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mikwuyma: 2009-03-30 07:33:29 am
My feelings on The Demon Rush
Game Page: Doesn't exist yet.

Giel Goertz's UFO glitch run

Quote:
Well, this was certainly an interesting run to watch. It's amusing how fast UFO destroys the main bosses. The run isn't entirely in UFO; there're a few instances where the runner switches off and back after. These are done to save time in certain areas, and are noted below.

There are a number of minor errors, mostly related to entering doors. They all probably total up to 2-3 seconds lost at most, so no big deal.

Switches to Wheel from the 2-2 midboss, then back to UFO in 2-3.

Switches to Hi-Jump in the first room of 3-3, then back to UFO in the 2nd room by mixing 2 Hi-Jumps. First critical mistake occurs in the third room of 3-3, where the runner fails the UFO glitch twice. Loses about 10 seconds here.

Navigates the Gordo room in the last room of 4-5 especially well.

Ditches UFO at the beginning of 5-2, and picks it up again partway through. Not exactly sure why this was done; there doesn't appear to be a logical reason for it. Definitely costs probably 20-30 seconds or so. Some clarification on whether this was intentional would be nice.

Misses one hit on DeDeDe, costs probably five seconds. Misses one hit on final boss as well, maybe another five seconds lost.

Finishes with 71%.

Overall, this is a great and entertaining run. I don't see how it could be improved much, to be honest, outside of erasing the mistakes along the way. Most of them are trivial at most, with only two critical errors totalling about 40 seconds lost. Maybe a minute in total at most could be shaved.

Accept.


Quote:
I had absolutely zero expectations what this speedrun would look like.
It was kinda cool to see the UFO glitch could be done on console, yet, it was kinda dissapointing too.
Of course it ends up being like twenty minutes faster than using any other power, but it's also damn easy and boring.

I was prepared to comment on every stage, but they were mostly the same.
So I'm just going to comment on what the run looked like in general.

Pros:
First of all, UFO is damn easy to play. It's the fastest, has three different ways to attack stuff, including the most powerful attack. Can't really blame the author for using it.
He got the UFO twice from a MIX enemy which gives a random power. +50 points for that. Seems to me like it isn't possible to go down stairs with UFO so he has to lose it temporarily. At least the TAS does it too.
He got two powers other than UFO in the whole run: Wheel and High-jump. Both seemed optimal picks, so no problem there.
Killing lots of enemies, even if it wasn't always necessary. Reduces lag.
Final boss fights looked great (ones killed with Starrod).

Cons:
Took damage quite a few times. Some of them won't lose even half a second probably since he won't lose the UFO power once the glitch is done. But he messed up doing the glitch, wasting some seconds there.
Entering doors seemed to be hard for him, but I guess it's just the nature of them, especially when using a fast moving UFO. Nothing too serious amount of time lost there neither.

Just getting the whole run completed using UFO without dying means it's automatically a good one.


Quote:
I see no cheating, video and audio quality are fine.

UFO glitch, eh? The only problem is actually getting a HOLY CRAP HOW LONG HAS THAT BEEN THERE IVE BEATEN THIS GAME MAYBE A HUNDRED TIMES AND NEVER KNEW OF THAT UFO ON LEVEL 1

This is a decent run. Runner is very good at getting UFO in the roulette, which is never messed up. Activating the glitch, though, is botched a couple times, losing maybe 3 to 5 seconds each time. Stupid mistake in grabbing the rod at an angle after the first boss, making us have to wait for Kirby to walk back to the middle for his celebratory dance. A few seconds lost. Lag is managed badly in some places. The beam and double star attacks cause alot of lag and should be avoided except when digging up or down with the beam, or doing lots of damage to bosses or digging straight ahead with the double star. I can't estimate how much time is lost to this, but definitely something significant. Even the single star should be avoided for anywhere that a laser shot is good enough. Misses a shot on DeDeDe and then gets hit, losing some time, and misses a shot against the final boss. Many minor errors throughout.

It's about 5 minutes slower than the TAS, which doesn't contain any major glitches besides the UFO glitch, and doesn't rely on any super improbable luck, so I think it's safe to say that this is about 5 minutes slower than optimal (yes, I took timing methods into account). That sounds like alot, but the parts where the UFO has to be given up are done very well, and it's very hard to maximize Kirby's speed. I'll say "accept", though not by very much. It's good enough.


Quote:
Video Quality: Good (for an NES game)
Audio Quality: Good (for an NES game)

Personally, I've never been fond of a UFO glitch run (since the multitude of powers is what makes Kirby games fun).  But one thing is for certain, UFO makes Kirby's Adventure a lot easier to control, since the NES controls for this game are very stiff.

Given the difficulty of performing the trick (and having to mix TWICE for UFO), doing all this in a single session with as few mistakes made as there were is quite impressive.  I only counted like 2 flubs with getting the glitch to go and about 15 unintended hits (the vast majority on Nightmare Orb and Nightmare King).  This is quite impressive.

Consider the run accepted, though maybe UFO Glitch should be a separate category.  That's just my opinion though.

Kirby - Nightmare in Dream Land is still 1000x better then Kirby's Adventure though.  Tongue


Quote:
Great run. No major complaints.

Accepted
Yes, that was really the entire message.

Decision: Accept

Reason: The runner utilizes the UFO glitch effectively.

Also, it sounds like the UFO glitch is such a game-breaking glitch that it should be a separate category, any reason I shouldn't make it one?
Thread title:  
Why so serious?
I definitely think the UFO glitch changes the game enough that it should be a separate category. You can practically fly over everything...
Totally a separate category. The UFO glitch makes the entire game a joke difficulty-wise (it was easy to begin with), think of it like playing an FPS that's already easy, but also starting with the best weapon and infinite ammo.

