.  Interesting take.

The biggest change from the last run and this run was the Alumina route.  I went for the Herat Alumina piece along with the Might Helmet.  Then I went to the Tower of Light, Linze, then went for the remaining five pieces on the islands.  I used two Foul Waters within Elba Island (IIRC, the one with the inn) to level up to the levels listed for Pirates.

Another change was the fact I decided to use the spell Statue against the Guardian.  This was so Aguro and Hero could gain experience from that battle instead of sitting it out.  As I noted earlier, I had more difficulty this time around, probably because I was one level lower than usual.  I don't have this much difficulty since Jerin matches the Guardian's AGL action for action.  This time around, however, the Guardian occasionally performed two actions for every action the girls did, which led to my premature demise.

What I did not do this time around was fight my usual two battles in order to gain enough experience to level against Nazeby.  Usually, I level Jerin to 30 within the Glasdar Key cave, then warp to Herat and get my wish from the Egg Dragon.  In this run, I ran from every subsequent battle.  In my previous run, I fought two battles that earned me about 7000-9000 EXP, enough for a level up for Hero and Lufia against Nazeby.  It's more of a precaution, and I think I don't need it.  Besides, it looks more impressive when the levels of the team are less than 40.

The route is all but set, as I want to test whether or not I should get the Alumina pieces in Elba and Ulupp Islands before entering the Tower of Light.  If I were to do this, I would probably have to divert to Frederia early to purchase the Grand Blade for Aguro.  I also will powerbuild  with the Foul Water found in Medan nearby the inn in Elba Island.  At this point, I know that powerbuilding is necessary in order for me to keep pace in levels so Jerin reaches Level 30 RIGHT when I finish the Glasdar Key cave.  The Grand Blade is necessary for Aguro to keep pace with Hero's damage, since the Great Axe is drastically weaker than the Carbo Sword Hero is using (53 ATK points lower, which is about 30-50 HP of damage depending on the enemy).  The Foul Water found in Loire Island will also be used to powerlevel.

I also have to find out what triggers Brant's appearance on Loire Island.  I'm fairly certain it is talking to the Doom Island Researcher, which means that I won't enter Loire Island until after the Tower of Light.

As for items, I probably won't diverge much from my route.  As it stands, this was my inventory at the end of my 3rd practice run.

37 Smoke Balls (I probably should just buy 60 Smoke Balls in Bakku)
31 Sweet Water (I probably should buy 60 Sweet Water in Bakku along with the Smoke Balls)
6 Hi Magic
38 Ex Potions (I used 26 against Gades.  Eep)
1 Awaken (won in a monster battle)
8 Hi Potions (leftovers from the Water Ghost battle)
4 Ex Magic
4 Revives
18 Miracles (16 used in total against the Sinistrals)
34 Power Gourd (27 used in total against the Sinistrals)
1 Magic Guard
4 Stone Cure (precaution in the area around Odel)
1 Antidote (won in a monster battle)
1 Grilled Newt (won in a monster battle)
1 Foul Water (won in a monster battle)
2 Spell Potions (um...)
1 Mystery Pin (found, precaution against Daos)
1 Purple Ring
1 Engage Ring
1 Green Ring

Mr_Nice_Guy

2006-03-01 11:08:11 pm

Battle Is My Forte

i did a little trial for Lufia 2 (even though im working on MMBN2) and got a time of 00:27 after getting Tia and saving in the town. Dont know if Lufia 2 is possible to beat in 7 hours but i will try after MMBN2.

Enhasa

2006-03-02 04:24:27 am

everybody wanna tell you the meaning of music

Quote:

I was going by the FAQ there. I have NO idea where those items are.

Oh, that was just copied from the FAQ's item list, I see. That makes a lot more sense.

I am quite sure that SDA times with the final hit and doesn't care that you have to hit A to text advance afterwards, so you can say that your current time is 6:14.

