My feelings on The Demon Rush
Game Page: Doesn't exist yet.
Tyler 'Zyre' Larsen's run
Verifier Responses
Decision: Accept
Reason: An epic RPG brought to its knees without any broken mechanics for once.
BTW, this is going to be our longest run when it's posted. The time is 12 hours 15 minutes, AFAIK.
Tyler 'Zyre' Larsen's run
Verifier Responses
Quote:
My apologies for the delay, Mike.
There are no issues with video or audio, and no sneakiness I've been able to see. To the comments:
In conclusion, this is an impressive first speedrun on a game that's been begging for one for years. The play quality dips at times (none more so than seg#31 ¬_¬), there's the odd questionable strategy, a few of the saves could do with being moved around, and a couple oversights, but face it, it's a 12-hour first run on the game by a first-time runner. If nothing else it's a very good starting point, and a couple years back "Skies in 12 hours" would make verification unnecessary. It's just a shame that the final segment looks such a mess.
Decision: Acc-wait a minute...
There are no issues with video or audio, and no sneakiness I've been able to see. To the comments:
Key: RB = Random Battle, MB = Miniboss, SB = Ship Battle
Ratings: 1-2 Bad, 3-4 Meh, 5-6 Solid, 7-8 Good, 9-10 Perfect
This is based on execution of the strategy, so this is more a gauge of how much goes wrong, and how much goes better than normal, than how good the segment is as a whole. Take with a grain of salt.
When I mention "optimal" in the context of a ship battle, there's generally a set point (typically an S-Cannon opportunity) that's the earliest you can reasonably expect a victory. Apart from specials and in some cases torpedoes and subcannons, the flow of battle takes the same time every time, so if there are none of these atypical attacks, you can judge a battle accurately by the turn count and the input time.
I sometimes mention EM, or Enemy Move(s)/Magic. This is to help judge the success (in speedrunning terms) of random battles - these moves generally take significantly longer than normal attacks.
1: 6m. ~18s lost to poor luck. Main goal is a 1% drop 3m into segment. 5
2: 16m. Drop from seg#1 used to devastating effect on boss. ~2s travel mistakes. Minimal time lost in 1 complete/2 total random battles. 8
3: 7m. 1 quick farm + 22s lost (failed run) in 5 RBs. ~3s travel. 5
4: 8m. 1 wasted focus on boss (4s lost), 1 more RB than normal? No time lost in 2 RBs. 5
5: 11m. 1/2 RBs, ~20s lost by poor strategy. Have both Aika & Vyse use Pyri in 1st round? 3
6: 4m. Luck manip segment (merchant). Could have reduced backtracking by including outdoors moonfish collection, ship parts shop, and/or tavern/guild in segs#5/7 and making this seg only for merchant and gold/upstairs moonfish collection. This would add ~2m of story to seg#7 though. 4
7: 15m. Ship battle seems sub-optimal at first glance but is actually good. Increm duration afaik is (crew * 2) turns, starting the turn after casting; last attack therefore was on the last turn. 1RB, completed in 1 move. Minimal time lost from travel mistakes. 9
8: 10m. RB1 1 round. RB2 run. RB3 2x enemy magic, 1 round. RB4 1x enemy magic, 2 rounds. RB5 main enemy defends, 2 rounds. RB6 1 round. Minimal travel mistakes. Heavily luck-dependant seg dealt with well. 9
9: 3m. Very good execution/luck against boss, completed 1 round earlier than normal. ~15s each way backtrack to re-save for seg#10 boss. 9
10: 9m. Very good boss, 1 round earlier than normal. Could have turned rd1: Vyse Focus Drachma Crystalen into Vyse Crystalen Drachma Spirit Charge (-2s)? RB1 run. RB2 1 move. 10
11: 14m. Slight hesistation on miniboss, battle went well. Ship battle optimal. Small mistake on last moonfish. 8
12: 6m. RB1 1 move. RB2 messy input, 1 round. 8
13: 12m. ~3s of dhabu suck. RB1 good move choice, 1 round. Intercepted moving discovery well. 9
14: 12m. RB1 1 round. RB2 defending enemy, 2 quick rounds. RB3+4 run. RB5 run 2nd round (~20s lost). RB6-8: run. Tough segment dealt with well. 7
15: 27m. Boss went well. SB1: Autoscroller, avoids damage well. SB2: Messes up rd1 input (~10s lost). Lots of input hesistancy. RB: Ambushed, 2 rounds. 4
16: 9m. RB1+2 run. RB3 missed run (~55s lost), completed for useful amount of gold. Completes a good amount of exploration in Ixa'taka with no RBs. 5
17: 15m. RB1 run. SB optimal, 2 rounds with slight hesitation. RB2 run. 9
18: 12m. RB1 2 rounds (defending enemy), 2x EM. RB2 1 round, 2x EM. RB3 ambushed, 1x EM, run. RB4 ambushed, run. MB: 2 rounds, 4x EM. 5
19: 8m. Boss target # of rounds. RB run. 9
20: 11m. RB1 missed run, completed 3 rounds (~1m20 lost). RB2+3 run. RB4 ambushed, run (~22s lost). RB5+6 run. 4
21: 9m. Chosen strategy performed pretty much perfectly. Ideal strategy would save ~25s, but the chance of Aika being targeted when Vyse is available is tiny. 9
22: 19m. SB1 Solid, 4 rounds. SB2 Input hesitant at times, but went well anyway. Detoured to Rixis for a save point; should have free-saved in the air. 4
23: 10m. RB1 run. Quick discovery collection. Boss: Poison and failed Lunar Glyphs lose ~22s, close to optimal otherwise. RB2 ~50s lost from two failed runs, gains useful amount of gold however. RB3 run. 4
24: 13m. MB: Good counter luck with Vyse, solid battle. SB: Generally went poorly but ended on the first possible turn. 6
25: 30m. RB1 all enemies run (~35s lost). RB2 2E 1T. RB3 ambushed, 4E 1T. RB4 3E 1T. RB4 2E 1st move. RB5 2E 1T. RB6 1E 1T. RB7 ambushed, 1E no turns o_O I would suggest saving seg#24 once scavenging sidequests start to avoid luck manip starting 7m into segment - would lose ~10s upfront. A little messy picking up wood/moonstones. Very little action in this segment considering the time. 4
26: 2m. RB run. Basically perfect, but it's a very short segment. 9
