How to bypass HDCP for use with Blackmagic Intensity (PS3 owners, read here!)

MrLonghair

Edit history:

MrLonghair: 2014-01-24 03:18:20 am

MrLonghair: 2014-01-24 03:14:30 am

2014-01-24 03:02:16 am

Audio-guy. twitchtv:ohgoddamnit

Oh for the love of.. thank you fro getting me the information blizzz and the gang. I can give 1080p60 PS4 and PS3 to my HDPVR2 and it'll record to 1080p30, as broken and unreliable it is to use it looks like I'm sticking with that and putting the spare hundred I have in my budget for this into savings for a 512. Tricky business for us who need internal 1080p60 input in realtime.

USB3 box that relies on a computer for encoding: http://sknet-eshop.com/SHOP/4515692002752.html 20k yen, HDMI passthrough. http://www.sknet-web.co.jp/product/mvxu3r/index.html
Requires a computer that isn't getting hogged down by hungry software. Argh.

More on that box: http://www18.atwiki.jp/live2ch/pages/384.html (in Japanese, sorry. From impressions on youtube, nicovideo, twitter it seems it's really rather great.)
They make sure to tell you on the wiki that 1080p60 still isn't guaranteed stable and reliable. Fffffff

Andrew_Mills

Edit history:

Andrew_Mills: 2014-01-24 03:23:05 am

2014-01-24 03:15:26 am

AlphaStrategyGui des.com

How easy/reliable is it to buy from a Japanese site? I'm quite a fan of the UK Long Distance Selling regulations in case it doesn't work right or isn't up to scratch for any other reason.

http://www.sknet-web.co.jp/product/mvxu3r/specification.html

http://www.solarisjapan.com/sc-512n1-l-dvi-component-hd-and-dvi-capture-board/

Cost isn't the biggest issue as it's a tax-deductible business expense. I'm just wondering if the internal is as 'futureproofed' as you can get for 1080p?

@TheThrillness: You have the SC-512N1 don't you? (According to your feedback on their site). Does it handle everything great and can I use my own codecs? Also, what software can I use to record? AmaRecTV and others?

TheThrillness

Edit history:

TheThrillness: 2014-01-24 03:34:21 am

2014-01-24 03:30:59 am

thethrillness.blogspot.com

Quote from Andrew_Mills:

How easy/reliable is it to buy from a Japanese site?

It's easy to buy but like you said, I don't even know how the returns process would be. I've been communicating with Startech so we wouldn't have to put up with that.

This card has also went under the radar: http://www.ebay.com/itm/Pcie-HDMI-DVI-Component-AV-S-1080p60hz-video-grabber-Timeleak-HD100C-/171156197483?pt=US_Video_Capture_TV_Tuner_Cards&hash=item27d9b4506b

You at least have the added benefit there of Ebay protection.

Andrew, it's DirectShow so everything you asked works. Smiley

Edit - As for futureproof, I think Gen2 on motherboards will be around for a very long time.

Andrew_Mills

Edit history:

Andrew_Mills: 2014-01-24 03:45:25 am

2014-01-24 03:43:39 am

AlphaStrategyGui des.com

The Timeleak is only PCIe X1 (200MB/s) so is that actually sufficient for 1080p60? What's the datarate when using x264vfw lossless at 1080p60? (The codec you seem to recommend for 1080p60).

Thinking about it, I have automatic section 76 protection if I buy anything over £100 with a credit card, so that's not as big a problem as I first thought.

TheThrillness

2014-01-24 04:01:09 am

thethrillness.blogspot.com

Quote from Andrew_Mills:

The Timeleak is only PCIe X1 (200MB/s) so is that actually sufficient for 1080p60?

Good catch. It says it does but I highly doubt 200Mb/s is enough for raw preview. I'd stay away until there is actually proof.

I clocked the highest data rate of x264vfw at about 95MB/s so you can JUST get away with one really fast drive. It's absolute pants for editing though as I think it has no key frames so seeking in Vegas takes like 8 seconds.

I've thought about starting up a blog about games, video capture etc so I think I will do a real full proper 1080p60 test soon and then post it up with all the main codecs (Lagarith, Huffyuv, UT and x264vfw).