I'm gonna list how many minutes you are ahead at the comparable listed points:

Bakku: 25
Linze: 16
Marse: 17
Carbis: 26
Epro: 25
Arubus: 25
Arubus: 27
Doom Island: 34
End: 30

My point is, even though your levels are similar throughout, your relative time keeps on fluctuating, going up and down based on segment. This is all fine and dandy while you are making your test runs (and you should keep on doing them until you can't improve your time anymore), but for your recorded run, you should make sure that each segment goes basically as well as it has ever gone.

And it should be good enough that were you to redo the run, you would not be able to get a better time. When you're recording, redo each segment until it goes very well. This will mean that you will likely need to be using all three slots: you would load A, run a segment and save on B. Then load A and keep on running and saving on C until C is better than B, and so on.

Those stats look better than last time, but I'm wondering... how low can they go? Tongue

I actually especially liked that you were able to reduce your rest count from 34 to 26. That's always an underappreciated time saver, and 8 out of 34 is a lot of difference.

As an aside, the Statue spell is one of the things that makes Lufia (the game) awesome.

Ya, like I said, when you have Mirror, you're set for life.

About that inventory, before I jump to any false conclusions, that's from your final save right? Not after the game. I'll assume so, because then it doesn't look too shabby. Smiley

I guess I will respond to this:

Quote:

Basically, all of the items I pick up now are generally equipment and Miracles. I get all of the healing items in the early game because you can't predict when a particularly nasty hit may happen. This generally stops by the point I reach Belgen. Revives are still a priority for the most part. At the very least, I can sell my supply of them. I also stock Ex Potions to save money in the long run. The exception is the Old Cave; I get everything there because all of the chests are in close proximity.

You can't predict when a nasty hit may happen, but since this is segmented, you don't have to. When you actually record this, you can pick up less healing items and use the good luck to carry you through. Oh and when you said early, I was thinking early like Treck, not like Belgen. =/ That's like a third through the game.

It doesn't matter if you can sell them later, it's still bad to get extra items like Revives. Would you buy too many, then sell them off later? Of course not, that'd be awful. Well, finding too many and selling later is strictly even worse if you think about it.

I know what you mean about the Old Cave, but honestly if you pick up everything in there it'll be suboptimal and look sloppy. It doesn't matter if something is right next to you; if you don't need something, don't pick it up. FF2 is a much easier game than Lufia, but the point remains: a couple times all I had to do was face a different direction and hit A to pick up better armor, but I still didn't do it since it was unnecessary. So I'm certainly not feeling the Hi Potions and rods and things like that.

Keep up the good work! Years down the line, I still want you to think of this run as your masterpiece, so do a great job. Wink

[quote]I was going by the FAQ there.  I have NO idea where those items are.[/quote]
Oh, that was just copied from the FAQ's item list, I see. That makes a lot more sense.

I am quite sure that SDA times with the final hit and doesn't care that you have to hit A to text advance afterwards, so you can say that your current time is 6:14.

I'm gonna list how many minutes you are ahead at the comparable listed points:

Bakku: 25
Linze: 16
Marse: 17
Carbis: 26
Epro: 25
Arubus: 25
Arubus: 27
Doom Island: 34
End: 30

My point is, even though your levels are similar throughout, your relative time keeps on fluctuating, going up and down based on segment. This is all fine and dandy while you are making your test runs (and you should keep on doing them until you can't improve your time anymore), but for your recorded run, you should make sure that each segment goes basically as well as it has ever gone.

And it should be good enough that were you to redo the run, you would not be able to get a better time. When you're recording, redo each segment until it goes very well. This will mean that you will likely need to be using all three slots: you would load A, run a segment and save on B. Then load A and keep on running and saving on C until C is better than B, and so on.

Those stats look better than last time, but I'm wondering... how low can they go? :P I actually especially liked that you were able to reduce your rest count from 34 to 26. That's always an underappreciated time saver, and 8 out of 34 is a lot of difference.