27: 9m. RB1 run. RB2 ambushed, run missed, run. Seg#26 had 1RB on same route, so RB2 effectively loses 35s. RB3+4 run. RB5 run missed, run (~25s). 4
28: 9m. Boss is a bit hairy, but goes well, and Aika is at ideal HP for Seg#29. Input is quick. RB1 ambushed, run (~8s). Gets caught on a ship trying to be cool (~2s). RB2 ambushed, run (~15s). 5
29: 23m. MB: 1EM, otherwise optimal. Boss: Sacrifices Aika (kiss of death o_O), 1EM, last round ~7s lost due to having Gilder attack (and be counterattacked) unnecessarily? Good otherwise. RB1 ambushed, run (~31s). MB: 1 round, perfect. RB2 ambushed, run (~16s). Caught by searchlight (~40s). Good stuff happens... but then again bad stuff happens as well. 4
30: 23m. Boss: Perhaps 1 round longer than optimal due to attacks targeting both Gilder and Aika and necessitating healing. Aika is KO'd but this actually saves time when she's targeted yet again - without the full-HP effect of Riselem she'd be KO'd in that round anyway. About as good as this can be done at low levels. SB: A formality, optimal. Then 5 minutes of zzz getting the White Map, but there's absolutely no question that it's worth it. RB: 1 move. 8
31: 16m. Considering it's into the 7th hour of a first speedrun of this game, being short on a hefty amount of mandatory gold is understandable. Perhaps a later run (if any) could identify high-gold enemies (Kanezl etc) and fight more battles involving them that this run ran from, factor in more discoveries/saleable-items collection, and review the current amount of gold to help decide on money-making strategy up to this point. Regardless, overall gold farming takes about 5m50 over the normal traveling time, and is fairly good but not spectacular. It has the added benefit of gaining some more EXP (spirit level) and MEXP (Illchymis), so it's not a horrible situation.
What is horrible, however, is a run-killing mistake that happens at exactly 12:53.47 in this video file. For some inexplicable reason (perhaps mashing A too much and not paying attention?), the runner selects Vyse's unimaginative skull-with-a-visor-biting-a-cutlass instead of the obviously superior cat-with-goggles-and-weird-pigtails-biting-a-coin that Aika supplies. Selecting the pirate cliché has implications for the entire run past this point, and frankly I'm amazed this segment wasn't redone to rectify the error and rescue the run as a whole. The run up to now was solid, but now? Unless the rest of the run is spectacular I'm afraid I can't accept such a horrific error of judgement into the hallowed halls of SDA.
32: 19m. SB1+2 optimal. SB3 good use of items, but not quite optimal, moonstone cannon doesn't do enough damage (~20s). 7
33: 3m. RB1+2 run. 9
34: 8m. SB is about as optimal as you're going to get, that's a lot of HP. 9
35: 17m. Fifth ship battle in a row >_> goes well. Boss: HAAAAAAAAAAAAAAA... The run enters a short period where Prophecy is a good option against bosses. Considering there's only the one ship battle before this point, even if it's one of the more iffy ones, could perhaps play more riskily and get MaxSP one round earlier? Gets caught on a wall unnecessarily and gets an RB as a result (~19s). Lots of detouring in Yafutoma, but Sacrum is a major asset in battle, and moonberries don't grow on trees. 6
36: 14m. No issues with clearing the dungeon. MB: Simple Cutlass Fury strategy, a couple characters get stone which loses ~8s total from the recovery notifications. Good overall. 7
37: 19m. Boss: Manips Sacrulen just in time for Prophecy. Standard HAAAAAAAAAAA strategy. Then instead of going for Prophecy again, he switches to a Cutlass Fury strategy when needing to do almost as much damage as Prophecy does. This only pays off - and marginally, at that - if the boss doesn't do Steelskin (negates damage) in the space of 4 rounds (3 if you're very lucky) - as it is it does Steelskin twice, and that part of the battle takes ~26s longer than the second Prophecy setup and execution. However that's still not a lot of time to lose and the battle is still solid. The rest of the segment is about perfect. 5
38: 31m. Boss: Enemies helpful, rest of battle almost perfect. SB1 optimal. SB2: Pretty much optimal despite being a toughie. Possibly the most well-performed segment in the run. 9
39: 10m. Good flying, though it's hard to say optimal with such a complex route. Finds Aurora discovery unintentionally? (~5s?). 7
40: 17m. Boss: Never going to go smoothly unless you have death protection. 3 KOs, but never two in one round. Manages to keep a Cutlass Fury coming each round, which is about all you can do short of Prophecy (which would also be messy). NO RANDOM BATTLES BETWEEN GLACIA AND CRESCENT ISLE WTF. 6
41: 4m. Illchymis, a moonberry detour, and a very quick navigation to the Maw of Tartas. 9
42: 21m. Considering the first area is only really a maze and doesn't offer any difficulty besides that, I'd probably suggest saving Seg#41 at the second save point to better luck manip Yeligar. SB: Goes for 3 moonstone cannons, so it's optimal if you go by that strategy. I can't help but think that abandoning defence (one round he defends on 3 turns when the enemy only attacks once) and solely using Increm/Marco/Focus/attacks would get the job done a fair bit earlier. Especially considering you have 2 Captain's Stripes available before the battle starts, which this run doesn't use until later (for quicker overall menu time, and because the 3xMSC Yeligar strategy is comfortable even without them). It'd also be worth using Increm the round before you actually need it rather than in advance, and investigating whether it affects torpedoes on launch or on hit to help with that. In short, the strategy is done well, but (unlike the rest of the run, which is planned well) I think the strategy itself is poor.