And to the first verifier, he has to change from the UFO those 3 or so times because the UFO can't climb down stairs and you need to.
DS Dictator
Quote:
Consider the run accepted, though maybe UFO Glitch should be a separate category.  That's just my opinion though.

Kirby - Nightmare in Dream Land is still 1000x better then Kirby's Adventure though.


Hmm I heard something like this before Tongue

I need to watch it when it gets published.

And Mikwuyma, the UFO glitch should be a seperate category because:

The UFO itself was meant to be removed after completing a stage, but with the glitch:
* Getting hit still keeps your UFO powers (not counting Dedede's Swallow)
* You can use it on other levels
* Reliable speed
* Most effective attack in the game (Double Star Shot), which can be abused from distances which makes Boss battles (& Mini boss battles) very easy to progress.

Without the UFO abuse, the boss battles are tough to defeat (even harder than the GBA version)  mainly because the Ball Power is less abuseable (you can't bounce down if the top screen edge isn't solid) also if you hit the boss during his/her hit invulnerability sequence there is so much lag that you're more likely to be vulnerable and get hit (& lose your power too).
Edit history:
Zealie: 2009-03-30 04:41:35 am
Thanks all! Smiley
First off all @ Mike, it's Giel Goertz, but I'm assuming that's just a typo Wink Tongue
I'm glad the video quality was good, I was worried for a second it would have the same problems as my current ducktales run, but I guess it didn't.

Anyway, a few pointers:
Like Nihilus said I need to lose the UFO because it can't go down stairs and/or go down from a platform.
@ Nihilus, I've tried speedrunning this game without using the glitch and I don't think this game is that easy to play... I challange you ;p

I knew about that UFO in level one thanks to Greenalink. (Thanks dude! :D)

@ Verifier 3:
I thank Greenalink for showing me where that UFO was. (via his youtube vids).
About the TAS, it's in NTSC. Maybe I should of mentioned it myself (atleast I think I forgot), but this run is a PAL version, so it's slower on the whole. I've read that normally you could use a 5/6 multiplier to it to get to the NTSC time, but that would mean I was faster then the TAS, which I'm obviously not. So I'm guessing it's something like in Duck Tales where the game overall is lower but the main character (or maybe in this case kirby) is faster compared to the rest. (Although it doesn't feel like it). Maybe the game just lags less in PAL.
Anyway, bottom line: I'm not sure what it is, or by how much but PAL is slower then the TAS (NTSC). I think if you'd TAS a PAL run of Kirby you'd have a hard time trying to get sub 40 minutes.
I also think I did a pretty good job not trying to lag the game with beam (I think I made 1 or 2 mistakes in using it, 1 really big one when first using it to destroy blocks, the problem was that the game was already lagging so much because of the blocks being destroyed that me pushing the button didn't register properly (or maybe because of the lag my timing was off =x ;p) and I ended up doing a beam instead of a laser (twice :(). Double star I 'screwed' up m. I sometimes charged my weapon for nothing.

1 thing I must say is that the randomness can be an arse sometimes. (sometimes the enemies jump up, so you should try to avoid/kill them, sometimes they just use their weapon and create lag, thus killing them would be better and sometimes they just do nothing so just flying past/killing them if they are in the way anyway is best.) I've tried to play in such way that I was prepared at every possibility.
Hmmm sounds a bit hader now then it really is, but you just gotta remember it properly.

@verifier 4:
Respect the original/elders! Tongue (yes I know it was released for GB first, that's why level 7-6 is the most epic of them all and tbh should have a screenshot of it on the page)

@verifier 5:
I agree with you.

And lastly, if glitch should be a separate category...
Well personally I don't mind if it is, but also wouldn't mind if it wasn't.
The main thing is (I think) that most people say this should be a separate category, because if it's not they'll lose the chance of seeing the epicness of something trying to run this game using different powers.
Seeing how the game is made I do think it does kinda revolve on the usage of all kinds of powers, so that would mean using the UFO Glitch does kinda beat a purpose that was intended to be a part of the game.
Also I think if you're not using the glitch it will probably take you atleast 10 minutes longer before completing the game (but this is a rough estimate, so don't pin me down on it).
So that's how I think it is. If this means a separate category or not I leave to others. Smiley
My feelings on The Demon Rush
Quote from ZaibirQuild:
Thanks all! Smiley
First off all @ Mike, it's Giel Goertz, but I'm assuming that's just a typo Wink Tongue


Oops :-[

Fixed.
I am that third verifier actually Tongue and what I meant was normal gameplay is really easy I think, but optimizing Kirby's speed is a nightmare, with having to minimize "floaty time" and dash-jump everywhere. I don't have the stuff to record off my NES at the moment, but I did give it a shot on a rom to see how it would go, and it is extremely tricky.

And I had no idea they were different versions! I retract my verification statement of "accept though not by very much", and instead I'll call it a solid Accept!
Just a minor note, I'd also personally favor towards putting it as its own category.
DS Dictator
Very good run, I like the UFO mix tricks and you just barely survive against the last boss (pretty impressive for an Single Segment run).
Fucking Weeaboo
I seem to be a very popular target for the news. Tongue
sinister1
so pro u don't even know
Nicely done ZQ!
everybody wanna tell you the meaning of music
Quote from Lord_VG:
I seem to be a very popular target for the news. Tongue

What can I say, you run a lot of games -> you're in the news a lot. Wink