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ktwo: 2021-02-14 09:51:50 am
My feelings on The Demon Rush
Game Page: Doesn't exist yet

'ktwo's PAL run

Verifier Responses

Quote:
Solomon's Key verification
Audio/Visual:  Fine.  Does have the false start the runner mentioned.  Make sure Nate knows about it when he does his magic (if the runner doesn't do it himself).
No cheating detected.

Individual rooms:

Room 1:

Perfect as it should be for the first room.

Room 2:

At first glance, it seems taking the time to break the block near the key would be slower than dropping off the other side of the block directly below the key, but Dana doesn't land on the block, so it works out fine.

Room 3:

Nice use of the block on the ghost.  First of many close to death jumps.

Room 4:

Nothing much to comment on.

Room 5:

I hated this room as a kid playing it.  Couldn't figure it out.  Nice fireball cancellation.

Room 6:  Manipulation the first row of ghosts is great since the timing has Dana fall right behind the other ghosts. Has to wait a small bit to hit the exit.  Fireballs are all rationed out.  Picking up a fireball to be used doesn't seem likely.


Room 7:

First warp here.  Going up the right seems so obvious now watching it being played.  I was a fool always going left.

Room 13:

Why did the programmers decide on skipping six levels?

Anyway.  the block on the left dragon spawn really seems dangerous.  Having to avoid the flame and the ghost.  I found the time between dragon spawns on that room was somewhat random on my playthroughs.  If that's the case, a second could be gained from Dana having to wait for a dragon to clear.  Maybe that's what the runner means about scaling faster?

Room 14:

Easy level.  Annoying, but easy.

Room 15:

Next warp.  Nice manipulation of where the dragons go.

Room 21:

This room really starts to show the many times the runner uses Dana's spacing to be fast and stay alive. Breaking the above block while standing one square to the left.

Room 22:

Edge platforming reminds me of the Air Man stage in Mega Man 2.

Room 23:

Next warp.  Dana can be a little difficult to handle while in air.  Once again, using spacing to create a block in the same column Dana is in.

Room 29:

Can't say much here.  Can't find fault.

Room 30:

Splendid.  Outstanding room

Room 31:

Next warp.

This room has me wondering if can be done faster.  The runner will do this later in the run, too.  First, Dana has to jump up one and right two to avoid the flame. He does so at 9380 on the life meter.  Because the flame is there, he cannot create a block to simply walk over to the gray block and jump on it.  However, he has to have the right step or Dana will hit the gray block two spaces above the orange block.  He does so, showing that this jump is possible.  However, for the remainder of the stage, he does drop the block underneath to make the jump easy.  If the jump is possible, can't time be taken off this stage?  There are 11 instances where the block could have been avoided.

Room 37:

Makes this room look like it should be Room 2.

Room 38:

A couple possible jumps I mentioned in Room 31, but a great stage anyway.

Room 39:

Next warp.  Nice climbing.  Does spend the time getting the fireball.

Room 45:

Solid.  No complaints here.

Room 46:

The big mistake happens.  Almost kills him.  That fall to catch the block is harder than you may think.

Room 47:

A small mistake clicking a gray block, but it's minor.

Room 48:

I like the half break of the block.  A few jumps similar to Room 31.  Long room.  Hard to see a faster way.  Unlikely.

Final room:

Waiting for the ghost does take time, but it's the final room.  Caution is understandable.  Same with the mirror.

Verdict:

I go into judging the run thinking, "Is this comparable to other runs on site?"  For a run like this, route means just as much as execution.  I didn't see anything other than a type of jump that could be improved with the tricks known to the runner.  The route is solid.  Nothing glaring that could be improved.  With new tricks, maybe in the future it could be improved, but as far as the strategy is concerned, no way could I reject it.  And as far as execution, there are only three really noticeable mistakes.  Time loss is fairly minimal, so I can't see a reason to reject on that end, especially for a new game to SDA.

Accept.


Quote:
Audio/Video: No problems, save what was already mentioned.

Gameplay:
Ahh, Solomon's Key...I remember this game tormenting my childhood with some of it's twisted rooms. But enough reminiscing - there's a run to verified here!

I plugged in my copy (NTSC version) and tested out a few things, namely being able to jump from corridors that are only one block high without bumping Dana's head. It definitely seems like there are some tricks that can be performed on the NTSC version that didn't look like they'd be possible on the PAL version (especially after watching this run). I'd also forgotten how finicky the controls can be sometimes...

Room-by-room analysis:

Room 1: Looks fine, but since I know you can jump from the edge of a tunnel without Dana hitting his head, why doesn't he do that to grab the key? I thought it looked a little slow the way he did it. It probably doesn't actually affect the time any and I'm just being paranoid, but it just seemed to me that it may have been slightly faster (< 1 second)

Room 2: Flawless.

Room 3: This room shows just how much planning can go into this game. Very tight execution by the runner. Another flawless room.