Andrew_Mills

2014-01-24 04:08:28 am

AlphaStrategyGui des.com

That'd be massively appreciated. Whilst the Elgato and my Stripper is still a reasonable solution just now, I do need to consider an option that offers easy editing as I use the Adobe Creative Suite (Pro/AE etc), so ease of editing is essential. I'm finding out using PlayClaw isn't that great as the MJPEG codec it's using isn't up to the task and that FRAPS at least is easy to edit and the compressed version seems to work better than the MJPEG to h264 conversion that I'm working with at the minute.

MrLonghair

2014-01-24 04:46:01 am

Audio-guy. twitchtv:ohgoddamnit

Conflicting reports on the internet as I search again. About PEXHDCAP, SC-500-N1:
1) Can it receive 1080p60 input, or does it black out? (HDMI)
2) Can it display it in something like Amarec or its own software, or does it black out? (HDMI)

I'm mostly streaming, taking still images, not exactly having the need for full 1080p60 recordings yet. I just want to dump this HDPVR2 on some poorer soul.

Andrew_Mills

2014-01-24 05:39:25 am

AlphaStrategyGui des.com

So what's the best compromise on a codec that offers reasonable CPU/disk use (I have 2 x 2TB 7,200RPM HD's in RAID0) and supports multiple reference frames for ease of editing?

My knowledge of P/B/I-frames is somewhat lacking (as that was always more advanced than I needed to know); but it's sounding like I might need to educate myself to a higher level for work purposes.

TheThrillness

2014-01-24 05:50:19 am

thethrillness.blogspot.com

Oh if you have a RAID0 and more than like a Sandybridge i5 then Lagarith in YUY2 mode is the way to go. Its editing is like frame responsive in Vegas (so I expect it is the same for AE etc).

I only ever tried x264vfw in Ultra fast mode but if you lower the preset I think it will start to introduce reference frames which will make it easier for editing but obviously the CPU load will increase.

Andrew_Mills

2014-01-24 05:53:07 am

AlphaStrategyGui des.com

I have the Ivy Bridge i5-3570k and 16GB DDR3 1600MHz of RAM, so my system is reasonably decent.

blizzz

2014-01-24 06:14:47 am

Quote from MrLonghair:

Conflicting reports on the internet as I search again. About PEXHDCAP, SC-500-N1:
1) Can it receive 1080p60 input, or does it black out? (HDMI)
2) Can it display it in something like Amarec or its own software, or does it black out? (HDMI)

I've got the SC-500N1, but the PEXHDCAP seems to be 100% identical.
1) No image with 1080p60 input
2) Works very well with Amarec or the original software, or really anything that supports DirectShow. The programmer of AmarecTV uses Micomsoft cards.

For the importing questions: Afaik Micomsoft doesn't respond to hardware problems unless you're in Japan. Solaris-Japan offers a 6 month warranty. (though shipping costs might be high and you might have to pay custom taxes multiple times)
For someone in Germany the SC-512N1-L from Solaris would cost 314,38€ (239,48€ + 24,70 shipping + 50,20 sales tax + 0 customs).

Another thing to keep in mind with the Micomsoft cards is that the driver disables the C1 state. That means that your CPU will run at full clock speed while you're using the card. Sometimes it doesn't reset after you quit recording and you have to manually reset your PC's power settings.

[quote="MrLonghair"]Conflicting reports on the internet as I search again. About PEXHDCAP, SC-500-N1:
1) Can it receive 1080p60 input, or does it black out? (HDMI)
2) Can it display it in something like Amarec or its own software, or does it black out? (HDMI)[/quote]

I've got the SC-500N1, but the PEXHDCAP seems to be 100% identical.
1) No image with 1080p60 input
2) Works very well with Amarec or the original software, or really anything that supports DirectShow. The programmer of AmarecTV uses Micomsoft cards.

For the importing questions: Afaik Micomsoft doesn't respond to hardware problems unless you're in Japan.  Solaris-Japan offers a 6 month warranty. (though shipping costs might be high and you might have to pay custom taxes multiple times)
For someone in Germany the SC-512N1-L from Solaris would cost 314,38€ (239,48€ + 24,70 shipping + 50,20 sales tax + 0 customs).

