Golden Axe

Heidrage

Edit history:

Heidrage: 2012-08-11 10:34:14 pm

2012-08-11 10:33:11 pm

Willing to teach you the impossible

When you gain control, so once the last dialog box is gone.

I would still like to get a look at it before you submit.

honorableJay

2012-08-15 09:35:37 pm

The Dork Knight himself.

Still at it. Since Flip is still out of town I've been working to reduce my time now that I've broken the 10-min barrier. Current estimated time is down to 9:49. This however brings up a bit of a paradox: I want to submit this run over the 9:59 that I originally was going to submit, and even though it is faster, it still feels sloppier. Time is king here, but it still annoys me that I can have more mistakes in a faster run simply because of a few small spots overall (including the last fight, arguably the biggest improvement).

Heidrage

2012-08-15 09:38:07 pm

Willing to teach you the impossible

I say sit on it and keep at it for a bit longer, then submit your best time

honorableJay

2012-08-19 08:42:33 pm

The Dork Knight himself.

I just keep chip-chip-chipping away at my time. Just dropped it down to 9:43 with a cleaner stage 7 and a perfect Death Bringer fight.

honorableJay

2012-08-28 07:19:18 pm

The Dork Knight himself.

Not perfect by any means, but I'm getting there. Sub 9:30 is definitely within reach, and it's not a stretch to say it could even go under 9:20.

honorableJay

2012-09-01 01:43:14 pm

The Dork Knight himself.

I finally figured out how to properly handle the Knights on stage 7, and why the same strat doesn't work on stage 5. For stage 7 I can take an early hit, then RJA the upper Knight to force the 2nd Knight into position quicker. My estimate is about a 7-10 sec timesaver since I get the dash juggle started quicker. Now the only reason this works here is due to the size of the pit: I can move higher up on the z-axis which moves them closer together. Since they move so slow, being as close as possible increases my success. In stage 5 the pit is very small, so I have to stay pretty low (which keeps them separated). I'm gonna see just how high I need to be to get them into the pit before I give up on stage 5. Such a shame that Knights can't just walk into the pits Sad

honorableJay

Edit history:

honorableJay: 2012-10-28 08:40:54 am

honorableJay: 2012-10-27 11:22:52 pm

2012-10-27 11:19:55 pm

The Dork Knight himself.

Ok, now that my run has passed verification and I have the official timing, I'm going to do a live audio commentary on Tuesday, 10/30 @ 10pm EST. My twitch page can be found here.

I plan on going over many different sections of the run and discussing my strats and other scenarios I've run into, so I will be pausing and backing up the video quite a bit. If anyone cares to know more about this game, then check it out.

honorableJay

2012-10-28 05:13:49 pm

The Dork Knight himself.

Quick update: with the latest hurricane hitting the east coast I might be out of power for a day or two, so if I don't show up in my twitch channel for the commentary by 10:30, it's probably due to no power and I'll reschedule for a later date.

honorableJay

2012-10-30 09:45:51 pm

The Dork Knight himself.

http://www.twitch.tv/honorablejay/c/1718476

Just finished up the live commentary, and even though I went with no scripts or notes and have never done this kind of thing before, I'd say it turned out pretty well. If you missed it and don't mind spending an hour on a run that's not even 10 mins long, check it out. Any feedback would be appreciated. I'm also gonna try to get this linked to the run page alongside the run (once I get the videos finalized and sent over to Nate).

honorableJay

Edit history:

honorableJay: 2013-09-24 04:34:20 pm

honorableJay: 2013-09-24 04:33:57 pm

honorableJay: 2013-09-22 05:38:10 am

2013-09-22 12:29:20 am

The Dork Knight himself.

Time to blow the dust off, it's marathon practice time Smiley

So, since the game has 3 characters, looks like I'll have to learn how to beat it with the other 2. This definitely poses a challenge as Tyris is so heavily overpowered in every aspect. After playing around with Ax Battler and Gilius, it seems that all normal attacks have set damage. The differences boil down to animation times and attack box ranges/positioning. Here's the breakdown:

Tyris:
Farthest swing range
Quickest/Most useful back attack
Highest magic strength
Farthest attack box for the dash attack

Ax Battler:
Same back attack as Tyris
Shortest range for dash attack (hitbox can't extend outside of the screen border, slight backwards shift in character position makes hitting Knights almost impossible)
Second highest magic level
Slowest walking speed (hard to notice, but it's there)

Gilius:
Longest range for back attack, but cannot hit enemies directly behind (he rolls through them)
Enemies can jump over back attack
Weakest magic level
Shorter dash attack range than Tyris, but longer than Ax Battler

Due to these differences, a LOT of fights need to be tweaked.