As an aside, the Statue spell is one of the things that makes Lufia (the game) awesome.

Ya, like I said, when you have Mirror, you're set for life.

About that inventory, before I jump to any false conclusions, [i]that's from your final save right[/i]? Not after the game. I'll assume so, because then it doesn't look too shabby. :)

I guess I will respond to this:
[quote]Basically, all of the items I pick up now are generally equipment and Miracles.  I get all of the healing items in the early game because you can't predict when a particularly nasty hit may happen.  This generally stops by the point I reach Belgen.  Revives are still a priority for the most part.  At the very least, I can sell my supply of them.  I also stock Ex Potions to save money in the long run.  The exception is the Old Cave; I get everything there because all of the chests are in close proximity.[/quote]
You can't predict when a nasty hit may happen, but since this is segmented, you don't have to. When you actually record this, you can pick up less healing items and use the good luck to carry you through. Oh and when you said early, I was thinking early like Treck, not like Belgen. =/ That's like a third through the game.

It doesn't matter if you can sell them later, it's still bad to get extra items like Revives. Would you buy too many, then sell them off later? Of course not, that'd be awful. Well, finding too many and selling later is strictly even worse if you think about it.

I know what you mean about the Old Cave, but honestly if you pick up everything in there it'll be suboptimal and look sloppy. It doesn't matter if something is right next to you; if you don't need something, don't pick it up. FF2 is a much easier game than Lufia, but the point remains: a couple times all I had to do was face a different direction and hit A to pick up better armor, but I still didn't do it since it was unnecessary. So I'm certainly not feeling the Hi Potions and rods and things like that.

Keep up the good work! Years down the line, I still want you to think of this run as your masterpiece, so do a great job. ;)

Enhasa

Edit history:

Enhasa: 2006-03-02 04:40:59 am

2006-03-02 04:36:09 am

everybody wanna tell you the meaning of music

Quote:

i did a little trial for Lufia 2 (even though im working on MMBN2) and got a time of 00:27 after getting Tia and saving in the town. Dont know if Lufia 2 is possible to beat in 7 hours but i will try after MMBN2.

This may interest Dragondarch when it's time, but seeing this made me wonder what I could do.

Ownage! 12 minutes, first try, SS. I could maybe do 11. Oh yeah, and I got the Insect Crush while I was at it because you would want it for the coming parts. Here's a hint on how you probably could improve your time: imagine that instead of a monster hunter, Maxim was a... crocodile hunter!

1. Lufia 1 is less than 7 hours. See this thread.
2. Lufia 2 is faster to run than Lufia 1.
3. Lufia 2 is (much) less than 7 hours.

You don't have to level or even encounter regular enemies much in this game. I'm thinking it'd be closer to 4 hours than 7. And honestly, I think I'm being conservative. There's a TAS WIP btw, that stalled at the Ancient Cave. If I knew what the time for that was, I could give a better estimate.

[quote]i did a little trial for Lufia 2 (even though im working on MMBN2) and got a time of 00:27 after getting Tia and saving in the town. Dont know if Lufia 2 is possible to beat in 7 hours but i will try after MMBN2.[/quote]
This may interest Dragondarch when it's time, but seeing this made me wonder what I could do.

Ownage! 12 minutes, first try, SS. I could maybe do 11. Oh yeah, and I got the Insect Crush while I was at it because you would want it for the coming parts. Here's a hint on how you probably could improve your time: imagine that instead of a monster hunter, Maxim was a... crocodile hunter!

1. Lufia 1 is less than 7 hours. See this thread.
2. Lufia 2 is faster to run than Lufia 1.
3. Lufia 2 is (much) less than 7 hours.

You don't have to level or even encounter regular enemies much in this game. I'm thinking it'd be closer to 4 hours than 7. And honestly, I think I'm being conservative. There's a TAS WIP btw, that stalled at the Ancient Cave. If I knew what the time for that was, I could give a better estimate.