43: 12m. A minimal-hassle segment done with minimal mistakes. 8
44: 16m. Fina's ship is found quickly. De Loco is taken out with no misses. I think one of the attacks in part 2 hits when Increm is not in effect, but it doesn't affect the strategy. Baltor is comic relief and is taken out in 1 round (I believe that's quicker than normal?). 9
45: 30m. The first 17m of this segment consist of a lot of exposition and only one battle, which is a fairly easy one to optimise. The inn save in Seg#44 requires a detour of ~7s each way, so taking the story into account saving at the start of the Great Silver Shrine may be a better choice. However I can understand wanting the security of a save after the series of battles in Seg#44. Loses a few seconds in GSS getting lost, but nothing notable. Also messes up the approach to Dangral Island, losing ~6s. 5
46: 9m. Boss: About 45s slower than a very good battle would be I think. Aika being KO'd loses enough SP to delay the final Pirate's Wrath for one round, and Vyse gets confused the round before that anyway. While it's not great, it's also not bad, and Vigoro is one bad mutha. 5
47: 26m. Boss: Goes well. I'm not totally sure on the strategy of defending with Aika/Fina rather than focusing, but any time gained by having more SP would be minimal I think. There's a slight error of judgement towards the end that leaves Vyse 1SP short of Pirate's Wrath, but it loses only ~7s. A bit messy when ODing on Paranta Seeds. Also worth seeing if taking a bit of time to sell stuff and buy more seeds saves time overall by making Vyse even more of a destructive machine. 7
48: 25m. SB1: The enemy HITS 3 TIMES AND DOES 0 DAMAGE. SB2: With his new STR buff, Vyse becomes by far the biggest attack threat in ship battles. Optimal. SB3: The Hydra's one tough cookie. Well-choreographed start gets max damage in the first 1.2 rounds. Loses ~10s from input confusion towards the end. The battle falls apart right at the end when two attacks miss, losing possibly as much as ~2m20. I think a more aggressive strategy wouldn't have hurt, rather than half-heartedly going for the win while holding out for the final MSC. But considering it's the _Hydra_... 5
49: 3m. A simple travelling segment, but with a great battle skip. 9
50: 20m. Boss: Galcian has a thing for Vyse, which works well because he and Gilder can take Terminal and leave the team free to enact a simple but effective strategy. Strategy errs in having Gilder (3SP) abandon focusing to heal instead of Fina (2SP).
There's the possibility of having Vyse focus instead of using CF to allow more use of PW (which does slightly less than 3x the damage of CF). As Increm isn't a good option, extending the length of this battle. Whether the added time spent focusing by Vyse would negate the 1 or 2 rounds you save? Regardless, not counting the use of Gilder for healing (not sure if it actually causes an SP shortage in this battle), it's a good execution of one of the two strategies that make sense. SB2 is good. 8
51: 6m. Navigated with a minimum of RBs. 10
52: 41:31.6 from first frame of control to first frame of damage notification fade-in on final attack. Some complex menu work at the very start, done well.
Boss 1: Ramirez is very similar to Galcian. The main differences: Drachma is available giving you 3SP more per round in less time, Ramirez has a regen move that should be dealt with, and he has an all-enemy move that can be a handful. Aika's KO loses only ~4s, and the battle itself is very quick. I don't know whether her not levelling up as a result means she doesn't level SP after Zelos for the final battle (the only stat that really matters at this point), but tbh 1SP/rd isn't a lot.
SB: ~3s is lost from an input error at the start, and the first two attacks miss. ...HOW DO YOU MISS SOMETHING 20 TIMES YOUR SIZE? For some reason Zelos has cool Evade% despite the fact it barely moves. With Vyse as the only character capable of serious damage, any miss from him is bad, and he has 3 early on. ~4s of hesistation near the end. I'd estimate 1m20 lost on optimal.
Boss 2: A better opening round might be Cutlass Fury/Delta Shield/Aura of Valor/Glyph of Might (Vyse) though it depends on the timing between GoM/CF/AoV (that order being ideal) and isn't great if Fina gets targeted. Fina is Silver Nightmare'd into removing Increm from Vyse, halving CF's damage and wasting a round. Or it would if the runner didn't do PW immediately anyway - smarter choice would be CF to make sure a costly PW isn't in a race with GoM.
Halfway point, Destruction removes Vyse's Increm again, cue confusion that ends with the accidental selection of AoV instead of GoM. Same round Fina uses Lunar Light - Sacrum Crystal might be better with LL being a big SP drain (though AoV makes this a moot point), but Aika is the beneficiary and she's the most dangerous character to lose, so it's a prudent choice. As it is, though, Silver Binds KOs Aika anyway.
Next round Aika is revived, however Vyse attacks with PW but without Increm. Drilnos gives him ATK-down, and runner uses the questionable choice of Lunar Cleansing with Fina (6SP vs Curia 2SP)... which never happens as Fina is targeted with Silver Nightmare. Good thing is she subsequently stones Vyse so he doesn't have to waste 21SP, bad thing is Vyse is now afflicted with both Stone _and_ ATK-down.
Which leads to the most blatant mistake, Fina attempts Curia after Aika has performed Delta Shield. This if nothing else is surely motivation to buy some Curia Crystals at some point after the "everything must go" episode. Having to come up with a good move quickly, the result is Lunar Light, which, while probably not the best move, is at least guaranteed to work. Fina is SN'd again for little ill effect.
Next round the runner forgets to reapply Increm for a PW round. The mistake makes no difference to the end time though. In a rare show of good fortune(?), Aika is targeted with SN, saving 2SP in exchange for minor damage to the party. Vyse celebrates by (just) taking Ramirez out and making that 2SP irrelevant.
So, what to make of this battle? The first 45% of Ramirez's HP - this time includes the initial setup of AoV and LL - goes in 4 minutes. The remainder takes just under 6. I can probably say that that battle lasted 2 minutes longer than a solid battle would. That said, it's more than a worthy final boss even at the best of times - he can mess up the best of strategies in a handful of ways with ease - and the first almost-half went quite smoothly before it turned into the epic struggle that it did.