Ax Battler
Stage 2 second fight: shoulder bash can't hit the left enemy since the attack box is too short and doesn't extend past the player collision box.
Stage 3 boss fight: lower strength magic requires an extra downstab on the Knight
Stage 5 Knights: shoulder bash can't hit the Knights before they swing, back attacks required to knock them into the pit
Death Adder: highest level magic attacks don't kill the skeletons
Death Bringer: 1 extra downstab required due to weaker magic

Gilius
Every stage: back attack spamming doesn't work, positioning needs to be changed and fights reworked
Every boss: extremely weak magic means finding quick ways to manipulate the stronger attacks

Gilius is technically the hardest character, but since his headbutt dash attack has more range than Ax Battler's shoulder bash it makes key fights easier to manage. I do have to fight more enemies and can't rely on ending boss's quickly with magic, but at least I don't have to worry about the Knights giving me headaches cause I can't hit them.

Time to blow the dust off, it's marathon practice time :)

So, since the game has 3 characters, looks like I'll have to learn how to beat it with the other 2. This definitely poses a challenge as Tyris is so heavily overpowered in every aspect. After playing around with Ax Battler and Gilius, it seems that all normal attacks have set damage. The differences boil down to animation times and attack box ranges/positioning. Here's the breakdown:

Tyris:
Farthest swing range
Quickest/Most useful back attack
Highest magic strength
Farthest attack box for the dash attack

Ax Battler:
Same back attack as Tyris
Shortest range for dash attack (hitbox can't extend outside of the screen border, slight backwards shift in character position makes hitting Knights almost impossible)
Second highest magic level
Slowest walking speed (hard to notice, but it's there)

Gilius:
Longest range for back attack, but cannot hit enemies directly behind (he rolls through them)
Enemies can jump over back attack
Weakest magic level
Shorter dash attack range than Tyris, but longer than Ax Battler

Due to these differences, a LOT of fights need to be tweaked.

Ax Battler
Stage 2 second fight: shoulder bash can't hit the left enemy since the attack box is too short and doesn't extend past the player collision box.
Stage 3 boss fight: lower strength magic requires an extra downstab on the Knight
Stage 5 Knights: shoulder bash can't hit the Knights before they swing, back attacks required to knock them into the pit
Death Adder: highest level magic attacks don't kill the skeletons
Death Bringer: 1 extra downstab required due to weaker magic

Gilius
Every stage: back attack spamming doesn't work, positioning needs to be changed and fights reworked
Every boss: extremely weak magic means finding quick ways to manipulate the stronger attacks

Gilius is technically the hardest character, but since his headbutt dash attack has more range than Ax Battler's shoulder bash it makes key fights easier to manage. I do have to fight more enemies and can't rely on ending boss's quickly with magic, but at least I don't have to worry about the Knights giving me headaches cause I can't hit them.

JackintheBox333

2014-07-29 05:42:32 pm

Professional Shaq Fu Speedrunner

So I'm resurrecting this thread for this: I had this weird thing happen to me during a blind race of Golden Axe last week. Does anybody know exactly what happened here?

thekeepersa

2014-07-29 09:32:14 pm

If memory serves me well, there's a bottomless pit on the left and you kicked the armored knight in it.

JackintheBox333

2014-07-29 10:58:13 pm

Professional Shaq Fu Speedrunner

Huh, I had no idea the pit extended that far over to the boss screen when its that far off screen, but I guess that makes sense.

honorableJay

2014-08-03 05:37:07 pm

The Dork Knight himself.

Jack: if you want a complete breakdown of the game, the livestream I recorded after my run was accepted is on the game page. I go over everything I know about the game (at the time of recording anyway).

01Garland01

2016-07-13 11:12:39 am

I have been working on a run on the PC/Steam release of Golden axe for some time. I'm hoping to submit a run once I beat my latest PB which was recorded at the wrong frame rate. I wanted to share the new strategies I've been using, which I think could be used to achieve a sub 8:30 run (albeit with perfect luck).

I started writing the strategy for the whole run but it would have taken a million years to finish so instead I thought I would link my PB video on twitch and explain the new/different strategies I use compared to honouableJay's current WR run. For the most part I tried to add more strategies from the TAS by Mukki. And a twitch steamer called Galedog developed a new stage 1 boss strategy. Other than that I tried to replace as many back attacks as I could with down stabs, as I find the back attacks a big source of frustration due to their inconsistency. Sometimes the back attack input gods just are not with you, and there are still places in the run where a failed back attack means a reset.