DTaeKim

2006-03-02 06:27:41 am

Quote:

Oh, that was just copied from the FAQ's item list, I see. That makes a lot more sense.

Indeed.

Quote:

I am quite sure that SDA times with the final hit and doesn't care that you have to hit A to text advance afterwards, so you can say that your current time is 6:14.

If that's the case, I'm going to aim for a sub 6-hour time. To think that before I thought sub-7 was going to be nigh-impossible.

Quote:

I'm gonna list how many minutes you are ahead at the comparable listed points:

Bakku: 25
Linze: 16
Marse: 17
Carbis: 26
Epro: 25
Arubus: 25
Arubus: 27
Doom Island: 34
End: 30

My point is, even though your levels are similar throughout, your relative time keeps on fluctuating, going up and down based on segment. This is all fine and dandy while you are making your test runs (and you should keep on doing them until you can't improve your time anymore), but for your recorded run, you should make sure that each segment goes basically as well as it has ever gone.

The loss of time saved at Bakku and Marse was a result of a route change. In the 3rd run, I went for the Herat Alumina piece. I think it saved me a bit of time, actually, since I don't have to use Warp twice and backtrack to Herat later. I'm still not done with experimenting on the route. On my next practice run, I'm going to see whether or not I should hold off getting 4 Alumina pieces until after the Tower of Light or before the Tower of Light. Both runs will make a diversion towards Frederia early to purchase the Grand Blade for Aguro. Defensive equipment can wait until before I go for the Pirates.

Quote:

And it should be good enough that were you to redo the run, you would not be able to get a better time. When you're recording, redo each segment until it goes very well. This will mean that you will likely need to be using all three slots: you would load A, run a segment and save on B. Then load A and keep on running and saving on C until C is better than B, and so on.

Then it's a good thing I bought 10 VCR tapes before I left for college in anticipation of a run. It wasn't this run, I can assure you that.

Quote:

Those stats look better than last time, but I'm wondering... how low can they go? Tongue

I actually especially liked that you were able to reduce your rest count from 34 to 26. That's always an underappreciated time saver, and 8 out of 34 is a lot of difference.

While the chests opened went down, as well as the rest count, my death count actually increased, although most of it was augmented by Gades. If he uses Undead to increase his ATK, the party will start dropping like flies.

Quote:

As an aside, the Statue spell is one of the things that makes Lufia (the game) awesome.

I never used it, until I suddenly thought of it for the Guardian. It wastes some time, as the animation is longer, but I think it pays off since I don't lose experience. If a person dies in a battle, it's wasted for the most part.

Quote:

About that inventory, before I jump to any false conclusions, that's from your final save right? Not after the game. I'll assume so, because then it doesn't look too shabby. Smiley

Yes, it is at the final save point. Not too bad, eh?

As for the healing items, I won't shrink from getting them. For starters, Hi Potions are almost a necessity in surviving the Follower, and arguably the Phantasm. Hi Magic is useful for avoiding inns as long as possible. Basically, a problem in the game is the gap between Potions and Hi Potions. Hi Potions cannot be bought until Surinagal, but since I skip the town entirely, effectively, I can't buy them until Jenoba. Potions only heal about 20 HP, which is not enough considering my HP is around 100-120 at that point for Hero and Aguro.

As for Revives, they are needed. Death will happen in a segment, and it usually does when I'm doing particularly well in terms of random battles (the riskier a battle, the better its rewards). I picked up about 21 Revives, and finished with 4.

As for the Old Cave, it does annoy me with the empty chests. It's far too difficult to commit them to memory, but I aim to make a map of each floor and find which items are in which chests and skip the rest, like the damn Sleep Arrow I keep picking up.

[quote]
Oh, that was just copied from the FAQ's item list, I see. That makes a lot more sense.[/quote]

Indeed.