Another thing to keep in mind with the Micomsoft cards is that the driver disables the C1 state. That means that your CPU will run at full clock speed while you're using the card. Sometimes it doesn't reset after you quit recording and you have to manually reset your PC's power settings.

TheThrillness

Edit history:

TheThrillness: 2014-02-04 05:57:20 pm

2014-01-29 12:23:14 pm

thethrillness.blogspot.com

Andrew, I put up a quick 1080p60 post on my new blog.

http://www.thethrillness.com/2014/01/1080p60-lossless-capture.html

Hopefully this helps.

Andrew_Mills

Edit history:

Andrew_Mills: 2014-02-01 06:07:02 am

Andrew_Mills: 2014-02-01 06:06:22 am

2014-02-01 05:48:37 am

AlphaStrategyGui des.com

Quote from TheThrillness:

Andrew, I put up a quick 1080p60 post on my new blog.

http://www.thethrillness.com/2014/01/lossless-capture-for-1080p60-video.html

Hopefully this helps.

Thanks, here's an answer to your last question:

Quote from TheThrillness:

There is however one issue though if you do take the 1080p60 and x264vfw route. Editing the captured file is very laggy in Sony Vegas (it was taking about 10 seconds to seek to a different part of the video). Maybe other programs such as Adobe After Effects will be much better.

Premier Pro took well over 30 seconds to find any image when using x264vfw (and my rig was built with video editing in mind), so it's a completely useless codec where editing is concerned. For pure archiving purposes though, it's amazing and will keep file sizes ultra low. Probably good for screenshots, but as I said, waste of time for editing.

Are there any lossy codecs that can offer near lossless with better CPU results at 1080p60? (Such as a MJPEG codec)?

Great blog btw, great reading. Think I'll be upgrading soon. One quick question though: You state the Micomsoft drivers for the SC-512N1 lock your CPU to 100% and thus increase the temp. What sort of increases are we talking about? I've got a Hypercooler aftermarket cooler on my CPU, so - in theory - it should keep those temps right down. Is the workaround you offer something you have to do for every capture? Or just a once off in the power management screen?

[quote="TheThrillness"]Andrew, I put up a quick 1080p60 post on my new blog.

http://www.thethrillness.com/2014/01/lossless-capture-for-1080p60-video.html

Hopefully this helps.[/quote]
Thanks, here's an answer to your last question:

[quote="TheThrillness"]There is however one issue though if you do take the 1080p60 and x264vfw route. Editing the captured file is very laggy in Sony Vegas (it was taking about 10 seconds to seek to a different part of the video). Maybe other programs such as Adobe After Effects will be much better.[/quote]
Premier Pro took well over 30 seconds to find any image when using x264vfw (and my rig was built with video editing in mind), so it's a completely useless codec where editing is concerned. For pure archiving purposes though, it's amazing and will keep file sizes ultra low. Probably good for screenshots, but as I said, waste of time for editing.

Are there any lossy codecs that can offer near lossless with better CPU results at 1080p60? (Such as a MJPEG codec)?

Great blog btw, great reading. Think I'll be upgrading soon. One quick question though: You state the Micomsoft drivers for the SC-512N1 lock your CPU to 100% and thus increase the temp. What sort of increases are we talking about? I've got a Hypercooler aftermarket cooler on my CPU, so - in theory - it should keep those temps right down. Is the workaround you offer something you have to do for every capture? Or just a once off in the power management screen?

TheThrillness

2014-02-01 07:56:31 am

thethrillness.blogspot.com

I put up a review for the Micomsoft SC-512 here (includes screenshots and sample videos): http://www.thethrillness.com/2014/01/micomsoft-sc-512n1-ldvi-capture-card.html

I also partnered with solarisjapan so my readers get a special discount on purchasing the capture card from solarisjapan. All links and information in the blog post. Wink

Hey Andrew, yeah the editing is a big concern. It's unfortunate to know Premier Pro is even worse.

Quote from Andrew_Mills:

Are there any lossy codecs that can offer near lossless with better CPU results at 1080p60? (Such as a MJPEG codec)?