My current PB (which I think is also the unofficial WR for the PC version) is here

-20s
Keep on the same y axis after the gnome instead of moving down.
Then time a down stab attack on the amazon.
Take off just as the screen lags to spawn the enemies, and delay moving left briefly to make sure the amazon is in the right position.
Immediatly down stab again catching both enemies who are now baited by the chicken leg

-38s
Take a higher y axis position in line with a texture seam
start a down stab in line with the left of the Turtle Village sign just as the screen scrolls
Down stab the first giant
pause very briefly and back attack the chicken leg rider
Move down to the standing giant and begin a three hit combo
Move towards the other approaching giant slightly in between slashes 1 and 2
Back stab both giants and the approaching mace man
jump attack (DS might be better here if I could get it consistent) the chicken leg rider to evade his attack
DS the mace man who is now baited by the chicken leg (can be skipped if down stabbed on previous step)
Down stab above the chicken leg as the giant is not baited into a charge

-1m 42s
Attack the gnome to from the right so that three consecutive stabs can be done. Saves no time but I found it more consistent than having to do the third attack on the gnome when he is off screen

-2m 29s
Slight difference, down stab the amazon facing left instead of right. I found it easier.

-3m 34s
Another change for consistensy
Down stab the first mace man knocking him right as normal
Down stab both mace men as the second charges youtube
Third down stab on remaining mace man
Move down and back attack third made man dodging his charge
Down stab mace man who cannot evade as he is at the bottom of the screen

-4m 6s
Use a down stab on the second attack for each skelton to avoid back attacks

-4m 27s
Position above right most black gap in the ground and slightly up
Sprint left as the screen starts moving and down stab the skelton
bait the mace man into a charge and dodge it (y position is important here to setup the next two attacks)
finish skeleton and mace man with back attacks (brief pause for last attack on mace man to let him enter range)
brief pause again then DS the spawning mace man in the centre of the screen
immediatly down stab the mace man again
I got very lucky and caught the skeleton in the same down stab (hense the gold split), but usually I would down stab him here exploiting a trick where you can down stab if you start at a specific range
Down stab the other skeleton using the same trick
Do another down stab on the same skeleton as the stands up
dodge the last skeletons charge and finish with a back attack or down stab as appropriate

-5m 17s
Steal the dragon from the amazon by jump attacking as the screen scrolls
get on the dragon and move left to the edge to force the amazon to charge
dodge her charge so she suicides
now move right to the spawning mace man (not too far, we only want one to spawn)
sprint left to bait the mace man to suicide into the pit with a charge
do the same again for the next mace man (moving as far right as possible to scroll the screen is important to setup the next pack)
knock the two mace men spawning on the left into the pit with the dragon breath attack
dodge the charge from the third mace man then knock him into the pit too
move right in case the screen didn't fully scroll to spawn the knights
wait until the bottom knights sword reaches the left of the second small butress in the background (from left to right)
sprint at the knight then move up just as he attacks to dodge
sprint left again past the knight then move down and dragon breath attack him to the left
move slightly right then dragon breath again as the other knight appoaches, just before he moves down onto your y axix (positioning is very tight here)
move forward and dragon breath both knights repeatedly until they fall into the pit

-6m 3s
bait the mace man into a charge here to close ground faster
(if you mess up you may find the giant can be down stabbed as he is at the bottom of the screen)

-7m 3s
Charge attack to the right to position on the ledge
move up and down to trigger the top mace man to run into the pit
dodge the second mace man as he charges into the pit
(I wish I knew how to trigger both to run as they spawn!)

-7m 11s
move down and right to position the skeleton so he can be jump attacked into the pit on the right

-7m 17s
charge the mace man on the left as the amazon walks to her death
jump attack the last mace man into the pit on the right

-7m 26s
start with an attack on the blue gnome and attempt to down stab him again as you force the mace men to walk into the pit (only one fell in my run but it's possible to get both here)
move up to evade the skeleton charge then down stab again to get him to suicide also (all the time trying to hit the gnomes with the down stabs if possible)
pray to the RNG gods for a good gnomes pattern
only stage 5 magic is needed for death bringer so leave any un-needed ones. The last gnome can be knocked into the pit before his bag is empty also if you managed to collect all the other pots.