[quote]I am quite sure that SDA times with the final hit and doesn't care that you have to hit A to text advance afterwards, so you can say that your current time is 6:14.[/quote]

If that's the case, I'm going to aim for a sub 6-hour time.  To think that before I thought sub-7 was going to be nigh-impossible.

[quote]I'm gonna list how many minutes you are ahead at the comparable listed points:

Bakku: 25
Linze: 16
Marse: 17
Carbis: 26
Epro: 25
Arubus: 25
Arubus: 27
Doom Island: 34
End: 30

My point is, even though your levels are similar throughout, your relative time keeps on fluctuating, going up and down based on segment. This is all fine and dandy while you are making your test runs (and you should keep on doing them until you can't improve your time anymore), but for your recorded run, you should make sure that each segment goes basically as well as it has ever gone.[/quote]

The loss of time saved at Bakku and Marse was a result of a route change.  In the 3rd run, I went for the Herat Alumina piece.  I think it saved me a bit of time, actually, since I don't have to use Warp twice and backtrack to Herat later.  I'm still not done with experimenting on the route.  On my next practice run, I'm going to see whether or not I should hold off getting 4 Alumina pieces until after the Tower of Light or before the Tower of Light.  Both runs will make a diversion towards Frederia early to purchase the Grand Blade for Aguro.  Defensive equipment can wait until before I go for the Pirates.

[quote]And it should be good enough that were you to redo the run, you would not be able to get a better time. When you're recording, redo each segment until it goes very well. This will mean that you will likely need to be using all three slots: you would load A, run a segment and save on B. Then load A and keep on running and saving on C until C is better than B, and so on.[/quote]

Then it's a good thing I bought 10 VCR tapes before I left for college in anticipation of a run.  It wasn't this run, I can assure you that.

[quote]Those stats look better than last time, but I'm wondering... how low can they go? :P I actually especially liked that you were able to reduce your rest count from 34 to 26. That's always an underappreciated time saver, and 8 out of 34 is a lot of difference.[/quote]

While the chests opened went down, as well as the rest count, my death count actually increased, although most of it was augmented by Gades.  If he uses Undead to increase his ATK, the party will start dropping like flies.

[quote]As an aside, the Statue spell is one of the things that makes Lufia (the game) awesome.[/quote]

I never used it, until I suddenly thought of it for the Guardian.  It wastes some time, as the animation is longer, but I think it pays off since I don't lose experience.    If a person dies in a battle, it's wasted for the most part.

[quote]About that inventory, before I jump to any false conclusions, [i]that's from your final save right[/i]? Not after the game. I'll assume so, because then it doesn't look too shabby. :)[/quote]

Yes, it is at the final save point.  Not too bad, eh?

As for the healing items, I won't shrink from getting them.  For starters, Hi Potions are almost a necessity in surviving the Follower, and arguably the Phantasm.  Hi Magic is useful for avoiding inns as long as possible.  Basically, a problem in the game is the gap between Potions and Hi Potions.  Hi Potions cannot be bought until Surinagal, but since I skip the town entirely, effectively, I can't buy them until Jenoba.  Potions only heal about 20 HP, which is not enough considering my HP is around 100-120 at that point for Hero and Aguro.

As for Revives, they are needed.  Death will happen in a segment, and it usually does when I'm doing particularly well in terms of random battles (the riskier a battle, the better its rewards).  I picked up about 21 Revives, and finished with 4.

As for the Old Cave, it does annoy me with the empty chests.  It's far too difficult to commit them to memory, but I aim to make a map of each floor and find which items are in which chests and skip the rest, like the damn Sleep Arrow I keep picking up.

Dragondarch

2006-03-02 09:36:32 am

Pudding%

Quote:

This may interest Dragondarch when it's time, but seeing this made me wonder what I could do.

Ownage! 12 minutes, first try, SS. I could maybe do 11. Oh yeah, and I got the Insect Crush while I was at it because you would want it for the coming parts. Here's a hint on how you probably could improve your time: imagine that instead of a monster hunter, Maxim was a... crocodile hunter!