Overall, Ramirez 1 is very good, Zelos is iffy, and Ramirez 2 makes a 12 hour run go out with a whimper rather than a bang. 4
Ratings: 1-2 Bad, 3-4 Meh, 5-6 Solid, 7-8 Good, 9-10 Perfect
This is based on execution of the strategy, so this is more a gauge of how much goes wrong, and how much goes better than normal, than how good the segment is as a whole. Take with a grain of salt.
When I mention "optimal" in the context of a ship battle, there's generally a set point (typically an S-Cannon opportunity) that's the earliest you can reasonably expect a victory. Apart from specials and in some cases torpedoes and subcannons, the flow of battle takes the same time every time, so if there are none of these atypical attacks, you can judge a battle accurately by the turn count and the input time.
I sometimes mention EM, or Enemy Move(s)/Magic. This is to help judge the success (in speedrunning terms) of random battles - these moves generally take significantly longer than normal attacks.
1: 6m. ~18s lost to poor luck. Main goal is a 1% drop 3m into segment. 5
2: 16m. Drop from seg#1 used to devastating effect on boss. ~2s travel mistakes. Minimal time lost in 1 complete/2 total random battles. 8
3: 7m. 1 quick farm + 22s lost (failed run) in 5 RBs. ~3s travel. 5
4: 8m. 1 wasted focus on boss (4s lost), 1 more RB than normal? No time lost in 2 RBs. 5
5: 11m. 1/2 RBs, ~20s lost by poor strategy. Have both Aika & Vyse use Pyri in 1st round? 3
6: 4m. Luck manip segment (merchant). Could have reduced backtracking by including outdoors moonfish collection, ship parts shop, and/or tavern/guild in segs#5/7 and making this seg only for merchant and gold/upstairs moonfish collection. This would add ~2m of story to seg#7 though. 4
7: 15m. Ship battle seems sub-optimal at first glance but is actually good. Increm duration afaik is (crew * 2) turns, starting the turn after casting; last attack therefore was on the last turn. 1RB, completed in 1 move. Minimal time lost from travel mistakes. 9
8: 10m. RB1 1 round. RB2 run. RB3 2x enemy magic, 1 round. RB4 1x enemy magic, 2 rounds. RB5 main enemy defends, 2 rounds. RB6 1 round. Minimal travel mistakes. Heavily luck-dependant seg dealt with well. 9
9: 3m. Very good execution/luck against boss, completed 1 round earlier than normal. ~15s each way backtrack to re-save for seg#10 boss. 9
10: 9m. Very good boss, 1 round earlier than normal. Could have turned rd1: Vyse Focus Drachma Crystalen into Vyse Crystalen Drachma Spirit Charge (-2s)? RB1 run. RB2 1 move. 10
11: 14m. Slight hesistation on miniboss, battle went well. Ship battle optimal. Small mistake on last moonfish. 8
12: 6m. RB1 1 move. RB2 messy input, 1 round. 8
13: 12m. ~3s of dhabu suck. RB1 good move choice, 1 round. Intercepted moving discovery well. 9
14: 12m. RB1 1 round. RB2 defending enemy, 2 quick rounds. RB3+4 run. RB5 run 2nd round (~20s lost). RB6-8: run. Tough segment dealt with well. 7
15: 27m. Boss went well. SB1: Autoscroller, avoids damage well. SB2: Messes up rd1 input (~10s lost). Lots of input hesistancy. RB: Ambushed, 2 rounds. 4
16: 9m. RB1+2 run. RB3 missed run (~55s lost), completed for useful amount of gold. Completes a good amount of exploration in Ixa'taka with no RBs. 5
17: 15m. RB1 run. SB optimal, 2 rounds with slight hesitation. RB2 run. 9
18: 12m. RB1 2 rounds (defending enemy), 2x EM. RB2 1 round, 2x EM. RB3 ambushed, 1x EM, run. RB4 ambushed, run. MB: 2 rounds, 4x EM. 5
19: 8m. Boss target # of rounds. RB run. 9
20: 11m. RB1 missed run, completed 3 rounds (~1m20 lost). RB2+3 run. RB4 ambushed, run (~22s lost). RB5+6 run. 4
21: 9m. Chosen strategy performed pretty much perfectly. Ideal strategy would save ~25s, but the chance of Aika being targeted when Vyse is available is tiny. 9
22: 19m. SB1 Solid, 4 rounds. SB2 Input hesitant at times, but went well anyway. Detoured to Rixis for a save point; should have free-saved in the air. 4
23: 10m. RB1 run. Quick discovery collection. Boss: Poison and failed Lunar Glyphs lose ~22s, close to optimal otherwise. RB2 ~50s lost from two failed runs, gains useful amount of gold however. RB3 run. 4
24: 13m. MB: Good counter luck with Vyse, solid battle. SB: Generally went poorly but ended on the first possible turn. 6
25: 30m. RB1 all enemies run (~35s lost). RB2 2E 1T. RB3 ambushed, 4E 1T. RB4 3E 1T. RB4 2E 1st move. RB5 2E 1T. RB6 1E 1T. RB7 ambushed, 1E no turns o_O I would suggest saving seg#24 once scavenging sidequests start to avoid luck manip starting 7m into segment - would lose ~10s upfront. A little messy picking up wood/moonstones. Very little action in this segment considering the time. 4
26: 2m. RB run. Basically perfect, but it's a very short segment. 9
27: 9m. RB1 run. RB2 ambushed, run missed, run. Seg#26 had 1RB on same route, so RB2 effectively loses 35s. RB3+4 run. RB5 run missed, run (~25s). 4
28: 9m. Boss is a bit hairy, but goes well, and Aika is at ideal HP for Seg#29. Input is quick. RB1 ambushed, run (~8s). Gets caught on a ship trying to be cool (~2s). RB2 ambushed, run (~15s). 5
29: 23m. MB: 1EM, otherwise optimal. Boss: Sacrifices Aika (kiss of death o_O), 1EM, last round ~7s lost due to having Gilder attack (and be counterattacked) unnecessarily? Good otherwise. RB1 ambushed, run (~31s). MB: 1 round, perfect. RB2 ambushed, run (~16s). Caught by searchlight (~40s). Good stuff happens... but then again bad stuff happens as well. 4
30: 23m. Boss: Perhaps 1 round longer than optimal due to attacks targeting both Gilder and Aika and necessitating healing. Aika is KO'd but this actually saves time when she's targeted yet again - without the full-HP effect of Riselem she'd be KO'd in that round anyway. About as good as this can be done at low levels. SB: A formality, optimal. Then 5 minutes of zzz getting the White Map, but there's absolutely no question that it's worth it. RB: 1 move. 8
31: 16m. Considering it's into the 7th hour of a first speedrun of this game, being short on a hefty amount of mandatory gold is understandable. Perhaps a later run (if any) could identify high-gold enemies (Kanezl etc) and fight more battles involving them that this run ran from, factor in more discoveries/saleable-items collection, and review the current amount of gold to help decide on money-making strategy up to this point. Regardless, overall gold farming takes about 5m50 over the normal traveling time, and is fairly good but not spectacular. It has the added benefit of gaining some more EXP (spirit level) and MEXP (Illchymis), so it's not a horrible situation.