-7m 52s
You can reverse back attack the skeleton here but it's hard so I always just jump attack
then bait both skeleton into charges
if you are lucky they both charge into the pit, if not they both down stab and need an extra jump attack to knock them in the pit
now sprint to the top right to screen the screen
and sprint back to the left side of the screen to bait the spawning mace man into a charge
move down just to the right of the pit to force the mace man to walk to his death
bait the last mace man into a charge attack into the pit

-8m 9s
Wait for the first knights sword to reach the gap between the statues
charge and move up just as he attacks to avoid his swing
quickly reverse jump attack him to the left
move right to allow the second knight to move up to your y position
charge attack both knights (too pricise for this to be consistent, most often you get only one knight or even worse get attacked)
if you missed one knight, move right again as I did and charge attack him towards the first knight
now charge attack both knights at once until they fall into the pit (the timing is a little precise but with practice it's ok)

-8m 26s
Immediatly move up to the throne and use your magic before death bringer can swing
one down stabs knocking him right
three down stabs knocking him left (stay far enough left to avoid the right move skeleton, but also not too far attempting to keep the other skeleton on your left)
two down stabs right again to finish him, if the skeletons are too aggressive you need to charge them before the last down stab, I messed up

I have been working on a run on the PC/Steam release of Golden axe for some time. I'm hoping to submit a run once I beat my latest PB which was recorded at the wrong frame rate. I wanted to share the new strategies I've been using, which I think could be used to achieve a sub 8:30 run (albeit with perfect luck).

I started writing the strategy for the whole run but it would have taken a million years to finish so instead I thought I would link my PB video on twitch and explain the new/different strategies I use compared to honouableJay's current WR run. For the most part I tried to add more strategies from the [url=https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EjbNa7fwBvE]TAS by Mukk[/url]i. And a twitch steamer called [url=https://www.twitch.tv/galedog/profile]Galedog[/url] developed a [url=https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-nFyQ3LXPrs]new stage 1 boss strategy[/url]. Other than that I tried to replace as many back attacks as I could with down stabs, as I find the back attacks a big source of frustration due to their inconsistency. Sometimes the back attack input gods just are not with you, and there are still places in the run where a failed back attack means a reset.

My current PB (which I think is also the unofficial WR for the PC version) is [url=https://www.twitch.tv/01garland01/v/75892484]here[/url]

-20s
Keep on the same y axis after the gnome instead of moving down. 
Then time a down stab attack on the amazon. 
Take off just as the screen lags to spawn the enemies, and delay moving left briefly to make sure the amazon is in the right position.
Immediatly down stab again catching both enemies who are now baited by the chicken leg

-38s
Take a higher y axis position in line with a texture seam
start a down stab in line with the left of the Turtle Village sign just as the screen scrolls
Down stab the first giant
pause very briefly and back attack the chicken leg rider
Move down to the standing giant and begin a three hit combo
Move towards the other approaching giant slightly in between slashes 1 and 2
Back stab both giants and the approaching mace man
jump attack (DS might be better here if I could get it consistent) the chicken leg rider to evade his attack
DS the mace man who is now baited by the chicken leg (can be skipped if down stabbed on previous step)
Down stab above the chicken leg as the giant is not baited into a charge

-1m 42s
Attack the gnome to from the right so that three consecutive stabs can be done. Saves no time but I found it more consistent than having to do the third attack on the gnome when he is off screen

-2m 29s
Slight difference, down stab the amazon facing left instead of right. I found it easier.

-3m 34s
Another change for consistensy
Down stab the first mace man knocking him right as normal
Down stab both mace men as the second charges youtube
Third down stab on remaining mace man
Move down and back attack third made man dodging his charge
Down stab mace man who cannot evade as he is at the bottom of the screen

-4m 6s
Use a down stab on the second attack for each skelton to avoid back attacks

-4m 27s 
Position above right most black gap in the ground and slightly up
Sprint left as the screen starts moving and down stab the skelton
bait the mace man into a charge and dodge it (y position is important here to setup the next two attacks)
finish skeleton and mace man with back attacks (brief pause for last attack on mace man to let him enter range)
brief pause again then DS the spawning mace man in the centre of the screen
immediatly down stab the mace man again
I got very lucky and caught the skeleton in the same down stab (hense the gold split), but usually I would down stab him here exploiting a trick where you can down stab if you start at a specific range
Down stab the other skeleton using the same trick
Do another down stab on the same skeleton as the stands up
dodge the last skeletons charge and finish with a back attack or down stab as appropriate