Room 4: Good demonstration of knowledge of hit boxes. The runner says he couldn't find a way to get around that Sparkball on the PAL version, and I'm going to take his word for it. It IS possible on the NTSC version as I was able to do it fine on my first try.

Room 5: Flawless in my eye.

Room 6: More tight execution. Flawless again.

Room 7: Some slight execution errors that the runner already acknowledges. Great otherwise.

Room 13: The runner mentions a possible faster way to ascend the center shaft, but couldn't explain it well. I think I see how it would work, but his execution would have to be perfect (I'd wager almost down to the frame). He admits also that not picking up the Crystal of Rad cost him time later on, which I can also see. Other than those, though, his execution was spot on and his jumps were pretty much perfect. The only other thing I saw was some slight fudging of the controls right before picking up the key.
EDIT: He mentions that the japanese run grabs one of the bottles at the start to change enemy spawns. I just tried it out, and it doesn't change the spawns per se, but rather skips every other spawn so long as the initial 2 enemies both drop an item. I believe it's a "too many objects on-screen" issue. It does make the ascension quite a bit faster. I was able to do it with only one spawn of enemies right after picking up the bottle, and finishing the climb before the next spawn.

Room 14: Another flawless room.

Room 15: Other than what he mentioned, the only other thing I saw was he moved farther left than he needed to right at the start (when jumping up on the second block he created). It made it seem like a very close call with the...whatever the hell that fire breathing monkey is called...

Room 21: If only you could get the key and still have enough time to make into the chamber below the door...

Room 22: Very tight execution here. Literally brushes up against a couple enemies without dying. He had to only be a couple pixels at most from death.

Room 23: More tight execution falling down between the flying bats, and nice show of minor glitches climbing to get the key. Flawless room.

Room 29: I don't see how this room could have gone any faster.

Room 30: I always hated this room. Controlling the enemies is key here and he does it perfectly.

Room 31: The only improvements I can see here are from jumping from some of the passages without creating a block underneath to stand on. Minor improvement though.

Room 37: I don't see any way this room could be improved.

Room 38: Talk about a room that teases Dana. The key is within spittin' distance and yet he has to take the dick drunk route to get to it. Some developer is snickering right now...

Room 39: Flawless.

Room 45: Extremely good enemy control by the runner here. This was one of the rooms that frustrated me like nobody's business when I was younger.

Room 46: Considering how late in the game this is, you'd think this room would be harder. The runner mentions his mistake here, so I won't bother touching on it.

Room 47: To be honest I don't think that's how the developers had planned on this room being solved. As for him bumping his head: I'd rather make it into the shaft and have a headache than to miss the shaft completely Wink

Room 48: Very clean, minus a couple headache inducers.

Solomon: He mentions a way to clear this room slightly faster with a very dangerous trick. I'm not going to berate him for not doing it.

Overall, a very solid run with a lot of what seemed like great planning (route) and very tight execution.

Decision: Accept.


Quote:
I've reviewed the Solomon's Key any% (warps) run and have compared it to other relevant runs.  As much as I'd like to give a complete break-down of each individual level I cannot at this moment in time as my computer has been corrupted along with many of its programs so I don't want to delay this run any further (and I've watched the run enough times to make an informed judgment).  Here's the synopsis:

There are no signs of cheating, the runner resets a couple times in the beginning to make sure there are no doubts.  The audio/visual aspect are good for the most part, no reason to complain.

The route planning is impeccable for the most part and it incorporates many of the strategies used in the TAS and nico run.  I can't say there were any alternative routes that I came up with that would be faster than his.  He mentions some different paths on some levels as well as Solomon's room but his routes were solid for the most part so a rejection on route selection is out of the question since he generally opted for the riskiest paths (which saved the most time) and nailed them to near perfection.  Special kudos on the levels where he has to stack boxes till the top as he created the minimum amount of boxes to climb up erstwhile protecting himself from the statues' projectiles (on 1st attempts no less). 

The runner budgets his magic fire (don't know what else to call it) very well and uses them all and in the most appropriate places.  He does things like jump over enemies consistently well considering how risky this maneuver is.  Also, he makes use of a technique where he builds/destroys blocks in mid-air while platforming without touching the ground throughout the run.  Very meticulous and optimal movements obviously that are tricky to pull off in some of the later levels.  One particularly neat trick that he performs a couple times in the run is when he creates a block in mid-air on top of another and manages to get Dana in between the boxes which allowed for at least one "sequence break".  I don't know if it's a glitch or not but he comes up with some creative solutions utilizing this maneuver which no doubt saved some chunks of time in their respective rooms.  Overall, the gameplay is very impressive and the execution is extremely tight considering how unforgiving this game can be at times.

Of course, there are errors.  Most of the mistakes are very minor though:  there one or two times where he accidentally attempts to create a block that isn't necessary (most notably in Solomon's room, but by then the pressure must be great).  There were a couple of funny errors though where he bumps his head on the way down from a jump that I never knew was possible.  All of the mistakes don't add up to more than 5-10 secs. though and none of them look horrendous or anything.  For a game that requires you to solve complex puzzles in a finite amount of time, the runner handles these challenges very well and limits himself to minor mistakes that are pretty much expected.  Anyone looking to beat his time is gonna feel a lot like Sisyphus as there is no excess fat to trim off the run.