What is horrible, however, is a run-killing mistake that happens at exactly 12:53.47 in this video file. For some inexplicable reason (perhaps mashing A too much and not paying attention?), the runner selects Vyse's unimaginative skull-with-a-visor-biting-a-cutlass instead of the obviously superior cat-with-goggles-and-weird-pigtails-biting-a-coin that Aika supplies. Selecting the pirate cliché has implications for the entire run past this point, and frankly I'm amazed this segment wasn't redone to rectify the error and rescue the run as a whole. The run up to now was solid, but now? Unless the rest of the run is spectacular I'm afraid I can't accept such a horrific error of judgement into the hallowed halls of SDA.
32: 19m. SB1+2 optimal. SB3 good use of items, but not quite optimal, moonstone cannon doesn't do enough damage (~20s). 7
33: 3m. RB1+2 run. 9
34: 8m. SB is about as optimal as you're going to get, that's a lot of HP. 9
35: 17m. Fifth ship battle in a row >_> goes well. Boss: HAAAAAAAAAAAAAAA... The run enters a short period where Prophecy is a good option against bosses. Considering there's only the one ship battle before this point, even if it's one of the more iffy ones, could perhaps play more riskily and get MaxSP one round earlier? Gets caught on a wall unnecessarily and gets an RB as a result (~19s). Lots of detouring in Yafutoma, but Sacrum is a major asset in battle, and moonberries don't grow on trees. 6
36: 14m. No issues with clearing the dungeon. MB: Simple Cutlass Fury strategy, a couple characters get stone which loses ~8s total from the recovery notifications. Good overall. 7
37: 19m. Boss: Manips Sacrulen just in time for Prophecy. Standard HAAAAAAAAAAA strategy. Then instead of going for Prophecy again, he switches to a Cutlass Fury strategy when needing to do almost as much damage as Prophecy does. This only pays off - and marginally, at that - if the boss doesn't do Steelskin (negates damage) in the space of 4 rounds (3 if you're very lucky) - as it is it does Steelskin twice, and that part of the battle takes ~26s longer than the second Prophecy setup and execution. However that's still not a lot of time to lose and the battle is still solid. The rest of the segment is about perfect. 5
38: 31m. Boss: Enemies helpful, rest of battle almost perfect. SB1 optimal. SB2: Pretty much optimal despite being a toughie. Possibly the most well-performed segment in the run. 9
39: 10m. Good flying, though it's hard to say optimal with such a complex route. Finds Aurora discovery unintentionally? (~5s?). 7
40: 17m. Boss: Never going to go smoothly unless you have death protection. 3 KOs, but never two in one round. Manages to keep a Cutlass Fury coming each round, which is about all you can do short of Prophecy (which would also be messy). NO RANDOM BATTLES BETWEEN GLACIA AND CRESCENT ISLE WTF. 6
41: 4m. Illchymis, a moonberry detour, and a very quick navigation to the Maw of Tartas. 9
42: 21m. Considering the first area is only really a maze and doesn't offer any difficulty besides that, I'd probably suggest saving Seg#41 at the second save point to better luck manip Yeligar. SB: Goes for 3 moonstone cannons, so it's optimal if you go by that strategy. I can't help but think that abandoning defence (one round he defends on 3 turns when the enemy only attacks once) and solely using Increm/Marco/Focus/attacks would get the job done a fair bit earlier. Especially considering you have 2 Captain's Stripes available before the battle starts, which this run doesn't use until later (for quicker overall menu time, and because the 3xMSC Yeligar strategy is comfortable even without them). It'd also be worth using Increm the round before you actually need it rather than in advance, and investigating whether it affects torpedoes on launch or on hit to help with that. In short, the strategy is done well, but (unlike the rest of the run, which is planned well) I think the strategy itself is poor.