1. Lufia 1 is less than 7 hours. See this thread.
2. Lufia 2 is faster to run than Lufia 1.
3. Lufia 2 is (much) less than 7 hours.

You don't have to level or even encounter regular enemies much in this game. I'm thinking it'd be closer to 4 hours than 7. And honestly, I think I'm being conservative. There's a TAS WIP btw, that stalled at the Ancient Cave. If I knew what the time for that was, I could give a better estimate.

Yeah, I'll be keeping that in mind when I get to it (after M&L). The only non-required rights I would think would be useful are the core fights on the overqorld map in certain areas (Reds near Parcelyte, and Nos near the final towers...don't remember where the others are ATM). Doing a short (luck manipulative) power-level segment on them may speed some bosses up.

[quote]
This may interest Dragondarch when it's time, but seeing this made me wonder what I could do.

Ownage! 12 minutes, first try, SS. I could maybe do 11. Oh yeah, and I got the Insect Crush while I was at it because you would want it for the coming parts. Here's a hint on how you probably could improve your time: imagine that instead of a monster hunter, Maxim was a... crocodile hunter!

1. Lufia 1 is less than 7 hours. See this thread.
2. Lufia 2 is faster to run than Lufia 1.
3. Lufia 2 is (much) less than 7 hours.

You don't have to level or even encounter regular enemies much in this game. I'm thinking it'd be closer to 4 hours than 7. And honestly, I think I'm being conservative. There's a TAS WIP btw, that stalled at the Ancient Cave. If I knew what the time for that was, I could give a better estimate.[/quote]

Yeah, I'll be keeping that in mind when I get to it (after M&L). The only non-required rights I would think would be useful are the core fights on the overqorld map in certain areas (Reds near Parcelyte, and Nos near the final towers...don't remember where the others are ATM). Doing a short (luck manipulative) power-level segment on them may speed some bosses up.

Mr_Nice_Guy

Edit history:

Mr_Nice_Guy: 2006-03-02 12:15:41 pm

2006-03-02 11:00:20 am

Battle Is My Forte

Quote:

This may interest Dragondarch when it's time, but seeing this made me wonder what I could do.

Ownage! 12 minutes, first try, SS. I could maybe do 11. Oh yeah, and I got the Insect Crush while I was at it because you would want it for the coming parts. Here's a hint on how you probably could improve your time: imagine that instead of a monster hunter, Maxim was a... crocodile hunter!

1. Lufia 1 is less than 7 hours. See this thread.
2. Lufia 2 is faster to run than Lufia 1.
3. Lufia 2 is (much) less than 7 hours.

You don't have to level or even encounter regular enemies much in this game. I'm thinking it'd be closer to 4 hours than 7. And honestly, I think I'm being conservative. There's a TAS WIP btw, that stalled at the Ancient Cave. If I knew what the time for that was, I could give a better estimate.

The difference is that i did the multi-battles to get the speed ring, which i think will be good for later battles.

EDIT: For when i reach Tanbel =>
Gonna buy 2 Kukri andd Flash, since Camu is weak against lightning attacks.
I think im gonna go up the tower twice at where you fought Camu. Fire dagger that with the Insect Crush will help a lot against the tarantula =P

Edit2: 1h03m after guy joins the team
with my speed i probably dont make less then 7 hours >_>

[quote]
This may interest Dragondarch when it's time, but seeing this made me wonder what I could do.

Ownage! 12 minutes, first try, SS. I could maybe do 11. Oh yeah, and I got the Insect Crush while I was at it because you would want it for the coming parts. Here's a hint on how you probably could improve your time: imagine that instead of a monster hunter, Maxim was a... crocodile hunter!

1. Lufia 1 is less than 7 hours. See this thread.
2. Lufia 2 is faster to run than Lufia 1.
3. Lufia 2 is (much) less than 7 hours.