Decision:  Accept

Congrats Ktwo/Dana for sealing away the Devil's Underground w/ Solomon's Key!


Decision: Accept

Reason: Ktwo is keeping up his reputation of first-class underrated NES game runner.
Thread title:  
First of all a comment to the non-verifyers : this is an improvement over the run that I have on youtube with several new ideas so make sure to check this one out when it gets posted.

Quote from Verifyer 1:
Room 31:

Next warp.

This room has me wondering if can be done faster.  The runner will do this later in the run, too.  First, Dana has to jump up one and right two to avoid the flame. He does so at 9380 on the life meter.  Because the flame is there, he cannot create a block to simply walk over to the gray block and jump on it.  However, he has to have the right step or Dana will hit the gray block two spaces above the orange block.  He does so, showing that this jump is possible.  However, for the remainder of the stage, he does drop the block underneath to make the jump easy.  If the jump is possible, can't time be taken off this stage?  There are 11 instances where the block could have been avoided.

Yes, it's humanly possible, but all those jumps are very risky and it all adds up... The case with the flame saved me a detour of a couple of seconds and I judged it worthy to take the risk in that case. I basically made a compromise to use that kind of jump if it saved me a detour, but not to do it if it just meant "not creating one block". But it's an accute observation and a valid point. (I believe this answers similar comments from the other verifyers as well)

Quote from Verifyer 2:
Room 1: Looks fine, but since I know you can jump from the edge of a tunnel without Dana hitting his head, why doesn't he do that to grab the key? I thought it looked a little slow the way he did it. It probably doesn't actually affect the time any and I'm just being paranoid, but it just seemed to me that it may have been slightly faster (< 1 second)

I suggested my strategy (which is actually not mine, but was suggested to me by ZenicRevery) at tasvideos' forum and they seemed to conclude that it was faster than jumping out to grab the key. It was only by a frame though and to be perfectly honest I'm therefore not sure the same is true for a human player where turning around etc obviously can not be done perfectly.

Quote from Verifyer 2:
Room 13: [...]
EDIT: He mentions that the japanese run grabs one of the bottles at the start to change enemy spawns. I just tried it out, and it doesn't change the spawns per se, but rather skips every other spawn so long as the initial 2 enemies both drop an item. I believe it's a "too many objects on-screen" issue. It does make the ascension quite a bit faster. I was able to do it with only one spawn of enemies right after picking up the bottle, and finishing the climb before the next spawn.

Thanks for clarifying that. It's definitely a difference between the pal- and the ntsc-version then. The enemies spawn with the same rate whether the bottle is picked up or not in the pal-version.

Quote from Verifyer 2:
Room 15: Other than what he mentioned, the only other thing I saw was he moved farther left than he needed to right at the start (when jumping up on the second block he created). It made it seem like a very close call with the...whatever the hell that fire breathing monkey is called...

I did it to manipulate the "fire breathing monkey" (or saramandor if you like) into going to the left first. If he goes to the right, you will have a faster last drop, but be closer to the ghost when picking up the key (which would surely cost a couple of runs when the timing is not perfect). Time wise it's the same as you would have to wait for a saramandor at the bottom (I think you will have to take my word for it or maybe try it on a pal-rom). I have to admit that I did this from routine, so I almost forgot about the other possibility. However, seeing this again spawned an idea for improving the route for the best ending run so thanks for that...  Smiley

Thanks for verifying everyone. I hope you're up for verifying more runs for this game in the future (and that there will be more opportunities to do so  ;)).
Complete. Global. Saturation.
When I first saw this thread, I said to myself, "Hey, someone actually went after that high price bounty on that game I've never heard of!" Then I realized that it was done by the person who offered it. Does this mean that I can still list it under the "paid" section ktwo? Wink
To qualify for the bounty, the best ending is required, while this run was for the normal ending (should maybe have been mentioned at the top of this thread). But I hope you will have reason to ask the same question again some time in the future.  Wink
Highly Evolved
Would you do the jumps if you were to better the run, ktwo?
Quote from Darkwing Duck:
Would you do the jumps if you were to better the run, ktwo?

To be honest, that is not what I have planned. If it was just a question of one or two more jumps, then I'd probably try until I got it right. But you can do them in so many places (and mostly towards the end of the run, room 31, 38 and 48), that I had to draw a line somewhere. As a reference, the nicovideo runner, whose execution is overall quite good, does this kind of jump in one or two places, but generally opts for the safer way of creating a block underneath.

I do however plan on improving this run. My plan is to first make a best ending run (if I pull this off, I promise there will be a couple of nice shortcuts based on the above mentioned jump) and then go back to improve the normal ending. The improvement would include anything that has been found until then + some of the more difficult tricks I skipped in this run (but not the jumps, even though you should probably never say never...).