43: 12m. A minimal-hassle segment done with minimal mistakes. 8
44: 16m. Fina's ship is found quickly. De Loco is taken out with no misses. I think one of the attacks in part 2 hits when Increm is not in effect, but it doesn't affect the strategy. Baltor is comic relief and is taken out in 1 round (I believe that's quicker than normal?). 9
45: 30m. The first 17m of this segment consist of a lot of exposition and only one battle, which is a fairly easy one to optimise. The inn save in Seg#44 requires a detour of ~7s each way, so taking the story into account saving at the start of the Great Silver Shrine may be a better choice. However I can understand wanting the security of a save after the series of battles in Seg#44. Loses a few seconds in GSS getting lost, but nothing notable. Also messes up the approach to Dangral Island, losing ~6s. 5
46: 9m. Boss: About 45s slower than a very good battle would be I think. Aika being KO'd loses enough SP to delay the final Pirate's Wrath for one round, and Vyse gets confused the round before that anyway. While it's not great, it's also not bad, and Vigoro is one bad mutha. 5
47: 26m. Boss: Goes well. I'm not totally sure on the strategy of defending with Aika/Fina rather than focusing, but any time gained by having more SP would be minimal I think. There's a slight error of judgement towards the end that leaves Vyse 1SP short of Pirate's Wrath, but it loses only ~7s. A bit messy when ODing on Paranta Seeds. Also worth seeing if taking a bit of time to sell stuff and buy more seeds saves time overall by making Vyse even more of a destructive machine. 7
48: 25m. SB1: The enemy HITS 3 TIMES AND DOES 0 DAMAGE. SB2: With his new STR buff, Vyse becomes by far the biggest attack threat in ship battles. Optimal. SB3: The Hydra's one tough cookie. Well-choreographed start gets max damage in the first 1.2 rounds. Loses ~10s from input confusion towards the end. The battle falls apart right at the end when two attacks miss, losing possibly as much as ~2m20. I think a more aggressive strategy wouldn't have hurt, rather than half-heartedly going for the win while holding out for the final MSC. But considering it's the _Hydra_... 5
49: 3m. A simple travelling segment, but with a great battle skip. 9
50: 20m. Boss: Galcian has a thing for Vyse, which works well because he and Gilder can take Terminal and leave the team free to enact a simple but effective strategy. Strategy errs in having Gilder (3SP) abandon focusing to heal instead of Fina (2SP).
There's the possibility of having Vyse focus instead of using CF to allow more use of PW (which does slightly less than 3x the damage of CF). As Increm isn't a good option, extending the length of this battle. Whether the added time spent focusing by Vyse would negate the 1 or 2 rounds you save? Regardless, not counting the use of Gilder for healing (not sure if it actually causes an SP shortage in this battle), it's a good execution of one of the two strategies that make sense. SB2 is good. 8
51: 6m. Navigated with a minimum of RBs. 10
52: 41:31.6 from first frame of control to first frame of damage notification fade-in on final attack. Some complex menu work at the very start, done well.
Boss 1: Ramirez is very similar to Galcian. The main differences: Drachma is available giving you 3SP more per round in less time, Ramirez has a regen move that should be dealt with, and he has an all-enemy move that can be a handful. Aika's KO loses only ~4s, and the battle itself is very quick. I don't know whether her not levelling up as a result means she doesn't level SP after Zelos for the final battle (the only stat that really matters at this point), but tbh 1SP/rd isn't a lot.
SB: ~3s is lost from an input error at the start, and the first two attacks miss. ...HOW DO YOU MISS SOMETHING 20 TIMES YOUR SIZE? For some reason Zelos has cool Evade% despite the fact it barely moves. With Vyse as the only character capable of serious damage, any miss from him is bad, and he has 3 early on. ~4s of hesistation near the end. I'd estimate 1m20 lost on optimal.
Boss 2: A better opening round might be Cutlass Fury/Delta Shield/Aura of Valor/Glyph of Might (Vyse) though it depends on the timing between GoM/CF/AoV (that order being ideal) and isn't great if Fina gets targeted. Fina is Silver Nightmare'd into removing Increm from Vyse, halving CF's damage and wasting a round. Or it would if the runner didn't do PW immediately anyway - smarter choice would be CF to make sure a costly PW isn't in a race with GoM.
Halfway point, Destruction removes Vyse's Increm again, cue confusion that ends with the accidental selection of AoV instead of GoM. Same round Fina uses Lunar Light - Sacrum Crystal might be better with LL being a big SP drain (though AoV makes this a moot point), but Aika is the beneficiary and she's the most dangerous character to lose, so it's a prudent choice. As it is, though, Silver Binds KOs Aika anyway.
Next round Aika is revived, however Vyse attacks with PW but without Increm. Drilnos gives him ATK-down, and runner uses the questionable choice of Lunar Cleansing with Fina (6SP vs Curia 2SP)... which never happens as Fina is targeted with Silver Nightmare. Good thing is she subsequently stones Vyse so he doesn't have to waste 21SP, bad thing is Vyse is now afflicted with both Stone _and_ ATK-down.
Which leads to the most blatant mistake, Fina attempts Curia after Aika has performed Delta Shield. This if nothing else is surely motivation to buy some Curia Crystals at some point after the "everything must go" episode. Having to come up with a good move quickly, the result is Lunar Light, which, while probably not the best move, is at least guaranteed to work. Fina is SN'd again for little ill effect.
Next round the runner forgets to reapply Increm for a PW round. The mistake makes no difference to the end time though. In a rare show of good fortune(?), Aika is targeted with SN, saving 2SP in exchange for minor damage to the party. Vyse celebrates by (just) taking Ramirez out and making that 2SP irrelevant.
So, what to make of this battle? The first 45% of Ramirez's HP - this time includes the initial setup of AoV and LL - goes in 4 minutes. The remainder takes just under 6. I can probably say that that battle lasted 2 minutes longer than a solid battle would. That said, it's more than a worthy final boss even at the best of times - he can mess up the best of strategies in a handful of ways with ease - and the first almost-half went quite smoothly before it turned into the epic struggle that it did.
Overall, Ramirez 1 is very good, Zelos is iffy, and Ramirez 2 makes a 12 hour run go out with a whimper rather than a bang. 4
In conclusion, this is an impressive first speedrun on a game that's been begging for one for years. The play quality dips at times (none more so than seg#31 ¬_¬), there's the odd questionable strategy, a few of the saves could do with being moved around, and a couple oversights, but face it, it's a 12-hour first run on the game by a first-time runner. If nothing else it's a very good starting point, and a couple years back "Skies in 12 hours" would make verification unnecessary. It's just a shame that the final segment looks such a mess.
Decision: Acc-wait a minute...
Quote:
The audio and video were fine. There is an odd audio glitch at the end of some segments (I think 21 and 39 and probably a few others), where the page-flipping sounds of the save menu start stuttering or the sound of the save completing repeats, but that might just be a bad cut on the end of that segment, and it really doesn't hurt anything anyway.