-5m 17s
Steal the dragon from the amazon by jump attacking as the screen scrolls
get on the dragon and move left to the edge to force the amazon to charge
dodge her charge so she suicides
now move right to the spawning mace man (not too far, we only want one to spawn)
sprint left to bait the mace man to suicide into the pit with a charge
do the same again for the next mace man (moving as far right as possible to scroll the screen is important to setup the next pack)
knock the two mace men spawning on the left into the pit with the dragon breath attack
dodge the charge from the third mace man then knock him into the pit too
move right in case the screen didn't fully scroll to spawn the knights
wait until the bottom knights sword reaches the left of the second small butress in the background (from left to right)
sprint at the knight then move up just as he attacks to dodge
sprint left again past the knight then move down and dragon breath attack him to the left
move slightly right then dragon breath again as the other knight appoaches, just before he moves down onto your y axix (positioning is very tight here)
move forward and dragon breath both knights repeatedly until they fall into the pit

-6m 3s
bait the mace man into a charge here to close ground faster
(if you mess up you may find the giant can be down stabbed as he is at the bottom of the screen)

-7m 3s
Charge attack to the right to position on the ledge
move up and down to trigger the top mace man to run into the pit
dodge the second mace man as he charges into the pit
(I wish I knew how to trigger both to run as they spawn!)

-7m 11s
move down and right to position the skeleton so he can be jump attacked into the pit on the right

-7m 17s
charge the mace man on the left as the amazon walks to her death
jump attack the last mace man into the pit on the right

-7m 26s
start with an attack on the blue gnome and attempt to down stab him again as you force the mace men to walk into the pit (only one fell in my run but it's possible to get both here)
move up to evade the skeleton charge then down stab again to get him to suicide also (all the time trying to hit the gnomes with the down stabs if possible)
pray to the RNG gods for a good gnomes pattern
only stage 5 magic is needed for death bringer so leave any un-needed ones. The last gnome can be knocked into the pit before his bag is empty also if you managed to collect all the other pots.

-7m 52s
You can reverse back attack the skeleton here but it's hard so I always just jump attack
then bait both skeleton into charges
if you are lucky they both charge into the pit, if not they both down stab and need an extra jump attack to knock them in the pit
now sprint to the top right to screen the screen
and sprint back to the left side of the screen to bait the spawning mace man into a charge
move down just to the right of the pit to force the mace man to walk to his death
bait the last mace man into a charge attack into the pit

-8m 9s
Wait for the first knights sword to reach the gap between the statues
charge and move up just as he attacks to avoid his swing
quickly reverse jump attack him to the left
move right to allow the second knight to move up to your y position
charge attack both knights (too pricise for this to be consistent, most often you get only one knight or even worse get attacked)
if you missed one knight, move right again as I did and charge attack him towards the first knight
now charge attack both knights at once until they fall into the pit (the timing is a little precise but with practice it's ok)

-8m 26s
Immediatly move up to the throne and use your magic before death bringer can swing
one down stabs knocking him right
three down stabs knocking him left (stay far enough left to avoid the right move skeleton, but also not too far attempting to keep the other skeleton on your left)
two down stabs right again to finish him, if the skeletons are too aggressive you need to charge them before the last down stab, I messed up

honorableJay

2016-07-14 06:45:01 pm

The Dork Knight himself.

Checked out your PB, very nice.

I am a little concerned about your version of the game though. Enemies don't seem to dodge downstabs the same as they do on a standard cart version of the game. If you go to 4:35 (video timestamp), when you attack the left skeleton with a downstab, instead of going for the standard move straight down to dodge, he oscillates between up and down repeatedly. This pattern never makes him actually move out of the way of the downstab. It's possible this could be a different ROM than what was released years ago.

I'm grabbing this version to do some tests, since I also noticed that enemies stand still a lot upon wakeup which is another strange behavior.

honorableJay

2016-07-16 05:12:18 pm

The Dork Knight himself.

Well, I did some testing and it looks like the Steam version plays the same. The weird AI routines I was seeing in your run is just from not playing the game for a while. All I could find different between the versions is text box skipping is way slower on the Steam version (on top of the input lag).

01Garland01

2016-07-18 10:11:29 am

Thanks for testing this honorableJay. I'm glad there is minimal difference between the versions, I was a bit worried for a minute the strategies I wrote up would be useless for the megadrive run which would have been a massive shame. For what it's worth, the steam version is a buggy, laggy mess and I wouldn't recommend anyone picks it up over any other platform. It doesn't even have a reset function, you have to manually quit out through the menus each time.