I've not tried any lossy codecs yet but I had a good idea yesterday. We might still be able to use x264vfw in lossy mode. I'll have to do more experimenting but what I did was set the QP value to 5. This nearly halved the peak bit rate I was seeing in lossless mode with x264vfw. The best thing is that when running objective comparisons the QP 5 screenshots were showing 99.7% similarity to the lossless screenshots (basically you could not tell a difference).

What we might be able to do is find a QP value that is still like 99% similar to lossless that allows us to easily lower the preset which will hopefully allow easier editing. I'll spend some time today doing practical work with it.

Quote from Andrew_Mills:

You state the Micomsoft drivers for the SC-512N1 lock your CPU to 100% and thus increase the temp. What sort of increases are we talking about? I've got a Hypercooler aftermarket cooler on my CPU, so - in theory - it should keep those temps right down. Is the workaround you offer something you have to do for every capture? Or just a once off in the power management screen?

I have my CPU on stock speeds and a low voltage so my temperature increases are like 5-6 degrees when the 100% comes into effect. Basically you have to do it every time you access the card. If you're just doing a quick session with AmaRecTV then I don't bother as once you quit AmaRec, the CPU will go back to normal. It's only if I am doing long sessions that I bother to do the power management stuff.

I put up a review for the Micomsoft SC-512 here (includes screenshots and sample videos): http://www.thethrillness.com/2014/01/micomsoft-sc-512n1-ldvi-capture-card.html

I also partnered with solarisjapan so my readers get a special discount on purchasing the capture card from solarisjapan. All links and information in the blog post. ;)

Hey Andrew, yeah the editing is a big concern. It's unfortunate to know Premier Pro is even worse.

[quote="Andrew_Mills"]
Are there any lossy codecs that can offer near lossless with better CPU results at 1080p60? (Such as a MJPEG codec)?
[/quote]

I've not tried any lossy codecs yet but I had a good idea yesterday. We might still be able to use x264vfw in lossy mode. I'll have to do more experimenting but what I did was set the QP value to 5. This nearly halved the peak bit rate I was seeing in lossless mode with x264vfw. The best thing is that when running objective comparisons the QP 5 screenshots were showing 99.7% similarity to the lossless screenshots (basically you could not tell a difference).

What we might be able to do is find a QP value that is still like 99% similar to lossless that allows us to easily lower the preset which will hopefully allow easier editing. I'll spend some time today doing practical work with it.

[quote="Andrew_Mills"]
You state the Micomsoft drivers for the SC-512N1 lock your CPU to 100% and thus increase the temp. What sort of increases are we talking about? I've got a Hypercooler aftermarket cooler on my CPU, so - in theory - it should keep those temps right down. Is the workaround you offer something you have to do for every capture? Or just a once off in the power management screen?
[/quote]

I have my CPU on stock speeds and a low voltage so my temperature increases are like 5-6 degrees when the 100% comes into effect. Basically you have to do it every time you access the card. If you're just doing a quick session with AmaRecTV then I don't bother as once you quit AmaRec, the CPU will go back to normal. It's only if I am doing long sessions that I bother to do the power management stuff.

TheThrillness

2014-02-02 02:59:16 pm

thethrillness.blogspot.com

Getting way off topic here but I guess people will want to know this since they will have splitters capable of 1080p60. Wink

So basically, x264vfw and editing might not be a lost cause after all. I realized you could use command line features so what I did was mess with the --keyint values which from what I understand will insert more I frames and improve seeking. The default value is 250 so I went to something crazy like "--keyint 10" and the resulting file has nearly perfect seeking in Vegas. Playback is really bad though (but even my media players can't handle such high bit rate video).

I tried --keyint 60 and similar but they aren't as good as 10. Andrew, can you try setting --keyint 10 and see what you experience in Premier Pro? If you get good results I'll write another blog post about "editable" files and combine it with good lossy codec settings for x264vfw (not going above 400 Mb/s or something).

Andrew_Mills

2014-02-03 07:53:43 am

AlphaStrategyGui des.com

Like this you mean? (I've never needed to use command lines before):

TheThrillness

2014-02-03 09:21:15 am

thethrillness.blogspot.com

Yip, that's it. Tell me how you get on.