The gameplay was good overall. There were a number of input flubs, a few hesitations (especially in a long ship battle, where I suspect he might have been making sure he knew where he was in his notes as some turns look very similar), and a few brain farts that look really silly (Curia + Delta Shield?), but I feel he already knows most of those anyway, and the bad luck in every segment was already noted by a far too thorough verifier combing each segment. I can't really blame the input flubs too much, or the fact that the quality makes a noted increase over the course of the run.
Notable segments that come to mind, whether related to performance or not (although I tried to make most of them relevant):
21: I had no idea that this boss was weak to Petrify like that! You learn something new every day. Same for Gordo later on; I always just used Fina as a support healer/buffer/occasional damage mage, and basically never touch Lunar Glyph.
21 and 22: I know that Japan is pretty big on cultural references, so is it just me, or does Grendel really resemble EVA-01 going berserk in the cutscenes here? Either way, a pair of ship battles, one of which is quite long, and they both go pretty well.
31: I was always partial to Fina's flag, personally...Vyse's is still the worst of the trio by far, though. Oh, the gold problem...maybe not running from quite as many battles that can be finished in short order or skipping another non-essential equipment upgrade would help. ~7,700 gold just seems like it could vary wildly by a few random battles or lucky drops here or there along the course of the six hours leading up to this that it's hard to pin down an exact suggestion to help not have to stop and grind gold.
32: Something that's always bothered me about the Delphinus, and a few of the other really long ships, and can be clearly seen in this segment, is how it doesn't even come close to fitting inside the Evasive Action bubble. Increm looks fine, but Evasive Action could really be scaled a lot better for the larger ships. I dunno, just something that's always bothered me, and the Rift Guardian later is a particularly egregious offender. The series of ship battles go fine, though.
35: You'd think crashing a moon into the planet would do a lot more damage. You'd be wrong. You'd also think crashing a moon into your enemy would hurt a lot more than telling your crew to attack with baked goods and snot bubbles. Again, you'd be wrong, but at least your crew starts out weaker than the moon.
42: Yeligar looks kind of like a facehugger. Maybe that's why he so weak.
45: The Great Silver Shrine is actually pretty interesting, personally. It'd be more fun if you had full camera control, though, I think; that way, you still get the almost Escher-like pathway twisting, but you can actually navigate them. Still, I only noticed a couple of camera flubs, and one missed turn, so it's all good.
48: You have two ships battles that are random encounter level (seriously, you can encounter Valuan Spellships randomly in the sky right after getting the Delphinus), then the Hydra. Aside from that, the fights are bookended by cutscenes and not much else. Aside from sitting through all of that, there's no reason to accept a suboptimal Hydra fight, and those two misses and just faffing about until another MoonStone Cannon shot comes up are definitely suboptimal.
Aside from that, HOW DO YOU MISS A STATIONARY TARGET THAT LARGE? This segment should have been re-done just because that looks utterly ridiculous.
Nah, I'm just kidding. Although I'd have no problem accepting a fight like this from a single-segment run, or if the segment was a lot more than just this one fight bookended by :words:, when you consider that the segment basically boils down to this one fight...As another verifier said, though: It's the _Hydra_. A perfect run should have redone this segment until it came out right, but it still looks good. So while I would really like to say that he should have done it over, I can't say it that strongly, as I'm sure he did try it multiple times anyway and this was the best he got within a reasonable number of tries. Although, with how low the Hydra was, I have to wonder if he could have been taken down even with the misses had he bought a couple of extra seeds for Vyse by selling items, as well.
50: I think having Gilder stop Focus instead of Fina does cause a _slight_ SP shortage, forcing a would-be Pirate's Wrath to become a Cutlass Fury instead. After the first Terminal, he's effectively "down" 1SP. Since he needs 23SP for Pirate's Wrath + Delta Shield, I'm looking for a round that starts with 22SP for now. A few rounds later comes Terminal #2, and now he's "down" 2SP, meaning any round that comes up starting with 21 or 22SP is a delayed Wrath opportunity. In an amusing twist of irony, the round right after Terminal #3, he starts with 22SP, forcing a Cutlass Fury instead of a Pirate's Wrath. He also goes down 3SP from optimal.
The bigger question: Does that delayed Wrath cost any time? Cutlass Fury + Pirate's Wrath ends with Galcian at a tiny sliver of health and 12SP to use. So the answer, in this specific case, is no. The Wrath coming one round sooner wouldn't have won the battle for him, unless he had been able to use two Wraths, one after another. Galcian not using Devolver would have also won it a round earlier for him. It's still technically sub-optimal, but in this case, it doesn't actually change anything either way.
52: Curia + Delta Shield! Okay, I can excuse a brain fart after a solid 40 minutes or so of fighting through the three final bosses back to back to back, and it doesn't really waste more than a turn, but it does look silly. As this was the only time he's needed Curia up to this point, I can't really say "Buy Curia crystals!", especially since this was such a freak occurrence (Ramirez has to use Silver Nightmare on Fina, who has to select Lunar Glyph at random, which has to hit someone who isn't the one wearing Gem of Fluidity, which then has to succeed at applying Petrify).
Final thoughts: You've made me play a game I haven't played in years with this run, a very good game that I never quite gave due justice on the Dreamcast. There's room for improvement, and I definitely think that a time in 11:xx is possible. That said, it's still a solid run with a few low points, but none so bad that they bring the entire run crashing down. Well, except for his choice in flags. Questionable strategies and a noted increase in general quality over the course of the run I think can just be chalked up to the fact that this is a long game, and it's also the first submitted run (that I know of) for the game.
I say accept. Arr.
The gameplay was good overall. There were a number of input flubs, a few hesitations (especially in a long ship battle, where I suspect he might have been making sure he knew where he was in his notes as some turns look very similar), and a few brain farts that look really silly (Curia + Delta Shield?), but I feel he already knows most of those anyway, and the bad luck in every segment was already noted by a far too thorough verifier combing each segment. I can't really blame the input flubs too much, or the fact that the quality makes a noted increase over the course of the run.