You don't have to level or even encounter regular enemies much in this game. I'm thinking it'd be closer to 4 hours than 7. And honestly, I think I'm being conservative. There's a TAS WIP btw, that stalled at the Ancient Cave. If I knew what the time for that was, I could give a better estimate.[/quote]

The difference is that i did the multi-battles to get the speed ring, which i think will be good for later battles.

EDIT: For when i reach Tanbel =>
Gonna buy 2 Kukri andd Flash, since Camu is weak against lightning attacks.
I think im gonna go up the tower twice at where you fought Camu. Fire dagger that with the Insect Crush will help a lot against the tarantula =P

Edit2: 1h03m after guy joins the team
with my speed i probably dont make less then 7 hours >_>

Enhasa

2006-03-02 04:58:10 pm

everybody wanna tell you the meaning of music

Quote:

If that's the case, I'm going to aim for a sub 6-hour time. To think that before I thought sub-7 was going to be nigh-impossible.

Thank you! I'm so glad you said this yourself because I wanted to say it but didn't want to sound pushy. My initial thought was sub5 with core abuse, so sub6 without core abuse sounds right.

Good to see you're not satisfied yet with your route!

About the Old Cave, haven't you committed the rest of the game to memory? Wink

Quote:

Yeah, I'll be keeping that in mind when I get to it (after M&L). The only non-required rights I would think would be useful are the core fights on the overqorld map in certain areas (Reds near Parcelyte, and Nos near the final towers...don't remember where the others are ATM). Doing a short (luck manipulative) power-level segment on them may speed some bosses up.

If you need help vs Idura (hardest fight in the game but I doubt it), the Reds would be useful. No point in fighting Nos since by that point every fight is cake.

More details when it's time but here are some general points:
1) No leveling.
2) No Ancient Cave.
3) No capsule monsters.
4) Redo segments until you get useful drops such as Catfish Jewel. This sounds kinda crazy but there are people who do this for normal play, so it can't be that bad.
5) This is what I am referring to by "crocodile hunter" btw. Use items when they're better. Boomerang fucking owns everyone at the beginning of the game.
6) Don't get the chests that involve, say, doing a 1 minute puzzle to get. Battles are pretty fast in this game anyway.
7) Two people to talk to: quietkane at bisqwit's, who did a good TAS WIP up to the Ancient Cave, and relnqshd at gamefaqs, who is a romhacker who could tell you all the formulas and everything you ever wanted to know about this game.

From trying out the beginning, I realize that running Lufia 2 will require a lot of route planning just within dungeons to optimize them. It'll also require a lot of play skill since Maxim moves so fast and you need to be able to do the puzzles quickly, make sure you stun enemies instead of meeting them, and so on. And of course there's the normal RPG macro level planning. It seems like it'd all be real fun though.

One more thing before I forget. I said this somewhere else, but I'll say it again. After Dragondarch does a Normal game run, I will try a Gift mode run (i.e. from scratch) of the Ancient Cave. Don't expect anywhere near perfection because this is obviously one of the most random things ever, and definitely on SDA. (I can do 5 minutes with massive save state abuse on ZSNES heh.) Oh and before anyone asks I will do the suicide vs Master Jelly. That seems like a given to me but I bet someone would ask.

Quote:

The difference is that i did the multi-battles to get the speed ring, which i think will be good for later battles.

12 and 27 is a lot of difference. The Speed Ring does not take anywhere near 15 minutes, and there is no way that it is worth getting either.

Besides skipping Speed Ring, I'm assuming I also gained time from:
1) faster play
2) more optimized route
3) lower levels (did Big Catfish at 5; I had to fight the frog right before him to get to 5)
4) Boomerangs! (kills Lizard Man in 2 hits, Catfish in 4 hits)

[quote]If that's the case, I'm going to aim for a sub 6-hour time.  To think that before I thought sub-7 was going to be nigh-impossible.[/quote]
Thank you! I'm so glad you said this yourself because I wanted to say it but didn't want to sound pushy. My initial thought was sub5 with core abuse, so sub6 without core abuse sounds right.