Andrew_Mills

Edit history:

Andrew_Mills: 2014-02-09 07:16:32 am

Andrew_Mills: 2014-02-09 07:16:27 am

2014-02-09 07:16:05 am

AlphaStrategyGui des.com

Quote from TheThrillness:

Yip, that's it. Tell me how you get on.

USed DXtory to test and with Output mode set to *VFW* Premier Pro WILL NOT recognise it or support it (so file mode *must* be used for Pro to even acknowledge it).

Also had to change colour space to convert to YUV for VLC to see it. Then I tried it in Pro with the keyint value and it doesn't bring anything up after 60 seconds (even though the video works fine in VLC). Huh?

Looks like this codec simply isn't for me when it comes to video editing Sad

TheThrillness

Edit history:

TheThrillness: 2014-02-10 01:33:18 am

TheThrillness: 2014-02-10 01:32:04 am

TheThrillness: 2014-02-10 01:31:00 am

2014-02-10 01:30:09 am

thethrillness.blogspot.com

I've read that x264vfw should have its VFW FourCC changed to x264 (it's defaulted to H264) when importing into Sony Vegas or similar. This guy seems to also use the x264 FourCC trick for your editing program (about 2:56 into the video):

I've never had to do that myself (H264 worked fine) so I wonder if it is codec dependent and what you have installed on your computer.

Also I had great success with 1080p60 over USB 2 data rates: http://www.thethrillness.com/2014/02/1080p60-capture-over-usb-2.html

Andrew_Mills

2014-02-10 12:39:39 pm

AlphaStrategyGui des.com

Thanks for that but still no joy, unless I convert the DXTory video in Handbrake first (no need to change intkey values either). Once converted in HB it'll run perfectly fine in Pro with perfect seeking. Still, VLC sees it so it's good for screenshots and then just needs compressed using HB for editing purposes. Shame it just won't work first time in Pro CS 6 Sad

TheThrillness

2014-02-10 12:57:46 pm

thethrillness.blogspot.com

I never really considered this but since you mentioned it I may as well try one last thing for you. Do you only use VLC for video playback? If so, I might have a solution. As you may know, VLC uses its own codecs for playback. I doubt Premier Pro has access to these.

It's a long shot but I would try installing a good codec pack (I highly recommend this one): http://haruhichan.com/forum/showthread.php?7545-KCP-Kawaii-Codec-Pack

That might get Premier Pro to see the x264 decoder globally. If you install that and it still fails in CS 6, I'll "acquire" it myself and see what I can do. I love a good problem.

Andrew_Mills

2014-02-10 01:18:57 pm

AlphaStrategyGui des.com

I mainly use VLC for grabbing screenshots from my lossless videos for our guides. But I might switch to YUA (more-so if nate can add in the ability to save to somewhere other than the desktop)...

I'll try that codec pack now anyways. Thanks again for the help Smiley

TheThrillness

2014-02-10 01:40:47 pm

thethrillness.blogspot.com

Sorry bro, don't bother. It doesn't work (tried to import myself).

I found the fix though. Looks like Premiere doesn't like x264 in AVI container. You gotta convert to MP4 first (very quick using FFMpeg). Found out from a YouTube comment on that above video (who would have guessed). I attached the folder with it all set up. Just stick your AVI video in the same folder and double click avi2mp4. Should import fine now.

Attachment:

avi2mp4.rar

Andrew_Mills

2014-02-10 04:15:30 pm

AlphaStrategyGui des.com

Well that makes some sense I suppose. Wish we could save it to a .mp4 container in DXTory. I assume the avi2mp4 converter is quick? As HB is pretty damn quick at doing it too.

TheThrillness

2014-02-11 01:37:23 am

thethrillness.blogspot.com

It took me 1:45 to convert a 5:36 1080p60 video with avi2mp4 (200 fps encoding speed it said). In Handbrake I chose MPEG-4 so I could CQP 1. It took like 5 minutes. The avi2mp4 route is the fastest by far but the problem is it also spits out AAC audio. The Handbrake video transcoded the PCM to AC3.

I even tried AVIDemux but you can't have PCM audio in an MP4 container (I guess that is why avi2mp4 is set up to do that). You can however mux x264 video with PCM audio into .mkv or .mov but again Premeire hates this.

Basically you are really screwed if you use Premiere. Tongue