Notable segments that come to mind, whether related to performance or not (although I tried to make most of them relevant):
21: I had no idea that this boss was weak to Petrify like that! You learn something new every day. Same for Gordo later on; I always just used Fina as a support healer/buffer/occasional damage mage, and basically never touch Lunar Glyph.
21 and 22: I know that Japan is pretty big on cultural references, so is it just me, or does Grendel really resemble EVA-01 going berserk in the cutscenes here? Either way, a pair of ship battles, one of which is quite long, and they both go pretty well.
31: I was always partial to Fina's flag, personally...Vyse's is still the worst of the trio by far, though. Oh, the gold problem...maybe not running from quite as many battles that can be finished in short order or skipping another non-essential equipment upgrade would help. ~7,700 gold just seems like it could vary wildly by a few random battles or lucky drops here or there along the course of the six hours leading up to this that it's hard to pin down an exact suggestion to help not have to stop and grind gold.
32: Something that's always bothered me about the Delphinus, and a few of the other really long ships, and can be clearly seen in this segment, is how it doesn't even come close to fitting inside the Evasive Action bubble. Increm looks fine, but Evasive Action could really be scaled a lot better for the larger ships. I dunno, just something that's always bothered me, and the Rift Guardian later is a particularly egregious offender. The series of ship battles go fine, though.
35: You'd think crashing a moon into the planet would do a lot more damage. You'd be wrong. You'd also think crashing a moon into your enemy would hurt a lot more than telling your crew to attack with baked goods and snot bubbles. Again, you'd be wrong, but at least your crew starts out weaker than the moon.
42: Yeligar looks kind of like a facehugger. Maybe that's why he so weak.
45: The Great Silver Shrine is actually pretty interesting, personally. It'd be more fun if you had full camera control, though, I think; that way, you still get the almost Escher-like pathway twisting, but you can actually navigate them. Still, I only noticed a couple of camera flubs, and one missed turn, so it's all good.
48: You have two ships battles that are random encounter level (seriously, you can encounter Valuan Spellships randomly in the sky right after getting the Delphinus), then the Hydra. Aside from that, the fights are bookended by cutscenes and not much else. Aside from sitting through all of that, there's no reason to accept a suboptimal Hydra fight, and those two misses and just faffing about until another MoonStone Cannon shot comes up are definitely suboptimal.
Aside from that, HOW DO YOU MISS A STATIONARY TARGET THAT LARGE? This segment should have been re-done just because that looks utterly ridiculous.
Nah, I'm just kidding. Although I'd have no problem accepting a fight like this from a single-segment run, or if the segment was a lot more than just this one fight bookended by :words:, when you consider that the segment basically boils down to this one fight...As another verifier said, though: It's the _Hydra_. A perfect run should have redone this segment until it came out right, but it still looks good. So while I would really like to say that he should have done it over, I can't say it that strongly, as I'm sure he did try it multiple times anyway and this was the best he got within a reasonable number of tries. Although, with how low the Hydra was, I have to wonder if he could have been taken down even with the misses had he bought a couple of extra seeds for Vyse by selling items, as well.
50: I think having Gilder stop Focus instead of Fina does cause a _slight_ SP shortage, forcing a would-be Pirate's Wrath to become a Cutlass Fury instead. After the first Terminal, he's effectively "down" 1SP. Since he needs 23SP for Pirate's Wrath + Delta Shield, I'm looking for a round that starts with 22SP for now. A few rounds later comes Terminal #2, and now he's "down" 2SP, meaning any round that comes up starting with 21 or 22SP is a delayed Wrath opportunity. In an amusing twist of irony, the round right after Terminal #3, he starts with 22SP, forcing a Cutlass Fury instead of a Pirate's Wrath. He also goes down 3SP from optimal.
The bigger question: Does that delayed Wrath cost any time? Cutlass Fury + Pirate's Wrath ends with Galcian at a tiny sliver of health and 12SP to use. So the answer, in this specific case, is no. The Wrath coming one round sooner wouldn't have won the battle for him, unless he had been able to use two Wraths, one after another. Galcian not using Devolver would have also won it a round earlier for him. It's still technically sub-optimal, but in this case, it doesn't actually change anything either way.
52: Curia + Delta Shield! Okay, I can excuse a brain fart after a solid 40 minutes or so of fighting through the three final bosses back to back to back, and it doesn't really waste more than a turn, but it does look silly. As this was the only time he's needed Curia up to this point, I can't really say "Buy Curia crystals!", especially since this was such a freak occurrence (Ramirez has to use Silver Nightmare on Fina, who has to select Lunar Glyph at random, which has to hit someone who isn't the one wearing Gem of Fluidity, which then has to succeed at applying Petrify).
Final thoughts: You've made me play a game I haven't played in years with this run, a very good game that I never quite gave due justice on the Dreamcast. There's room for improvement, and I definitely think that a time in 11:xx is possible. That said, it's still a solid run with a few low points, but none so bad that they bring the entire run crashing down. Well, except for his choice in flags. Questionable strategies and a noted increase in general quality over the course of the run I think can just be chalked up to the fact that this is a long game, and it's also the first submitted run (that I know of) for the game.
I say accept. Arr.
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During the weekend, I didn't realize the amount of shit I had for school, so I'm not going to have time to type out proper verification notes. That said, I'm going to accept this run. The gist of my comments is that it's a good run of a long RPG, especially with few mechanics to compensate for the low levels (unlike, for example, FFX with the trio of 9999). In long RPG runs like this, the route is probably the most important factor, and Zyre doesn't disappoint. Some segments could have had better luck manip, but all in all, it's a solid run.
In other words, what they said.
In other words, what they said.
Decision: Accept
Reason: An epic RPG brought to its knees without any broken mechanics for once.
BTW, this is going to be our longest run when it's posted. The time is 12 hours 15 minutes, AFAIK.
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