Good to see you're not satisfied yet with your route!

About the Old Cave, haven't you committed the rest of the game to memory? ;)

[quote]Yeah, I'll be keeping that in mind when I get to it (after M&L). The only non-required rights I would think would be useful are the core fights on the overqorld map in certain areas (Reds near Parcelyte, and Nos near the final towers...don't remember where the others are ATM). Doing a short (luck manipulative) power-level segment on them may speed some bosses up.[/quote]
If you need help vs Idura (hardest fight in the game but I doubt it), the Reds would be useful. No point in fighting Nos since by that point every fight is cake.

More details when it's time but here are some general points:
1) No leveling.
2) No Ancient Cave.
3) No capsule monsters.
4) Redo segments until you get useful drops such as Catfish Jewel. This sounds kinda crazy but there are people who do this for normal play, so it can't be that bad.
5) This is what I am referring to by "crocodile hunter" btw. Use items when they're better. Boomerang fucking owns everyone at the beginning of the game.
6) Don't get the chests that involve, say, doing a 1 minute puzzle to get. Battles are pretty fast in this game anyway.
7) Two people to talk to: quietkane at bisqwit's, who did a good TAS WIP up to the Ancient Cave, and relnqshd at gamefaqs, who is a romhacker who could tell you all the formulas and everything you ever wanted to know about this game.

From trying out the beginning, I realize that running Lufia 2 will require a lot of route planning just within dungeons to optimize them. It'll also require a lot of play skill since Maxim moves so fast and you need to be able to do the puzzles quickly, make sure you stun enemies instead of meeting them, and so on. And of course there's the normal RPG macro level planning. It seems like it'd all be real fun though.

One more thing before I forget. I said this somewhere else, but I'll say it again. After Dragondarch does a Normal game run, I will try a Gift mode run (i.e. from scratch) of the Ancient Cave. Don't expect anywhere near perfection because this is obviously one of the most random things ever, and definitely on SDA. (I can do 5 minutes with massive save state abuse on ZSNES heh.) Oh and before anyone asks I will do the suicide vs Master Jelly. That seems like a given to me but I bet someone would ask.

[quote]The difference is that i did the multi-battles to get the speed ring, which i think will be good for later battles.[/quote]
12 and 27 is a lot of difference. The Speed Ring does not take anywhere near 15 minutes, and there is [i]no way[/i] that it is worth getting either.

Besides skipping Speed Ring, I'm assuming I also gained time from:
1) faster play
2) more optimized route
3) lower levels (did Big Catfish at 5; I had to fight the frog right before him to get to 5)
4) Boomerangs! (kills Lizard Man in 2 hits, Catfish in 4 hits)

Mr_Nice_Guy

Edit history:

Mr_Nice_Guy: 2006-03-02 05:15:16 pm

2006-03-02 05:13:30 pm

Battle Is My Forte

same levels as you, only i didnt used boomerangs...
probably would have shaved of quite some minutes...

And i play the Dutch version (which means some english words become bigger in Dutch, making conversations longer)

DTaeKim

Edit history:

DTaeKim: 2006-03-03 03:12:44 am

2006-03-02 10:54:22 pm

This fourth run will be my be-all, end-all practice run. I will optimize everything, and write everything down in anticipation for my Lufia and the Fortress of Doom run when I get home for Spring Break, assuming my SNES doesn't give up the ghost in the meantime.

I've only done the introduction, but I finished the Sinistrals with 13 minutes elapsed, and 15 minutes after I have done my usual duties in Alekia. So far, so good.

EDIT: I just got 14 minutes at the save. However, it turns to 15 minutes right after I load the save, so it's pretty much 15 minutes.